Composition Of Protodermis

[Lara White]

I'm kinda sad to see S&T die down, and all those grand theory topics about the nature of the MU and such now vanished only into the memories of older members. So I figured I'd pick one of the great unanswered mysteries, see what evidence I could find concerning it, and see where that led me. (Kapura's as much of a mystery as ever, but I don't mind).What exactly protodermis is has been something no one is exactly sure of, because it's so irregular. Most people chalk it up to magic but I, being a science fiction fan, have decided to collate everything we know about protodermis, put into the context of normal science, and then see if anyone here who has a better knowledge of the interaction between real elements can help me figure out exactly what might match those known properties.To clarify, I'm referring to the GB-created stuff, not natural EP.Let's start with the basics.

• [*]Protodermis is a molecule, not an elemental atom. Evidence to this effect is the fact that the GBs invented protodermis instead of discovering it. (I vaguley remember something about a Greg quote, but until I see the exact wording of it I'm not going to bring that into this.)[*]Protodermis either bonds easily with other molecules or it can assimilate atoms into its molecular structure (as evidenced by its incredibly variant forms that it can take, along with references to "purifying" protodermis in Ga-Metru). I lean toward the first, as assimilation would make the molecule really no longer protodermis, and the process of breaking the molecule to reassemble pure protodermis would be incredibly difficult, even at the level of tech we saw in Metru Nui.[*]There is, in fact, one "true" (or "pure," so to speak) form of proto, because it's processed into pure proto in Ga-Metru.[*]It is very hard to oxidize. Mata Nui's Great Spirit body was seen to have made it through a thousand-year sleep without rusting, instead being covered in mud.

Now, I think that we can extrapolate a few things about the pure and impure states of proto.

• [*]At least one form of impure protodermis has a very low melting point, as we have seen liquid protodermis in Ga-Metru, where (not coincidentally, I think) impure proto is gathered to be purified. It acts exactly like water, and Water Toa can influence it. I suspect that this means that the impure proto found in Ga-Metru is bonded with H₂O molecules. I think this means that the frozen proto seen in Ko-Metru is impure as well.[*]Pure protodermis has a very high melting temperature, as evidenced by the lava-like protodermis that we can see in Ta-Metru. It has been stated that pure proto is what Ta-Metru processes to make disks and masks, and therefore it is likely that the stuff that is seen there is pure proto. BS01 suggests that this might actually be the plasma state of protodermis, but I have seen no evidence for that and it doesn't (to my knowledge) really act like plasma, so I disagree with that theory.[*]"Raw" protodermis, I suspect, is also impure protodermis, but bonded with something that has a melting point higher than that of liquid proto, such as dirt. This is because BS01 delineates between raw proto and pure proto, which implies that raw proto is impure. However, it doesn't imitate water like liquid proto does, and therefore is likely bonded to another molecule. Bonesiii said that he recalls something about raw being more impure than liquid proto. If this is, in fact, true, it seems likely that pure protodermis can bond together with solid materials more easily than with liquids, but not to the point of making it unlikely to see liquid proto.

So, what's in a protodermis molecule?

• [*]Iron. We can say this for fairly certain because an Iron Toa can create and use solid protodermis, as well as natural wrought iron.[*]An unknown element with a high melting point. See my reasoning about molten protodermis for this.[*]An unknown factor which causes natural crystal lattices in protodermis. This is what results in lightstones and their close cousin, heatstones. This form of proto also seems to be very conducive to storing energy.

It is possible that Iron is merely another element which is bonded to proto, but BS01 says that Iron Toa can maniulate pure proto. That being said, I'm willing to cede the point if I'm disproved.There are two other forms of protodermis that need to be addressed. One is protosteel, and the other is organic protodermis.Protosteel is likely a form of impure protodermis with a higher-than-normal amount of carbon and iron (and possibly other things like titanium), causing a much more resilient form of proto.Organic protodermis is fairly simple to explain: it's just organic cells built of of protodermis molecules instead of their real-world counterparts.Energized protodermis, being entirely divorced from normal protodermis, I have little idea about. Bonesiii suggests that the Great Beings failed to mimick an "energized" form of protodermis which gave them artificial proto instead of EP, and the modification of proto beings that EP seems capable of doing is simple the energy in EP being converted into extra mass to modify the subject.

