94 replies to this topic

[Bambi]

Would you prefer if BZP shifted it's focus to mainly Hero Factory?

Edited by Bambi, Mar 21 2012 - 01:21 PM.

[Mesonak]

I'm a diehard Hero Factory fan (likely one of its more... devoted followers). I've bought nearly all the sets, followed what there is of the story with rabid interest in hopes that it will better itself eventually, and have listened to (and watched) most media.

I'm usually the first to come across most news relating to Hero Factory, have made numerous HF MoCs both IRL and on LDD, and have defended it against many criticisms and fought for it in many debates. In some ways, I prefer it to BIONICLE and think it does certain things better than BIONICLE.

It don't want it to become the dominant focus of BZP. Increased focus? Definiteiy. But to take away pre-existing focus from BIONICLE? Eh... I voted no.Only in the most dire of situations.

-Mesonak

Edited by Mesonak, Mar 20 2012 - 04:13 PM.

[bonesiii]

Honestly I don't think Hero Factory is likely to stick around for long enough to do that.

So voted for BZP... for now. A name change is probably in order but probably not to HF specifically. Or like I've said before, we could stick with "BZP" as Buildable-figure (or buildfig...) zone power, including Bionicle, HF, and anything else like it that comes up in the future.

Or just Build Zone Power, encompassing all of LEGO.

[Makuta_of_Oz]

No.

[Aanchir: Rachira of Time]

No. I think the site's current focus is the path it should continue to follow: a general LEGO site, but with preference to themes like Hero Factory and Ninjago that follow in BIONICLE's footsteps in one way or another. What would make a Hero Factory focus any better than a BIONICLE focus in terms of longevity? Sure, right now Hero Factory shows no signs of going away. Neither did BIONICLE for the most part up until 2005-2006, when its growth started to level off in advent of a coming decline. Switching to a focus on one particular theme just sets us up for another inevitable change of focus should Hero Factory eventually end (and we have to remember that perennial LEGO themes are the exception rather than the norm).

Besides, what would a Hero Factory focus accomplish, really? Hero Factory already has by far the most discussion here of any currently-running LEGO theme. News coverage of Hero Factory is more comprehensive than any other theme, usually covering every set in the theme (generous donations of sets for review purposes help with this). What would branding ourselves as a Hero Factory site do for us other than changing the site header yet again to reflect that purpose, when discussion of Hero Factory, BIONICLE, and other LEGO themes would probably continue at the same pace? At best it would be a purely nominal change, with no impact on the site, whereas at worst it would alienate LEGO and BIONICLE fans who aren't especially fond of Hero Factory.

Some people wonder why we're still called BZPower if we're no longer strictly a BIONICLE site, but BZPower is just a name that shows the site's heritage as a merger of the sites BIONICLE Zone and Kanohi Power. It has little, if anything, to do with the site's mission, and frankly I'm sure many newcomers might not realize the name's significance at all.

[Peach 00]

Nope.

(I'd love to see it expand in LEGO discussion and HF discussion, but I would like to see the primary focus stay BIONICLE, regardless of its death. It was meant to be BIONICLE, so obviously it should stay BIONICLE.)

Edited by Peach 00, Mar 20 2012 - 09:53 PM.

[Applejack]

I voted yes.
Bionicle is dead, and the site's dying.

[Makuta_of_Oz]

I voted yes.
Bionicle is dead, and the site's dying.

*has brought a squadron of Tahnok*

I assume you're prepared for flaming?

[T3CHn0-LAz0oRZ]

^that is awesome^
anyway, it doesn;t make any difference, this site is this site, it's a cool site
but i would like to see an option on the poll to change it to spinjitzu-power.com

[Roablin]

Nope. I like Bionicle.

[Applejack]

I voted yes.
Bionicle is dead, and the site's dying.

*has brought a squadron of Tahnok*

I assume you're prepared for flaming?

Nice pun.

But yes. It is a good day to die.

[DeeVee]

No. I love HF more than the next person, at least set-wise, I think it has movies I haven't really seen.

