Petition to release the BIONICLE movie soundtracks

[Tyrion Archer]

Hey everyone,

 

I started a petition on Change.org to get Miramax, The LEGO Group, and Buena Vista to release the complete scores from all three BIONICLE movies. If you've waited all these years to hear Nathan Furst's amazing music from the films on its own without any sound effects or dialogue like I have, now there's something you can do to try and make that happen! Please, if you like the music of the BIONICLE movies and want to see it released, please consider signing this petition and sharing it as much as possible.

 

Follow the link to sign the petition:

 

https://www.change.org/p/buena-vista-home-entertainment-the-lego-group-miramax-release-the-complete-scores-from-all-three-bionicle-movies-on-cd-and-or-itunes

 

Thanks.

[Lyichir]

I think this is pretty futile. If a soundtrack were ever going to be released, it would have been back in the day when those movies were coming out. At this point the demand is much lower. The fact that fans have edited out the voices to create unofficial soundtracks (which, while not perfect, are "good enough" for many) is another point against this effort. And even putting all that aside, even if you did somehow get a large number of signatures for this—there's nothing binding about a petition, and petitions for much more significant or divisive issues have not gotten much more than a smile and nod from Lego.

In any case, I'm personally not interested enough to buy it even if it were released, so it wouldn't be honest of me to sign this. Good luck getting a result out of this, I suppose—I fear it'll take nothing short of a miracle.

[Tyrion Archer]

I think this is pretty futile. If a soundtrack were ever going to be released, it would have been back in the day when those movies were coming out. At this point the demand is much lower. The fact that fans have edited out the voices to create unofficial soundtracks (which, while not perfect, are "good enough" for many) is another point against this effort. And even putting all that aside, even if you did somehow get a large number of signatures for this—there's nothing binding about a petition, and petitions for much more significant or divisive issues have not gotten much more than a smile and nod from Lego.

 

In any case, I'm personally not interested enough to buy it even if it were released, so it wouldn't be honest of me to sign this. Good luck getting a result out of this, I suppose—I fear it'll take nothing short of a miracle.

Yeah, you're probably right, but I figured it was worth a shot. I really do think they're some of the best scores ever and it's a shame they haven't been released.

[Nidhiki of the Shadows]

While I have my doubts about this actually reaching the eyes and ears of the parties involved, we do know that Nathan Furst has expressed interest in releasing the soundtracks - he even stated he would release a Bionicle EP two years ago (which sadly never happened). Regardless, Nathan is busy and if he ever gets back to working on that EP I know for sure he would be willing to share it.

 

-NotS

[Wolfrenz0]

These petitions always seem dumb, and if they were going to release the music they'd of done it when the movies came out. There are some people on tumblr who've been taking the music from Bionicle Heroes.   

[TheSkeletonMan939]

Furst's comments on the matter:

 

Thank you all for the kind words.  I'm glad you all enjoy it.  Of course I still care about Bionicle.  It's really the first full score I ever composed in an autonomous way, when I was 23 years old.  Most of the score will not be released, for several reasons.  However, I was able to find something from MOL I'll post later today.  

 

 

Wait... read that last part more closely.... 

 

However, I was able to find something from MOL I'll post later today.

was able to find

 

Find? Find? 

 

Either he has poor word choice or he's lost his own copies of the files (I'm sure Lego and/or Mirmamax still have all the separate audio stems).

 

By the way... if you didn't know already, I put together unofficial soundtracks for each film using the films' respective 5.1 audio tracks. They're pretty SFX-heavy, but I was able to squeeze out a lot of good music. If you haven't listened to it already you might be interested in what I've done.

 

Someone should try to get some sort of interview with him... TheThreeVirtues, BZP, Mask of Destiny - anyone - and just ask about what reasons there are that he's not allowed to release the music. I'd also love to hear some inside info about how he was told to make the music sound, how much collaboration he had with the sound design team, how much freedom he had in deciding what the tone of the music should be, etc.