Edited November 17, 2011 by Lloyd: the White Wolf

[Katuko]

I like this analysis, because it sounds plausible while not being all out-there with physics and stuff. Good job, haven't got much more to say.

[Taipu1]

Sounds plausible, except the Iron bit, as I believe that actually Toa of Iron are misnamed. They're element is called Iron, but I believe there control is just generally over metallic substances, which really widens the field a bit as far as working out what it is that makes up protodermis. Iron would be a good assumption though.

[Katuko]

Ah, yes, Iron controls all types of metal. Iron is still one of the most common forms of metal, so it would make sense for that being the atom present in proto. Personally I dislike those element names precisely because they cause some confusion. Why not Toa of Metal, Plant Life and Electricity instead of Iron, "the Green" and Lightning? But that's for another topic, I guess.

[Makuta Matata]

Keep in mind that Bionicle takes place in a completely different Universe from ours; Protodermis doesn't necessarily have to follow our laws of Physics....

[Lara White]

Knuckles--Your point is true. That being said, there are some things we know are the same--ex, gravity is probably roughly similar to ours, since Glatorian and Agori are roughly of the same build as humans. I prefer to think that as many things as possible follow Earth physics--for example, I'm not going to try and explain elemental powers, but obviously I'm willing to take a stab at figuring out what protodermis might consist of. After all, wouldn't it be fun if we could actually jump through the loophole Greg said? I believe it was something along the lines of "Bionicle physics are not the same as Earth physics, unless someone invented protodermis yesterday and no one told me about it." (I kid, I kid. But a man can dream.)Re: Metal/Iron discussion--I suppose that it could be any metal on the periodic table. Does anyone know a metal that bonds with other elements better than iron? (Help me out here guys.)

[Taipu1]

Sounds like you're looking for the reactivity series. Unfortunately, my memories of it are a little rusty (please excuse that poor pun). This page (admittedly the first I found when I googled it) lists the most reactive as potassium, put thats only for the lighter elements of the periodic table. I think the most reactive metal is Francium, but bearing in mind it's rather explosive properties and miniscule half life, I doubt it would be part of the composition of protodermis. Then again, Bionicle physics aren't equal to earth physics.

Edited November 15, 2011 by Taipu1

[Exo-Kahgarak]

The most reactive non-radioactive metal is cesium, but it's really reactive. By the way, all three main properties (controllable by Toa of Iron, high melting point, crystalline structure) point to an ionic bond (metal bonded to nonmetal). Alkali metals (including cesium) in the vast majority of circumstances only bond with one other thing (though that 'other thing' could be acetate (C₂H₃O₂) or something similarly complicated). Sodium acetate (NaC₂H₃O₂) exists and is used industrially, so cesium acetate (CsC₂H₃O₂) is a potential candidate for protodermis. If we want to stick to transition metals, your guess is as good as mine (Silver acetate? Zinc carbonate? Copper (III) phosphate?) However, these aren't metals per se; they simply contain metals. If we want a metallic bond, we could say lightstones are a form of impure proto (metallic bond wouldn't explain crystalline structure).

[Lara White]

I think that it's likely that Lightstones are impure proto, considering that, if I recall correctly, they're formed out of raw (IE impure) proto.

