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Avak Prototype?


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I noticed when I got the book when it came out, and I compared Avak to the one on the cover. They looked different and I thought it was a prototype. Since I didn't create an account and heard about this site at that time, I had it to myself. But now, I need to know what you think.

 

Is the Avak on the cover a prototype, or did the artist design it that way?

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the cover on the book were avak seems to have a third eye and a more stretched out face could of just been artist flaw or they had a prototype on the desk.

one day this will contain greatness only the best. But take this with the ocean of salt then you will know what to expect from this

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I believe all of them were prototypes, yes, or at least not the finalized renderings. The most obvious clues are Reidak and Avak's head/spine piece, Reidak's weapon (it's shown as silver), and Hakann's Zamor launcher. The fogginess and cluttered nature of the rest of the cover make it difficult to spot any other differences, but it's safe to assume that the cover design used the almost-final versions of the sets rather than the final versions, which is what occasionally happened with the books (see City of the Lost) and other media.

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  • 3 weeks later...

For the record, the image is here:

 

http://biosector01.com/wiki/images/2/29/BL2.png

 

 

The most obvious clues are Reidak and Avak's head/spine piece, Reidak's weapon (it's shown as silver), and Hakann's Zamor launcher.

Hm... I'm not totally convinced of all of these. I agree about Reidak's weapon color (obvious) and kinda with the head, but all I'm seeing for sure is that the artist showed the "hole" shape in his forehead glowing as a third eye -- that could just be the artist's mistaken assumption.

 

With Avak, what is anyone seeing that's any different? Maybe the arm spines are a bit more spaced out, but it's hard to tell from just comparing the set image at one angle and this at another, etc. It may be like looking at a sheet of paper edge-wise, seeing it as very thin, versus a slight angle.

 

The face looks the same to me, albeit in different lighting.

 

As for Hakann's Zamor launcher, it doesn't look different to me. What's different is he's holding it sideways; clearly an inside joke to fans who know the Piraka were portrayed as gangsters.

 

Even Reidak's weapon color scheme could be a mistake and not technically a prototype. I'm presuming these were 3D renders, so the color would have to be added even if they were modeled exactly on the sets. Thoughts? Crazy? :P

Edited by bonesiii

The Destiny of Bionicle (chronological retelling of Bionicle original series, 9 PDFs of 10 chapters each on Google Drive)Part 1 - Warring with Fate | Part 2 - Year of Change | Part 3 - The Exploration Trap | Part 4 - Rise of the Warlords | Part 5 - A Busy Matoran | Part 6 - The Dark Time | Part 7 - Proving Grounds | Part 8 - A Rude Awakening | Part 9 - The Battle of Giants

My Bionicle Fanfiction  (Google Drive folder, eventually planned to have PDFs of all of it)

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For the record, the image is here:

 

http://biosector01.com/wiki/images/2/29/BL2.png

 

 

The most obvious clues are Reidak and Avak's head/spine piece, Reidak's weapon (it's shown as silver), and Hakann's Zamor launcher.

Hm... I'm not totally convinced of all of these. I agree about Reidak's weapon color (obvious) and kinda with the head, but all I'm seeing for sure is that the artist showed the "hole" shape in his forehead glowing as a third eye -- that could just be the artist's mistaken assumption.

 

With Avak, what is anyone seeing that's any different? Maybe the arm spines are a bit more spaced out, but it's hard to tell from just comparing the set image at one angle and this at another, etc. It may be like looking at a sheet of paper edge-wise, seeing it as very thin, versus a slight angle.

 

The face looks the same to me, albeit in different lighting.

 

As for Hakann's Zamor launcher, it doesn't look different to me. What's different is he's holding it sideways; clearly an inside joke to fans who know the Piraka were portrayed as gangsters.