[Jacks]

I second TheSkeletonMan. I would love to see an interview with Nathan Furst happen. His scores might not be as iconic as the music from the Teplar animations and the MNOGs, but it's probably the highest-quality music Bionicle ever had.

[TheSkeletonMan939]

Yeah... it's a real shame he wasn't invited back to score The Legend Reborn. He wanted to be a part of it, you know! This interview mentions it briefly:

 

John Mansell: You worked on the first three of the BIONICLE films. How did you become involved with this trilogy and why did you not score the fourth film in the series as your music for the first three was well thought of?
Nathan Furst: I happened to know someone who knew the producer who was actively looking for a composer. I submitted some of my music, in addition to original theme concept sketch (which ended up being one of the main themes). That’s pretty much it. I loved working on those films. For me, it’s some of the best work I’ve ever done. After the original trilogy, an entirely different production team was hired to create the 4th film. I think not seeking me out is probably because they were anxious to make their own mark, so to speak. So, the very fact that I scored the original trilogy omitted my consideration. Someone sent me a couple scenes from that score, and I was flattered to find that my BIONICLE score was obviously the inspiration! Best compliment a composer could have.

 

 

The tragic part is that the sound mix for The Legend Reborn leaves the music nearly entirely isolated in the front and rear channels. Just imagine how much more Furst music we'd have if he'd scored the 4th movie!

 

Ah well... D'Andrea had some nice tunes as well.

 

People say that Furst's tone of music didn't fit the franchise very well... but is there really any definitive Bionicle music? It's not like there were many themes that were used more than once.

 

If Furst were to release the music, I'd want it as a CD... hearing that music in lossless would be fantastic.

[Tyrion Archer]

Furst's comments on the matter:

 

Thank you all for the kind words.  I'm glad you all enjoy it.  Of course I still care about Bionicle.  It's really the first full score I ever composed in an autonomous way, when I was 23 years old.  Most of the score will not be released, for several reasons.  However, I was able to find something from MOL I'll post later today.  

 

 

Wait... read that last part more closely.... 

 

However, I was able to find something from MOL I'll post later today.

was able to find

 

Find? Find? 

 

Either he has poor word choice or he's lost his own copies of the files (I'm sure Lego and/or Mirmamax still have all the separate audio stems).

 

By the way... if you didn't know already, I put together unofficial soundtracks for each film using the films' respective 5.1 audio tracks. They're pretty SFX-heavy, but I was able to squeeze out a lot of good music. If you haven't listened to it already you might be interested in what I've done.

 

Someone should try to get some sort of interview with him... TheThreeVirtues, BZP, Mask of Destiny - anyone - and just ask about what reasons there are that he's not allowed to release the music. I'd also love to hear some inside info about how he was told to make the music sound, how much collaboration he had with the sound design team, how much freedom he had in deciding what the tone of the music should be, etc.

He also said on Facebook that he lost Legends of Metru Nui in a "bad drive crash"... I really hope he has backups of the soundtracks somewhere. I would imagine he'd make a lot of those in his line of work.

 

I did give your unofficial OSTs a look. Nice work, though it is a pity that so many pesky SFX carried over into those two back channels. Still, pretty good job considering what you had to work with.

 

I've actually been working on my own custom score compiling all of the online sources of stand-alone music I know of - the cues from Nathan Furst's website, the two tracks he uploaded to SoundCloud, and the one he posted on YouTube - with the menu loops and end credits medleys from the DVDs. I've basically put them together in a bunch of suites, with the menu loops segueing into each other. So it's more like what you'd typically find in an original soundtrack release; embellishment of a lot of music from the actual movie and a completely non-chronological arrangement of the music. I'll consider posting it on BZP if I ever finish it. I say "if" because almost every time I listen to it there's almost always a segue or fade-in/out or something like that where I think "eh, that could have been better..."