But I think the site should continue as a basic LEGO site with a focus on constraction figures first and foremost.

[Makuta_of_Oz]

But I think the site should continue as a basic LEGO site with a focus on constraction figures first and foremost.

What if Bionicle comes back? Will this place become primarily a Bionicle forum again?

[Eljay: Toa of Mangosteen]

No. I am not the biggest HF fan, so that's a contributor, and I understand Bionicle is 100% dead with no return in the next 10+ years, but BZP did start on Bionicle, and I'd much rather have a Lego/Bionicle focused forum then an HF/Lego focus, as that wouldn't do anyone any good.

[DeeVee]

But I think the site should continue as a basic LEGO site with a focus on constraction figures first and foremost.

What if Bionicle comes back? Will this place become primarily a Bionicle forum again?

We would most likely be a LEGO forum with the heaviest BIONICLE presence on the Internet, as I assume it would be TLG's only real constraction figure line.

I'd much rather have a Lego/Bionicle focused forum then an HF/Lego focus, as that wouldn't do anyone any good.

That doesn't make any sense. Having a forum devoted solely to a dead and gone toyline with a story that has disintegrated and has little interesting mystery left to keep conversation and news moving does people a lot less good than a HF/Lego focus that actually has something to discuss on a daily basis.

People seem to forget that a LEGO site with a constraction figure slant still includes BIONICLE disucssion.

[Bambi]

But I think the site should continue as a basic LEGO site with a focus on constraction figures first and foremost.

What if Bionicle comes back? Will this place become primarily a Bionicle forum again?

You really need to accept the fact that Bionicle is dead. Hero Factory seems to be doing it fine, so I doubt they're going to just end it.

[Makuta_of_Oz]

But I think the site should continue as a basic LEGO site with a focus on constraction figures first and foremost.

What if Bionicle comes back? Will this place become primarily a Bionicle forum again?

You really need to accept the fact that Bionicle is dead. Hero Factory seems to be doing it fine, so I doubt they're going to just end it.

Do you WANT to make this a flame war?

[Axilus Prime]

We've been over this question a thousand times. As long as there are fans, the Bionicle theme lives on, storyline, sets, or not.

[Makuta_of_Oz]

We've been over this question a thousand times. As long as there are fans, the Bionicle theme lives on, storyline, sets, or not.

This.

Same can be said with Commander Keen, another unfinished series that was discontinued and abandoned by its creator nearly 20 years ago. Even today, communities and forums exist for it. Not every fan has abandoned it in favour of Wolfenstein and Doom.

Edited by Makuta_of_Oz, Mar 20 2012 - 09:37 PM.

[Bambi]

But I think the site should continue as a basic LEGO site with a focus on constraction figures first and foremost.

What if Bionicle comes back? Will this place become primarily a Bionicle forum again?

You really need to accept the fact that Bionicle is dead. Hero Factory seems to be doing it fine, so I doubt they're going to just end it.

Do you WANT to make this a flame war?

No I don't WANT to make this a flame war. There's nothing to flame about. I'm just saying you should move on, because it doesn't look like Bionicle is coming back anytime soon.

[Peach 00]

Many people on BZP live in fantasy worlds that believe the franchise is going to come back like J.R.R Tolkien's ghost coming up from his grave. Truth is, it isn't going to happen. From a psychological standpoint, most of you are just going through denial, a stage which you guys lingering a little too long in. It's gone, and you people need to realize it.

I'd love it if the site primarly focused on constraction figures, but still focusing on BIONICLE. But look: BIONICLE lives on in all of us, here with us physically in set form or not, it's with us. It lives on, but the toyline itself isn't coming back. People can remain loyal all they want, but LEGO has already chosen Hero Factory as BIONICLE's successor. I don't mind you loving the theme, but just don't keep on saying it's going to come back, even though the line has been dead for two years. And even if it does come back, it's probably going to be nothing like the old toyline we have come to know and love.