 

Even Reidak's weapon color scheme could be a mistake and not technically a prototype. I'm presuming these were 3D renders, so the color would have to be added even if they were modeled exactly on the sets. Thoughts? Crazy? :P

 

Take a good look at Avak's spine in the final set (which has some of the smallest spikes), and in this image, where it is one of the biggest, and he appears to have tusks. Then compare all the Piraka to prototype pictures of them. The Proto's have it all, even down to Reidak's third eye. These are prototypes.

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For the record, the image is here:

 

http://biosector01.com/wiki/images/2/29/BL2.png

 

 

The most obvious clues are Reidak and Avak's head/spine piece, Reidak's weapon (it's shown as silver), and Hakann's Zamor launcher.

Hm... I'm not totally convinced of all of these. I agree about Reidak's weapon color (obvious) and kinda with the head, but all I'm seeing for sure is that the artist showed the "hole" shape in his forehead glowing as a third eye -- that could just be the artist's mistaken assumption.

 

With Avak, what is anyone seeing that's any different? Maybe the arm spines are a bit more spaced out, but it's hard to tell from just comparing the set image at one angle and this at another, etc. It may be like looking at a sheet of paper edge-wise, seeing it as very thin, versus a slight angle.

 

The face looks the same to me, albeit in different lighting.

 

As for Hakann's Zamor launcher, it doesn't look different to me. What's different is he's holding it sideways; clearly an inside joke to fans who know the Piraka were portrayed as gangsters.

 

Even Reidak's weapon color scheme could be a mistake and not technically a prototype. I'm presuming these were 3D renders, so the color would have to be added even if they were modeled exactly on the sets. Thoughts? Crazy? :P

These definitely aren't 3D renderings. They do look very similar to some of the 3D renderings, so its hard to tell the difference. ;) The cover of Dark Destiny and most of the other cover pictures of the books were highly Photoshopped images of the actual sets.

 

Also, if you compare Avak's head on the cover of Dark Destiny to a picture of the prototype Avak, you will see that it is indeed a prototype. The prototype Reidak also has the top eye hole. Additionally, all the Piraka prototypes had upside down Zamor launchers. The Piraka on the cover of Dark Destiny also have upside down Zamor launchers.

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For the record, the image is here: http://biosector01.com/wiki/images/2/29/BL2.png

The most obvious clues are Reidak and Avak's head/spine piece, Reidak's weapon (it's shown as silver), and Hakann's Zamor launcher.

Hm... I'm not totally convinced of all of these. I agree about Reidak's weapon color (obvious) and kinda with the head, but all I'm seeing for sure is that the artist showed the "hole" shape in his forehead glowing as a third eye -- that could just be the artist's mistaken assumption.

 

Check the spine, though. Reidak's finalized spine has the row of two "forks", whereas this version has just a single row of (what I assume are) spikes.

With Avak, what is anyone seeing that's any different? Maybe the arm spines are a bit more spaced out, but it's hard to tell from just comparing the set image at one angle and this at another, etc. It may be like looking at a sheet of paper edge-wise, seeing it as very thin, versus a slight angle. The face looks the same to me, albeit in different lighting.

Also the back spine, and the tusks mentioned above.

As for Hakann's Zamor launcher, it doesn't look different to me. What's different is he's holding it sideways; clearly an inside joke to fans who know the Piraka were portrayed as gangsters. Even Reidak's weapon color scheme could be a mistake and not technically a prototype. I'm presuming these were 3D renders, so the color would have to be added even if they were modeled exactly on the sets. Thoughts? Crazy? :P

I believe in other media such as the VNOLG where they clearly used non-finalized versions of the sets, the Zamor launchers were shown being held top-down by a horizontal peg (in the beginning-of-chapter animations). They also seemed to lack the two "arms" on the side that held the sphere in for some reason. This seems to match Hakann's launcher on the cover; he's holding it via a visibly different connection, and the only visible prong is on the opposite side (closest to his body; it seems to be at the wrong angle to be the top axle hole).

