S&T used to have a lot of official topics for major subjects of discussion, and they used to have factlists, putting all of the most important things we knew about a subject in one place. Since Bionicle ended these have fallen out of use as there hasn't been much need for them, but the Red Star has been one subject that has had a lot of ongoing misconceptions (probably just because there's been so many reveals about it that came after the story ended), and the quotes from Greg about them are spread out over a number of topics.
So, I thought it would be handy to put them all in one place. Please note that although this topic is official, it is an "official guide" which just means it's revivable -- discussion about the Red Star may, yes, may, go in other topics. (I may close some basic question topics which are answered here, though.) But this will be one optional place for discussion about it, and a place to link to so finding all the related quotes won't be so tricky. I've also included comments about major unanswered questions and some related theories.
- The Red Star has four main known functions:
1) Serves like a space shuttle's extra rocket boosters to help the Great Spirit robot leave a planet's gravity, connecting like a backpack to it for space travel, and leaving to orbit a planet when he lands.
2) Has a "Toa-izing" beam, a contingency for if destined Matoran are outside the robot and Toa are needed there (as happened on Voya Nui with the Toa Inika).
3) Its motions, with respect to real stars in the background form shapes that help predict the future.
4) The one that the big reveals have all been about -- it has its own interior habitat ruled by the Kestora, and having machines that teleport up Matoran Universe beings who die, and either repair their bodies or make new bodies, reviving them. Then it was supposed to send them back to the MU to continue their jobs, but that part of it hasn't worked for a long time. Thus, many beings who died in Bionicle's storyline are alive but trapped on the Red Star. The Kestora are apparently insane, killing many, and others may kill too, so we can't be sure everybody is still alive.
- It revives sapient beings and Rahi from the Matoran Universe.
- Its range of revivability is not limited to the domes; Hydraxon is confirmed to be revived on the RS from the Pit, which is just inside the outer shell of the giant robot. It seems implied that if Takutanuva hadn't revived Jaller by other means, he would have been revived there too, but this is unclear.
- Some corpses apparently do not get teleported up; the reasons why are unknown. This may be intentional or it may be glitches, etc.
- It can only revive you if there is a body -- total disintegration permanently kills you. It is not known for sure that a body without the brain intact will still work; it may need to download memories from the old body to the new. But if the brain is intact we can be sure that the being can be revived. (Although we can't necessarily be sure they were, or that they survived the harsh realm of the Red Star's interior to story-present.)
-It is "indirectly confirmed" or if you like, "strongly implied" that there is a wait time of unknown duration between a being's death and when they would disappear.
Confirmed (directly) revived:
-Mavrah (still alive)
-Hydraxon ([Correction: apparently still alive])
-Lhikan (specifically mentioned that we don't know if still alive)
-Botar (strongly implied still alive and since he can teleport, might even be back in the MU)
-Gaardus (sort of confirmed; we know he's alive now, the question was if he had been revived there in the past so that was how he knew of it, and Greg's answer left room for him to change his mind about it)
Believed to be revived:
-Reysa (killed by a Rahi)
-Guardian (killed in Teridax's reign by ground swallowing him, though it's possible he was crushed too much to go... or may simply have suffocated or died on impact with a cave floor)
-Ihu (Nui-Rama destroyed base of a chute he was traveling in, presumably impact death)
-Jovan (killed as Voya Nui rocketed to the surface; presumably impact death)
-Kodan (killed by Eliminator, assumed not to have been disintegrated)
-Naho (same, and same with all other members of Lhikan's team other than Nidhiki and Tuyet)
-Nocturn (I'm unsure how he died but it was in trying to escape the new Pit)
-Sidorak (crushed by Keetongu, but this may have made the brain unrevivable, IF that is a limit to the RS)
Confirmed NOT revived:
-the other Makuta (gaseous antidermis only dies if it is destroyed basically)
-No Spherus Magna natives (it only works for Matoran Universe beings)
-Alternate (Decoy) Tuyet (unknown why not; Hydraxon is confirmed revived from the same location; see discussion here)
-Tren Krom (Greg said this was due to being "completely organic" -- what exactly this means is unclear; would strange protodermic beings like Krahka be unrevivable? Does there have to be a specific mechanical implant in them to be teleported? Or is Tren Krom not protodermic and made with older GB Spherus Magna means and more comparable to the naturally organic state of Agori?)
