blogs_blog_26

This is an interesting Entry

 

 

Yes, i have too agree with you aswell. The one whos sent the message, seems to have a negative feelign for...How shall i put it, over excessive fans, who would die to have a piece of the story made by them. Is is always been my opinion that fan help/support is wonderfull, and it s a priveledge and a Pleasure to be able to PM you.

 

-Star*

I would think it would be good for you to listen to the fans, as they are the ones reading the story, buying the sets, etc. so if the story is changed by the fans to include something they want, wouldn't that make them happy? So, I agree with Greg's statements, but this anonymous person made an interesting point.

I think that you answering questions is a good thing. And when you (and the rest of the story team) follows the advice of a fan and adds something extra to a story serial, or something, that's great. Usually.

 

Not saying I agree with all the fan-suggested things that have made it into the story, but I think that overall the unique system here is pretty good.

 

~Bunda

Greg is right, once again.

 

But Greg, what's your response to his claim, "The fact that we get everything about the story on a silver platter every time we just ask is not good story development." Because that's the only part of this guy's PM I agree with... a lot of the time I like not to read all your answers to questions because it stops the story from developing on its own. Case in point, today's website update ("Unity") being complete old news for most of us.

Greg is right, once again.

 

But Greg, what's your response to his claim, "The fact that we get everything about the story on a silver platter every time we just ask is not good story development." Because that's the only part of this guy's PM I agree with... a lot of the time I like not to read all your answers to questions because it stops the story from developing on its own. Case in point, today's website update ("Unity") being complete old news for most of us.

That wasn't Greg's fault though, all of that info was in the movie, and spoilers have been allowed for a while now so we'd know it all anyway even if he wasn't here.

People who think it's easy to get new info out of Greg obviously haven't tried recently.

Greg is right, once again.

 

But Greg, what's your response to his claim, "The fact that we get everything about the story on a silver platter every time we just ask is not good story development." Because that's the only part of this guy's PM I agree with... a lot of the time I like not to read all your answers to questions because it stops the story from developing on its own. Case in point, today's website update ("Unity") being complete old news for most of us.

 

But most of us share one common trait: we're the minority in the BIONICLE community who actively seeks answers to the enigmas presented, so it's natural than we get those answers earlier. And Greg doesn't just answer every question that is sent to him. If he thinks we shouldn't know something just yet, he "can't answer it".

Greg, like always, is right

 

You can do what you want on here (Well, not what you want) But YOU are the one who decides if you answer or not the questions.

I agree and disagree to that PM in many ways. However, one thing I can say is:

Please no more fan contributions and contests. It may be fun, but I think it's too much. Maybe some contests in the LEGO Magazine or Brickmaster, but please no more online contests and storyline suggestions.

I think that you answering questions is a good thing. And when you (and the rest of the story team) follows the advice of a fan and adds something extra to a story serial, or something, that's great. Usually.

 

Not saying I agree with all the fan-suggested things that have made it into the story, but I think that overall the unique system here is pretty good.

 

~Bunda

The rabbit speaks the truth.

I agree with you, Greg, on everything except what Dokuma said.

 

We do sometimes get too many plot points out of you ahead of time, and they end up spoiling the story when they actually happen. Like how you explained everything about the Baterra early on, when people were just beginning to get excited about what these mysterious new villains could be. The problem isn't you adding fan's ideas, it's you revealing too much to us. I would never even think about sacrificing the ability to ask you questions and give suggestions, but it might help to be a bit more tight-lipped.

I agree with you, Greg, on everything except what Dokuma said.

 

We do sometimes get too many plot points out of you ahead of time, and they end up spoiling the story when they actually happen. Like how you explained everything about the Baterra early on, when people were just beginning to get excited about what these mysterious new villains could be. The problem isn't you adding fan's ideas, it's you revealing too much to us. I would never even think about sacrificing the ability to ask you questions and give suggestions, but it might help to be a bit more tight-lipped.