 

As for Reidak's weapon, I'm not sure how you're defining "prototype" here, but for me it's anything pre-finalized and/or pre-final-render. Him having a silver weapon is definitely not final, so it counts as a prototype in my eyes.

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It has always been totally obvious to me that they are all prototypes. There are several details that give this away. The Zamor launchers are a different design, obviously a prototype design as I have no idea how that is supposed to work. Also, all weapons but Zaktan's are silver. The most obvious ones are some of their faces, though. Avak's and Reidak's faces are quite different from their final designs. Reidak not only has a third eye but Avak's face has a different shape with some sort of pincers, hooks or whatever on the sides. There is also a quite subtle difference on Vezok, which can be seen on that cover but is actually easier to see on the Island of Doom cover. You may notice that on the top his head is slightly dented, something that doesn't appear on the final design. Then there are also Reidak's and Avak's spines as has been pointed out. To be honest, I'm not sure what there is to discuss about this. This has always been quite clear to me.-Gata signoff.png

Edited by Gatanui

- Gata

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It has always been totally obvious to me that they are all prototypes. There are several details that give this away. The Zamor launchers are a different design, obviously a prototype design as I have no idea how that is supposed to work. Also, all weapons but Zaktan's are silver. The most obvious ones are some of their faces, though. Avak's and Reidak's faces are quite different from their final designs. Reidak not only has a third eye but Avak's face has a different shape with some sort of pincers, hooks or whatever on the sides. There is also a quite subtle difference on Vezok, which can be seen on that cover but is actually easier to see on the Island of Doom cover. You may notice that on the top his head is slightly dented, something that doesn't appear on the final design. Then there are also Reidak's and Avak's spines as has been pointed out. To be honest, I'm not sure what there is to discuss about this. This has always been quite clear to me.-Gata signoff.png

Bones the Third just had a minor derp moment. That's all.

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Yeah, I see the tusks now. On my screen it looks just like a part of the body beneath the head, and hard to find a prototype image of that online but found two in a google search.

 

Why oh why didn't they keep the tusks in final set lol? That looks way cooler than final Avak. Ah well.

 

*carry on*

 

Bones the Third just had a minor derp moment. That's all.

:lol: For the record, I assumed yall must have been seeing something, and asking usually gets answers. ^_^

 

Edit:

 

I believe in other media such as the VNOLG where they clearly used non-finalized versions of the sets, the Zamor launchers were shown being held top-down by a horizontal peg (in the beginning-of-chapter animations). They also seemed to lack the two "arms" on the side that held the sphere in for some reason. This seems to match Hakann's launcher on the cover; he's holding it via a visibly different connection, and the only visible prong is on the opposite side (closest to his body; it seems to be at the wrong angle to be the top axle hole).

Not entirely sure what you're trying to say here -- sorry if this is another derp moment. :P We're agreed the zamor launcher's physical shape in the image is final, right, but that he's just holding it weird (specifically sideways, gangsta-style, as I said)?

 

Yes, the VNOG designs are clearly not the same, but not sure why you bring that up here, and I don't understand the phrase "this seems to match Hakann's launcher" in that context. And I don't know what you mean about "a visibly different connection" (different from what?), nor seeming to lack arms holding the sphere in. The VNOG design obviously does have pieces holding the sphere in; what it lacks is the pressure arm in the back and the parts on the top and bottom.

 

For the record, here's the VNOG launcher in question:

http://biosector01.com/wiki/images/b/bb/VNOLG_Zamor_Launcher.png

 

The Zamor launchers are a different design, obviously a prototype design as I have no idea how that is supposed to work.

Same questions basically to you. What specifically about it looks prototype to you, versus just held sideways (and having just been fired so the sphere obscures the central parts)?

 

Avak's and Reidak's faces are quite different from their final designs. Reidak not only has a third eye but Avak's face has a different shape with some sort of pincers, hooks or whatever on the sides.