Believed to be NOT revived:
-Ancient (disintegrated by the Shadowed One)
-Carapar (disintegrated by Tren Krom)
-Karzahni (this may ONLY be because the wait time hasn't yet elapsed, or perhaps because he died after the disabling of the giant robot, or perhaps because he is too far away from the giant robot on Spherus Magna)
-Karzahni Plant (presumed not to include plants, plus it was huge too)
-Morbuzahk ("confirmed by plot" and also way too big)
-Nidhiki (mass absorbed by Teridax)
Uncertain either way:
-Nikila and other members of Lesovikk's Toa Team (killed by Zyglak, unknown if they used their disintegration spears to do it or their consuming disease or other means -- also these deaths were so early some think they may be both revived and teleported home but never happened to be found by Lesovikk again)
Major unanswered questions (feel free to suggest more; I'm sure I've forgotten much here)
-When the Sendback teleporter stopped working (what year on the timeline).
-Exact range limits and whether MU beings who are outside the giant robot can be revived (strongly implied yes with Jaller; see my comments with relevant quotes below)
-What "will" happen (or would have had the serials continued) to Kopaka and Pohatu who Gaardus teleported to the RS, and the Kestora were opposing.
-How and if Velika's plans involve the Red Star (one thing is that he seemed convinced Kopaka and Pohatu would get off of it).
-Exactly what is up with the Kestora's apparent insanity; what caused it, how much sanity they still have, and whether it has to do with why the Sendback teleporter was never repaired.
-What the inhabitants of the MU know or don't know about it (prior to Kopaka and Pohatu's discovery), if anything.
Greg's words are those that are in quote tags and not underlined. Underlined text is someone (usually Erebus) asking Greg a question. My comments are outside the quotes.
Mata Nui was supposed to be a self-sustaining system, and obviously, certain individuals played very important roles in maintaining it. In addition, it necessarily had finite resources for producing new beings to replace any lost in accidents, etc. Hence the red star -- a being who died inside Mata Nui would be teleported to the red star where their essence would be transplanted into another body and they would be sent back. Unfortunately, as with so many things related to Mata Nui's construction, it didn't work very well. The teleporting "to" worked but the teleporting "from" didn't, so a lot of newly revived dead folk were stuck on the satellite with no way to get back home.
That was the original reveal. (See the chapters of the unfinished serial that hinted at it here; Chapters 3 and 4.)
Why are some beings alive, like Mavrah, and others are not?
Matoro and the Makuta did not come back, for a simple reason. None of them have bodies anymore. The body is what is teleported up (which is why you don't see BIONICLE graveyards) and then either repaired or a new one is made to house the consciousness. If the body has been utterly destroyed, there is nothing to work with.
Note that fans had been asking about graveyards since at least 2003 (because of the question of Jaller's original body). This may imply the story team knew something unusual happened with dead bodies that far back. However, the timing of when it was all decided is unknown, and Greg seems to have implied in an audio interview that the RS part of it was recent. (See interview here; be warned it's really long! [Edit: See the video's description for the times where certain sections start.])
Note too that what counts as "something to work with" here is unclear. Is it the memories recorded in the brain, thus a destroyed brain means no revival? Or is it a body at all?
Perhaps relevant is Matoro's death and revival on the 777 stairs (in a room with red lightstones, possibly an early hint to the RS's purpose, though the RS itself was almost certainly not involved here). His entire body was turned to dust, yet revived by the machine. Some say this was just an illusion and he didn't really die. But it might mean that "disintegration" (into dust) is not as final as we are assuming, and only some kinds of disintegration count like the total destruction of Matoro later. Or that machine might be completely irrelevant, if it simply purposefully stores his memories and a record of how to remake his body before disintegrating him (which wouldn't apply to the RS).
What is the nature of the lightning that struck 6 Matoran?
There was never supposed to be Matoran outside the robot. The Toa Mata failed to wake Mata Nui on time, and thus there were still Matoran outside on the islands of Mata Nui and Voya Nui. The lightning acts like a fail-safe to create new Toa outside the robot in case they are ever needed.
Fulfilling your destiny does not mean you cannot be revived. We have seen plenty of characters fulfill their destiny and yet live on. The point of the red star is basically that even Mata Nui is not self-sustaining if it loses too many beings (to an accident, say), the same way you could not survive if you lost too many blood cells without replacing them. We haven't SEEN Lhikan alive again, that doesn't mean he isn't.