[Mask Maker Takuna]

Awesome idea. S&T could use some good discussion, and I think this has a lot of open space that we can work with.I think the idea of Protodermis as actually some kind of super-molecule that reacts with other molecules is a great one - it explains why we have so many different kind of protodermis without getting into it being some new kind of subatomic substance (which is what I'd always assumed).Before I go into depth on what ideas you've sparked in me, I'd like to look at why the Great Beings created protodermis. Without an understanding of what protodermis exists for, I don't think we'll ever really be able to get down to its nature. So, what did the Great Beings need to synthesize protodermis for?Now, operating on memory here, but didn't they need to purify protodermis so that they could actually power the Mata Nui robot? The nature of the power source notwithstanding (zero point energy, anybody?), the omnipresence of the robot implies that it has something to do with every aspect of the machine, not just a power source. So, it appears that protodermis is a powerful conductor of energy, which takes the power produced in Karda Nui in its Energy Storms and transports it across all of Mata Nui's body. So, that would mean that the protodermis molecule would have one part of it that is involved in energy transference. This makes sense with Kanohi: Protodermis is purified, and then formed into these impressive masks that can convert energy into supernatural abilities, like seeing through objects or flight. Lightstones and heatstones would probably be a special kind of purified protodermis, that converts that energy into heat or light instead of controlled energies.Now, the second reason I see for protodermis being essential for Mata Nui's construction: mass-production. The Great Beings built a world from scratch; this being was massive. Now, let's say that protodermis bonds with other atoms and molecules, imitating their chemical activity. Now, let's also say that the Great Beings could produce massive amounts of pure protodermis, much faster than they could produce the materials needed for the Great Spirit project. Now, let's also say that, when protodermis 'absorbs' a molecule, you get much more 'protodermic' substance than you did the original (ie, react 4 grams of water with 20 kilograms of protodermis to get 20 kilograms of protodermic water). They could use take their protodermis, have it imitate comparatively tiny amounts of 'real' substances, and mass-produce 'protodermic' substances for use in the Great Spirit project.So, to sum these two points up: The Great Beings used Protodermis to mass-produce a highly imitative conductor that would distribute power across the robot while simulating the environment of Spherus Magna.So, I'd go with different terminology than what you've been using. While, from the Matoran's point of view, it is "impure protodermis," I'd go with the Great Beings looking at it as something along the lines of 'infused protodermis.' This also explains why Toa have power over both natural and protodermic forms of elements: the protodermis actually containts and mimics the natural element that Toa controls, so it falls under the same category.So, as to how this fits in with the kinds of protodermis we have:

• [*]Pure Protodermis: A solid that can be formed to be either metallic (in the case of Kanohi and Kanoka) or crystalline (as per TSO's staff and Lightstones). Pure protodermis takes energy and converts it directly into some other useable form.[*]Natural Protodermis: water, earth, stone, etc. in the Matoran Universe. This is the Protodermis molecule that imitates natural molecules, incorporating them into its structure. Through various processes, the natural parts can be removed, leaving behind Pure Protodermis.[*]Organic Protodermis: Like you said, it's just cells made out of Natural Protodermis.[*]Metallic Protodermis: This is the stuff that rusts, that Toa of Iron can control. It might not actually be Pure Protodermis (In fact, have we ever seen a Toa of Iron manipulate a Kanohi or a Kanoka?). It might just be natural protodermis that has absorbed metals; when those metals rust, the protodermis is now imitating a rusted molecule.

So, yeah, those are my two cents. It's an interesting idea, protodermis being a chemical imitator. I definitely like the broad concept; I'll have to sleep on some of the details, though.

[Lara White]

Ayeesh, huge post (I shouldn't be the one talking though. ). My only comment is that I'm fairly certain that Lightstones are what you would call "Natural" proto, not pure. If I'm wrong, someone feel free to correct me on this.

[Mask Maker Takuna]

Ayeesh, huge post (I shouldn't be the one talking though. ). My only comment is that I'm fairly certain that Lightstones are what you would call "Natural" proto, not pure. If I'm wrong, someone feel free to correct me on this.