I'm granting the pinchers, which proves this is more than just a color difference (as do the spines I guess, although I just thought it was a different angle), but did you see my point about the coloring of Reidak's "third eye"? The set has that shape. And the rest of Avak's face looks pretty much identical to final to me. I wouldn't call that "quite" different at all; subtle but there.

 

Here's the set form of Reidak:

 

http://biosector01.com/wiki/images/d/d0/Reidak.png

 

These definitely aren't 3D renderings.

I see.

 

The prototype Reidak also has the top eye hole.

Does not the final set as well? I don't have Reidak (Avak, Thok, Vezok), so all I have to go on is the final set image. BS01 shows it as having that hole. So the fact that this keeps being brought up as proof of a prototype form is puzzling.

 

 

Additionally, all the Piraka prototypes had upside down Zamor launchers. The Piraka on the cover of Dark Destiny also have upside down Zamor launchers.

I'm not getting where you're getting this part from either. Apologies for continual potential derp, but it's fun to discuss it. :P (For some weird reason lol.)

 

We're talking about this image, right?

 

http://biosector01.com/wiki/images/2/29/BL2.png

 

I'm not seeing the other launchers at all -- they're obscured behind Hakann and others and the whitish fog effect. Only Hakann's is visible and it's sideways, not upside-down, and held at the same connection point as in his final set image:

 

http://biosector01.com/wiki/images/d/db/Hakann.png

 

Reason I say this (even though this is the height of triviality but hey :P) is that if the actual Piraka prototypes had the launchers upside-down, then this not being CG (I assume it's "painted" digitally or whatever), and not having upside-down launchers would seem to imply these forms might in some cases be a bit beyond the prototype forms you're thinking of. :) Maybe a mix of those and the final forms?

 

BTW, I've had a hard time finding other prototype images other than Avak and Reidak. Avak's launcher is unclear, but Reidak's looks pretty clear:

 

http://www.brickshelf.com/gallery/murare/Piraka-Changes/pirakareidak1.jpg

 

This sounds like "upside-down" is not a fact, as this is sideways (looks kinda like the grips are sideways too though, so it might not be the final form?). I think I can now grant that the Hakann launcher isn't just a gangsta thing with the final one, and might not have been fired? Still, this is not upside-down. Anyone have a pic to explain that comment? :) Or better yet all six?

 

Fun trivial food for thought-exercise. :shrugs:

 

Another edit for funzorz: If you look close in the cover art, Avak is holding his launcher rightside-up. (But maybe if it's prototype launchers that is "sideways"... dunno. And he's holding it in his right hand instead of left. Yarr.)

Edited by bonesiii

The Destiny of Bionicle (chronological retelling of Bionicle original series, 9 PDFs of 10 chapters each on Google Drive)Part 1 - Warring with Fate | Part 2 - Year of Change | Part 3 - The Exploration Trap | Part 4 - Rise of the Warlords | Part 5 - A Busy Matoran | Part 6 - The Dark Time | Part 7 - Proving Grounds | Part 8 - A Rude Awakening | Part 9 - The Battle of Giants

My Bionicle Fanfiction  (Google Drive folder, eventually planned to have PDFs of all of it)

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Yeah, I see the tusks now. On my screen it looks just like a part of the body beneath the head, and hard to find a prototype image of that online but found two in a google search.

 

Why oh why didn't they keep the tusks in final set lol? That looks way cooler than final Avak. Ah well.

 

Yeah, it does look a lot cooler than the final version.

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The "hole" in Reidak's head isn't actually a hole in the final set, just an indentation.

 

Here are some of the images I was talking about from the VNOLG. I didn't mean the in-game sprites. You can more easily see the difference in the Zamor launchers if you look at, say Thok's launcher's silhouette at the left of the first image and again in the second image. That's what I mean by the launchers not having the two prongs on the side; the prototype versions only seemed to have the bottom one. Not only that, but I'm realizing now that it appears the prototype versions had the same connection points on the top and the bottom, meaning they could be swapped. Think of the two connections on the Nynrah blasters. The final Zamor launchers didn't have an axle hole all the way through.

