65 replies to this topic

[Scanty Demon]

So a few "Bionicle will/won't return" debates have popped up, I want to know what you think of these debates? Please don't discuss whether or not you think Bionicle will return, just discuss what you think when you see these debates.

[an cool dude]

They have been going on forever and they are getting really really really old.

[Applejack]

I think... "Oh, I can up my cost count one!""Here we go again...."

[Bambi]

Entertainment!

[Toa Smoke Monster]

"...and here we go once again."

This is usually what pops into my head when I see one of these debates starting up.

[Electric Turahk]

They need to stop. At this point, the instigators have to be doing it to purposefully antagonize certain individuals on the other side. If you already know how they're going to respond, why instigate it?

It's plain annoying.

~|ET|~

[Ballom]

My opinion mostly is the following: "Everyone, put down the sticks and step away from the dead horse, and nobody gets hurt."

~B~

[GSR]

By and large fruitless, not to mention they tend to pop up in topics only tangentially related to the subject. It's good to keep awareness of the current situation alive, but there's only so many times one can argue the same points over and over when there's been essentially no new evidence one way or the other to work off of.

[Makuta_of_Oz]

They've come back? :/

I really HAVE spent too much time away from the blogs!

[Gatanui]

Here´s an idea, guys. Instead of arguing about whether BIONICLE will return or not, why not simply wait a few years and see?

-Gata

[Paleo]

Here´s an idea, guys. Instead of arguing about whether BIONICLE will return or not, why not simply wait a few years and see?

-Gata

I second this. But as bones said in one of his essay posts, it might be a long time.

[Makuta_of_Oz]

Here´s an idea, guys. Instead of arguing about whether BIONICLE will return or not, why not simply wait a few years and see?

-Gata

Agreed. Patience is a virtue.

Though dropping a few hints doesn't hurt either...

[Sumiki]

I think it's ridiculous to say that it will never ever ever under any circumstances whatsoever return. I'm sure that LEGO officials have, in so many words, stated that, but it's also impossible to know what LEGO will do in, say, 2042.

That being said, I take the word of those same LEGO employees in that BIONICLE will not return in the near or immediate future, because it's not. I think the only realistic prospect of its return is in a farther and unforeseeable future.

I do get sick of the tireless debates which essentially rehash the same arguments for and against every single time. It gets pretty old pretty quick.

[fishers64]

Interesting...I'll watch this.

[Tekulo the WindWriter]

Eh, I think it's pretty much pointless to keep that debate alive. I tend to just go somewhere else when I see the debates now.

Edited by Tekulo: Toa of Gales, Apr 01 2012 - 11:55 AM.

[bonesiii]

The interesting thing about the current debate is that apparently new information actually is being brought up. Prior to that I would have said pretty much what the rest of yall are saying -- it's been discussed to death already (actually I did say that and apparently I was wrong about that).

[Gatanui]

Here´s an idea, guys. Instead of arguing about whether BIONICLE will return or not, why not simply wait a few years and see?

-Gata

I second this. But as bones said in one of his essay posts, it might be a long time.

It´s the only way to know for sure, everything else is basically speculation.

-Gata

Edited by Gatanui, Apr 01 2012 - 12:41 PM.

[Skarloth]

It's actually annoying to see these debates still floating around, even after all this time. I'm convinced Bionicle is over, and that there's no further need to debate about it. So, when these debates come along, I usually just roll my eyes, and stay out of them.

-Skar

[Peach 00]

It's an exasperating tradition that's been blown up throughout the community since the news broke, and I personally am sick of it. Shoot me for being downright honest about my thoughts, but I think the Bring Back BIONICLE Club and others have gotten out of hand for their continuous arguing with others about its return. Others (including myself) haven't been much better about the repetitive, quarrelsome attitude, but others like myself have gotten thoroughly annoyed.

The debate has been rehashed over and over, and it needs to be ended by simply saying either, "We'll wait with patience to see if it will come back," or, "Nobody's right and nobody's wrong, and there's no way to prove if anybody could be right or wrong." Nonetheless, I get irritated about it. To me, there's no point in the debates, no point in the movement, and no reason why LEGO would give in to these BIONICLE fans' demand.

[Lyichir]

It's an exasperating tradition that's been blown up throughout the community since the news broke, and I personally am sick of it. Shoot me for being downright honest about my thoughts, but I think the Bring Back BIONICLE Club and others have gotten out of hand for their continuous arguing with others about its return. Others (including myself) haven't been much better about the repetitive, quarrelsome attitude, but others like myself have gotten thoroughly annoyed.

