20 replies to this topic

[Cederak]

Regrettably, the last GD Library Discussion topic entered DNR status a couple months back, so here's a new place for the writers to come together and discuss some ideas. To start off, I have some questions (some are mine, some came from others) for you to consider. If you have anything to add to these questions, or other ideas for the Library, feel free to mention it.

-Ced


1.) Should the entire Library have a 300 word minimum? Why?

2.) Should comedies be merged with the rest of the library? Why?

3.) Should the "one chapter per 24 hours" rule be reinstated for anyone not reposting an epic from the old board?

4.) Do you want a CoT Library? Why? If a CoT Library existed, how often would you make use of it?

5.) Are there any ideas, themes, etc. you feel would be better expressed in your writing without a Bionicle influence? What are they?

6.) How often do you post a story? How often do you review?

7.) Do you use the critic clubs? Why or why not? Do you find the critic clubs useful?

8.) Who are some of your favorite Library writers? What are some of your favorite Library stories? What's your favorite self-written work?


1.) Should the entire Library have a 300 word minimum? Why?
(I've encountered some Epic and SS writers that can't be bothered to crank out 300 words for a chapter or story. It's fair to say there are exceptions to the rule, and less than 300 words could be sufficient, though that seldom seems to be the case.)

2.) Should comedies be merged with the rest of the library? Why?
(An argument was posed to me recently under the question, "What's the difference between a humorous epic and a multi-post comedy? What's the difference between a single-post comedy and a humorous short story? If the difference is only a matter or preference on where to post the idea, why not eliminate the burden of choice?" The script format is more widely used in comedies, but that's not to say it doesn't exist in the occasional epic or SS.)

3.) Should the "one chapter per 24 hours" rule be reinstated for anyone not reposting an epic from the old board?
(When did quantity over quality become the recipe for success? In earlier BZP days, epics were posted at most, once per week, often on a Friday, Saturday or Sunday. That was the norm. Now people are dumping a couple chapters a day into their work. Even if prospective readers choose to keep up with that rate of posting, a post a day suggests a couple things. A: You're going to be busy soon and want some of the later work posted now. B: You already wrote the entire epic and just want to get it posted now. C: You got an idea for your next chapter, wrote it up, and posted it.
Now, regarding scenario A, I can understand that. Sometimes. Scenario B shows a lack of restraint, simply dumping out an entire piece as "well, I'm done, might as well show BZP what I've done." The problem is how the episodic pace of usual epics is removed. The fun feeling of a cliffhanger chapter feels less powerful, because the next chapter isn't a week away, it's a mouse scroll away. The process hampers what can be a fun experience for the reader and also promotes patience, for both the audience and the writer. More importantly, the writer has less time to proofread.
So then we have scenario C. With less of a timeframe between when an idea comes together and when it gets posted, you'll typically find the quality of the work suffers for it, lacking the proofreading it needs and what could've been a strongly executed story feels flat, because the writer rushed. This can also be considered a lesson in patience, but more for the writer in this case. There needs to be a time for writing, a time for gathering thoughts, a time for editing, and a time when all of the aforementioned have been addressed to completion, at which point posting the chapter makes more sense.
Ultimately, a writer that can police his/herself and properly pace how often their chapters are released will probably create a more rewarding experience both for themselves and the members who choose to read their work.)

4.) Do you want a CoT Library? Why? If a CoT Library existed, how often would you make use of it?
(I imagine most writers are in favor of this one, despite how unlikely it is. Unless, of course, you enjoy having your CoT written work get kicked into obscurity within hours.)

5.) Are there any ideas, themes, etc. you feel would be better expressed in your writing without a Bionicle influence? What are they?
(We can't capture everything about people and twist it to work in the Bionicle universe. Love being a canon no-no inside the MU and my lack of interest for Spherus Magna is a good example of an idea I feel would be better expressed outside Bionicle work.)

6.) How often do you post a story? How often do you review?
(My posting frequency varies, but I try to review at least once every week or so.)

7.) Do you use the critic clubs? Why or why not? Do you find the critic clubs useful?
(As an active presence in the Library, I use the critic clubs when I have a chance, often after letting the general library users provide an opinion or two beforehand. I appreciate the feedback I receive from critic club reviews and I definitely find them useful. Also, if you want to ignore my positive response to critic clubs considering I am a critic club member, I'd understand.)

8.) Who are some of your favorite Library writers? What are some of your favorite Library stories? What's your favorite self-written work?
(Having worked with some of the Library's finest in the past year, my former colleagues in the SSCC and those I still work alongside in the ECC have become real favorites for me. I may cite specific examples later on, but they are some truly accomplished writers. In terms of a favorite self-written piece, my recently completed epic Cenotaphs is still fresh in my mind and close to my heart.)

Edited by Cederak, Oct 27 2012 - 07:58 PM.

[Aderia]

1.) Should the entire Library have a 300 word minimum? Why?
I vote yes. Even for flash fiction contests, there is a minimum of 400 words. I have yet to see a piece in the library under 300 words that was worth my while.

While I’m at it.

1.) Should the entire Library have a 300 word minimum? Why?
(I've encountered some Epic and SS writers that can't be bothered to crank out 300 words for a chapter or story. It's fair to say there are exceptions to the rule, and less than 300 words could be sufficient, though that seldom seems to be the case.)

Those of you who have been around BZP longer than I have, have you ever seen a 300 or less word story that was decent?

2.) Should comedies be merged with the rest of the library? Why?
Meaning no offense to either side, I’d rather that not happen. Cederak brought up a good point, when he asked what the difference was between a comedy and a humorous SS or epic, besides where it’s posted. I want to use that as my point, that’s really the only difference, and I’m okay with that. It makes the library look more organized, and it shows that we acknowledge each separate sub-forum by giving each Epic, Short Stories, and Comedies their own section.

If Comedies were to be merged, I think there would just be a whole bunch of confusion. It would also be unfair for Epics authors who have a separate review topic, their topics would be buried beneath the multi post comedies that get 10+ posts a day because their story and review topics are one and the same.

3.) Should the "one chapter per 24 hours" rule be reinstated for anyone not reposting an epic from the old board?
I actually don’t have much of an opinion on this. If an author has written an entire epic and wants to post it all at once, that’s their choice. Personally, that’s not what I would do, but to each their own.

4.) Do you want a CoT Library? Why? If a CoT Library existed, how often would you make use of it?
Yes. I think not having a COT library is bad for business, so to speak.

The Bionicle story line is dead. There’s only so much the authors can do to keep their fanfictions going. Not all of us have time to figure out what the behemoth that is the Expanded Multiverse is about.

A lot of really good writers have already expanded into COT, but the stories are buried within a matter of hours beneath Brony topics and Minecraft discussion etc. Etc. There are so many drowning stories that don’t deserve to drown.

If the writers who have been posting COT stories migrated to the hypothetical COT library, I would definitely make use of it. I’m not exactly sure why a COT library isn’t in place, because COT is frankly, a mess. That’s not bad, except for the poor drowning stories that deserve a chance.

5.) Are there any ideas, themes, etc. you feel would be better expressed in your writing without a Bionicle influence? What are they?
Yes. For example, emotions. Whenever I try to write about a person/robot who can shoot fire out of his hands and give him any depth, I feel like I could do so much better with an actual person who doesn’t live inside a giant robot and lives hundreds of thousands of years.

6.) How often do you post a story? How often do you review?
I haven’t been posting stories recently, but I try to review once a week or two.

7.) Do you use the critic clubs? Why or why not? Do you find the critic clubs useful?
On occasion, I do use the critic clubs because I can count on an honest and in depth review for my story, which is always useful. I’d recommend ECC and SSCC to authors in a heartbeat.

8.) Who are some of your favorite Library writers? What are some of your favorite Library stories? What's your favorite self-written work?
And one of my favorite self written works is probably my SSC8 Entry, All Our Sins Remembered. If I had to choose one off the top of my head to be proud of, it’s that one =) Also, for COT, I wrote a songfic, River, Oh River, Flow Gently for Me, that also has a special place on my ‘bookshelf’ because the song is from The Prince of Egypt, one of my favorite movies.

