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Atmosphere of Bara Magna


Irrie

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This has always perplexed me.

Sahmad was able to see the two Giant Robots, as described in Sahmad's Tale:

The Skrall have been driven from Roxtus, two giant men made of metal are battling in the sky for reasons I cannot imagine.

Now, Sahmad was able to see enough of the two robots to figure out that they were humanoid in shape. Normally, Humans can see (at least where I live) somewhere around ten miles, depending on the air quality of the specific day. Assuming that Agori have about the same optical attributes that we do, this would obviously render them unable to see something that's forty million feet tall, or at least an amount that would allow for them to recognize what it was.

So this might mean that the atmosphere of Bara Magna is really clean, right? Seems odd, since they've got a huge desert in the middle of their planet. One would think that a lot of dust would accumulate in the air. What do you all have to say on this?

Edited by The Irrational Rock

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I doubt the dust from the desert would get into the upper atmosphere. Also, the desert might actually make things clearer - less water = less water vapor in the atmosphere to obscure the fight.

 

It's possible that the Agori simply have better eyesight then us, or the GBs enhanced it. But even if you saw a blurry picture of two giant legs and an arm and heard a giant robot voice, I'd think you would get the picture rather quickly.

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Um well; http://www.livescience.com/33895-human-eye.html

 

Yeah... Bara Magna is massive, the Robots are massive; they are wide not just tall; so I think it would be strang if one couldn't see them... but as it is I have no real idea how Agori sight works. But apparently he could see it & fishers64 brings up soem very good points.

 

A few other sites seem to think people should be able to see well and truly more than 10 miles...

 

Maybe something to keep in mind is how much of Earth is covered by various pollutants which might not really exist on Bara Magna?

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I doubt the dust from the desert would get into the upper atmosphere. Also, the desert might actually make things clearer - less water = less water vapor in the atmosphere to obscure the fight.

 

It's possible that the Agori simply have better eyesight then us, or the GBs enhanced it. But even if you saw a blurry picture of two giant legs and an arm and heard a giant robot voice, I'd think you would get the picture rather quickly.

Especially if one of them came crashing down. I say you'd know the shape rather well.

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A few other sites seem to think people should be able to see well and truly more than 10 miles...

Well there goes my local weather channel's credibility.  :P

 

Bara magna always seemed to have thin air, at least from what imagery we got. and yeah, i think one huge leg or two would tip someone off to the titans clobbering each other overhead.

A lot of the artwork produced for Bara Magna had the robots downscaled massively, if you're referring to the atmosphere level compared to the robots. As for your second point, he would have had to have been in a place where he could have seen the other legs. Otherwise (or at least to me), it would have looked like a massive stone pillar or something. 

I doubt the dust from the desert would get into the upper atmosphere. Also, the desert might actually make things clearer - less water = less water vapor in the atmosphere to obscure the fight.

True, but the dust obscures close images, right? Wouldn't that same dust cover your upward vision, too?

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I doubt the dust from the desert would get into the upper atmosphere. Also, the desert might actually make things clearer - less water = less water vapor in the atmosphere to obscure the fight.

True, but the dust obscures close images, right? Wouldn't that same dust cover your upward vision, too?

 

 

Even still, [water 'warps' the direction of light were as dust just obstructs it] I'm not sure how far away you would need to be from the ultra-huge robots to get to a point where they aren't just a blurry humanoid but just a solid blob/block, from memory; the scattering that is required to obscure a dark object decreases as the size of that object increase (or the closer you are), at a diminishing rate (favouring the object being visible to you), but even if I do remember correctly that would probably have been an oversimplified model I was looking at. XD

 

...As it is though, how big is the GSR? Because if we actually tried to appyl some sort of notion to how high the atmosphere 'actually' extends, could make it easier; if he actually extends out, then seeing a few distinct legs at the base may have been enough, & mentally pieced it all together; & depending on how well one can see through the atmosphere, things would be much clearer that are just in space; & once it's at that scale the sheer width of it should be enough to make it clear... Eh. >->"

 

To many arbitrary guesses (that I made) IMO, but I don't see why Sahmad's Tale has to be wrong  until we rule out some of these arbitrary guesses & half a dozen others (+ many more, proing a negative and all), or if you know which measurement you want to use we could try and appropriate RW sight capacity &/or RW light etc. until we find something that fits :)

~ Sophistry: A way to be antidisuncorrect. ~


 


 


In a decade you might convince maybe a small tribe of people.


In a decade you might also conquer one million km2 of land,


& in over a thousand years you might have over a billion followers.


 


I like building things. Please don't break the big ones.


& evidential philosophies that dare to extrapolate beyond


an individual's direct experience aren't easily built.

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A few other sites seem to think people should be able to see well and truly more than 10 miles...

Well there goes my local weather channel's credibility.  :P

 

Bara magna always seemed to have thin air, at least from what imagery we got. and yeah, i think one huge leg or two would tip someone off to the titans clobbering each other overhead.