The debate has been rehashed over and over, and it needs to be ended by simply saying either, "We'll wait with patience to see if it will come back," or, "Nobody's right and nobody's wrong, and there's no way to prove if anybody could be right or wrong." Nonetheless, I get irritated about it. To me, there's no point in the debates, no point in the movement, and no reason why LEGO would give in to these BIONICLE fans' demand.

I think there's more to the debates than that. I've found them to be eye-opening. They involve discussions on what made BIONICLE unique, what causes led to its end, what changes could be made to make it viable again, and how much it could change without losing what made it BIONICLE in the first place. I'm not trying to convince LEGO that BIONICLE should or shouldn't return, and I don't pretend to have any control over LEGO's decisions one way or the other. But these debates are a vehicle for members to reflect and to speculate, and I get more insight out of them than from echo-chamber-like topics where members post how much they liked or disliked BIONICLE and ignore members with differing views. I acknowledge that these debates tend to spring up in topics they're only marginally related to, but they're currently the most interesting thing happening on BZP.

[Cederak]

I'm pretty apathetic about the debating, actually. You don't win anything for being right or being wrong, and debating does not suggest either side is doing anything about the matter (like asking Lego to bring back Bionicle, or less likely if they are BZP members, telling them it was a good idea to retire the line). I believe talk is cheap. A theory, no matter how thought out or explained, cannot infallibly predict Bionicle's return or permanent end. We simply don't have that kind of access to that kind of information. In the case of Bionicle, a company will decide what is right for itself and BZP members can choose for themselves how to spend their time. Unless your ultimate plan is to control the Lego Company to the extent of deciding which particular lines are revived or not (which would require years of working your way up quite a corporate ladder), there is an extreme possibility that all the arguing, all the theories, all the requests to Lego, will not noticeably affect the outcome of whether Bionicle returns or not. It will be left in the hands of someone else - someone situated above talk and able to act. All that said, I think people have every right to voice opinions and beliefs. If you don't want to read about the topic at hand, don't read it. And if you want to discuss Bionicle's return, no one here is stopping you, so long as you can remain civil. At the very least, one member will walk away inspired or educated.


tl;dr - I don't really care about the debates.

-Ced

[Mesonak]

I used to enjoy being a part of the discussion because it was an interesting and relevant topic due to the freshness of the cancellation and uncertainty regarding Hero Factory.

2 years+ later... it really isn't, nor is it enjoyable to partake in anymore. Rather then debating BIONICLE's return, effort should be made in sustaining its relevance in the community for as long as humanly possible and not letting it die out. Which is, thankfully, what most have done and are doing.

And such.

-Mesonak

Edited by Mesonak, Apr 02 2012 - 10:58 PM.

[Taka Nuvia]

_{Call me deaf or blind, but somehow I've managed to miss out on all of them so far :/}
Can I still give my opinion? I guess so.

Since this is a Bionicle community, discussion like that is inevitable. It doesn't really help, it probably won't change anything, but it happens. And as long as both (or all three, if "I don't care" counts as well) sides keep it all nice and as long as there's no flaming, a reasonable debate is completely fine, IMO.

[The Inquisitive Automaton]

I think at this point, it's just been wasting their breath (or whatever the substitute is for breath when one is typing). There's pretty much no chance of Bionicle returning any time soon, so anyone who posts theories on its return or requests everyone to sign their petition is just being a little too optimistic, not that there's anything wrong with that, but it's always better to be a realist. Or a pessimist. That way, you can't be disappointed.

[Aanchir: Rachira of Time]

I think this sort of debate is a good way for people on different sides of the issue to exchange ideas. People who are skeptical about a return can share the reasons why they think a return is unlikely, or ideas regarding the obstacles that would be in the way of a potential return. On the other side, people who do hope for or expect a return can brainstorm ways to overcome those obstacles and reasons why it might be worth the trouble to overcome them instead of starting fresh with an entirely new story the way BIONICLE did in 2001 and Ninjago has done in BIONICLE's wake. Both sides are also able to provide insight on what made BIONICLE so unique among other themes, for better or worse.

The important thing to these debates, though, is to always keep in mind that they're not going to change whether or not the theme comes back. That will be entirely at TLG's discretion and will probably be based largely on how well the theme can bring in new fans, not on how well it will appeal to older fans. People who don't expect or hope for a return aren't betraying the theme or hurting the theme's chances of coming back, and people who do expect or hope for a return aren't convincing TLG that a return would be necessary or even a financial benefit.