Note that although this was the purpose of the RS, since the Sendback wasn't working, Mata Nui had to settle for just making new beings to replace those that died, which works, but apparently is more of a drain on "resources." (What resources is unclear, but it seems to be mentally taxing, rather than being about physical materials since the RS itself will make new bodies if needed, and other quotes make it clear it's the memories and related things that matter.)
Rahi can be revived, since they play a role in Mata Nui's functioning as well.
The Kanohi Tryna, the Mask of Reanimation, brings you back right away with all the damage -- red star takes a good deal longer, but repairs the damage.
Note that the "good deal longer" here includes the time delay before disappearing. And this quote and others here about Jaller seem to mean that the time delay's purpose is to give others a chance to revive their friends by other means without having to involve the RS (though the Tryna is not a true revival). Although, it's possible the waiting is just a waiting list due to practical reasons (or both), especially if multiple beings throughout the MU are dying at the same time and can only be teleported up one at a time.
Does the Red Star always work in reviving every dead being with an intact body or is it selective about what it chooses to resurrect? Rahi too?
No, it works in general, everyone has some role to play in the universe.
Can you name anyone other than Mavrah who [is] alive in the Red Star?
Basically, anyone whose body was not disintegrated would be there.
So no Matoro, no Brotherhood members, nobody who had no body left
How long ago was the Red Star broken? From the start, or was it due to the Great Cataclysm?
It stopped working quite a while before the events of Mystery of Metru Nui, which is why no one was looking around for Lhikan to come back.
This means that the absolute latest date, after which we can be certain nobody was teleported back into the MU, was 1000 YA (Years Ago by biosector01's reckoning, or Year 99,000 after the Shattering / Launch). By comparison, Nikila and the rest of Lesovikk's team died in what I call Year 1 (100,000 YA). So, it's easy to see why we wonder if they might have gone back to the MU (assuming they weren't disintegrated).
Does this mean there are two Hydraxons alive now?
Yes, one up there, one down here.
That's because the "second" is really the Po-Matoran named Dekar, transformed by the Mask of Life to forget who he really is, and given the memories and shape of Hydraxon.
[Correction from earlier draft: I had said we're not sure if Hydraxon is still alive in story-present, but "are" and "now" would confirm it I guess.]
Can the Red Star still teleport the dead MU inhabitants to it now that the MU is effectively destroyed, and if not, how was it able to reach the Matoran in canisters in Voya Nui to turn them into the Toa Inika?
It can't teleport right now, because the system is broken. As for the Inika, that wasn't teleportation at work, that was electrical discharge.
This quote is confusing. Did Greg misunderstand the question and mean that nothing can be teleported back? Or by "system" did he mean a system in the MU itself is what "sends"? If the latter, then nobody could be revived (not normally anyways) by the RS since Teridax's defeat. And it would also strongly imply that to be revived you had to be detected by the giant robot's systems and "sent", rather than detected by the RS and "brought." Unless the RS's "bringing" system has coincidentally broken too...
A major question has been how far away from the domes you can be and still be revived. A common (apparent) misconception is that you have to be in the "Matoran Universe" and that this is only the domes (or some other definition that doesn't include the entire robot interior).
Hydraxon's confirmed revival in the Pit (just inside the outer skin of the giant robot, usually not considered part of the "Matoran Universe, though that's still an open semantic question) appears to confirm that anywhere inside the robot is fair game. (Unless the Pit counts as "MU" since Mata Nui probably knew about it and could program the system to include it?)
What about just outside but in indirect physical contact with it? That would include anyone touching the land of Mata Nui (island), Voya Nui (via the stone cord), Mahri Nui, and the seafloor around Mahri Nui. And what about someone simply "near the giant robot"? We don't yet know, however, some upcoming quotes here seem to virtually confirm Mata Nui island is fair game at least.
Is there any kind of injury that would bar a being from being revived by the Red Star? Like perhaps a missing limb?
No, there simply has to be a body left to work with.
Again, this quote is of little help to the big question of "what about the brain?" In the context of a missing arm or leg as the question's example, "no" might not be relevant to the brain. But in the context of "any" injury, "no" would seem to mean even a disintegrated brain but intact torso (or even disintegrated everything but one finger!) would work... which seems doubtful, but we don't know how it works, so who knows?
One speculation that's been floated is that some kind of backup of memories is stored in every protodermis molecule of a person's body, but this seems unlikely. However, if so, might it imply that some disintegrations like Carapar's odd one might still be fair game? (I kind of hope not, as it's much less confusing to be able to answer questions with "if disintegrated, gone".)