And here are my favorite writers/stories in no particular order, quoted from my library topic:

Recommendations

Epics
Second Chance by Grant Sud and Zo'Tomana
The Best Kept Secrets by the Wretched Automaton
Life is a Blank by Hahli Historian
Cenotaphs by Cederak


Short Stories
Authors (too many Short Stories to name)

Velox (Library)
GSR
Tolkein
Grant Sud (Library)
Cederak (Library)
Nuile (Library)
Peach 00 (Library)
Tyler Durden
Wretched Automaton
Zarayna (Library)
Legolover-361 (Library)
Nick SilverPen

There have been a couple name changes since I typed up the recommendation section of my library. Grant Sud goes by Quote (Mr. Traveler) these days. The Wretched Automaton has been ‘Grimoire Albastry’, ‘Marluxia’, and ‘Sechs – King of Façade’ since then.

[TNTOS]

1.) Should the entire Library have a 300 word minimum? Why?

I wouldn't object to it, but on the other hand, I really don't see the point. Most epics and short stories, from my experience, are well over 300 words. Only flash fiction is ever less than that and that is intentional. Just doesn't seem like a real problem to address, at least at the moment anyway.

2.) Should comedies be merged with the rest of the library? Why?

Your argument for merging Comedies with Epics and Short Stories does make sense, but on the other hand, the Comedies forum really has become its own little culture throughout the years. Hastily fusing it together with the Epics and Short Stories forums could have unforeseen consequences. Probably just best to leave it as is.

3.) Should the "one chapter per 24 hours" rule be reinstated for anyone not reposting an epic from the old board?

No. Like Aderia said, it's the author's choice when and how often he or she chooses to post his or her epic. Posting it all at once isn't really my style, but making a rule against it just rubs me the wrong way for some reason

4.) Do you want a CoT Library? Why? If a CoT Library existed, how often would you make use of it?

A COT Library would be nice, but I'm not sure how often I'd use it, considering the vast majority of my BZP stories are Bionicle fanfics. Definitely would support it, though, if only to help COT stories get more attention.

5.) Are there any ideas, themes, etc. you feel would be better expressed in your writing without a Bionicle influence? What are they?

Religion and politics, I think. Although it's possible to feature religion and politics in a Bionicle fanfic, I feel that it would be easier to explore those concepts -- religion in particular -- in an original story. I wouldn't have to worry about breaking BZP's "no religion/politics" rule, at any rate.

6.) How often do you post a story? How often do you review?

I post a story usually once every couple of months, especially if it's an epic or chaptered comedy. As for reviewing, I review once or twice a week, generally-speaking.

7.) Do you use the critic clubs? Why or why not? Do you find the critic clubs useful?

I use the ECC sometimes, mostly because I know I'll get a good review from them. Don't use the SSCC or the CCC much, but considering I haven't posted many new stories in the SS or Comedies forum, that is to be expected.

As for if I find them useful, well, what do you expect me to say ?

8.) Who are some of your favorite Library writers? What are some of your favorite Library stories? What's your favorite self-written work?

Favorite writers? Hmm, that's tough, mostly because I can't think of many right now. Maybe if I remember any I'll edit this post later.

Same thing with stories. Few library stories stick out to me, except for Fractures, by GSR. That was a very good one.

As for my favorite work, thus far it would have to be Dimension Hoppers. I've written good stories before, but I feel DiH really takes the cake in tems of overall quality.

-TNTOS-

[fishers64]

1.) Should the entire Library have a 300 word minimum? Why?

Does it need one? Its presence or absence in the SS and Epics forums doesn't change very much. Also, I think it would get a lot of Epics and SS's by developing writers closed, cutting them off from criticism that could help them improve.

2.) Should comedies be merged with the rest of the library? Why?

No, because Comedies are different from Epics and Short Stories, and a merger would just make a mess. (Where would you put all the comedies topics? Dividing the oneshots from the rest would be a pain.)

3.) Should the "one chapter per 24 hours" rule be reinstated for anyone not reposting an epic from the old board?

Nah, probably will result in good epics being needlessly closed. There used to be a electronic safeguard that prevented that, but reenabling it wouldn't discriminate between who was reposting and who wasn't, so the moderators would have to watch that, and it's just not necessary. Having it reenabled in general... I didn't know it was gone until you asked, but I would advocate that as a writing practice. I don't know if it needs to be a rule...*imagines opening up an epic with 10 one-line chapters* Um.

4.) Do you want a CoT Library? Why? If a CoT Library existed, how often would you make use of it?

No and no. There are other writing sites to post CoT work on. Posting it on here is not prudent IMO. You can get money for that stuff.

5.) Are there any ideas, themes, etc. you feel would be better expressed in your writing without a Bionicle influence? What are they?

Alienation and separation from home. Little tricky to do that in Bionicle...for me, anyway.

6.) How often do you post a story? How often do you review?

Posting stories...when did I post the last one? It's been way too long. I review frequently, although not as much or as often as I should have, again.

7.) Do you use the critic clubs? Why or why not? Do you find the critic clubs useful?

Yes. People don't post to review my stories much, so sometimes I want some feedback. Yes.

8.) Who are some of your favorite Library writers? What are some of your favorite Library stories? What's your favorite self-written work?

I'm tired of playing favorites.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Last week, I was browsing through the comedies forum (I know, everyone's favorite forum ), and found this review by Velox. It gave me an idea.

I would like to offer a challenge to you.

Last topic we got everyone arguing about the fate of said forum. Many of you dissaprove of the quality of the comedies there. My challenge to you - and to everyone who reads this topic is this.

Review one of them.

I don't care which one it is. Review one comedy - any comedy. Tell the author what you think - how to better express emotion without using emoticons, or **actions, or whatever bugs you. Provide suggestions to improve the quality of their work. Most of you all are critics. You know what I mean when I say "through in-depth review." That's what I'm challenging you to do for some of what you think (at least, if I am hearing you correctly) is the worst stuff in the Library.

But I understand that some of you have busy lives. So I'm going to give you something back, if you want it. If you do that - review any comedy, PM me and provide a link to the review, I will review any library work that you want me to review (Please tell me in the PM ). If you don't want the exchange, that's fine. But I think that poor section of the forum has suffered for long enough and it's time to call in some professional advice.

What do you think?

Edited by fishers64, Oct 29 2012 - 06:50 AM.

[Hurricane iBrow]

^fishers there has a point about the review thing. I'm going to be absolutely brutal here.

You whine, you moan, you complain, you whine some more about the Comedies forum - and then you don't even bother to click on the forum, and if you do, chances are you don't even read any of them - or you read one and leave. Several of you have already stated that you don't read my comedies, have never read my comedies, and you most likely will not ever read my comedies - despite my reputation in the Comedies forum. I'm okay with that... until you start looping my comedies automatically into the "lol these r so horrible comdeies" section of your minds.

I apologize for bringing this up, but Peach 00 just posted a script comedy recently - a script comedy that is more to the style of a play than the sort of script commonly used in comedies, which is something you have all whined and moaned and complained about script comedies never using. Now, let us become clear here for everyone: Peach 00 is usually in SS or Epics... this is the first time I've seen Peach in comedies in a long time, if ever. Why is that important? Maybe because she began getting replies and reviews from those that frequent the SS and Epics forums.

One of you posts in comedies, and suddenly you're all there, cheering them on because they write like you and how you want them to write. But then you leave as fast as you can, without a second glance at the other comedies that are there, without a second thought of "hey, maybe if I gave a few of them in-depth reviews, I could not only explain in a civilized manner why their comedy sucks, but I could actually HLEP THEM GET BETTER!" - and so the comedies do absolutely nothing. Why should they? Most of them don't venture into SS and Epics, and I understand that. I made points about it in the other topic I don't feel the need to repeat quite yet. So they don't know what you say in SS, or Epics, or anywhere else on BZP (or off BZP, for that matter).

So start reviewing - we'll throw reviews back.

Anyway, rant over, mental exhaustion's effects on my brain ending, questions time.

1.) Should the entire Library have a 300 word minimum? Why?
I don't see why not. Any chapter under 300 words is almost guaranteed to suck - these days, I'm unable to write less than 500 words for a chapter and be happy with it. It's just not enough.

2.) Should comedies be merged with the rest of the library? Why?
Hmm... difficult question. While I question what would become of things like the CCC and the CF, and I also question how many members would actually make the migration (and how the heck they would transfer stories over, because I'm not gonna re-post something), I think in the long run a merger might turn out to be for the best. Humour is one genre out of many, and I have long questioned why it was given its own forum. Just have oneshot comedies placed into SS, and the multi-chapter comedies in Epics with their own review topics.

