10 replies to this topic

[Kooler186]

I noticed something strange about The Kingdom and which matoran became Toa because of Turaga Takanuva

1. There is no Earth Toa
2. There is no Ice Toa
3. There are two Ta-Matoran transformed into Toa, why would a Toa team need 2 Fire Toa

The two matoran are Balta and Kapura. Kapura was taught by Vakama to master being slow, and how to use it in advantage. I think Vakama was holding onto the Vahi until he deemed Kapura ready for wearing the Vahi. Most likely Kapura would become the Toa of Time instead of Toa of Flame like the Bionicle Wiki. Vakama was awful at using the mask, and Tahu had the same problem, I feel like Kapura should have been important to the story, but he was passed up like he was since the Battle of Kini Nui.

Plus I never understood why they passed up Macku as a Toa when she has chemistry with Hewkii, and she probably is the only one that talks to the Toa Mahri because of this bond. Jaller was important to Ta-Koro, so I dont undertsnad why he is unpopular, he and Kongu brought reinforcements to the battle of Kini Nui. Nuparu most likely could have improved the Kingdom because he is the best mechanic they have seen. Hewkii is the patron of Kohlii and in The Kingdom he should be in charge of running the competition.

Matoro being called the Disgraced One is the only thing that didn't seem flawed to me...I need to reread the rest of The Kingdom in order to see if there is anything else I find flawed. I understand the Kingdom is about Matoro failure, but why penalize the whole team for his mistake. He helped Makuta, the rest of the Mahri didn't.

Edited by Kooler186, Feb 22 2013 - 08:25 AM.

[Vakama-san]

Well, the thing with this kind of question is: you forgot to take into account the fact that in another Plane(excuse me if you don't like the term; but this is the word I'll use for Alternate Dimensions and seperate Planes of existence), there's most likely numerous changes to it's timeline; personalities could change, certain beings could not exist, anything down to a person or place being named different. Otherwise, if everything happened the same, Matoro, in his Main Universe personality, wouldn't hesitate whatsoever to race ahead of the plummeting Voya Nui, because it's also his personality that caused him to do so. Because this is the case, other's personallities would differ from their Main Universe counterpart's as well, leading to their seemingly impossible and utter rejection of him and the Toa Mahri.

Also Hewkii and Macku's..."chemistry" was retconned to be nonexistent.

And, finally, Kapura wouldn't become a Toa of Time just because he could wield the Vahi(IF he could do so to begin with). Just like any other Ta-Matoran, he would become a Toa of Fire.

Hope this helps!

EDIT: oh yeah, it isn't a rule for a Toa team to have the normal six elements. After all, it's not that the "main" six are the norm, it's just that those are the elements used by the Toa in the main story. There's also no rule against double up elements.

Edited by Vakama-san, Feb 22 2013 - 08:53 AM.

[Strack]

well, the answer to 1 and 2 is simply that we hadn't seen all of it. I mean, all we saw was the streets, the city "hall", and the barrier. so there COULD be more Toa there, I mean....it would be pretty stupid  to have only about 12 toa to guard the whole island where nearly all of the citizens of the world are, right? the answer the three is that....well, fire is pretty powerful, and it's (in my opinion) the most destructive of the six original elements, so take a normal team, double the firepower, and you have yourself a force that could stop just about anything that came through. as for why there would be two on one team, all the set Toas were in a team of six with different elements, but we know of many who aren't that balanced out. Lhikan's and Lessovik's, to name a few.

 

Jaller was unpopular because he failed at what he was supposed to do, literally saving the world. I guess Macku was passed up because the writer didn't think of her. Nuparu was mentioned to having helped build things to reach the stars, so he was helping the place. hewkii was killed. and Matoro didn't help Makuta, he destroyed his plans by allowing the great spirit to die.

 

Hope this helps!

[DuplexBeGreat]

In response to Vakama-san, I'd like to say that I disagree. An alternate reality, which is the word I choose to use, generally has only one change made from the "prime" reality that makes it different in a fictional story. Matoro's personality isn't the thing that changed either; nothing changed except that Matoro made a spur of the moment decision (or rather, didn't make that decision). Nothing else needed to be different, and I believe Greg has confirmed that the alternate realities are separated by only one major change.

[The Great Being Velika]

There's also not several other types of Toa not chosen in the story, why wouldn't a team need two fire Toa? The Toa Mangai had four Toa of Ice and two Toa of Water.

 

A "Toa of Time"? Sorry, but that's impossible, Kapura is a Ta-Matoran, hence Toa of fire, he doesn't switch to a legendary element because he learned to walk slow. Interesting theory about Turaga Vakama preparing Kapura  for the Kanohi Vahi, if unlikely.

 

More likely they passed up Macku simply because she was not destined to become Toa. Also the relationship between Hewkii and Macku has been sadly decanonized. Jaller, Kongu, and Hewkii, as described in the story, are unpopular due to being part of the Toa team that failed to save the Universe.

 

I don't recall any point in which Matoro willingly helped Teridax....

Edited by The Great Being Velika, Feb 22 2013 - 12:37 PM.

[Takua Dragonstar7]

Toa Teams can have any elements and any number of teammates on it. About the two Fire Toa thing, the Toa Mangai had around four Ice Toa on it.

[TheSkeletonMan939]

1. There is no Earth Toa
2. 
   
3. There is no Ice Toa
4. 
   
5. There are two Ta-Matoran transformed into Toa, why would a Toa team need 2 Fire Toa

    

 

So what if there's no earth or ice Toa? How do know there aren't? We were never given an in-depth look into the Kingdom dimension.

 

 

And what's the big problem with two fire Toa? Are you saying that there should only be one fire Toa at a time? If that's what you're saying, that's just ridiculous. It's like saying, "I have one child. Why should I have another?"

 

Also, Greg did not spend day and night creating a rigid timeline for this universe. He didn't consider the possibilities of each character and how each could be used. He was too busy with the books and comics and all his other Lego writing stuff to dive into the world of the Kingdom.

Edited by TheSkeletonMan939, Feb 22 2013 - 03:17 PM.

[XyzTheDay!]

I believe Greg has confirmed that the alternate realities are separated by only one major change.

 

The thing about alternate realities is that while they start with one single alteration (major or minor), that one alteration tends to kick off a domino effect that extends indefinitely into the future, which in turn results in many more alterations.

Edited by XyzTheDay!, Feb 22 2013 - 04:06 PM.

[Kooler186]

What I'm saying is Kapura was trained to be slow, the Vahi makes people slow, Kapura most likely became the only Toa of Time

[TheSkeletonMan939]

What I'm saying is Kapura was trained to be slow, the Vahi makes people slow, Kapura most likely became the only Toa of Time

There can't be a Toa of Time. Are you suggesting that Vakama used the Vahi to make Kapura fast but slow?

[The Great Being Velika]

What I'm saying is Kapura was trained to be slow, the Vahi makes people slow, Kapura most likely became the only Toa of Time

For there to be a Toa of Time there would have to be a Matoran of Time, and there are no Matoran of Time because Matoran cannot have Legendary Elements. No Matoran can be "trained" into another element anyway. I can buy Vakama somehow knowing that Kapura could be destined to become a Toa, and training him to be able to use the Kanohi Vahi, but Toa are classified by their element, not their mask powers. Therefore Kapura would be a Toa of Fire, possibly wearing a Vahi (We have no idea what Kanohi he wore as a Toa).

Edited by The Great Being Velika, Feb 23 2013 - 06:08 PM.