[TheSkeletonMan939]

 

I've actually been working on my own custom score compiling all of the online sources of stand-alone music I know of - the cues from Nathan Furst's website, the two tracks he uploaded to SoundCloud, and the one he posted on YouTube - with the menu loops and end credits medleys from the DVDs. I've basically put them together in a bunch of suites, with the menu loops segueing into each other. So it's more like what you'd typically find in an original soundtrack release; embellishment of a lot of music from the actual movie and a completely non-chronological arrangement of the music. I'll consider posting it on BZP if I ever finish it. I say "if" because almost every time I listen to it there's almost always a segue or fade-in/out or something like that where I think "eh, that could have been better..."

 

 

Yeah, I compiled all that into my soundtrack as well. I used menu music, SoundCloud files, old website files, and anything else I could find to replace audio from the film.

 

A lot of menu music never actually appears in the movie though! Especially the menus from Legends of Metru Nui. Did Furst compose extra tracks for fun? Did the runtimes change? Did the DVD producers actually ask for new tracks specifically for the menus?

 

That'd be another question to ask Furst in an interview.

 

It's nice to see some actual Bionicle music discussion on this board. I'd better savor it while I can...

[Jacks]

People say that Furst's tone of music didn't fit the franchise very well... but is there really any definitive Bionicle music? It's not like there were many themes that were used more than once.

Well, they certainly fit the franchise better than the straight rock music we had from 2006 onwards

 

But let's look at this a bit more closely. Furst's scores have something of a high-fantasy sound to them, so people who say they don't fit the franchise now probably came to the franchise after the films, once the slightly generic rock music had fully taken over. People who said the scores didn't fit the franchise at the time the films were released are probably the ones who were fans from the beginning, and thus were more accustomed to the music from the MNOGs and the other Templar pieces from the first few years -- like I said, it's iconic. But thematically, it's all over the dang place.

 

Take MNOG1, for instance. When Kopaka battles the Muaka in the Drifts, you hear something that sounds a little bit like industrial-rock. When Lewa and Onua fight in the Nui-Rama hive, it sounds a little more like techno. When the Toa confront Makuta, you get more industrial-rock plus unintelligible operatic chanting. And you have funk-style slap bass playing when Gali battles the Tarakava. What even?

 

Now, although Furst's film scores have more of a high-fantasy sensibility to them, he did a lot -- especially in the latter two movies -- to give them just the slightest hint of a mechanical edge. LoMN and WoS have a distinctly urban quality, while still retaining the broad, sweeping fantasy motifs introduced in MoL. And together, I think those scores are the only Bionicle music that has truly aged well. They can stand up to repeated listenings 10-12 years later, and be appreciated on their own merit without the aid of nostalgia. And I think they've grown to fit the franchise, if anything.

 

Sorry to totally run away on this. I too am savoring the actual discussion of Bionicle music

 

 

He also said on Facebook that he lost Legends of Metru Nui in a "bad drive crash"... I really hope he has backups of the soundtracks somewhere. I would imagine he'd make a lot of those in his line of work.

That drive crash was probably what taught him the importance of making backups :\

[TheSkeletonMan939]

Take MNOG1, for instance. When Kopaka battles the Muaka in the Drifts, you hear something that sounds a little bit like industrial-rock. When Lewa and Onua fight in the Nui-Rama hive, it sounds a little more like techno. When the Toa confront Makuta, you get more industrial-rock plus unintelligible operatic chanting. And you have funk-style slap bass playing when Gali battles the Tarakava. What even?

 

Yeah, thematic unity is not something that Justin Luchter tried to attain while composing the Templar stuff.

 

The neat thing is that even though all the different instruments and music pieces are so different from area to area in the game, it all feels like it can belong together. Some games use a very diverse range of music types, and it can sort of take you out of the immersion when that happens. Luchter made it all work, though.

 

Now, although Furst's film scores have more of a high-fantasy sensibility to them, he did a lot -- especially in the latter two movies -- to give them just the slightest hint of a mechanical edge.