Regardless, I don't want to discuss the topic any further. Don't try to make this a flame war - you're simply pushing it further by arguing it will come back. Not that I'm helping it any better than you are, I'd prefer it if the issue were closed now. People here have differences of opinion, and obviously many of us in this topic do. So let's just leave it at this, bury the hatchet and move on. Nobody's right and nobody wrong in this case, and neither side has fact to prove their argument as right. Unless you can prove otherwise, I suggest we move on and continue to discuss, not argue.

(Keep in mind I'm not meaning to offend anybody here, [not that I can entirely avoid doing that...] but I'm just ranting about this because I'm tired of this issue being opened and closed on a regular basis. If it comes back, it comes back. If it doesn't, it doesn't.)

Edited by Peach 00, Mar 20 2012 - 09:51 PM.

[Malignus]

I vote no. even if we may need a name change, this is not the ideal choice. Furthermore, the whole theme of this site has been Bionicle from the beginning. the only reason this site even does reviews of HF and Marvel Heroes sets is because they are Bionicle's successors. We can still do reviews and news on those lines, but the main focus of BZP should remain Bionicle.

[Makuta_of_Oz]

Keep in mind that if Star Trek fans had, as a group, said, "No point in talking about this anymore, it's never going to come back," it never WOULD have come back.

The way I'm seeig things here, it's like many posters here don't even WANT Bionicle back!

[Overmegasixwave]

Keep in mind that if Star Trek fans had, as a group, said, "No point in talking about this anymore, it's never going to come back," it never WOULD have come back.

The way I'm seeig things here, it's like many posters here don't even WANT Bionicle back!

I officially don't want it back out of spite.

[Applejack]

The way I'm seeig things here, it's like many posters here don't even WANT Bionicle back!

I blame the bring back Bionicle guys.

[bonesiii]

Guys, here's a tip. Telling others to not flame, while talking about Tahnok and saying people are living in fantasy worlds, is not exactly consistent. Yeah? People have different opinions and desires about a possible Bionicle return. Neither preference is wrong. And that's that. (And I've shown pretty conclusively that Bionicle MIGHT come back, and if it does, those who don't really want it can simply ignore it.)

Besides, about half the posts in here have been almost totally off-topic. (And I've reported them to be looked at.) Please stop.

Posting this just to get yall to stop until VB staff get here.

The VB Staff endorses this post and see no need to add anything further at this time (Thanks, Bonesiii). Play nice, everybody! -Smeag

Edited by McSmeag, Mar 20 2012 - 10:58 PM.

[Tenebrae Invictus]

The wording of the question the poll headline was confusing, so I voted Yea, but meant Nay. I only saw the question that suits the poll after I click cast.

SO I MEANT NO

[Peach 00]

I obviously didn't help things, my apologies. Thank you for the reminder to all of us, however. Nonetheless, my thoughts as I have said before have been that the focus of BIONICLE will remain a primary subject of discussion on the site, but it'd be great to see expansion in the discussion of LEGO and Hero Factory. LEGO is the primary reason BIONICLE even exists, so it'd be nice to see even more about it than we are now. But, I'd still prefer BZP over HFP, just as many others would, obviously.

(Again, sorry for getting off-topic and arguing. I just get tired after awhile and ignoring it is hard to do. Not that ranting is the best reasoning to solving the problem, putting in my two cents is always nice. Sorry for the offensive comments I made about fantasy worlds, and my apologies to Makuta_of_Oz and others I may have offended.)

[Makuta_of_Oz]

I, too, apologise for going off-topic. My addiction (trust me, it IS an addiction, and I believe I am experiencing withdrawal symptoms) clouded my judgement.

[fishers64]

No. We still discuss Bionicle here. We are one of the few places, if not the only, that still do.

[Sumiki]

First off, Bambi, I think this is a great poll - but I do think that it would be better served if further clarified.

I voted that it really doesn't matter - not because I really feel that way, but rather because it's pretty much the closest thing that comes to my position on the issue.