However, the move would have to be very carefully organized and executed perfectly, and lots of warning would have to be given about the move.

3.) Should the "one chapter per 24 hours" rule be reinstated for anyone not reposting an epic from the old board?
Yes, I think it should be. There's no reason anybody needs to be posting more than one chapter a day - despite how noobish you guys think comedies in, we don't have that problem.

4.) Do you want a CoT Library? Why? If a CoT Library existed, how often would you make use of it?
Yes, I do want a COT Library. I don't usually post COT stuff here because there's no real point - why post if nobody will ever see it again after an hour? That's no fun. However, at this point in time I don't think a COT Library would need to be split into things like SS, Epics, and Comedies.

5.) Are there any ideas, themes, etc. you feel would be better expressed in your writing without a Bionicle influence? What are they?
Hmm... anything to do with romance, definitely. It's a lot harder to do romance with Bionicle, and god forbid a romance in a story about Hero Factory. And, with the recent revelations about the Red Star, I think the suspense of "they could die at any moment" is sort of lost.

6.) How often do you post a story? How often do you review?
How often do I post a story... hmm. It's hard to say, really. I usually post something around 13 comedies a year, including all the oneshots I write, and I've been writing more short stories this year. As for reviewing... I don't have as much time as I like for that, but I try to make up for it with reviews I do for the CCC.

7.) Do you use the critic clubs? Why or why not? Do you find the critic clubs useful?
I use the SSCC, since unles my story is amazing people don't really post in it. As for the others - I don't really ever post in Epics, so it's a no there, and I have used the new CCC on occasion just to give my critics something to do.

8.) Who are some of your favorite Library writers? What are some of your favorite Library stories? What's your favorite self-written work?
Some of my favourite Library writers? Geez, I dunno. Back in Short Stories Contest #8, I enjoyed the entries by Aderia and GSR, fishers64 up there has actually written some pretty sweet stuff. Snoopy82 has some cool stuff. Also, Mr. Chicken writes amazing comedies.

Favourite Library stories... well, fisher's "Twisting Doctor Drake" kinda twists your mind into a small pretzel. The entries by Aderia and GSR are both among my favourite pieces in the forums. Mr. Chicken's "Fun With Taka and Tahu" series was pretty awesome, and the reboot is going to be even better,

Favourite self-written works... it's not releasing until December, but The Afterwords was a heck of a lot of fun for me to write. Unfortunately for you SS and Epics-goers, it's a comedy, so back off. I also liked the final season of Tahu vs. Tahu. My favourite short stories... The Trial and Execution of Makuta Teridax by far. I still need to remake that thing.

Huff and puff, that's a long post.

-ibrow

[Aderia]

I think that iBrow and fishers bring up valid points, and the idea of an in-depth review written in the spirit of 'win-win' would be a good thing.

However, as it was pointed out, a lot of us are critics. ECC, SSCC, CCC, ETC. I know, as a member of the ECC, that I'm trying to help the author show their audience the world they created for the purpose of yes, entertaining an audience, but not in the same way a comedy story would seek to entertain an audience. I'm trying to help them create a world for their audience to live in, so to speak, alongside the characters. I nitpick grammar, spelling, dialogue, descriptions, sentence structure, analyze plots, and so on. I would have a hard time reviewing a comedy, because I feel like a lot of what I'm criticizing in short stories or epics is what is used in comedies to generate a grin on a reader's face.

I can't help feeling that the Comedies pulled the short straw here (correct me if I'm wrong, rate me one star, whatever you like) because not everyone has the same sense of humor. I know, personally, that's one of the big reasons I don't venture into the Comedies forum myself. My sense of humor doesn't really match up with yours. So, if I tried to review a comedy that I thought was horrible, it wouldn't be a review. It would be me trying to make it funny from my sense of funny, which is essentially back seat driving (writing?), and something that nobody likes. I've read through a bit of a comedy before, and tried to give honest feedback, and that's exactly what happened.

Now, I know I've seen the comedy folks out and about in the other sections of the library, which I applaud. Speaking for myself, I'm not sad to say, but I'll say it anyways, I don't return the favor very often. Learning to review a comedy effectively is something that doesn't interest me greatly at the moment, since, like fishers said, real life is a bit hectic. But in the long run, its definitely something I would like to try my hand at. I know a few of the CCC members have been posting here, if you could provide an example of a review to a comedy that would be a good example for me to learn from, I would be much obliged.

[fishers64]

ibrow, it's Spinning Doctor Drake.

But I can't rely on past glories in that forum or anywhere. There's always room to move forward. I just need to get my ideas sorted out.

I know a few of the CCC members have been posting here, if you could provide an example of a review to a comedy that would be a good example for me to learn from, I would be much obliged.

Well...this one is from Hubert, a fellow CCC critic.

Comedy that was reviewed.

Here's your ordered review from the CCC.

Spelling and Grammar:

Chapter 2.5:

He would have been as good as dead if the red-and-silver being hadn’t saved him, but it came at a cost for that being.

'At', not 'as'.

“Saves the story for another chapter, I suppose,”

Needs an 's'.

to tell you this comedy took a deep breath.

This phrase seems a bit awkward. Maybe a different phrase could be used.

Chapter 2.6:

“Pohatu and Onua set down the object, a large grand piano,” the Narrator said.

Needs a 'the'.

Other than some mistakes, your story is pretty much free of any major errors. If there are any, they don't really detract much from the story anyway. It flows pretty simply, and it is easy to understand your language. I suppose I would rate your story an 8/10.

Humour:

The humour in your story is rather enjoyable, but as shown in the parts when you include yourself and your minions, it just feels somewhat out of place and random. In order to maximise efficiency, you may need to place these scenes in areas where they fit better, other than in different areas. Too much random humour detracts from the story, so it is better to keep it to a minimum.

I find that the small jokes you insert throughout the story are good representations of the interactions between the characters themselves. This is more entertaining to me than situational comedy, for I like reading banter between people. However, the jokes may need a bit more work, seeing that they are somewhat forced, but they do enhance the story itself, which is good.

If I were to rate it, it'd be about 7/10.

Plot:

From what I've read, your story is more plot-orientated than most other comedies, which I rather like. I look for a good plot in a comedy, instead of just enjoyable humour. Your plot is pretty original as well, being set in an alternate universe where everything has gone wrong, a setting which I haven't seen many times.

However, there are some minor issues I have with your plot, one of which is how did this universe come about? You have not explained as of yet where the point of divergence with the main universe is, or if it is a completely different universe which is merely similar, other than Jovan's thoughts on how Axonn became crazy as a result of saving his life. This irks me somewhat, but if you plan on explaining it in a later chapter, I am fine with that.

But in the end, your comedy has a rather fun plot, and I enjoy Tahu's fun romp through the universe.

I'd rate your plot about 76/100.

Overall:

In conclusion, your story is pretty enjoyable, with decent spelling and grammar, some okay jokes and a rather original and fun plot to play with. It has a lot of potential, and I plan on seeing how far you can go with this.

(80 + 70 + 76) / 3 = 75.3 ...%

That's a good one. I could provide many more, but most of them are mine. More examples of comedic reviewing amazingness can be found here (by me and others).

Edited by fishers64, Oct 29 2012 - 04:11 PM.

[Velox]

1.) Should the entire Library have a 300 word minimum? Why?

Yes. 300 words really isn't all that much, and there are few exceptions when 300 words is sufficient. I've noticed more than several times, now, some incredibly short short stories or epic chapters, and I really don't see why we don't have a 300 word limit throughout the whole library, except for the fact that it's not as much of a problem as it is in Comedies, but even so -- there are still some stories that shouldn't be so short, in my opinion. I'd say definitely for Epics, but possibly allow it for Short Stories -- I really don't see why there should be a less than 300-word epic chapter, but I get if someone wants to do a hundred-word flash fiction piece or something, maybe.

2.) Should comedies be merged with the rest of the library? Why?

Yes and no. The problem for me isn't the script format -- it's the distortion of scrip format, the use of such improper grammar, the use of emoticons, and the use of just random gibberish. I'll probably end up getting into this more in-depth later, but basically, if Comedies were written as literature (I've made several long posts on the subject in the last LDT), I think they should be merged with Short Stories and Epics. What's to distinguish them? In SSs/Epics you can have tragedies, happy stories, romance stories, thrilling stories, fantasy stories, mystery stories, etc., etc. So why the Comedies forum? Because they are vastly different -- not because of the script format, but because of the respect (or rather, lack thereof) of the English language. I wish it wasn't like that, and that they could be merged, because I think that would probably be best -- like I said, it's just another genre, so why should it get its own forum? -- however, I am definitely happy that it has its own forum right now. If the quality from Comedies changed, then I definitely wouldn't mind merging Comedies (and would, in fact, support it) with the SSs and Epics forums.