 

Totally! It wasn't used in the film, but you can hear that Furst originally used a shrill electronic sound to start off the end credits. When the Toa Metru make their first public appearance, a very techno-based version of the Jaller/Takua theme from Mask of Light plays. The film version of the track where Vakama, Nokama, and Matau jump onto the Vahki transport uses very strange electronic sounds. I can't even begin to imagine any of that in his Mask of Light score, which is a good thing. It's good that Furst tried to do something different for each film, because it'd be boring if it were just the exact same all three times.

 

LoMN and WoS have a distinctly urban quality, while still retaining the broad, sweeping fantasy motifs introduced in MoL. And together, I think those scores are the only Bionicle music that has truly aged well. They can stand up to repeated listenings 10-12 years later, and be appreciated on their own merit without the aid of nostalgia. And I think they've grown to fit the franchise, if anything.

 

Edited February 20, 2015 by TheSkeletonMan939

[Sir Kohran]

 

Take MNOG1, for instance. When Kopaka battles the Muaka in the Drifts, you hear something that sounds a little bit like industrial-rock. When Lewa and Onua fight in the Nui-Rama hive, it sounds a little more like techno. When the Toa confront Makuta, you get more industrial-rock plus unintelligible operatic chanting. And you have funk-style slap bass playing when Gali battles the Tarakava. What even?

 

Yeah, thematic unity is not something that Justin Luchter tried to attain while composing the Templar stuff.

 

I'd like to point out that he didn't compose the music used in the Lewa/Onua, Kopaka/Muaka and Toa/Makuta fight scenes, which all incorporated excerpts from a fast-paced piece known only as "The Bionicle Music" which was released on the Powerpack music CD in 2001. Its style is different to most of the MNOLG music.

 

Listen to it here.

Edited February 22, 2015 by Sir Kohran

[UngluedBike]

Could you chuck MNOG into the petition please?

[TheSkeletonMan939]

 

 

Take MNOG1, for instance. When Kopaka battles the Muaka in the Drifts, you hear something that sounds a little bit like industrial-rock. When Lewa and Onua fight in the Nui-Rama hive, it sounds a little more like techno. When the Toa confront Makuta, you get more industrial-rock plus unintelligible operatic chanting. And you have funk-style slap bass playing when Gali battles the Tarakava. What even?

 

Yeah, thematic unity is not something that Justin Luchter tried to attain while composing the Templar stuff.

 

I'd like to point out that he didn't compose the music used in the Lewa/Onua, Kopaka/Muaka and Toa/Makuta fight scenes, which all incorporated excerpts from a fast-paced piece known only as "The Bionicle Music" which was released on the Powerpack music CD in 2001. Its style is different to most of the MNOLG music.

 

Listen to it here.

 

 

I'm well aware. "The BIONICLE Music" (and I imagine the rest of the Power Pack) was composed by Paul Hardcastle, not Luchter. But still, how many musical constants can you find within the Templar animations?

 

Could you chuck MNOG into the petition please?

 

Luchter lost a lot of the original MNOLG music. Cracked CDs, lost WAV files, etc. I imagine we won't see that surface anytime in the near future, if ever at all. A shame, considering the game uses mono files at a very low bitrate.

Edited February 22, 2015 by TheSkeletonMan939

[Sir Kohran]

I'm well aware. "The BIONICLE Music" (and I imagine the rest of the Power Pack) was composed by Paul Hardcastle, not Luchter.

 

Interesting, I never knew the composer's name (the CD notes jokingly credit the tracks to the Toa). Where did you find that out?

 

But still, how many musical constants can you find within the Templar animations.

