Element Naming Confusion

[Archon~]

So I read that the Toa Mata were created as avatars and named after their elements. Does this means that Tahu means Fire, just like how Gali means Water, etc.? Would a mask of fire be called the Kanohi Tahu then?

 

Also, we know that Kraahkan and Avohkii mean Shadow and Light respectively, just how Kra- and Av- are their prefixes. The Kanohi Garai is the mask of Gravity correct? Then why in the world is Ba- the prefix. Shouldn't it be Gar- or shouldn't the mask be called the Kanohi Barai?

Edited October 5, 2014 by Archon~

[Boidoh]

Toa Maya? Lol.

 

No. Tahu was named after his element because Ta- means fire. So TAhu.

 

Those two masks weren't made from those erm... What were they called. Elemental disk? Toa disks? Yeah that.... The Garai was made from the Disk of Gravity, so there isn't really any trend to follow.

Edited October 17, 2014 by Boidoh

[Aanchir]

So I read that the Toa Maya were created as avatars and named after their elements. Does this means that Tahu means Fire, just like how Gali means Water, etc.? Would a mask of fire be called the Kanohi Tahu then?

 

Also, we know that Kraahkan and Avohkii mean Shadow and Light respectively, just how Kra- and Av- are their prefixes. The Kanohi Garai is the mask of Gravity correct? Then why in the world is Ba- the prefix. Shouldn't it be Gar- or shouldn't the mask be called the Kanohi Barai?

Or it could be that the Matoran have more than one word for gravity.

 

I wouldn't overthink it. The Matoran language is something the story team sort of made up as they went along. It had less to do with specific linguistic rules and more to be with "which names can we get the legal team to approve and what can we assign them to".

[Archon~]

Toa Maya? Lol.

 

No. Tahu was named after his element because Ta- means fire. So TAhu.

 

Those two masks weren't made from those erm... What were they called. Elemental disk? Toa disks? Yeah that.... The Garai was made from the Mask of Gravity, so there isn't really any trend to follow.

lol sorry typos occur often since I post everything from my phone.

And it doesn't matrer what it was made from, if the mask translates to mask of gravity, then that is what Kanohi Garai means. Just cuz it's made from something else doesn't mean the masks name changes.

And yeah, I always got that the prefixes correlate to the elements, but I wanted more insight into this with someone who maybe remembers if something like this was brought up before (cough help bonesiii cough).

 

 

Or it could be that the Matoran have more than one word for gravity.

 

I wouldn't overthink it. The Matoran language is something the story team sort of made up as they went along. It had less to do with specific linguistic rules and more to be with "which names can we get the legal team to approve and what can we assign them to".

Oh, but overthinking it the job of S&T my good man!!

 

But that's a good point, maybe they could have two words, although it would be somewhat disappointing. :S

Edited October 5, 2014 by Archon~

[Cambion]

if fandom things count, then....

 

BZP member Tolkien's version of Matoran lists just the prefixes as meaning the elements. names like Tahu, Gali, Avohkii, etc., have meanings based on the element names, such as:

tahu¹  |adj.|  fiery, flaming [etymology uncertain; possibly tahu < tah-u, from tah (variant of ta, see entry) “elemental fire” and the adjectival particle u]

tahu²  |n.|  play of flame; lit. “sport/activity of fire” [etymology uncertain;possible tahu < ta-huw, from ta “elemental fire” and the stem huw “sport, activity”]

 

also, on the subject of the Garai:

garai  |n.|  (Kanohi-) control of gravity/weight [etymology uncertain; potentially a compound incorporating a verbal noun arai “reacting; acting upon”]

Edited October 5, 2014 by Arc

[bonesiii]

Boidoh answered the first.

 

The second has no for-sure canon answer as far as I recall. Now that Greg's talkative again, somebody might wanna ask. The main theory I usually post to this (it's a common question) is that since the abilities of the mask are more limited than a Toa of Gravity it is a different word referring only to that subset of powers (so something like weight control).

[Boidoh]

Since when is there a Matoran dictionary.

 

OK, so maybe Garai is when pertaining to Kanohi. Like how Su- means 'worker' when pertaining to Krana, but means Plasma, when pertaining to the element.

 

Also prefixes may also have different meanings than nouns.

 

I might as well ask Greg...

Edited October 5, 2014 by Boidoh

[Regitnui]

 

if fandom things count, then....