3.) Should the "one chapter per 24 hours" rule be reinstated for anyone not reposting an epic from the old board?

Hmm. Mixed feelings on this, really. I think, ultimately, yes, it would be a good idea to reinstate that rule. I don't know about other people, but it's hard for me to keep up with epics when they gain many chapters per day. Even just one a week can be hard sometimes. Of course, that's mostly due to my preferring actual books or short stories or whathaveyou. But I've always been a fan of having epics posted as "serials", if you will, spreading apart the chapter posting. I don't think there's anything wrong with waiting at least one day, and it could, in my opinion, be beneficial to the author, so why not? I also agree with Cederak's argument for the most part.

4.) Do you want a CoT Library? Why? If a CoT Library existed, how often would you make use of it?

I think my thoughts on this are fairly obvious, but to those who do not know me: Yes, I definitely want a COT Library. BZPower has been incredibly influential to me as a writer -- it's where I began, and BZPower is where I first gained interest in writing in the first place. Not to mention I have made many friends who are also writers on here. As such, I'd love to be able to keep writing here and sharing my works here (as I no longer write Bionicle fanfiction), without them getting buried in a matter of, sometimes, hours. I think a whole COT Creative Outlet could be extremely beneficial (just a single forum, even) to all creative members here. I have written, literally, pages of arguments for having a COT Library, and am definitely in full support.

How often would I use it? Very often. I'd try to post at least once a day there, if not more. I'd love to have a forum for the writing community (or even just art community in general) on BZPower.

5.) Are there any ideas, themes, etc. you feel would be better expressed in your writing without a Bionicle influence? What are they?

Hmm. Well a lot of things, really. I like to write more realistic stories, and that can always (obviously) be done easier/better without Bionicle. Specifically, romance would be a thing that I think is better expressed without a Bionicle influence.

6.) How often do you post a story? How often do you review?

Not often enough, unfortunately. For both. I haven't posted a short story here in a long time, and I've only recently been posting a few poems because they were written for a Creative Writing class I'm taking. I definitely hope to start writing more (after November, as I hope to do NaNo) and posting more stories. I try to review fairly often. At least once a week, but I'd like to do it much more often -- every day would be amazing, but lack of time and just knowing that, if I do a review of a COT story, it'll be lost in a day. This is another reason I'd really love to have a COT library -- I'd probably review more often.

7.) Do you use the critic clubs? Why or why not? Do you find the critic clubs useful?

Yep! I can always count on getting a great, constructive critique from the Epics Critics Club and the Short Stories Critics Club. I haven't written a comedy in years. But I definitely find the ECC and SSCC extremely useful -- there's a great set of critics for both.

8.) Who are some of your favorite Library writers? What are some of your favorite Library stories? What's your favorite self-written work?

Oh man, this list could go on and on. I'm going to be missing a lot, but some of my favorites include Tolkien, Cederak, Aderia, Ezorov, Kakaru, Peach 00, 55555, Kraggh, Grant-Sud, Legolover-361, Nuile, GSR, ToM Dracone, Takuta-Nui, Lady Kopaka, Jedi Gali, Tifosi 92, Snoopy 82, etc., etc. Really, the list goes on and on. For favorite stories...basically just anything written by any of the aforementioned authors.

My favorite self-written work? That's a little harder...often my latest story becomes my "favorite" (e.g., right now, my favorite is probably a Halloween-esque poem that I wrote about a week ago). I definitely have quite a fondness for "Tahu in the Rain", which is my first decent short story, in my opinion -- really where I shifted from horrible-writer to okay-writer. I love "The Tower" because it features a father and his son, as I hope my life to be some day -- the type of father I want to be. I love "Souvenirs" (my latest actual short story; "The Tower" is just flash fiction), probably because it was the first story I had written in a while, and is my latest short story still. And, lastly, I love "Staring Oceans", as it is the first poem I have written in literally years, and considering that, I am fairly proud of it.

----------------------------

Now for the fun part. Ranting/debating time!

What do you think?

I think people should be reviewing Epics or Short Stories instead. I'm not being crass here, I'm being practical. The CCC has existed for some time now. Heck, I ran the CCC for a while at one point. I haven't seen much of a change in the Comedies forum. Now, no, I'm not saying that every comedy is horrible -- not at all. But, as a whole, the forum has remained pretty much the same. For 10 years. Most have been the same, with a few "okay" ones thrown in the mix here and there. But back to what I was saying before...the CCC should be doing this -- that is, giving in-depth reviews that will help the author improve. Yet again, things have stayed relatively the same. So what's the problem then? Are the CCC reviews not doing what they should? Are the authors not wanting to change? Is there some sort of curse on the Comedies forum that makes every comedy like that?

I think we can safely rule out the third. But if you think that's likely, I'm open to the possibility. But assuming that's not the case, that leaves me with, from what I can think of, two options. I think it could be a little of both, but mostly people not wanting to change. People like the so-called "script" format. The emoticons. The overused jokes and improper grammar. But my point is, most comedies in that forum aren't serious writing. No, I'm not talking about non-funny; when I say "serious" I'm talking about writing that is taken seriously for writing/literature. There are definitely a few exceptions (hence the use of "most" and not "all"), but for the most part that's what I find. I'm happy to provide reviews for people I think are serious about writing -- Peach, for example -- but, because of my limited time with college and other priorities, I'd rather leave my reviews for those who are serious about their writing. I suppose I could write up a form letter of sorts, and it would fit for many of the comedies, but I don't feel like people want to take their writing seriously, and therefore, I see no point (and plus, it's kinda unfair to the author to just give a "form-review"). I'll probably end up ranting about all of the things I dislike about the comedies here later, but for now I'll just leave it at that.

You whine, you moan, you complain, you whine some more about the Comedies forum - and then you don't even bother to click on the forum, and if you do, chances are you don't even read any of them - or you read one and leave. Several of you have already stated that you don't read my comedies, have never read my comedies, and you most likely will not ever read my comedies - despite my reputation in the Comedies forum. I'm okay with that... until you start looping my comedies automatically into the "lol these r so horrible comdeies" section of your minds.

I haven't seen anyone whining or moaning about Comedies. People criticize it -- and for good reasons -- that is far different from whining about it. The other thing is, that's simply not true at all. If memory serves, Caleb and I were the main ones criticizing Comedies. And guess what, we both have a history there. We've both spent time in that forum, and we've both posted comedies there. Even now, I check that forum very, very often. I skim through most posts. I do that with every Library forum (though I do pay special attention to SSs, and will completely read every single post). So I critique the Comedies forum. You want me to critique the Epics and Short Stories forums, too? I can, but there's just much less for me to criticize. I don't like how some short stories and epics are extremely short, contain improper grammar, and just seem to have no point. I don't like how there's so much inactivity in those forums. I don't like how some people will just post fairly generic comments in stories. I don't like how some epic review topics get chatty. I don't like how some people post several epics at once.

But you'll notice the things I'm criticizing are not as bad as the things in Comedies that I, and others, criticize. And there are far, far less cases of all of those. I can remember one or two (or a few, at most) examples of most of those, and that's about it. So there's a good reason to criticize Comedies. I don't remember anyone specifically stating how your comedies were horrible, just because they're in the Comedies forum. In fact, I remember several times that people have said things like "for the most part" or "most Comedies" or "almost all Comedies", etc. Now, I don't agree with you using yourself as an example as a "good" writer because you have a good reputation there, but you asked, so, I have read the latest chapter of How to Be a Hero (and I remember reading a chapter or two a while ago, too, when this debate was first brought up, and thinking relatively the same things).

Since I'm not writing a review in the topic, I'll try to keep it brief. But to put it bluntly, I don't see much of a difference between this and the other comedies out there. There was one thing I commend you for, though: not a single emoticon. And that's a pretty big thing. A lot of comedies are filled with them. Even comedies that are considered to be "classics" or "the best" or whathaveyou. But yours didn't, and that is very, very good. If you need to use a picture to convey emotion, you're not writing well, in my opinion.