So Greg cut off Baterra speculation when people were just starting to get excited. Would you have preferred if Greg let everyone continue to build excitement until the massive letdown that "Guys, they're just assassin robots with one-track minds"?

 

As Greg said in the entry, it's his prerogative to let people know that they're on the wrong track-- if the truth about the Baterra's nature didn't excite people, that's no excuse for him to promote and endorse less accurate speculation and theories. Best to let people know the truth-- that Baterra aren't really a plot point that'll become critical anytime soon.

 

Besides, there's still some mystery left. After all, the graphic novel will show us what they look like, which Greg's only hinted at up until now.

 

Overall, regarding spoiler content, Greg can reveal it whenever he feels like it. If you choose to risk spoilers by reading online discussions, then any revelations you wish had come later are your own problem. And if it's discussion outside the OGD that's causing the spoilers, take that up with BZP staff in charge of spoiler policy, not with Greg.

 

Regarding fan-suggested content, I also approve, although sometimes I wish you'd either flesh out the details on it or ask the person who suggested it to flesh out the details-- the disputes regarding the recent Kanohi approvals lasted far longer than they should have, and even for things like that which you won't use in story it'd be nice to get all the kinks worked out before the final approval is given or publicized.

Aanchir -- Put simply, I was not aware of any kinks. I got submitted a suggestion re: the Kanohi from people on here I respect, and okayed it. I frankly did not have time to worry about every possible interpretation of the info, and assumed the people who were making the suggestion would have concerned themselves with that. I will take the blame for that one, though.

 

With regard to online contests for "canon" elements -- if you have an issue with the number of them, etc., this is something you need to take up with the staff at BZPower and BS01. These contests are run at their request and under their auspices, not mine, and if they concern things that I don't plan on showing/explaining, I see no reason not to okay them. BIONICLE.com does not run these contests. I have also rejected suggestions to do a number of contests because they dealt with things I could not or would not be able to make canon.

 

I do think, though, that all this may be leading into a larger debate among BZPers about what questions they ask and why. There is an insatiable hunger for future info on here, and even if it is stuff I can't answer, I still get constant questions on it. The poster who wrote me focused on me as the issue, and maybe that's fair -- but at the same time, I do not provide set images months before the sets come out, which always seem to wind up online (though not officially, as BZP staff are good about that sort of thing). Basically, a lot of people are on a spoiler hunt 24/7, and that's okay ... but if other people on here have a big issue with that, maybe the discussion needs to be among members.

 

Greg

Aanchir -- Put simply, I was not aware of any kinks. I got submitted a suggestion re: the Kanohi from people on here I respect, and okayed it. I frankly did not have time to worry about every possible interpretation of the info, and assumed the people who were making the suggestion would have concerned themselves with that. I will take the blame for that one, though.

 

With regard to online contests for "canon" elements -- if you have an issue with the number of them, etc., this is something you need to take up with the staff at BZPower and BS01. These contests are run at their request and under their auspices, not mine, and if they concern things that I don't plan on showing/explaining, I see no reason not to okay them. BIONICLE.com does not run these contests. I have also rejected suggestions to do a number of contests because they dealt with things I could not or would not be able to make canon.

 

I do think, though, that all this may be leading into a larger debate among BZPers about what questions they ask and why. There is an insatiable hunger for future info on here, and even if it is stuff I can't answer, I still get constant questions on it. The poster who wrote me focused on me as the issue, and maybe that's fair -- but at the same time, I do not provide set images months before the sets come out, which always seem to wind up online (though not officially, as BZP staff are good about that sort of thing). Basically, a lot of people are on a spoiler hunt 24/7, and that's okay ... but if other people on here have a big issue with that, maybe the discussion needs to be among members.