If BIONICLE does come back, it will essentially have to prove its potential from scratch just as it did during its initial development in 2000. Its dedicated fandom couldn't keep it alive past 2010, so I don't think its dedicated fandom would be what convinces TLG that it's worth another try. Its return, and the form it takes if it happens, will depend on internal decisions at TLG that will probably happen without any of our knowledge. So we as fans can only speculate based on what they've said in the past.

Edited by Aanchir: Rachira of Time, Apr 06 2012 - 08:44 AM.

[Sir Kohran]

The continual debates result from the fact that both sides have valid arguments.

Lego still exist, they're in a healthy financial condition, and they still own the Bionicle name. There could probably be Bionicle sets on the shelves next year if Lego desired it. A return is entirely possible.

Simultaneously however, it's fairly well established that in Bionicle's later years it showed little or no significant sales growth, the storyline had become bloated and inaccessible to newcomers, and the books were steadily dwindling in number and sales. Its place as a constraction figure line has since been filled by Hero Factory, which appears to be doing well enough for the time being. There's no need or point in a Bionicle return.

In summary, there is no theoretical reason that Bionicle won't return, and there's no practical reason that it will.

Ultimately, unless either Lego collapse, or Bionicle does return, neither side can declare the other to be wrong.

Edited by Sir Kohran, Apr 06 2012 - 10:37 AM.

[bonesiii]

Simultaneously however, it's fairly well established that in Bionicle's later years it showed little or no significant sales growth, the storyline had become bloated and inaccessible to newcomers, and the books were steadily dwindling in number and sales. Its place as a constraction figure line has since been filled by Hero Factory, which appears to be doing well enough for the time being. There's no need or point in a Bionicle return.

I agree with you that the "it won't return" viewpoint is very valid, and probably the most likely -- but this reasoning doesn't necessarily support the conclusion of there being "no point" to a return, because this shows what happened after Bionicle had been going continuously. A return could feel "just as if new" to new fans, after a significant break, so could pull in new fans just as easily, plus possibly a boost.

But of course, it's also possible something inherent to Bionicle would still make it sell more poorly than a brand new line, so this doesn't prove a return would be successful either. Let's just not confuse the results of Bionicle getting very old with what the results of a (limited) Bionicle return could be.

[Tahu Nuva 3.0]

I'm tired of all the debating. Lego has every right whether or not to continue the product and storyline.

Bioncile was an amazing run and Lego really pays attention to fans, as we've seen from petition-inspired sets like Minecraft and others,

I am not hopeful that sets will ever return. Because if it does people will complain since they will be more like HF sets possibly.

I can hope that Lego will allow Greg to at least continue the serials. But right now with his personal life and working with Lego, he does not have any time and Lego realizes that they do not have to deal with it right now.

[Randy Disher]

These debates seem to go on and on without anything happening, and are fairly boring.

[KlakWest]

"...and here we go once again."

This is usually what pops into my head when I see one of these debates starting up.

I thought that when I read the title of this topic.
I think the debate has merit in the sense that people have the right to do it, however, it can get tiring. On one side you have neigh-sayers. On the other, you have people who want Bionicle to return tomorrow.

I would like Bionicle to come back. Even if will be too old to enjoy it by then, I can rest assured that my children will. We shall see in the future.

[Axilus Prime]

If it comes back, it won't be what we know. It'll be more like Transformers was. A new version. A revamp. A remake. Could be anything from similar to no resemblance at all aside from design.

[Akuna Toa of Sonics]

They have really been becoming a nuisance.

[BenLuke]

Meh If it comes back it will come back, and I will be happy. If it doesn't it doesn't, and I will still be happy.

[Taka Nuvia]

[...]

I am not hopeful that sets will ever return. Because if it does people will complain since they will be more like HF sets possibly.
[...]

You know, from what I've seen, complaints are usually the first reaction to anything new or different ...

[BenLuke]

Complaints are usually the first response to everything.

[fishers64]

Complaints are usually the first response to everything.

I disagree with that. If a board notification pings in on my email or Bionicle comes back or something like that, my first response will be "Yay! Awesome!".

Complaints will come later.

[ZHX]

Wait, there are debates?

Oh yeah, there are debates at times. I don't really pay attention to them, nor do I really think much about if BIONICLE would come back or not.

[Yon]

I like seeing these debates, as it shows that someone apart from me actually cares about what this site was founded on once in a while.

[KlakWest]

I like seeing these debates, as it shows that someone apart from me actually cares about what this site was founded on once in a while.

Outdeed.

[Dimension Lord]

While I'd like to see the line return, I'm not sure what I would do if it did, I'm a bit older now. If I remember correctly the debates didn't usually go anywhere, the same stuff would be said on both sides over and over.

Edited by Dimension Lord, Apr 09 2012 - 04:58 PM.