But as I implied, I wasn't overly impressed, unfortunately. So I'll just quickly run through the things I didn't like: 1. the so-called "script" format. I'm not sure how exactly it can be called script, really, with the exception that it has a character's name and then what he or she says. But that's where the "script" format ends. There were no stage directions, there were no actions, there was no setting, etc.; 2. the characters. They were all incredibly flat to me. Now, sure, I've only read one or two other chapters of the whole comedy, so I haven't seen any characterization there may have been, but from that chapter alone, they seemed extremely two-dimensional. In fact, they all seemed to be relatively the same. The way they spoke, the way they all yelled and screamed at each other...if you had left the names out, I could swear that they were all the same character, for the most part. I also didn't feel like the characters were very accurate to canon; 3. Actions. I alluded to this before, but here I'm specifically talking about the use of ellipses. In script format, everything that comes after a character's name (unless it is in brackets) is what a character is saying. People don't say "...". You find someone that speaks an ellipsis, and I will be very, very impressed. Instead, you should use stage directions -- they're your friend in script format; 4. Actions part 2. It's purely speaking, with absolutely no setting, no actions, no hand gestures, anything; 5. All caps. I'd recommend stage directions or exclamation points for yelling, not all caps; and 6. I didn't find it funny. Now, this is obviously just a matter of opinion, and it doesn't mean that it's not funny -- it just means that I, personally, didn't find it funny. At times it just sounded like a bunch of kids yelling at each other, sans the kids, which would be the cute/funny part. As I mentioned, you didn't use emoticons, though. And for the most part, the grammar was at least okay (ignoring the script errors, of course) throughout. And that's great.

I apologize for bringing this up, but Peach 00 just posted a script comedy recently - a script comedy that is more to the style of a play than the sort of script commonly used in comedies, which is something you have all whined and moaned and complained about script comedies never using. Now, let us become clear here for everyone: Peach 00 is usually in SS or Epics... this is the first time I've seen Peach in comedies in a long time, if ever. Why is that important? Maybe because she began getting replies and reviews from those that frequent the SS and Epics forums.

Again, I don't recall anyone whining and moaning -- criticizing, yes, and again, for good reason. I don't think it was ever said that no Comedies are in the correct script format, but if I said that, then I apologize that I misspoke. Obviously you can't really say everything or nothing is something, unless you've read every single comedy there is -- I haven't. But, generally, the script format used in Comedies is distorted. Yes, Peach is usually in SSs or Epics. Y'know, I'm really not sure what your point is here; she posted, and I was attracted because I know that she takes her writing seriously and is a good writer (in my opinion). Seeing her comedy, I wasn't disappointed -- it was one of the better ones I've read on BZPower. Because it wasn't just a bunch of mindless gibberish of random shouting and "jokes" et cetera. So I gave her a reply -- again, as I've mentioned earlier, she's very serious about her writing. I want to help people as much as I can, but only if I see that they're serious about their writing -- it's hard for me to take the Comedies forum seriously. I think I've explained adequately why. She is generally considered to be a good writer in SSs or Epics, so of course she's going to attract some people. If a popular Comedies guy posted something in SSs, I'm sure that some people who frequent Comedies would come to reply. But I wouldn't say that "suddenly you're all there" -- she only got four reviews besides mine, and at least two frequent Comedies.

One of you posts in comedies, and suddenly you're all there, cheering them on because they write like you and how you want them to write. But then you leave as fast as you can, without a second glance at the other comedies that are there, without a second thought of "hey, maybe if I gave a few of them in-depth reviews, I could not only explain in a civilized manner why their comedy sucks, but I could actually HLEP THEM GET BETTER!" - and so the comedies do absolutely nothing. Why should they? Most of them don't venture into SS and Epics, and I understand that. I made points about it in the other topic I don't feel the need to repeat quite yet. So they don't know what you say in SS, or Epics, or anywhere else on BZP (or off BZP, for that matter).

Again, I don't think that it's just the fact that she's a SSs/Epics writer, that now "we're all there" -- it's that, people who enjoy reading her stories and read all of her stories, will read...well, all of her stories. Doesn't matter if it's Comedies, Epics, Short Stories, or COT. And, besides, no one posted that "frequents" SSs and Epics, with the exception of myself and TNTOS, but he frequents Comedies, too.

And again, that's just simply not true. As I already explained, I didn't just view her story and then leave. No, I didn't review any one else's comedy, but that's because I don't want to review a comedy unless someone asks me to (because it will, most likely, be rather negative. But hey, if someone wants to PM me and ask for a review, I will happily review their comedy and give as much constructive criticism as I can, as I do with all my reviews). The exception would be in a case like Peach -- I've liked everything else I've read from her, I know she's serious about writing, and I know that she'll appreciate a review. So I post a reply. Additionally, I think basically the opposite of what you've said. I want there to be improvement in Comedies. I want to believe that that can happen. So when someone like Peach posts a comedy, of course I'm going to take a look at it.

And you see, here's the other thing. I don't have unlimited time. I wish I did. And I wish that every free moment I had, I felt like reviewing stories. But unfortunately that's not how it is. So I have to choose what to review. So I choose to help the people that I think I can help the most, and the ones that I think will appreciate it the most. I write short stories, mostly. Therefore, I can best help other short story authors, and I feel like they take writing more seriously, and therefore, will appreciate my reviews more. As I said, I'm happy to review comedies. But only if it's requested of me, or in special cases. Because when I give a review, I want to help my fellow authors. That's why I helped create the Ambage, and that's why I give so much of my time to it. I want to help myself and others improve as writers, because every writer can improve. And I feel like those who tend to post more short stories and epics take their writing more seriously. I'm not saying that's 100% true, I'm just saying that, for the most part, that's what it seems to be -- to me. Like I mentioned earlier, Comedies hasn't really changed in 10 years -- that kinda sends the message that people don't want to change.

------------------------

@ Comedy reviews...I'm not going to mention that review specifically, but rather I just want to take a few things that I have seen in most in-depth comedy reviews. The main thing is the percentage rating. Honestly, it's never made much sense to me why people rate stories. We're not in school, here, and critics aren't teachers. The point of the critics clubs, in my opinion, is to provide constructive criticism. It's not a place to get a "review" in the sense of a fellow author's review of another book, or a book review by the New York Times, or a grading from an English teacher. Rather, it's a constructive critique. Requests are made to critics clubs so that someone can improve their writing -- as fellow writers, we can help each other out by using constructive criticism. But grading, or even just "rating" gets into the more "book-review" style. But that's not what the clubs are supposed to be for (IMO). They're to help writers improve. And yes, that can be done through praise -- I'm not saying that reviews need to be completely negative (and that is, in fact, against the rules of BZPower) -- I tend to praise a lot in my reviews. I'm saying that reviews should be geared toward helping your fellow author improve. Grading doesn't do that for me. And, now, I'm not saying that's the intention -- I'm just saying what it seems like, to me. Percentage ratings or number ratings have always done that for me with reviews, whether it be in the Library or BBC or whatever. I feel like they belong when reviewing a book or movie, not when critiquing a story. But maybe that's just me. Another thing is structure. Every review seems to have roughly the same structure. Now, all those things are good things that should be mentioned in a review, but I'm just not the biggest fan of having such structure like that. I also think that some key things are often not addressed, such as characterization, writing style, etc.

So, in response to Aderia, I'd say just start with the basics. Every single story, comedy or not, should have the few basic things. Grammar, plot, characterization, formatting, writing style, descriptions, etc. The only difference, then, is the humor. But those other things are needed first -- if it's just funny, but not serious literature, then I, personally, don't see the point of it. So start like any other epic or short story review, and then just try to add something about the humor of it. For example, you read a tragedy, and you comment about how emotionally moving that scene/story was. Same thing here. How funny was it? Or was it even funny at all? Obviously this is getting deep into subjective territory here, but that's about all you can do. There can be objective things wrong with the grammar etc., but humor is completely subjective. So if you don't think it's funny, that's fine -- it might not be your type of humor, or maybe it just actually isn't funny to most people (or "shouldn't" be funny). But again, I really think it comes down to the basics -- something that many comedies in the Comedies forum lack. So I'd start there. =]

[Hurricane iBrow]

>Sees huge post
>Sighs and begins to plan for later (=P)

Alright, just as a quick note before I fully reply (assuming I have time later, of course; it is Halloween, and I have no idea when the kids here like to start coming to doors), what was I gonna say... urp.