 

Not many, most of the tracks only play for one place or event and are never heard again. The only one used repeatedly is the 'ahhh-ooohhh' chant, which plays over (deep breath) the start of the legend vision, the first glimpse of Tahu, the Ta-Matoran bowing to him in the forest, the Kaita meeting, Takua meeting Vakama on the beach, the start of the first Bohrok episode, and the end of the Pahrak attack. One other example of reuse is the creepy bit that plays over Takua's 'beware the swarm' nightmare and then (appropriately enough) when the first Bohrok hatches.

Edited February 22, 2015 by Sir Kohran

[TheSkeletonMan939]

 

I'm well aware. "The BIONICLE Music" (and I imagine the rest of the Power Pack) was composed by Paul Hardcastle, not Luchter.

 

Interesting, I never knew the composer's name (the CD notes jokingly credit the tracks to the Toa). Where did you find that out?

 

Take a look at the CD. Notice "A 19 Production"?

 

"19" was a song Paul Hardcastle made, and he keeps making new remixes of it to keep people interested (I think it's the only song he's really known for)... I guess he named his company "19". The final piece of evidence is a FaceBook post (I think I'm allowed to link to that here).

[MrSciFiGuy]

Not sure if it will work, but definitely down to help just in case it does! 

[UnderscoreChronix]

The soundtrack is already released and available to watch and has been for years now. 

<-- This being just one of the ones uploaded.

[TheSkeletonMan939]

The soundtrack is already released and available to watch and has been for years now. 

 

What you have is just the standard menu loops, end credits, and any parts of the movie that happened to not have many sound effects.

 

We're more interested in the massive amount of material that has yet to be released, officially or unofficially.

[UnderscoreChronix]

 

The soundtrack is already released and available to watch and has been for years now. 

 

What you have is just the standard menu loops, end credits, and any parts of the movie that happened to not have many sound effects.

 

We're more interested in the massive amount of material that has yet to be released, officially or unofficially.

 

Eh, there's a playlist containing quite a lot of stuff, I don't think that much is missing.

[Tyrion Archer]

 

 

The soundtrack is already released and available to watch and has been for years now. 

 

What you have is just the standard menu loops, end credits, and any parts of the movie that happened to not have many sound effects.

 

We're more interested in the massive amount of material that has yet to be released, officially or unofficially.

 

Eh, there's a playlist containing quite a lot of stuff, I don't think that much is missing.

 

For the record, I put together my own version of the scores, compiling most of the salvageable music from the DVDs with the original cues that have been made available on SoundCloud and Nathan Furst's old website (plus the recently posted MoL opening from YouTube), which is about 45 minutes combined. That's 45 minutes devoted to pretty much ALL of the available music from the whole trilogy, not counting music from the actual films (except the end credits).

 

All three films were roughly 75 minutes each and had music in almost every scene, which adds up to 225 approximated minutes of music. 225 - 45 = 180. And I'm also counting certain menu loops which didn't even show up at all in the films.

 

Yeah, that's a lot of missing music. Just sayin'.

[Fry]

I highly doubt that a petition will do anything. How many Bring Back Bionicle petitions were made? Like 400 or something? Five years later and still they hadn't accomplished anything. I would try contacting Nathan Furst. Sounds stalky, but it might be possible. Also, maybe he doesn't even have the original score anymore. I'm just going to throw my opinion out there, but in all honesty, the score was mediocre at best.

[Sir Kohran]

I would try contacting Nathan Furst. Sounds stalky, but it might be possible. 

 

What's 'stalky' about contacting a professional about their work?

[The Hip Historian Iaredios]

Actually, as sort of a "Over Decade Ago" thing, Nathan Furst has released the first part of the Mask of Light soundtrack, and said that he might upload other parts of the movies' soundtracks later.

 

 

Feeling nostalgic now?

 

 

 

My favorite things about the movies were the most of the character and environment designs, and the music. i am glad that Nathan Furst remembered Bionicle after all these years.