My position is that BZP should do whatever it can to survive. If that means focusing on LEGO, with a specific focus on constraction, with an emphasis on BIONICLE, then I'm all for doing that over staying die-hard BIONICLE and then having the site die over a period of a few years. The forum layout is much better at giving off that impression - we stay true to the core roots of BIONICLE upon which this site was founded and has grown to maturity, while at the same time branching out from discussion of a dead line into other related realms. It's great that we're continuing to have BIONICLE discussion, don't get me wrong, but we cannot continue to have a site based solely on discussion of a singular, dead line. That's like buying stocks in one seemingly blue chip company, but as that company sinks down rapidly, you have to diversify your portfolio.

If it survives, no matter what is being discussed, a piece of BIONICLE lives on. We might not all be the most ardent fans, but the vast majority of us still like it to some degree. We might not all be willing to petition LEGO - either out of our own opinions on its end or from realistic judging of that strategy's unlikely prospects of effectiveness - but we still, as a community, enjoy it. The glue which brought this community together is still there.

[Bambi]

First off, Bambi, I think this is a great poll - but I do think that it would be better served if further clarified.

How so?

[Malignus]

First off, Bambi, I think this is a great poll - but I do think that it would be better served if further clarified.

I voted that it really doesn't matter - not because I really feel that way, but rather because it's pretty much the closest thing that comes to my position on the issue.

My position is that BZP should do whatever it can to survive. If that means focusing on LEGO, with a specific focus on constraction, with an emphasis on BIONICLE, then I'm all for doing that over staying die-hard BIONICLE and then having the site die over a period of a few years. The forum layout is much better at giving off that impression - we stay true to the core roots of BIONICLE upon which this site was founded and has grown to maturity, while at the same time branching out from discussion of a dead line into other related realms. It's great that we're continuing to have BIONICLE discussion, don't get me wrong, but we cannot continue to have a site based solely on discussion of a singular, dead line. That's like buying stocks in one seemingly blue chip company, but as that company sinks down rapidly, you have to diversify your portfolio.

If it survives, no matter what is being discussed, a piece of BIONICLE lives on. We might not all be the most ardent fans, but the vast majority of us still like it to some degree. We might not all be willing to petition LEGO - either out of our own opinions on its end or from realistic judging of that strategy's unlikely prospects of effectiveness - but we still, as a community, enjoy it. The glue which brought this community together is still there.

I concur with Sumiki, with a slight nay bias, that we should branch out. however, so many people get so worked up on such trivial topics that i wonder why we have such discussions. this is a great and important topic, don't get me wrong. but the topics are for discussing, not flaming.

[Half a Cup of EW]

I loved BIONICLE, but I want BZP to survive. If the site has to change in order to continue to attract and keep new members, then so be it. People can still discuss BIONICLE even if it isn't the main focus of the site anymore; it's not 'betrayal' whatsoever.

[GSR]

Frankly speaking, to the best of my knowledge HF hasn't got nearly the sort of active community Bionicle had in its heyday, and it may very well wind up being a much shorter-term line, so I don't think a full-out switch to a "HFPower" would be a good idea. However, I've said it before, and I'll say it again: as a guy whose username used to be "GoldenSunRules", there's nothing wrong with branching out while keeping a familiar identity. BZP might be identified with Bionicle, but there's no need for it to be synonymous with it.

[Sumiki]

First off, Bambi, I think this is a great poll - but I do think that it would be better served if further clarified.

How so?

I, for one, was rather confused with the seeming discrepancy between your title and your poll options. I think some have confused "yays" for "nays" in the poll - if they don't read your original post, things can get confusing really quickly.

Edited by Sumiki, Mar 20 2012 - 11:41 PM.

[Eljay: Toa of Mangosteen]

I'd much rather have a Lego/Bionicle focused forum then an HF/Lego focus, as that wouldn't do anyone any good.

That doesn't make any sense. Having a forum devoted solely to a dead and gone toyline with a story that has disintegrated and has little interesting mystery left to keep conversation and news moving does people a lot less good than a HF/Lego focus that actually has something to discuss on a daily basis.