 

BZP member Tolkien's version of Matoran lists just the prefixes as meaning the elements. names like Tahu, Gali, Avohkii, etc., have meanings based on the element names, such as:

tahu¹ |adj.| fiery, flaming [etymology uncertain; possibly tahu < tah-u, from tah (variant of ta, see entry) “elemental fire” and the adjectival particle u]tahu² |n.| play of flame; lit. “sport/activity of fire” [etymology uncertain;possible tahu < ta-huw, from ta “elemental fire” and the stem huw “sport, activity”]

also, on the subject of the Garai:

garai |n.| (Kanohi-) control of gravity/weight [etymology uncertain; potentially a compound incorporating a verbal noun arai “reacting; acting upon”]

Ooh. Could I have a link to that, please? Looks like an interesting read.

[Katuko]

The actual Maori words do indeed mean "fire" etc.
 

tahu
1. (verb) (-na) to set on fire, light, set alight, burn.

 

Taken from here.

kōpaka
1. (noun) ice, frost, hail, glacier.

pōhatu
1. (noun) stone.

ōnewa
1. (noun) dark grey stone, granite.

kakama
1. (stative) be quick, nimble, alert, active, capable.


Can't find all the names in that online dictionary, but from the ones we do find it's easy to tell that BIONICLE took a lot of words from Maori. Hence the hacking and lawsuit and name changing and all. In-universe, it might be opposite, so that the Toa Mata are named after the village prefixes or similar-sounding words, but I honestly think their names might just be the Matoran words for their elements as well.

[bonesiii]

Regitnui, here you go.

 

http://www.bzpower.com/board/blog/732/entry-129204-a-matoran-dictionary-2nd-ed-list-of-volumes/

[Regitnui]

Regitnui, here you go.

 

http://www.bzpower.com/board/blog/732/entry-129204-a-matoran-dictionary-2nd-ed-list-of-volumes/

Much obliged, bonesiii. I'm certainly looking through that.

 

Back on topic: Perhaps the 'elemental prefixes' don't directly mean the elements themselves, but mean something like "having the qualities of X". For example, "Ta-" would not mean "Fire", but would instead mean "having the qualities of flame". So "Ta-Matoran" would be "Matoran with the qualities of flame" or similar.

[Archon~]

From the Greg Question topic on the Lego Boards:

 

Boidoh wrote:

Recently on BZP, someone was asking why the Mask of Gravity; the Kanohi Garai, was called GArai when the Matoran prefix for Gravity is Ba-. His reasoning is that the AVohkii and KRAahkan has the prefix in their name, why not the Garai.

 

What I was thinking is that Ba- (the prefix) refers to the element, while Garai (the noun) refers to the Kanohi. What are your thoughts?

There isn't a story reason for it. There was no appropriate term starting with Ba on the approved name list, which is why Ba was not used in the name.

Interpert this as you want people.

And I still believe that Ta- Ga- etc are merely prefixes, actual words reffering to elements do, or should, exist in Bionicle, and I still firmly believe that the names of the Toa Mata are in fact names of elements.

[bonesiii]

I still firmly believe that the names of the Toa Mata are in fact names of elements.

I guess Boidoh's answer and my confirmation haven't been clear enough. No, they aren't; here's some of the quotes about it, starting with an ancient question by me from 04:

 

 

Why are the six sections of Metru Nui called Ta, Ga, Po, Onu, Ko, and Le? Are they named after Tahu, Gali, Pohatu, Onua, Kopaka, and Lewa?

No -- my feeling is "Ga" is a Matoran prefix meaning water, "Ta" is a Matoran prefix meaning "fire," etc.

 

 

How could the Metru's prefixes be the Toa Mata's name prefix if the Toa Mata were not around at the time?

Simple. Their prefixes are not based on the Toa Mata's names. Ta is a prefix meaning fire ... Ga is a prefix meaning water .. etc. ... so the Mata names are based on the prefixes, not the other way around

 

 

Is it possible that Tahu, Kopaka, Gali, Lewa, Onua and Pohatu literally mean Fire, Ice, Water, Air, Earth and Stone?

 

I ask mostly for the prefixes. If Ta- is only part of the word for Fire (as Av- is only part of the word "Avohkii", meaning light), logically Tahu would seem like a possible word for fire.

Nope

 

 

 

Would a Kanohi of Fire be called a Kanohi Tahu (since Tahu means fire)? So and and So forth for ice, air, stone, water, and earth.

Actually, we have never said Tahu meant fire. We have said that "Ta" is a Matoran prefix meaning fire.

 

 

Do the Toa Nuva's name mean their element?

 

No. "Ta" is a Matoran prefix meaning "fire," but "Tahu" does not mean fire.

 

[Archon~]

There we go, that helps, thanks!

[Regitnui]

Brace yourself in 2015 for the newbies asking this question right after they discover the language...

[Gonel]

Since when is there a Matoran dictionary.

Since BZP

[fishers64]

 

Since when is there a Matoran dictionary.

Since BZP

 

Since Tolkien made one on his blog. 

[Gonel]

I was joking.