 

Also, if you look at that first pic (the "Chapter 8" one), not only can you see the difference in Thok's launcher, you can see that the Piraka are shown in the same poses as they are on the book cover.

 

So basically:

Launchers aren't final

Reidak and Avak's headspines aren't final

Poses match the ones in the VNOLG, which aren't final

 

= sets in the image aren't final, which to me is within the definition of prototype

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The "hole" in Reidak's head isn't actually a hole in the final set, just an indentation.

Granted, but I think that technically my original point could still stand judging from that part alone; an artist could still misinterpret that as "supposed" to be glowing, like how the Zamor are "supposed" to be glowing but obviously don't in the set. Also, is it crystal clear that this wasn't already the case with the prototype form? That's "painted over" with glow too, apparently, like the main eyes. All three look digital, not made by physical glow-brain pieces.

 

Not that it matters if the cover art is entirely digitally painted anyways. :shrugs: I think what you mean is that it someone digitally painted over photos of the prototype sets?

 

And wow am I being really trivial today. Bored. :P

 

And BTW... same reaction about the third eye. Why oh why not keep it, that's cool! (Although weird numbers of eyes are perhaps a bit overused in Bionicle and HF together lol.)

 

 

I see what you mean about the missing prongs. Yeah... that's weird and physically impossible lol. Anyways, I'm glad I asked because I somehow missed all these images and some of these are very cool (I think I'll use some of them, carefully cropped, for my retelling now... in fact the Avak face fills a need I would otherwise have had to sketch for, with some color editing...).

The Destiny of Bionicle (chronological retelling of Bionicle original series, 9 PDFs of 10 chapters each on Google Drive)Part 1 - Warring with Fate | Part 2 - Year of Change | Part 3 - The Exploration Trap | Part 4 - Rise of the Warlords | Part 5 - A Busy Matoran | Part 6 - The Dark Time | Part 7 - Proving Grounds | Part 8 - A Rude Awakening | Part 9 - The Battle of Giants

My Bionicle Fanfiction  (Google Drive folder, eventually planned to have PDFs of all of it)

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Not that it matters if the cover art is entirely digitally painted anyways. :shrugs: I think what you mean is that it someone digitally painted over photos of the prototype sets?

 

Most of the cover art for the novels are images of digitally enhanced sets. (Often late stage prototypes as with the Piraka on Dark Destiny.)

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Yeah, I see the tusks now. On my screen it looks just like a part of the body beneath the head, and hard to find a prototype image of that online but found two in a google search.

 

Why oh why didn't they keep the tusks in final set lol? That looks way cooler than final Avak. Ah well.

 

Yeah, it does look a lot cooler than the final version.

 

Only Avak though. The third eye on Reidak looks awful to me.

 

Avak had by far my least favorite head design. It just looked so stupid.

 

 

Not that it matters if the cover art is entirely digitally painted anyways. :shrugs: I think what you mean is that it someone digitally painted over photos of the prototype sets?

 

Most of the cover art for the novels are images of digitally enhanced sets. (Often late stage prototypes as with the Piraka on Dark Destiny.)

 

I thought that most of the time, it was just the "official" image that appeared in the catalog or on the box or practically everywhere else. There are very few exceptions to that rule. This leads me to believe that these were all the early "official" images for the Piraka, and that Reidak was going to have the third eye glowing in those, which I am so happy that they changed.

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Yeah, I see the tusks now. On my screen it looks just like a part of the body beneath the head, and hard to find a prototype image of that online but found two in a google search.

 

Why oh why didn't they keep the tusks in final set lol? That looks way cooler than final Avak. Ah well.

 

Yeah, it does look a lot cooler than the final version.

 

Only Avak though. The third eye on Reidak looks awful to me.

 

Avak had by far my least favorite head design. It just looked so stupid.

 

 

Not that it matters if the cover art is entirely digitally painted anyways. :shrugs: I think what you mean is that it someone digitally painted over photos of the prototype sets?