People seem to forget that a LEGO site with a constraction figure slant still includes BIONICLE disucssion.

Sure, that is true, and I am sure I can hunt down a bunch of other forums/fan bases of which have managed to discuss any number of subjects for a period of time longer than Bionicle has been around, one of which is Earthbound. While it's true that you can get more discussion/news daily out of Hero Factory and other Lego themes, I think that a lot of the BZPopulace may like to see just a little bit of BZP's roots sticking around. And that would more than likely be out of dedication. Not saying that it would be preferred that BZP grasp the dead/dying straws of Bionicle's "passing", just thinking that BZP would seem a little more unique sticking even slightly to it's roots.

[DeeVee]

I'd much rather have a Lego/Bionicle focused forum then an HF/Lego focus, as that wouldn't do anyone any good.

That doesn't make any sense. Having a forum devoted solely to a dead and gone toyline with a story that has disintegrated and has little interesting mystery left to keep conversation and news moving does people a lot less good than a HF/Lego focus that actually has something to discuss on a daily basis.

People seem to forget that a LEGO site with a constraction figure slant still includes BIONICLE disucssion.

Sure, that is true, and I am sure I can hunt down a bunch of other forums/fan bases of which have managed to discuss any number of subjects for a period of time longer than Bionicle has been around, one of which is Earthbound. While it's true that you can get more discussion/news daily out of Hero Factory and other Lego themes, I think that a lot of the BZPopulace may like to see just a little bit of BZP's roots sticking around. And that would more than likely be out of dedication. Not saying that it would be preferred that BZP grasp the dead/dying straws of Bionicle's "passing", just thinking that BZP would seem a little more unique sticking even slightly to it's roots.

Where did this idea, that BZP is "losing it's roots" or ignoring BIONICLE come from? We just added Hapori Tohu back into the site, to purposefully maintain a visual homage to our roots. We started as a BIONICLE site, we are now so much more, but we are all aware that we started as, and owe ourselves to, that role as the world's largest BIONICLE and LEGO community. None of us have any desire to pretend that BIONICLE never happened or outlaw its discussion or ignore our roots. If there were real BIONICLE stories to be put on the front page, we'd put them there. There's not.

Guys, here's a tip. Telling others to not flame, while talking about Tahnok and saying people are living in fantasy worlds, is not exactly consistent. Yeah? People have different opinions and desires about a possible Bionicle return. Neither preference is wrong. And that's that. (And I've shown pretty conclusively that Bionicle MIGHT come back, and if it does, those who don't really want it can simply ignore it.)

Besides, about half the posts in here have been almost totally off-topic. (And I've reported them to be looked at.) Please stop.

Posting this just to get yall to stop until VB staff get here.

The VB Staff endorses this post and see no need to add anything further at this time (Thanks, Bonesiii). Play nice, everybody! -Smeag

I'm sorry Bonesiii, but no, while both preferences as to the desire for BIONICLE to come back are valid, the opinions on whether or not it will come back are not equally valid, and it is really about time a lot of people come to terms with that. LEGO's representatives have said that they as a company have moved on from BIONICLE, that like 9V trains (a direct connection TLG has made themselves between the two themes with avid fans hoping for more), BIONICLE is dead and has been replaced and that it will not come back. The BIONICLE line is through as far as TLG is concerned, and they have moved on, applying what they learned from BIONICLE to Hero Factory and system themes with storylines like Ninjago. While there is a chance that BIONICLE could return (and I do not think you have proved anything at all in your topic you reference), it is miniscule, and does not make that opinion as valid as the other.

Keep in mind that if Star Trek fans had, as a group, said, "No point in talking about this anymore, it's never going to come back," it never WOULD have come back.

The way I'm seeig things here, it's like many posters here don't even WANT Bionicle back!