 

Greg

As I said, I understand that such suggestions (i.e. ones you're not going to use in story) are less important for you and (generally) more time-consuming. I was just thinking you could ask the suggester (in this case, Bonesiii) to do an "error check" before proceeding. You did a good job, in that case, by asking him to work on limiting the conjuring power, and even gave a suggestion of how. That's going above and beyond, and I'm not asking you go through that much trouble with every suggestion you decide to OK. I suppose that's a rare scenario anyway and you can only consider BIG suggestions like that on a case-by-case basis, so I guess it's a silly idea for me to offer suggestions on that sort of matter after-the-fact.

 

Well said in the last paragraph.

Man if you told us who sent you that they would be driven out of BZ-Koro by an angry mob.

(I wonder how many members have pitchforks and/or torches.)

I agree with you, Greg, on everything except what Dokuma said.

 

We do sometimes get too many plot points out of you ahead of time, and they end up spoiling the story when they actually happen. Like how you explained everything about the Baterra early on, when people were just beginning to get excited about what these mysterious new villains could be. The problem isn't you adding fan's ideas, it's you revealing too much to us. I would never even think about sacrificing the ability to ask you questions and give suggestions, but it might help to be a bit more tight-lipped.

So Greg cut off Baterra speculation when people were just starting to get excited. Would you have preferred if Greg let everyone continue to build excitement until the massive letdown that "Guys, they're just assassin robots with one-track minds"?

X has a good point with the Baterra. People were getting excited about the mysterious Baterra, and then we were let down when we were told their nature. The part about them being one-minded robots made by the GBs to end the war was a revelation, but in text it was only mediocre, and we still have to wait until next year, at which point will see the Baterra form in comic. It won't be as cool as it could've been though, because there's no revelations about the Baterra one-minded robots made by the Great Beings to end the war.

 

However, if Greg hadn't explained the nature of Baterra to our persistent questions and just given the Baterra mysterious serial assassinations occasionally, we'd still be hyped right up until next year, at which point we would have the revelations of the Baterra's nature shown in glorious colour and comic action alongside the revelations of it's appearance. More than twice the cool from how it's currently playing out, and there would be no let-down period inbetween.

I can understand this guy, but I have to disagree. Fans want to know every detail, that is the nature of being a fan. And BIONICLE story is like the LEGO toys (Bob Thompson quote): every year you can add some more pieces. Why not have the fans add some pieces, too?

I agree with you, Greg, on everything except what Dokuma said.

 

We do sometimes get too many plot points out of you ahead of time, and they end up spoiling the story when they actually happen. Like how you explained everything about the Baterra early on, when people were just beginning to get excited about what these mysterious new villains could be. The problem isn't you adding fan's ideas, it's you revealing too much to us. I would never even think about sacrificing the ability to ask you questions and give suggestions, but it might help to be a bit more tight-lipped.

So Greg cut off Baterra speculation when people were just starting to get excited. Would you have preferred if Greg let everyone continue to build excitement until the massive letdown that "Guys, they're just assassin robots with one-track minds"?

In the long run, whether or not a few people are disappointed is a lot less important than whether a lot of people are excited.

 

Even so, this isn't so much an issue of excitement and letdowns as it is an issue of basic storytelling. The serials are obviously telling a story with an element of mystery, and when the answers to all the questions are given out ahead of time, there's no longer going to be any interest. You simply aren't supposed to tell what the story is before it actually happens. That's not how fiction works.

Well, again, Wrinkledlion, doesn't this then go back to a larger issue on BZP -- the constant pursuit of spoilers? That is very much a definition of what BZPower (and a lot of other sites) are about. If you feel that definition needs to be changed, then it is something the membership needs to resolve among themselves. The alternative is people basically saying to me, "Stop me before I read spoilers!" BZP's history is one of (whether I say anything or not) knowing everything months or a year ahead of time -- dating back at least to 2003, when people were parsing the interviews with the cast of MOL trying to figure out who the seventh Toa was, then broadcasting the news all over the site.