The main reason that I thought of them as a form of pure proto was because they actively convert energy into a useable form, something that natural proto doesn't do. Also, the fact that we're pretty much pulling this classifications out of thin air makes it pretty hard for anyone to correct anyone else as to which it would better fall as, so both do work equally as well.

[Lara White]

I find it unlikely that they're pure proto, since they were apparently naturally forming in geological formations (such as Mata Nui).

[Brickeens]

It can oxidize, or at least do something similar. Mata Nui's Great Spirit body was seen to have rusted in the Mata Nui Rising videos, if I recall correctly.

I'm pretty sure that was mud, rather than rust that was shown in the videos. Pic for reference.

[Lara White]

Really? It always looked like rust to me. And considering how long he's been there there's certainly been enough time for that much rust. We'd have to ask Greg, I guess.

[BenLuke]

Is it possible that Protodermis is Energized Proto bonded with another substance? So Proto-iron would be Energized Protodermis + normal iron and proto-water would EP + H2O.

[Lara White]

It seems unlikely, because proto was artifically made by the GBs in imitation of EP. Also, that would raise the question of how you'd make organic proto without killing the cell.

[BenLuke]

It has been shown that organic material can survive being exposed to EP ( The Brotherhood of Makuta uses it to grow Rahi.)Perhaps the Great Beings synthesized a copy of EP and used that to create normal Proto.

[Lara White]

That's a possibility. We're running on trace evidence here, so there's quite a bit that we can't say for sure. That's my only problem with stuff like this.Do you all think I should make an alternate theory list in the original post?

[Brickeens]

Really? It always looked like rust to me. And considering how long he's been there there's certainly been enough time for that much rust. We'd have to ask Greg, I guess.

That can't be rust - that brown stuff is clearly sitting on top of the metal, rather than eating or wearing into it. In addition, you can see lots of debris coming off him as he rises, which is the exact same color as the 'rust'. So unless the rust is coincidentally the exact same color as the muddy rock that's falling off him, or he's raining chunks of rust, that wouldn't make sense.

[Lara White]

Case made--I'll correct the original post. Thanks.

[BenLuke]

A list of alternate theories would be cool, although no one else seems to have proposed any.Also; it looks like rust here. it could just be the comic art style, though.

[bonesiii]