And guess what? We not only are okay with people discussing BIONICLE, we want people to actively engage in its discussion still. We want you guys to post in S&T, we want you guys to make fanfiction, art, and MOCs. We want those things to continue. We do not endorse ending all disucssions about BIONICLE. THIS is what Greg meant when he said what he said, not "keep bringing up bringing it back until it comes back, keep refusing to admit it is dead, because then it will come back". He meant "Star Trek was over, but people kept engaging with it, kept interacting with it, taking it new places, to such a strong degree that the studios realized this could be a profitable venture, and after research and other studio type things, brought it back". Star Trek fans did not sit around just ranting about how it needed to come back or else. They, like most fans of dead or defunct franchises, just kept enjoying it together. We want you guys to do that. Because if there was any chance for BIONICLE to gain that kind of cultural impact, it is through engaging in the franchise still together, not through petitions or clubs to bring it back. Not through refusing to admit it is officially done.

[Makuta_of_Oz]

Keep in mind that if Star Trek fans had, as a group, said, "No point in talking about this anymore, it's never going to come back," it never WOULD have come back.

The way I'm seeig things here, it's like many posters here don't even WANT Bionicle back!

And guess what? We not only are okay with people discussing BIONICLE, we want people to actively engage in its discussion still. We want you guys to post in S&T, we want you guys to make fanfiction, art, and MOCs. We want those things to continue. We do not endorse ending all disucssions about BIONICLE. THIS is what Greg meant when he said what he said, not "keep bringing up bringing it back until it comes back, keep refusing to admit it is dead, because then it will come back". He meant "Star Trek was over, but people kept engaging with it, kept interacting with it, taking it new places, to such a strong degree that the studios realized this could be a profitable venture, and after research and other studio type things, brought it back". Star Trek fans did not sit around just ranting about how it needed to come back or else. They, like most fans of dead or defunct franchises, just kept enjoying it together. We want you guys to do that. Because if there was any chance for BIONICLE to gain that kind of cultural impact, it is through engaging in the franchise still together, not through petitions or clubs to bring it back. Not through refusing to admit it is officially done.

I know what it means. What I meant was that a few people in this thread sounded like they wanted us to move on pretty much completely from Bionicle discussion, which would make it look like it wasn't worth bringing back.

Edited by Makuta_of_Oz, Mar 21 2012 - 01:52 AM.

[Eljay: Toa of Mangosteen]

I'd much rather have a Lego/Bionicle focused forum then an HF/Lego focus, as that wouldn't do anyone any good.

That doesn't make any sense. Having a forum devoted solely to a dead and gone toyline with a story that has disintegrated and has little interesting mystery left to keep conversation and news moving does people a lot less good than a HF/Lego focus that actually has something to discuss on a daily basis.

People seem to forget that a LEGO site with a constraction figure slant still includes BIONICLE disucssion.

Sure, that is true, and I am sure I can hunt down a bunch of other forums/fan bases of which have managed to discuss any number of subjects for a period of time longer than Bionicle has been around, one of which is Earthbound. While it's true that you can get more discussion/news daily out of Hero Factory and other Lego themes, I think that a lot of the BZPopulace may like to see just a little bit of BZP's roots sticking around. And that would more than likely be out of dedication. Not saying that it would be preferred that BZP grasp the dead/dying straws of Bionicle's "passing", just thinking that BZP would seem a little more unique sticking even slightly to it's roots.

Where did this idea, that BZP is "losing it's roots" or ignoring BIONICLE come from? We just added Hapori Tohu back into the site, to purposefully maintain a visual homage to our roots. We started as a BIONICLE site, we are now so much more, but we are all aware that we started as, and owe ourselves to, that role as the world's largest BIONICLE and LEGO community. None of us have any desire to pretend that BIONICLE never happened or outlaw its discussion or ignore our roots. If there were real BIONICLE stories to be put on the front page, we'd put them there. There's not.

I am merely speaking within the context of the topic's subject. I didn't see anywhere in my posts where I said "BZP is currently a titanic forum! Get to the floatation devices!" BZP is fine right now, IMO, so nothin' to worry about.