 

In my case, I am a fan of Dr. Who and Torchwood, and I have friends who visit sites and get great spoilers about upcoming shows, casting, etc. I don't want to know that stuff, so I don't go to those sites. As a fan, what I do or don't get exposed to is my responsibility. On the other hand, I do read Previews, so I can get an idea of what is coming out in comics in the next couple months, story-wise, so I know which series I want to buy and which I don't. I don't mind some spoilers there, because it helps me plan my budget.

 

We also have to keep a sense of perspective here, too -- the only people getting any spoilers given here are, say, 40,000 members and let's add maybe another 100,000 casual visitors to the site. That leaves millions of fans who either don't know BZP exists or don't come here because they don't want to see the sets a year before they come out, etc.

 

In the end, wanting spoilers is not "bad" or "wrong," and not wanting them is not "bad" or "wrong." But this site was about spoilers before I came here, and would still be about it even if I left, just in different ways ... so this is a question of the site's identity, which is why I shared this message to begin with. If the site as a whole resolves that they DON'T want to know anything ahead of time, I will gladly stop teasing ... but I do not then want to still be getting 50 PMs a day asking about next year.

What does the member mean, the blue STARS Piraka?

 

What does the member mean, the blue STARS Piraka?

 

It's a 2010 set.

Last thing you ever want to do if you're trying to avoid spoilers is visit the OGD or the rest of S&T. Its not that hard to avoid them if you want to. As long as people remember to use the spoiler tags, I don't see a problem with that.

 

 

And I really disagree with the part about not listening to fans making things better. I've been into Bionicle since the beginning when I was 10 (Or 11, cant really remember, I'm 20 now, and still buy sets, and follow the story). If you didn't spend so much time interacting with the fans, I'd have probably left sometime during my mid teens. In my opinion, not enough people keep a close watch on what their fans want, which is what makes Bionicle, and Lego for that matter, worth every penny.

I think that I may have fallen into the category of the person who sent you the PM =/ I thought it unfair that you had to devote so much time answering fan questions that you might not necessarily get other things done such as serials etc.

 

Clearly this is not the case and that you are happy to do so, which is fine Your logic is brilliant Mr Farshtey

Hi Ignition -- And I can see your logic. But for the record, BZP does not take time away from serials, etc., it's a leisure time activity for me. A lot of time what happens is I will be writing, and then take a break and come here, and then do more writing. If I wasn't coming here, I would just be going elsewhere on the web, cause I would still need the break

What does the member mean, the blue STARS Piraka?

 

It's a 2010 set.

 

Perfect example of a spoiler. I was hoping for a complete surprise around january 1st, but that never happens (and I have to blame myself too)...

 

Well, whoever PMed that is mostly right if you ask me. PM's about (yet) unknown storyline are pointless. What kind of answer should we expect? A complete summary of 2010?

One more thing, feedback and questions related to that wouldn't harm the story, right?

What does the member mean, the blue STARS Piraka?

 

It's a 2010 set.

 

Perfect example of a spoiler. I was hoping for a complete surprise around january 1st, but that never happens (and I have to blame myself too)...

 

Well, whoever PMed that is mostly right if you ask me. PM's about (yet) unknown storyline are pointless. What kind of answer should we expect? A complete summary of 2010?

One more thing, feedback and questions related to that wouldn't harm the story, right?

The person wanted an answer, and I was afraid spoiler tags would make them afraid it was some big spoiler. Anyway, talk of the 2010 sets has been in the open air for months, even in non-confidential images some sites have posted, and since it's not a story detail (like, at all) I didn't think it'd do any harm. As people have said, if you want to avoid spoilers you should avoid the places they're likely to show up, and that includes blogs.

 

EDIT: Furthermore, the next year's set info is going to come out officially before the holidays anyway, so if you want to avoid spoilers until the year itself comes you're gonna have to avoid BIONICLE sites as a whole, not just some parts of BZPower.