Overall, I think this is a great theory. I've seen some variants of it before, but not put forth in a topic theory with this level of detail.My basic reaction to this theory of something whose behavior changes due to molecular bonding has been that it doesn't seem to explain the instances in which physics are messed up, as in Karzahni's realm, nor does it explain powers, or elemental energy.The key thing to note about protodermis is that in different "mixtures" it can produce an infinite variety of powers. No normal molecule can do that, of course, but admittedly it IS molecular.This is what led me to my old nanotech-forcefield-projector theory. And from that I extrapolated that all its behaviors, including when it seems to act like other materials, could be code input into nanites (or microbots, whatever). This tech is then very similar to a living cell, which explains the term protodermis.However, the raw and pure terms are more of a stretch under my theory than under yours, so you get points there.Perhaps both may be true at the same time -- the molecule may be a cell-like nanotech that projects various powers with a combination of forcefield and energymatter conversion technology, plus that might bond with normal molecules to make the other forms.I had explained the terms as references to code purity; extra code governing material behaviors would make the total code impure.But as I admitted, this makes the low-tech purification systems more difficult to believe. We would also have to accept that the base code included lines telling it to delete any extra codes when some primitive effects such as melting were worked on it. This is possible, and in fact if material behavior is added code, then it would seem the GBs would definately think of this. But it's more of a stretch.(However, now that we know code = Matoran language, perhaps something like a spoken spell is part of the purification process...)Also, how do you explain Karzahni physics? Many things appeared to be one material, but behaved in an opposite or radically different way. To me that fits better with the idea that all protodermic behavior and physics is a code function, and the material code was messed up there.This makes sense to me given that Karzahni is a bad fixer.Under your theory quite the opposite would seem to be needed; he would have to be skilled with what code parts there are to make the protodermis part run a constant power to override the physics caused by the bonded molecule. This does make some sense; it's just his personality to want to make his realm terrifying. But it doesn't fit with his skill or lack of it, IMO.Still, maybe it's possible.Your theory also doesn't explain protodermic powers, but I don't think that needs to be relevant. The molecule that bonds to everything simply makes them.And what about elemental energy? This might be a serious challenge to your theory.It seems to me that in Bionicle physics, protodermis behaves like water when it is enfused with water elemental energy, and behaves like rock when enfused with rock elemental energy, etc. This seems to me to support the code part, even over the above purification problem, meaning that purifying removes elemental energy. And that energy is in turn a container of code.But again, it can still work with your theory -- say the molecule that bonds simply handles all materializing and energizing involved with elemental energy. So when a Toa makes water, she's materializing base protodermis, bonded with water molecules.This does make a lot of sense because we know they can also make normal water.Under the component rule, Tahu can make just heat, since his normal element is a fusion of heat + flammable material. Thus a Toa of Water normally makes protodermis + H2O, under your theory, and could also make just H2O.Also we know all Toa can in a sense make pure protodermis since when six combine beams of elemental energy, a pure protocage is created. This would seem to mean that code nulls the molecule's normal creating of both protodermis and other materials when it senses this situation, and instead makes only the protodermis.That would also seem to imply that most Toa are artificially locked out from making just protodermis. But since pure protodermis is metallic, Iron Toa have an exception to that lockout. I think this is more likely to explain that than what you said near the end.Although in a sense both may be true; some kind or kinds of normal metal molecules may very well be the main ingredient making up the pure molecule. But it need not be iron. (Or, the molecule might be more like plastic in makeup but behave like a metal due to code powers.)

Protodermis is a molecule, not an elemental atom. Evidence to this effect is the fact that the GBs invented protodermis instead of discovering it. (I vaguley remember something about a Greg quote, but until I see the exact wording of it I'm not going to bring that into this.)

For the record, the wording was very similar to "it's a molecule." Might not be an exact quote, but I'm absolutely sure it's close enough. It was a very short simple sentence like that confirming it clearly.BTW, the fact that they invented it doesn't necessarily imply it has to be a molecule. They could have some type of nuclear fusion system to manufacture a fantasy-atom. We only know they didn't need to because of Greg's confirmation.

It can oxidize, or at least do something similar. Mata Nui's Great Spirit body was seen to have rusted in the Mata Nui Rising videos, if I recall correctly.

I've never heard confirmation that it was rust. Considering how huge he is and that he was laying under an ocean and partly at least underground for a millenium, it could just be caked dirt.More likely to me is that proto-iron can rust, because either it is coded to behave like iron or is bonded to iron and doesn't interfere with iron's normal behavior. And Mata Nui isn't primarily made of pure protodermis as far as I'm aware; he's made instead of the material impure type called proto-iron.BTW, this is a problem for your theory too -- how is it that bonding to these materials could allow them to behave normally? Bonding in Earth physics generally changes the behavior of the other molecule, often radically. Rusting for example is a slow chemical reaction, which occurs because the iron has not yet bonded.I can think of a possible answer, but curious how you would answer first.

I think this means that the frozen proto seen in Ko-Metru is impure as well.

FTR, we know for sure that yes, the ice there is simply frozen protowater. So frozen impure liquid protodermis. (Meaning proto that is liquid at room temp.)

BS01 suggests that this might actually be the plasma state of protodermis, but I have seen no evidence for that and it doesn't (to my knowledge) really act like plasma, so I disagree with that theory.