 

 

 

 

 

_{^{EDIT: Typos}}

Edited March 1, 2015 by Iaredios

[TheSkeletonMan939]

Actually, as sort of a "Over Decade Ago" thing, Nathan Furst has released the first part of the Mask of Light soundtrack, and said that he might upload other parts of the movies' soundtracks later.

 

Old news by now, man.

[The Hip Historian Iaredios]

 

Actually, as sort of a "Over Decade Ago" thing, Nathan Furst has released the first part of the Mask of Light soundtrack, and said that he might upload other parts of the movies' soundtracks later.

 

Old news by now, man.

 

 

Yay! I helped!

[TheSkeletonMan939]

He also said on Facebook that he lost Legends of Metru Nui in a "bad drive crash"... I really hope he has backups of the soundtracks somewhere. I would imagine he'd make a lot of those in his line of work.

 

Do you have a link to the Facebook post/comment/whatever where he mentioned the hard drive crash?

[Tyrion Archer]

 

He also said on Facebook that he lost Legends of Metru Nui in a "bad drive crash"... I really hope he has backups of the soundtracks somewhere. I would imagine he'd make a lot of those in his line of work.

 

Do you have a link to the Facebook post/comment/whatever where he mentioned the hard drive crash?

 

Here it is.

 

https://www.facebook.com/NathanFurst/posts/787434911327041

Edited March 1, 2015 by IAmGroot

[Sir Kohran]

Could the music be extracted from the movie's audio tracks?

[TheSkeletonMan939]

Could the music be extracted from the movie's audio tracks?

 

If by audio tracks you mean "5.1 audio", then that's exactly what I did and it's completely riddled with sound effects.

 

Now, if Lego and/or Miramax are any good at keeping archives, they might have the audio stems (the individual types of tracks separated: sound effects, music, dialogue, etc. separated) and if they were really smart they kept the original files.

 

I hope no incompetents lost any of the film's audio assets when preparing any sort of archive for the companies.

Edited March 2, 2015 by TheSkeletonMan939

[Sir Kohran]

 

Could the music be extracted from the movie's audio tracks?

 

Now, if Lego and/or Miramax are any good at keeping archives, they might have the audio stems (the individual types of tracks separated: sound effects, music, dialogue, etc. separated) and if they were really smart they kept the original files.

 

That's what I had in mind. With an animated movie, dialogue, sound effects and music would all be recorded or created separately, each audio file existing at first in isolation. They're put together in the movie.

 

I'd be interested to know if it's possible to disassemble the audio back into those separate pieces. This would probably have to be done from the movie itself as I doubt anyone still has the files after ten years.

[TheSkeletonMan939]

That's what I had in mind. With an animated movie, dialogue, sound effects and music would all be recorded or created separately, each audio file existing at first in isolation. They're put together in the movie.

 

I'd be interested to know if it's possible to disassemble the audio back into those separate pieces. This would probably have to be done from the movie itself as I doubt anyone still has the files after ten years.

 

Even with non-animated movies, studios try to preserve the music and dialogue for use in promo material and such.

 

There's a lot more incentive to keep archives of films and their assets now that everything is digital. Hard drive space is nowhere as limited as it used to be.

 

The dialogue and sound effects are isolated (no music whatsoever) in the center channel of the surround sound mix, so that would be so easy to extract (that's how I got the dialogue for the video in my sig). The music, though, is not to impossible to nab w/o any SFX.

 

I wonder if Furst still has contacts within Lego or Miramax who he could talk to about retrieving any lost music.

[Tyrion Archer]

Turns out Mr. Furst's copies of the Legends of Metru Nui music aren't as "lost" as he previously indicated, as he just posted the entire prologue track from that film on YouTube. This will make a fine addition to the custom album I've been working on, I think.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gzwH5_u4l64&feature=youtu.be

 

Hopefully he'll upload some more pieces, and with any luck one of them will be the epilogue track to the same film which I really want.

Edited March 10, 2015 by IAmGroot

[TheSkeletonMan939]

Hey now! That's great! Maybe Furst found another copy!