A lot of the artwork produced for Bara Magna had the robots downscaled massively, if you're referring to the atmosphere level compared to the robots. As for your second point, he would have had to have been in a place where he could have seen the other legs. Otherwise (or at least to me), it would have looked like a massive stone pillar or something. 

Since when were weather channels credible? :P

 

Uh, a massive stone pillar that lifts up, moves a few miles, and then comes crashing down again? You're assuming their legs never moved. also that they were always there. One robot rose from the sands and the other descended from the stars--Anyone alive would have known that it was not a natural feature. 

 

Plus, there's the banter between the two that everyone down on the surface could hear, and the quakes that would naturally be produced by the two giants just beating each other up would be felt by everyone on the ground.

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I doubt the dust from the desert would get into the upper atmosphere. Also, the desert might actually make things clearer - less water = less water vapor in the atmosphere to obscure the fight.

True, but the dust obscures close images, right? Wouldn't that same dust cover your upward vision, too?

 

Wouldn't the dust settle after a few seconds of not moving and your vision clear? Unless you were in the middle of a dust storm when the robots arrived, I don't see a problem.

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On the atmousphere of Bara Magna, I always wondered how the Ignika made it through the atmousphere but Greg says Lehvak-Kal will burn up.

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I'm pretty sure that if we were to bring everything we know to both a physics major and a biology major, we could probably deduce quite a bit about Bara Magna, it's atmosphere, and the agori/glatorian physiology. :P BZPower is a pretty diverse community...anyone?

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I'm pretty sure that if we were to bring everything we know to both a physics major and a biology major, we could probably deduce quite a bit about Bara Magna, it's atmosphere, and the agori/glatorian physiology. :P BZPower is a pretty diverse community...anyone?

 

Oh trust me, I tried. I'm sure we wont be able to deduce anything from this "comic book science" approach Greg goes about using in his writing. (I have nothing against that though)

 

When I took that question to Greg about Lehvak-Kal and the Ignika, his response was something along the lines of "Lehvak-Kal could make it through the atmousphere, if the story team wanted him to", and when I asked a follow-up about how the Ignika made it through, his response was something like, "the story team wanted it to, thats how."

 

 

On the atmousphere of Bara Magna, I always wondered how the Ignika made it through the atmousphere but Greg says Lehvak-Kal will burn up.

 

pfft, greg can't kill off the last surviving kal like that. not with all the authorial command in the world. :v

 

 

I think there are two remaining -Kal. I think the electricity one is still in that electrical shield thing of his.

 

And I'm sure he could kill of the last surviving -Kal. In fact, he wanted to have him drift off into space, but I convinced him to have Lehvak-Kal still in orbit. (which is how I was eventually labeled as a person who tries to trick a forgetful author and extort answers from Greg, and all that stuff. But I think it was also due to the fact that in responce to one of my questions, Greg constantly said that Bara, Bota, and Aqua Magna are all planets.)

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The Ignika thing could work. The mask had a variety of abilities, and could even bestow new powers upon others. Being able to keep itself intact through instinct alone (as MN's mind overpowered it's) doesn't sound outside the realm of possibilities. The Lehvak-Kal would have no such power over itself the same way. 

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I feel like you're reading too much into this and missing the authors point - Greg wanted to let you know the batte of Bara Magna was happening at the same time, and Sahmad was seeing the two giant Robots at that point (which ends up influencing his dialogue). It sounds more dramatic to say "Two giant men made of metal" than "some giant metal thing obscuring like my whole view". I mean theoretically speaking, Sahmad shouldn't even be able to see anything more than Mata Nui or Makuta's foot, considering how large they are. 

 

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I mean theoretically speaking, Sahmad shouldn't even be able to see anything more than Mata Nui or Makuta's foot, considering how large they are. 

 

Considering some other explanations that have been pulled out for things, & given just how different the Bionicle 'verse is I don't think that's really fair to say; especially considering it was something said to make a point. I mean Sahmad might have happened to imagine the right thing etc.

Whilst I don't think it needs explaining, reading to much into it is really all that is left to do other than fanworks, & attempts to canonise things, in a now dead series on life support. :)

~ Sophistry: A way to be antidisuncorrect. ~


 


 


In a decade you might convince maybe a small tribe of people.


In a decade you might also conquer one million km2 of land,


& in over a thousand years you might have over a billion followers.


 


I like building things. Please don't break the big ones.


& evidential philosophies that dare to extrapolate beyond


an individual's direct experience aren't easily built.

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Well, the moon is a long distance away but we can see it just fine through our atmosphere.

 

The larger (but undefined) size of Spherus/Bara Magna, and Greg's confirming it has some higher level of gravity (also undefined) may indeed make the atmosphere thicker or more dense... the illustrations do seem to make it higher than ours, and I've gone with that interpretation myself. But how does that actually affect visibility? That's a math question that we probably can't settle without its actual composition and other things being known and this is very unlikely. I would basically presume it's more like ours, and seeing the moon and stars and the sun, etc. Just maybe slightly thicker so they may seem more faded.

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