As I said to your PM, we can rule that out absolutely. Greg confirmed that plasma in Bionicle refers to the fourth state of matter -- superheated gas -- while the lava-like stuff in Ta-Metru, called molten protodermis, is indeed molten as in liquid. Melted protodermis that would be solid at room tempurature. It is NOT plasma.Confusion on this happened because of scenes of Pahrak-Kal using his plasma power to melt rock into lava.People misunderstood those scenes to mean he had a power of lava, which was labelled "plasma", but that wasn't what was happening. Instead, he was shooting out superheated gas (confirmed by Greg) which melted or burned whatever it came into contact with. When it hit rock, the rock melted.Not sure why BS01 is behind the times on that. Probably it was just overlooked, but it should be edited.

Iron. We can say this for fairly certain because an Iron Toa can create and use solid protodermis, as well as natural wrought iron.

As others pointed out, "Iron Toa" is just a poetic simplification of "Metal Toa"; they can make many kinds of metal, not just iron. Proto-iron is probably the easiest kind for them to make and most common, hence the name.I'm curious what the wording of what source info you have for this part is, too, because you say "solid protodermis" but that could just mean "the most common type of raw protodermis." This wouldn't imply anything about the makeup of pure protodermis, would it?But assuming it means pure solid protodermis, again, I think it's far more likely that the base molecule simply behaves like a metal. It may be mostly made of metal atoms, or it may behave like metal based on code. Or perhaps even both. And since it counts as one of many possible metals, this would explain why Toa of Metal can make it.

An unknown element with a high melting point. See my reasoning about molten protodermis for this.An unknown factor which causes natural crystal lattices in protodermis. This is what results in lightstones and their close cousin, heatstones. This form of proto also seems to be very conducive to storing energy.

Both of these behaviors may have more to do with the powers coding than physical makeup.Consider that running a power takes energy. Where's the best place to get it? Heat.So pure protodermis might not have a natural molecular high melting point; it may be that the inner workings of the high-tech molecule simply convert heat into energy to run its powers. This would explain well why only pure protodermis can have powers. So it would be essentially self-refrigerated.And lightstones and heatstones and various other power-based crystals may be a combination of power-based physics and bonded crystalline materials. Under my theory I would explain it as simply extra materials physics code similar to the Karzahni physics; just more in a list of physics codes that include natural material behaviors as well.Or, it's possible the molecule actually constructs a secondary crystalline molecule of other raw atoms which in turn behaves like nanotech, and runs the lightstone and heatstone physics naturally.

It is possible that Iron is merely another element which is bonded to proto, but BS01 says that Iron Toa can maniulate pure proto. That being said, I'm willing to cede the point if I'm disproved.

Alright, granted on the pure point, but again, it doesn't mean iron only. I think this leaves us with the undeniable conclusion that pure protodermis behaves like a metal, but we can't rule out whether that's because it's made of mostly iron, made of mostly some other metal(s), or not metallic at all and simply acts like a metal due to code. Or even is metallic but also acts that way primarily due to code, heh.

Ah, yes, Iron controls all types of metal. Iron is still one of the most common forms of metal, so it would make sense for that being the atom present in proto. Personally I dislike those element names precisely because they cause some confusion. Why not Toa of Metal, Plant Life and Electricity instead of Iron, "the Green" and Lightning? But that's for another topic, I guess.

They're really just nicknames. Especially "the Green"; that is NOT their standard term, it's just a poetic nickname that Greg likes (for some reason ). Normally we call them Toa of Plants.Lightning is essentially a synonym; it's the same stuff, just in greater amounts than what we would only call electricity. I think that works similar to Ice -- large amounts of frozen water in whole chunks and called Ice, but tiny crystalline amounts are called Snow. Toa of Ice can control both.So Lightning is used to indicate the upper end of the spectrum of how powerful they can be. You wouldn't want to be called the Toa of Static Electricity, for example, anymore than Kopaka would want to be called the Toa of Snow. That would imply those were your maximum abilities, so would seem to mean you're weak.And Iron is more like "the Green" except it's more plausible to be commonly actually used by the characters. It's still a poetic simplification and is understood by the Matoran and Toa as such. They hear it and translate it to "Metal".The main problem comes with us fans who aren't living in the Matoran world and don't automatically translate like that. For our sakes it probably should have been Metal, but on the other hand it adds a layer of richness to the world that's more realistic. We humans commonly use figures of speech that would confuse outsiders, after all. (And they do, when someone learns a new language, they inevitably run into figures of speech and can be easily confused by them.)