For the comedies reputation thing... nah, it doesn't work. Now, maybe this is because most of my SS have sucked, but I think the majority of my reviews/replies in SS have been from people who, you know, frequent SS. Comedies, for whatever reason, has just become detached from the other two forums and I have no idea why. I feel like it's probably been like that for a long time.

Quick note on HTBAH: Well, I dislike saying it here, but I think I've said it either in that or the Tahu vs. Tahu (TvT) topic: it hasn't been updated much recently, mostly because I've pretty much done everything I really wanted to with that little escapade. I do prefer writing in prose, and as much fun/easy as it can be to whip out a script chapter (I propose we give it a new name, but later, since you are right in that it is not script), it just doesn't give me the narrative strength I crave. Unfortunately Velox, I did a sweep of the Comedies forum recently and... I am one of a total of two authors that are writing any comedies with prose. So that means everyone else is using script, and Peach's is the only one that has proper script. So I do understand if that's frustrating.

It's amazing what five minutes can do to show you what's going on, eh?

Perhaps I'll write up a few "how to write this" things, but I don't know if I should be the one to do so - I think Bionicle Guru had something like that on the old forums, and the problem was that it just sort of fell away. It became a topic nobody looked at. Actually, scratch that earlier idea - perhaps it's something we could all come up with.

On reviews: I suppose I'll get to this later. I need to make sure I word this section correctly.

Anyway, I'll have more later. Schooling time now, hurrah.

-ibrow

[Toa Smoke Monster]

1.) Should the entire Library have a 300 word minimum? Why?

2.) Should comedies be merged with the rest of the library? Why?

3.) Should the "one chapter per 24 hours" rule be reinstated for anyone not reposting an epic from the old board?

4.) Do you want a CoT Library? Why? If a CoT Library existed, how often would you make use of it?

5.) Are there any ideas, themes, etc. you feel would be better expressed in your writing without a Bionicle influence? What are they?

6.) How often do you post a story? How often do you review?

7.) Do you use the critic clubs? Why or why not? Do you find the critic clubs useful?

8.) Who are some of your favorite Library writers? What are some of your favorite Library stories? What's your favorite self-written work?

1. Unless there is a contest that requires a story to be less than 300 words, I don't why we couldn't have a 300 word minimum rule.
2. No. I think that the current sub-forums of Epics, Short Stories, and Comedies is fine the way it is.
3. If the Library Forum got as busy as it was before the downtime, then yes, this rule should be reinstated. Otherwise, leaving it up to the writer to decide how many chapters they post in a day is fine with me.
4. I would like a COT Library. It would be really helpful for members who post COT epics, short shories, and comedies. (And I bet it would help get more reviews too.) I would probably use it as much as I use the current Library forums- not often.
5. No, not really. Any ideas or themes that I have that wouldn't fit in a Bionicle story I use in non-Bionicle stories.
6. I don't post my own stories too often because I'm usually busy 4-5 days out of the week with work. And I'm writing something that I'm not posting on BZP, so that takes up some of my free time as well. As for reviewing other member's stories, I do tend to review one every now and again. There is one epic and one comedy that I follow which I review each chapter whenever the members post new ones, but outside of them I don't often review other member's works.
7. I've used them for the last couple of stories I've posted on BZP. I find that the members from these clubs give great reviews and may point out ways to help the member who posted the story to become a better writer. (I'm not saying that other members that review stories but aren't members of these clubs don't do the same, because they do too.)
8. Some of my favorite BZP writers are Lewa0111 Nuva and Eponine, along with a few others. Lewa0111 Nuva's comedies, like Ask Matau and The Nuva Inn, are very funny IMO and I always enjoy reading them. As for my favorite self-written work, that would go to my short story The Agori. I posted it on the forum before the downtime. I consider it the best story I've ever posted on BZP.

Edited by Toa Smoke Monster, Oct 31 2012 - 10:54 AM.

[Velox]

For the comedies reputation thing... nah, it doesn't work. Now, maybe this is because most of my SS have sucked, but I think the majority of my reviews/replies in SS have been from people who, you know, frequent SS. Comedies, for whatever reason, has just become detached from the other two forums and I have no idea why. I feel like it's probably been like that for a long time.

I don't know, it seemed like most replies came from people who frequent Comedies. If not, well, I wouldn't consider the other people that replied (going off of your three-part story, here) people who frequent SSs (with the exception of the SSCC critics, of course). Comedies does seem to be fairly detached from SSs and Epics, but at the same time...that's kinda the way it is for SSs and Epics, too -- you'll have people people who mostly only frequent one or the other. Like myself, for example. I'll post in Epics occasionally, but most of the time I just stay in SSs. I think you find more people who only frequent Comedies, though, just because of what's there -- they're attracted to whatever it is that's in Comedies, and so they stay there. At least, that's how it was for me when I first started out. I loved what Comedies offered, so I stayed there mostly, until I decided to branch out into SSs and I kinda never looked back, haha. I honestly do think it's due to the format that people find there -- it attracts some people. It unfortunately attracted me, too, but I wish it hadn't. Because it's very hard to take writing seriously there, or at least for me.

Quick note on HTBAH: Well, I dislike saying it here, but I think I've said it either in that or the Tahu vs. Tahu (TvT) topic: it hasn't been updated much recently, mostly because I've pretty much done everything I really wanted to with that little escapade. I do prefer writing in prose, and as much fun/easy as it can be to whip out a script chapter (I propose we give it a new name, but later, since you are right in that it is not script), it just doesn't give me the narrative strength I crave. Unfortunately Velox, I did a sweep of the Comedies forum recently and... I am one of a total of two authors that are writing any comedies with prose. So that means everyone else is using script, and Peach's is the only one that has proper script. So I do understand if that's frustrating.

The problem is, I'm not sure what else you'd call it. It's nothing, really. It's a distortion of script, and that's really it. Instead of making a new name for it, why not just actually use script? I can't see any benefit to using the BZP-Comedies-style with the exception that it might be "easier", but then again that goes back to my argument about not taking writing seriously. I'm not saying you have to want to be a professional writer, I'm just saying that, why not take your writing seriously? (and when I say "you" I'm using the plural form -- not singling anyone out here, or saying anyone specifically doesn't take their writing seriously) And it's not so much frustrating as it is...confusing, I guess. I just don't see the point in writing like that, except that it's easy to be lazy, then, because overall that style is lazier -- you only need emoticons to show emotion, you don't need proper grammar, you don't need to show actions or think about characterization, etc. I prefer prose overall, but I'm not against script -- I really enjoy reading plays, and those use script. It's just the distorted script that I'm not a fan of, and really don't understand.

Perhaps I'll write up a few "how to write this" things, but I don't know if I should be the one to do so - I think Bionicle Guru had something like that on the old forums, and the problem was that it just sort of fell away. It became a topic nobody looked at. Actually, scratch that earlier idea - perhaps it's something we could all come up with.

You see, that kind of proves my point. Nobody looked at it, nobody followed it -- what does that say? To me, it says that people don't care, like I was talking about earlier. People want the "script"; they like the style of the comedies in the Comedies forum on BZPower. I did at one point, too. Yes, I regret it to heck, but there was a time that I enjoyed it, too. And that's why I feel so strongly about this -- I love writing, and writing is extremely important to me. But I regret my time in Comedies so, so much, because it did nothing for me. I was encouraged to write poorly. I was encouraged to write random gibberish that's not literature but somehow is "funny", which apparently makes it okay. I didn't want to change back then, and I feel like that's the general consensus in the Comedies forum -- nothing changed with that topic; I don't think people want to change. And that's what saddens me.

[Grantaire]

Yeah, when I was a noob on BZP, I loved comedies, lame script ones, some not so lame ones. Now, there's only a few I like. Humor in stories for me is best when in epics or short stories; for instance, Ranger's Apprentice is a serious book, and yet I laugh a lot while reading it. Basically, when a story is dedicated solely to humor, it is hard to be good, to me that is. I mean, I'd love to see a 'comedy' that mixed seriousness and humor together. Only, that would be an Epic, not a Comedy.

/random thoughts.

[Hurricane iBrow]

Yeah, when I was a noob on BZP, I loved comedies, lame script ones, some not so lame ones. Now, there's only a few I like. Humor in stories for me is best when in epics or short stories; for instance, Ranger's Apprentice is a serious book, and yet I laugh a lot while reading it. Basically, when a story is dedicated solely to humor, it is hard to be good, to me that is. I mean, I'd love to see a 'comedy' that mixed seriousness and humor together. Only, that would be an Epic, not a Comedy.