 

Most of the cover art for the novels are images of digitally enhanced sets. (Often late stage prototypes as with the Piraka on Dark Destiny.)

 

I thought that most of the time, it was just the "official" image that appeared in the catalog or on the box or practically everywhere else. There are very few exceptions to that rule. This leads me to believe that these were all the early "official" images for the Piraka, and that Reidak was going to have the third eye glowing in those, which I am so happy that they changed.

 

A lot of the "official" images were Photoshopped images of the sets as well, like the Turaga of 2001 for example. But you're right, most of time the covers contain these "official" set images.

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Yeah, I see the tusks now. On my screen it looks just like a part of the body beneath the head, and hard to find a prototype image of that online but found two in a google search.

 

Why oh why didn't they keep the tusks in final set lol? That looks way cooler than final Avak. Ah well.

 

Yeah, it does look a lot cooler than the final version.

 

I support the motion above. :P

 

It's a real shame they didn't keep them.

 

As for what the topic actually respects to, I think they all are prototypes, at least most of them.

-G u u R a h K

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Yeah, I see the tusks now. On my screen it looks just like a part of the body beneath the head, and hard to find a prototype image of that online but found two in a google search.

 

Why oh why didn't they keep the tusks in final set lol? That looks way cooler than final Avak. Ah well.

 

Yeah, it does look a lot cooler than the final version.

 

I support the motion above. :P

 

It's a real shame they didn't keep them.

 

As for what the topic actually respects to, I think they all are prototypes, at least most of them.

 

They all are, though the differences are very subtle on most of them, like Vezok and Zaktan for example.

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Yeah, I see the tusks now. On my screen it looks just like a part of the body beneath the head, and hard to find a prototype image of that online but found two in a google search.

 

Why oh why didn't they keep the tusks in final set lol? That looks way cooler than final Avak. Ah well.

 

Yeah, it does look a lot cooler than the final version.

 

I support the motion above. :P

 

It's a real shame they didn't keep them.

 

As for what the topic actually respects to, I think they all are prototypes, at least most of them.

 

They all are, though the differences are very subtle on most of them, like Vezok and Zaktan for example.

 

I noticed Zaktan instantly. He has way too many spikes. But Vezok took me a while. The face is very slightly different.

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Yeah, I see the tusks now. On my screen it looks just like a part of the body beneath the head, and hard to find a prototype image of that online but found two in a google search.

 

Why oh why didn't they keep the tusks in final set lol? That looks way cooler than final Avak. Ah well.

 

Yeah, it does look a lot cooler than the final version.

 

I support the motion above. :P

 

It's a real shame they didn't keep them.

 

As for what the topic actually respects to, I think they all are prototypes, at least most of them.

 

They all are, though the differences are very subtle on most of them, like Vezok and Zaktan for example.

 

I noticed Zaktan instantly. He has way too many spikes. But Vezok took me a while. The face is very slightly different.

 

That's funny, because I noticed the differences in Vezok's face before Zaktan's spikes, although Vezok's differences are more subtle.

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Yeah, I see the tusks now. On my screen it looks just like a part of the body beneath the head, and hard to find a prototype image of that online but found two in a google search.

 

Why oh why didn't they keep the tusks in final set lol? That looks way cooler than final Avak. Ah well.

 

Yeah, it does look a lot cooler than the final version.

 

I support the motion above. :P

 

It's a real shame they didn't keep them.

 

As for what the topic actually respects to, I think they all are prototypes, at least most of them.

 

They all are, though the differences are very subtle on most of them, like Vezok and Zaktan for example.

 

I noticed Zaktan instantly. He has way too many spikes. But Vezok took me a while. The face is very slightly different.

 

That's funny, because I noticed the differences in Vezok's face before Zaktan's spikes, although Vezok's differences are more subtle.

 

 

Like those generic one-spike-only and wide spines.

-G u u R a h K

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