Keep in mind that Bionicle takes place in a completely different Universe from ours; Protodermis doesn't necessarily have to follow our laws of Physics....

Knuckles--Your point is true. That being said, there are some things we know are the same--ex, gravity is probably roughly similar to ours, since Glatorian and Agori are roughly of the same build as humans. I prefer to think that as many things as possible follow Earth physics--for example, I'm not going to try and explain elemental powers, but obviously I'm willing to take a stab at figuring out what protodermis might consist of.

1) This is something I haven't said enough, but along with keeping in mind what you said, Knuckles, we should all also be keeping in mind that things aren't that simple anymore.Since 2009, "Earth physics", at least in terms of real-world atoms and molecules, have been brought into Bionicle. The rock on Bara Magna is real rock like ours, not proto-rock for example. And yet we know that Toa can control both.This does strongly imply that we need to pay close attention to real-world atomic physics in order to understand Bionicle physics, including protodermis. :)I prefer to word it like this -- Earth Physics DOES apply, but Bionicle also adds a lot of extra physics that can overlap and override Earth physics. Earth physics is actually usually treated as the default, and Bionicle's other physics usually play the role of coming in and altering the default in some way.Protodermis is where that role seems at face value to be switched, but even there, most things normally behave just like the real-world materials.2) To Lloyd, though -- I think we should try to explain elemental powers too, though. This could be highly relevant to the question of what protodermis is.Put simply, elemental powers are already explained, same as with Star Trek replicators and transporters; matter can be converted into energy and vice versa. Something about protodermis, which is unlocked with the presence of "Toa energy" channels "elemental energy" into enabling this Star-Trek-like process.I did explain this in my protodermis theory; protodermis molecules are like high-tech nanites with machinery that projects energy fields and can transform matter and energy into each other. All other physics can then be governed by code making the fields behave in different ways. Including making certain fields hold steady, even over long distances, which makeup what we call "elemental energy."All of this is totally explainable in real-world physics. :)Put it another way; we throw around the word "physics" as if it has only a single definition, but that's not true; there are two basic levels to physics. One is the underlying physics, and second is the more specific physics of only certain materials and situations.Under Earth's underlying physics, the core basics, everything in Bionicle is explainable.The specific physics of Bionicle materials and energies are different in many ways from real-world specific physics. But this does not mean that Earth's underlying physics can't be used to explain the specific physics.If that were true, then we should not be able to explain real-world specific physics either. But we can. The key is to pay attention to underlying physics, and not get distracted by the surface appearance of how things normally work on Earth.(The one exception might be conservation of energy; in Bionicle it MIGHT be possible to make new energy from nothing, but this has never been clearly confirmed. There can be transfer-or-conversion-of-energy systems which can create the illusion of unlimited energy both in the real world and in Bionicle.)

So, what did the Great Beings need to synthesize protodermis for?Now, operating on memory here, but didn't they need to purify protodermis so that they could actually power the Mata Nui robot?

I think it was more to build it. Protodermis seems to be much more easy to move around, and especially easier to make it behave like other materials. Whether that's due to behavior code and/or bonding, either way you wouldn't need to mine near as much natural materials to make up the whole thing. Probably protodermis is somehow self-replicating as well, so the manufacturing process may be much easier than with even natural simple molecules.But in a sense, yes, since protodermis enables all these powers, it provides powers to the robot, but I'm not sure if those powers "power" it as in an energy source. I was under the impression they used natural Energized Protodermis as the main energy source.I think a more basic question is, "why did they originally make synthetic protodermis?" When you phrase it that way, the answer is obvious. They discovered natural protodermis, and being highly inventive and creative making synthetic forms of it is just in their nature. Plus I think they just wanted to have more of it, being useful stuff, so without a specific purpose for it in mind they may have researched how to make more.The specific purpose of the giant robot(s) may have come later. Depends on when they realized the planet was in trouble compared to when they figured out how to make more.