/random thoughts.

Au contraire, my friend. There are several comedies that mix seriousness and humour together in Comedies. As Velox I believe said in the original LDT, a comedy doesn't always have to be funny. Obviously the humour is going to be more prevalent if it's a comedy, but they can be serious/dramatic/action packed/other stuff as well.

-ibrow

[Grantaire]

There are, as always, a few exceptions to the rule. However:

1: in about half of the ones you talk of, the writing styles are mehish at best.
2: there are nowhere near enough to define comedies by them.

Granted, I might read a comedy by such a master as Juliana, but there's only one of her, not thirty.

[Hurricane iBrow]

There are, as always, a few exceptions to the rule. However:

1: in about half of the ones you talk of, the writing styles are mehish at best.
2: there are nowhere near enough to define comedies by them.

Granted, I might read a comedy by such a master as Juliana, but there's only one of her, not thirty.

I never implied that you should define comedies by those with an emphasis on the serious; I simply provided information to correct the assumption that there were none.

I get the gist of your comment, but I'm not even sure there's twenty authors in Comedies these days... but I digress.

-ibrow

[Hahli Husky]

As someone who's run the Library for 6 or so years (and worked in it about 2 or 3 years before that) and decides on the rules therein, sure, I'll take a GD quiz about the Library! But just warning everyone upfront that I can't promise I'll answer any opposing replies. I'm doing this right now because I'm bored and I actually have free time to reply to this. ;;

1.) Should the entire Library have a 300 word minimum? Why?

I don't think it should. The 300-word minimum rule in Comedies was instated because, at the time, it was the nature of many Comedies authors to constantly churn out what were basically repetitive, spam-filled chapters like little keyboard-mashing factories. I've never noticed such an issue in SS and Epics, and recently in Comedies, this problem has really calmed down.

Here's some history that might interest those who weren't here or don't remember. For a long time on BZP, we had to worry about bandwidth sizes and server overloads. Just a couple years after it was launched, BZP was rather limited and became very crowded. If you posted a topic in any Library forum, especially Comedies, and it received no replies, your topic was off the front page within 24 hours. Comedies authors struggled to be noticed amid some very talented and popular competition.

So to some, it seemed the easy way out was to post chapters as often as possible, no matter the quantity of words or quality of story. I think the Comedies leaders at the time felt that the 300-word-rule was the most effective way to curb this. There would be at least 10 reports a day about writers who had broken the rule. The concern wasn't the need to control content, though many staff appreciated that additional benefit offered by the rule. The point was to try to curb server and bandwidth overloads.

Nowadays, the activity has decreased drastically while server performance has increased. We don't need to worry about overloading the site anymore. All the 300-word-rule does is try to control content. For a long time, it has been assumed by staff and members alike that this rule was designed to control content.

Every 6 months or so, I review each Library division's rules. I revise them to correct errors, offer more clarity, add any needed new rules, and remove rules that are no longer relevant. As I've gained more experience and thought things over, I've found some rules to be unfair or ridiculous. Instead of just carrying on "because it's always been this way!", I talk it out with other staff and do some brainstorming to figure out if I should remove said rule.

Now that I've explained some history and my operations, I'll finish answering the question. After all the experience I've had, I feel that trying to control non-harmful content in a creative forum is wrong. In this case, I feel that making people adhere to a minimum word limit is stifling to creativity and growth, especially for those who are just starting out and have less experience in sharing their writing. Usually I find that people who write tiny stories or chapters are young, either in age or in writing skill, or possibly both. Just forcing them to write more words doesn't teach the point as well as good examples and feedback can.

I often think that more length makes for better stories and chapters, but not everyone does. And honestly, I've read stories, some of them on BZP, that are very short but very good, specifically snapshot or mood pieces. When I'm judging writing contests, I absolutely love when there's a short entry that really captures my interest.

I know when I first started posting in the Library, at age 14, my chapters and stories were very small and not very good. There were those who were my age who had more experience and were much better for it. But I was earnest in my writing; I thought it was clever and funny and interesting. Other members encouraged me and gently nudged me in the right direction. Within a year, I was confident and began writing stories that I enjoy when I go back and reread them, instead of cringing (my reaction to stuff I wrote before I started learning.)

Because of all this, I've been taking the time to study the nature of Comedies now and see if the 300-word-rule can be easily lifted. Until recently, McSmeag was in charge of Comedies, so it was his say whether the rule stayed or not. I can't say if I will lift the rule or not (please do not contact me about it), but I am feeling that it's very unnecessary these days. I definitely don't want to see content-controlling rules in SS or Epics, either. Extremely short fan fiction doesn't hurt anyone or anything. If you come across a very short short story or epic and feel that the author "didn't try" or "doesn't care", please try to give them the benefit of the doubt. Some people just don't know why longer, more fleshed-out stories are more popular and are often better quality. Maybe you could give them some hints.

2.) Should comedies be merged with the rest of the library? Why?

This is actually the first time I've heard this suggestion! I think the separation of comedic stories is just a deep-set habit now. People sometimes ask me if their story should be in Epics or Comedies, but it's very easy to decide. Comedies seems to be separated because of the common natures of fan fiction: they're often either extraordinarily silly or more serious. The intent of the separation seems to be for the benefit of those who aren't interested in reading really humorous stuff, or those who are. I know there are many technical comedies that can be serious at times, and many technical epics can be hilarious at times. I think Comedies is there because of a once-high demand for crazy, goofy stuff. I think it lingers because of that deep-set habit and the continued demand, although said demand has lessened. Maybe Comedies will merge with Epics and Short Stories in the future. But at this time, I feel that it's a non-issue as-is.

3.) Should the "one chapter per 24 hours" rule be reinstated for anyone not reposting an epic from the old board?

Since I was the one who removed it, that's an obvious no. The 24-hour rule was a lot like the 300-word rule. Once upon a time, it was there to help the clunky server out during the high traffic years. Once the server could handle the changing demand, the 24-hour rule became a content limiter. All it would do now is force people to post chapters at a pace that others (not everyone) feel is acceptable. As such, I think it would enforce an opinion on what is non-harmful to members. For instance, if you think someone is posting chapters too fast, that's their business. I personally think that chapters should be posted in a non-rushed manner, but since that's my opinion, it's not necessarily fair for me to force it on others.

4.) Do you want a CoT Library? Why? If a CoT Library existed, how often would you make use of it?

I doubt a CoT Library will ever happen. There's a good amount of members posting their non-LEGO stories in CoT and blogs, so I know there is a bit of a demand. But if B6 allows a CoT Library, it would open the door for creating a CoT-whatever-else-creative-forum just because of demand. This could result in many non-BIONICLE or LEGO forums. The BZP Administration wants to keep the site focused primarily on BIONICLE and secondary on LEGO. I understand their reasoning. In the end, it's their call, not mine.

If there was a CoT Library, I'm not sure how much I personally would use it, as I'm no longer interested in sharing the things I write on BZP.

5.) Are there any ideas, themes, etc. you feel would be better expressed in your writing without a Bionicle influence? What are they?

Not really, as I have always written fan-fiction with as much or as little canon regard as I want. I respect those who try to write within canon, but it's not for me. If I want to add something, I find a way to shape it and fit it in. Even if it means creating new worlds with different rules.

6.) How often do you post a story? How often do you review?

Like I said before, I don't post fan fiction anymore. I write every couple months, but I these days, I express myself better through creating game scripts, doodling, and sewing. I share what I write with Janus, and that's good enough for me. I don't publicly review much anymore, but members often ask me to read their stories and offer feedback before they post them. I do most of my reviewing that way.

7.) Do you use the critic clubs? Why or why not? Do you find the critic clubs useful?

No, since I don't post fan fiction anymore, I have nothing for them to review. A lot of people seem to like the critic's clubs, so i think they serve a good purpose as long as they stay helpful and genuine.

8.) Who are some of your favorite Library writers? What are some of your favorite Library stories? What's your favorite self-written work?

I'm so old-school when it comes to this! I remember really liking Nova Nuhvok (Belfy), Israeli Toa, Janus, PaharakGirl, korobound, <daydreamer>. I can't really remember the names of the stories I liked and would have to go on a huge hunt to find them. But basically, anything on the old forums by those people was RAD. As for my own fan fiction, I think my favorite is still that Vakama's Story one. I mean, I look at it now and it's kinda silly and sometimes campy, but I remember having such a great time writing it. I was actually depressed when I finished it. XD When I read back over it, I still feel proud of some of the different ideas I came up with and my dedication and love for it.