The following two quotes are multiple answers but part of ongoing conversations:
Now what if someone with teleportation powers (like Brutaka with a functional Olmak or Botar) died could they escape the Red Star back to the Matoran Universe?
So does that mean Botar was too damaged to be saved by the Red Star?
No, it simply means that either a ) he reappeared someplace we have not seen him yet, or ...b ) He was sufficiently messed up by the experience of dying and coming back that he doesn't know where he is and isn't focusing on getting back.
Does option B often happen to people? How aware are they of their circumstances?
Well, the folks encountered on the red star thus far did not seem too together to me.
Greg's audio interview with TTV revealed that his idea for the RS's revivals was basically to tell a "zombie story in space" (if memory serves; that's not neccessarily an exact quote and the interview is way too long for me to re-play to get the exact quote). This could imply many, perhaps even most, have been seriously altered by the revival process. Mavrah seemed physically okay, from what little description we got, but is he mentally okay? Or, does the quality of the revivals vary?
What was the purpose of the red star on the map that Tarduk was following in the web serial?
It marked the location of a Great Being facility, the one in which the RS was built.
Okay, now what about the mental image of the Red Star that Tren Krom projected right before his death?
TK was killed by a Great Being. The RS image served two purposes -- to TK, it symbolized the Great Beings, and ..it was a bit of irony .. as a completely organic being, the RS could not bring him back
As well as the fact that he was on Spherus Magna and the RS could not have brought him back anyways?
Well, we don't know that.
The RS is keyed in to MU inhabitants.
We don't know the fact that he was no longer in the MU would have made a difference. Might have made a difference to his being sent back ...
But the RS isn't sending anyone back now anyway.
This is the key quote to the big debate about whether what matters is "being inside the MU" or "being an MU being". Greg clearly confirms that being a native to the MU is most important. But even he is unsure as to whether being "not in" would matter. IMO, given the complexity of the previous Bionicle story and how much of it technically took place outside what may or may not be the proper definition of "Matoran Universe", Greg was very wise to be cautious here.
My guess is that it's a finer point that can only be pinned down after careful analysis of preceding story to make sure the answer won't contradict canon, and Greg may not have time to review everything, so we might not get an answer. Unless! Unless we figure out an answer that would work and Greg canonizes it (after all, it's the sort of thing we should be able to solve with thorough research, since the answer can only be "yes or no").
Work towards that so far has been unclear, but my proposal would be that anyone (of the MU beings) in close range of the MU (say about the distance of the height of the head) can be revived (due to being sensed by a system that is run in the Core, and is now disabled by that being smashed in the final battle), but that some things can interfere with the death sensor, similar to the many explanations in Star Trek of why their "transporters" won't work.
Specific explanations of what interfered in what case can be worked out later, if needed. (Question: can we get a complete list of who, like Alternate Tuyet, this would apply to? Weren't there other corpses in or near the old Pit too? Or something? I forget and out of time to check.)
At the very least, unless Greg has (perhaps on LEGO.com) given a later answer, this quote does disprove the claims by some that it's confirmed that beings outside the MU can't be revived.
What is the nature of Toa/Spirit stars inside and outside of the MU? [Toa Mata stars were outside the MU.But the Toa Metru spirit stars were inside the MU.]
The inside ones I feel are pretty easy ...I always felt they were some sort of electrical impulse from MN's system ...As far as the outside ones go ...I would think there would have to be some connection to the red star, since it was connected to his system at least peripherally.
This may mean there is a fifth purpose to the RS -- generating illusions of Spirit Stars. Or Spirit Stars may be energy spheres projected by Toa, and the RS may simply sort of anchor them in place... Or Greg might change his mind and say it has nothing to do with them.
Was Gaardus resurrected by Red Star, or did he originally end up there some other way?
I would think he would have had to be resurrected to be there.
How did MU inhabitants react to dead corpses disparitions? What was their interpretation of that?
They were becoming one with the Great Spirit
Is that what happened to Jaller on Mata Nui, then?
Yes, basically what Takutanuva did was what the red star is supposed to do.
I take this to mean that Jaller's old body did not go up to the RS, and he was revived within the time delay before he would have been. This would mean 1) There aren't two Jallers like there are two Hydraxons, and 2) it would confirm that Jaller could have been revived by the RS, even though he was "not inside the robot" (see also the next quote for that point).