The nature of the power source notwithstanding (zero point energy, anybody?), the omnipresence of the robot implies that it has something to do with every aspect of the machine, not just a power source. So, it appears that protodermis is a powerful conductor of energy, which takes the power produced in Karda Nui in its Energy Storms and transports it across all of Mata Nui's body. So, that would mean that the protodermis molecule would have one part of it that is involved in energy transference.

I agree. That could fit in well with either/both of the "mostly metallic" or nanite code theories.Both might be true; perhaps the molecule has portions which act like wire connectors from one molecule to its neighbors, and internal nanite code systems handle which wire connections are active and not, like a switchboard.If so, this would strongly imply something like rubber or some other non-conductive material is also part of the structure, so those parts of the molecules wouldn't transfer electricity.Of course, here I'm assuming the transfer method is electricity. It might be a more raw energy transfered through energy fields, which I think makes a bit more sense. That, too, could work with both the code and bonding theories. We basically know the base molecule kinda HAS to be something like nanotech, and so the energy transference could be part of that, regardless of which theory explains the material behavior part of its physics.

Now, the second reason I see for protodermis being essential for Mata Nui's construction: mass-production. The Great Beings built a world from scratch; this being was massive. Now, let's say that protodermis bonds with other atoms and molecules, imitating their chemical activity. Now, let's also say that the Great Beings could produce massive amounts of pure protodermis, much faster than they could produce the materials needed for the Great Spirit project. Now, let's also say that, when protodermis 'absorbs' a molecule, you get much more 'protodermic' substance than you did the original (ie, react 4 grams of water with 20 kilograms of protodermis to get 20 kilograms of protodermic water). They could use take their protodermis, have it imitate comparatively tiny amounts of 'real' substances, and mass-produce 'protodermic' substances for use in the Great Spirit project.

I agree. And if it's true that the protodermic part is somehow, or partly, self-replicating, this makes even more sense.(Perhaps there is some kind of an environment in which a self-replication function is activated. Normally it does NOT seem to replicate, though.)Also, perhaps we should theorize that the molecule is made mostly of very common atomic elements. So it would be easily to collect huge amounts of the raw ingredients in giant vats, set up whatever environmental factors (perhaps a special kind of energy field projected into the vat), and put in just one protodermis molecule. Then the protodermis would do the rest and it would be relatively inexpensive. It would be protected from over-replication because the field wouldn't extend beyond.Dude. Want.

I find it unlikely that they're pure proto, since they were apparently naturally forming in geological formations (such as Mata Nui).

Either's possible. Those geologic formations, under your theory, are protodermis molecules bonded to the natural atoms and molecules that make up the geologic formations. Thus, something either codewise or chemical might be causing some of the protodermis molecules to separate from the non-proto materials, and form pure-proto lightstones.Personally though I lean towards lightstones NOT being pure. Again, I do think this is best explained under my "it's all code and energy fields" theory, not your bonding theory. The lightstone behavior would all simply be a function of code. But it could also be various other things I mentioned above. Edited November 18, 2011 by bonesiii

[BenLuke]

The "Nanotech that bonds with normal molecules" theory fits pretty well with my own theory thatProtodermis is synthesized EP that is programmable bonded with a normal molecule. In my theory the main difference between normal EP and synth EP is that synth EP is controllable using the Matoranlanguage in some manner while normal EP is random in it's affects.

Edited November 18, 2011 by BenLuke-116