Thanks for the new GD quiz on the Library, Ced! I had a good time filling it out and thinking about it. Like I said before, I most likely won't be able to join the debate or follow-up on replies, but I hope people enjoy my post or even find it enlightening. <3

Edited by Hahli Husky, Nov 28 2012 - 07:30 PM.

[AZBlue]

HH: You just brought back a huge rush of nostalgic memories to me with that last answer. Korobound was one of my biggest inspirations to write in the library here. Her, Pahrakgirl, and <dd> were some of my best friends here in my early days, both with my writings, and with my socialization. I still go back to the archives to read korobound's unfinished epic that was similar to GaliGee's Makuta stories, and former member RahiZaku's great epic. Now I want to go back and read the epics again!

[ZHX]

1.) Should the entire Library have a 300 word minimum?
Not really, because sometimes there are short stories that work well under 300 words.

2.) Should comedies be merged with the rest of the library? Why?
Nope. The Comedies section is an independent entity, and its stories probably wouldn't fit in epics or short stories.

3.) Should the "one chapter per 24 hours" rule be reinstated for anyone not reposting an epic from the old board?
Nah. I've seen people who are pretty good at churning out chapters daily.

4.) Do you want a CoT Library? Why? If a CoT Library existed, how often would you make use of it?
Yeah. It makes it much easier to find stories in the random area that is CoT. I would probably visit it regularly to look for stories to read.

5.) Are there any ideas, themes, etc. you feel would be better expressed in your writing without a Bionicle influence? What are they?
Giant robots of course.

6.) How often do you post a story? How often do you review?
I haven't posted a story in ages. Will be posting a comedy at Christmas. And review? Maybe ... some times a week?

7.) Do you use the critic clubs? Why or why not? Do you find the critic clubs useful?
I'm part of the Comedies Critics Club. And I must admit I am a very useful person.

8.) Who are some of your favorite Library writers? What are some of your favorite Library stories? What's your favorite self-written work?
That's a very difficult question to ask. To tell you the truth, I really don't have any favourites, but I do enjoy most of the stories I read. And my favourite self-written work? Uh ... most of them are old and terrible, so none.

Edited by Ordinary Magician, Nov 20 2012 - 03:11 AM.

[Hahli Husky]

HH: You just brought back a huge rush of nostalgic memories to me with that last answer. Korobound was one of my biggest inspirations to write in the library here. Her, Pahrakgirl, and <dd> were some of my best friends here in my early days, both with my writings, and with my socialization. I still go back to the archives to read korobound's unfinished epic that was similar to GaliGee's Makuta stories, and former member RahiZaku's great epic. Now I want to go back and read the epics again!

Oh, wow, that's awesome! They were also some of my oldest and closest friends; the only one I'm still in touch with is <dd>, but man those were good times. They were amazing writers. It's cool someone else remembers them.

[Grantaire]

1.) Should the entire Library have a 300 word minimum? Why?

No. 200 words, perhaps, but 300? well, let's just say it's possible to have a good story that's shorter.

2.) Should comedies be merged with the rest of the library? Why?

No. They've been a separate thing in division and nature, adn should stay as such.

3.) Should the "one chapter per 24 hours" rule be reinstated for anyone not reposting an epic from the old board?

By no means.

4.) Do you want a CoT Library? Why? If a CoT Library existed, how often would you make use of it?

Yes! Most certainly yes. My stories are forever getting buried by stupid "What are you listening to" topics and such. I'd make use of it quite a lot if it existed.

5.) Are there any ideas, themes, etc. you feel would be better expressed in your writing without a Bionicle influence? What are they?

There probably are, I just can't think of any.

6.) How often do you post a story? How often do you review?

As often as I write them; about once every other week or less. I review at least every week.

7.) Do you use the critic clubs? Why or why not? Do you find the critic clubs useful?

I'm a critic in all but the CCC, and I submit most of my stories to them.

8.) Who are some of your favorite Library writers? What are some of your favorite Library stories? What's your favorite self-written work?

Grant-Sud, Tolkien, Inferna Firesword, Kraggh, Aderia, and others. Some of my favorite stories... Too many to name, just because I always forget titles. My favorite work of myself would be Safe and Sound.

[Peach 00]

How have I not posted in this? Oh, well, here we go.

 

1) Should the entire Library have a 300 word minimum? Why?

 

No. Perhaps a writer would like to write a simply descriptive essay, or write a poem. Poems usually are a maximum of 300 words, and that's a rather large poem as it is. Most of my poems reach perhaps a maximum of 150 words, so unless you were to create a poetry subforum (which I doubt would ever happen, there's a minority here that writes poetry), poems wouldn't be allowed, unless the Library forum moderators were to make some exceptions.

 

2) Should Comedies be merged with the rest of the Library? Why?

 

No. It's been a seperate entity in itself, and should stay as that. Perhaps I'm being a little hard on the forum, but I've read what's in there, and it would hardly be able to fit in with the writing in the Epics and Short Stories forum. Not to treat it as some lower class, but what's in the other forums isn't at all in Comedies. Epics and Short Stories both focus on more dramatic, serious writing, while Comedies tends to be just random gibberish. Sure, not all of it's like that, but a broad majority is, trust me.

 

3) Should the "one chapter per 24 hours" rule be reinstated for anyone not reposting an epic from the old board?

 

I suppose no. Some cases I can see it would be alright, but other times, no.

 

4) Do you want a CoT Library? Why? If a CoT Library existed, how often would you make use of it?
 

Very often. I would love one. I have posted at least six stories, and all of them have been buried underneath the useless game topics, there being maybe ten of those maximum. Within the first day it's already at the third page - so indeed, I would make enormous use of it and would love one, and thankfully, the staff has done so for us.

 

5) Are there any ideas, themes, etc. you feel would be better expressed in your writing without a Bionicle influence? What are they?
 

Not a lot. I would love to express such things as death, love, depression, et cetera, a little more thoroughly without BIONICLE's influence. Some may say you can go deep even with the influence of BIONICLE, but personally, I still think that there are some levels you can't penetrate with biomechanical beings. Human emotion is where it is that - mainly why I've been writing more COT pieces to try and penetrate those levels.

 

6) How often do you post a story? How often do you review?

 

Once every few months. And...well, once every few months.

 

7) Do you use the critic clubs? Why or why not? Do you find the critic clubs useful?
 

Yes, in order to gain some reviews. I had to use the ECC when I reposted Danger Close, considering I had a tough time garnering reviews and getting my old reviewers back into the story. I do find them very useful, yes.

 

8) Who are some of your favorite Library writers? What are some of your favorite Library stories? What's your favorite self-written work?
 

This was the part I wasn't looking forward to very much. My memory isn't very good at the moment, so I'll just give you a brief list (in no favorite order mind you, so don't think you're not one of my favorite writers if you're close to the bottom of the list).

 

• Velox
• Lady Kopaka
• Inferna Firesword
• Aderia
• Zarayna
• Grant-Sud
• Legolover (Gosh, I can never remember how to write your username, apologies)
• Rising Moon
• Jean Valjean (also known as Emperor Kraagh, I believe)
• GaliGee
• Taka Nuvia (she does write, you know!)
• Cederak
• Tifosi 92
• Yukiko

If I forgot anybody, forgive me. It's late, for goodness sakes. And my favorite stories? Too many to name. For the meantime, I'll mention that my favorite epic is Glitch In the System by Lady Kopaka. I owe all my writing talent to this wonderful epic and its wonderful writer. Thank you once again, Lady K - I owe you everything.

 

None of them. If I had to choose, and in this case I do, I'd say To Fly or Mistletoe.

 

Not much else to say than the fact that thanks to Velox for kind of defending me on my style of writing in Comedies. I chose script writing because it seemed proper in the Comedies forums, as in actual script writing like that used in plays. Truth be told, as Velox said, the BZP-script writing is slightly garbled and absolutely diffused from what actual script writing is, or at least to me anyway. Not to say that just because I'm using proper script writing means I'm better than everyone else, I just think that the way people use script writing here makes things very confusing, and it becomes irritating after awhile when everyone else starts writing in the same garbled mannerism.

 

I was going to write in prose at first, but I decided not to. No matter which way I went to write it, it didn't seem to fit in.