Note that it's also confirmed that Toa Takanuva was killed and revived too; the book version had him just escaping the door at the last second, but Greg has confirmed he died and was revived. [I actually have a theory in this part of my upcoming Bionicle retelling related to all this; stay tuned for that story to learn it! :P I won't post it here so I don't rob my story of all the fun, heh. But after that part is posted, note to self to edit in a link here for those interested.]
Is it reasonable to assume that the MU inhabitant's pattern is stored in a buffer in the Great Spirit robot which allowed for Jaller's ressurection?
Since these beings were created within the Great Spirit, yes, there would be a record of their creation which is shared with the RS
I'm not sure Greg understood that question right. "Pattern stored in a buffer" appears to be a direct allusion to Star Trek transporters, and would seem to imply the question is asking if the dead person is "absorbed by the giant robot" like being converted into energy in a Star Trek teleporter, then beamed to the RS, and materialized up there. If that is so, then it would confirm Jaller's revival was related to the RS revival system, but the "energy" was just intercepted part-way, rather than being sent to the RS.
However, regardless of what the questioner meant, this at least gives as an intriguing addition to all the previous facts -- the RS can apparently get the full information of what a being's personality and body were when they were first made, perhaps even if the brain was destroyed and there are no memories? So, in extreme cases, perhaps a being whose brain is crushed can still be revived, but with a total mindwipe.
Some beings require masks to function, such as Matoran and Turaga. When they die, their bodies are teleported to the Red Star. Are they given masks in the Red Star?
Prior to this reveal, Greg said that mask-wearers who died (without the masks being smashed) would have an "imprint" of them on the mask, and they could be revived purely through the mask. We assumed this was all that happened with Jaller for years. After a while the imprint fades away.
How that relates to all this is unknown. It may open the possibility for a "two copies" situation; what if Lhikan's mask was later used this way, after he'd already been revived on the RS? Or, perhaps the "fading" time is the same length as the "send/bring" teleporter's time limit? Or something?
Also, IF a destroyed brain means no memories, but the mask is intact, might the RS actually ever teleport up the mask to make sure memories are given? Or, do masks always go up unless somebody takes them off before the time limit? These probably only scratch the surface of unanswered questions.
Do you remember what Kopaka saw in the Red Star that freaked him out? Was it the dead bodies? Someone he knew?
I don't remember off the top of my head
Presumably it was either dangerous bad guys, maybe like Sidorak (description remembered from the Turaga's tales?), or "zombies". Or both.
Do the "revived" MU Residents in the Red Star have any memories of their "previous life"? (to simplify: do they remember anything in their life before they "died"?)
They should remember everything. That's the intent. But the process of being brough back to life tends to be very traumatic, so it takes a while to get one's thoughts unscrambled
Another possibility related to the mask questions above is that there is an intangible energy spirit for every MU being, and it either attaches to a dead body or to a mask, and is it this that is revived. The absence of a body OR mask would make it dissipate rapidly like antidermis that's spread out really fast. If so, then perhaps memories can be restored every time regardless of the status of the brain, and the MU records Greg mentioned are only for reconstructing seriously damaged bodies.
Even prior to the RS reveal, some theorized that the imprint fading meant a spirit was being detached from the body. Perhaps this solves some of the above questions by meaning that when Lhikan's spirit left the mask, it jumped back to his body, and then the body teleported. So, the attaching to the mask would define the "last chance for other methods of revival" time. And if there is no body, there's nothing to jump back to and the teleporter can't grab the spirit. It is possible, given the stable energy things we've seen in Bionicle before, especially the Kanohi Iden.
How was the Red Star's teleportation broken?
I don't have specifics on that
Wouldn't it be cool if some villain did it on purpose?
Personally, I wonder if the real problem with the sendback is a software glitch (or intentional software hack???), rather than a hardware issue. The Kestora may thus have been looking for the solution in all the wrong places -- repair hardware, dissect brains... when they really needed a geek. I say this because it would explain how the power of teleportation is still working, yet only in one direction. Of course, given the Kestora's apparent insanity it could also just be that they keep repairing it wrong. Or are creepy murderers who just like having excuses to dissect brains. (All three theories could be true at the same time, of course. )
Well, that's all, from Erebus's topics anyways; if anyone has any new ones lemme know! Source topics are all linked here.
Edited by bonesiii, Dec 04 2013 - 07:40 PM.