in defense of the Av-Matoran builds

[SynthMav]

hey I am the mavrick and i am here to defend the av-matoran build which is over hated in my opinion

 

Firstly Lets begin with with the articulation

 

we have ball joints in the shoulders

the hips

ankles 

neck

and wrist 

which is the most articulation out of any matoran build

the only build with the same amount is the voyi-toran and metru-toran but of course the mahri-toran who lost wrist articullation but the build suffices and i understand that the av matoran build isnt unique or anything but there are worst sets out there that people throw out because there was only 14 pieces when sets like klakk get unnoticed because matoran and I get that the build and peices i mean when solek is #1 on a top ten worst bionicle sets i thinks it over kill they are mediocer sets that are overhated in my opinion 

Edited December 14, 2015 by the mavrick

[Xboxtravis]

I don't own any Av-Matoran or Agori, but judging by photos and reviews online most complaints are due to the pieces used. The torso is large and clunky (admittedly the Metru Matoran torso was worse). The Av-Matoran legs were large and clunky. While the Av-Matoran definitely had more articulation than a Tohunga, Turaga, or Bohrak-Va: the Voya and Mahri Matoran had similar designs without using ackward new parts. Lastly the new Protector models can beat any Gen 1 Matoran in terms of complexity and articulation.

 

Don't take this as a total dis on the Av-Matoran/Agori though. I am tempted to someday Bricklink a few mostly to get a hold of characters I missed during 2008 and 2009.

Edited December 14, 2015 by Xboxtravis

[Naota Takizawa]

Dude, everyone hates the Av-Matoran because they were terribly designed & lacked creativity. Compare how creative the builds are to the Voyatoran & Mahritoran. Both of those sets used building ideas that hadn't been seen in official sets before & they were incredibly simple to build using pre-existing parts. The Kardatoran on the other hand, used overly specialized pieces for bionicle and not much could be achieved with them.

[RahiSpeak]

Well, there was the same amount of articulation in the matoran of Metru Nui, Voya Nui, and Mahri Nui as well. In fact, there were some additional points of articulation in the matoran of Mata Nui. So, yeah, in terms of articulation, the Av-matoran still are nothing special.

 

Of course, don't forget the pieces used! There was something like 40 pieces used in each of the matoran I mentioned while there were maybe 20 pieces included with the Av-matoran. Besides, what can you even use those pieces for? The previous matoran had lots of pieces that were generally handy, but those huge torsoes and awkward limbs of the matoran of Karda Nui?

 

Your intentions were noble, but nope, they're still bad.

Edited December 14, 2015 by RahiSpeak

[The Hip Historian Iaredios]

the only build with the same amount is the voyi-toran and metru-toran but of course the mahri-toran who lost wrist articullation but the build suffices

Whenever I construct matoran I use the Mahri-Nui Matoran build, I just use CCBS and Rahkshi thigh parts for articulated limbs. Turns out very well, very well indeed.

[Aanchir]

I definitely appreciated the improved articulation they offered, but the fact that they so few pieces for such a high price was bothersome. Also, the fragility of the joint pieces in 2008–2010 really limited their usability in MOCs. I do think the Agori and Stars did a very good job improving on and arguably helping to redeem the Av-Matoran build by introducing slightly more creative and less formulaic builds and tools. Then the first wave of Hero Factory heroes reverted things right back to a more formulaic build, which is part of why I didn't buy any of those sets.

 

Thankfully, the CCBS did a lot to improve on sets that size. The 2.0 and 3.0 Hero Factory heroes cost just a dollar more than the Av-Matoran but had twice as many pieces (30 pieces average rather than 14.3). They used more custom builds for their weapons instead of just single-piece blades, they fixed the fragile joint issue that had plagued the previous three years of sets, and they had leg and arm pieces you could actually customize the armor and proportions of instead of each limb being just one single piece. As much grief as the 2.0 and 3.0 Hero Factory heroes tend to get for their somewhat repetitive designs, it was really incredible getting sets with around the same proportions as the Toa Mata but as much articulation as a Toa Inika!

 

Now that Bionicle's back, I think the CCBS-based Protector sets are probably the best Bionicle villager sets we've had to date, even though they cost around twice as much as a typical pre-2008 Bionicle villager. They have very similar proportions to the Av-Matoran but more diverse torso builds, more complex weapons, and all the customization potential that comes with CCBS. I don't know if the Av-Matoran builds were a necessary step in the evolution of sets this size, but they weren't an entirely negative step either. I hope we get more Protector-esque villager sets in future years of G2 Bionicle.

[Xboxtravis]

 but there are worst sets out there that people throw out because there was only 14 pieces when sets like klakk get unnoticed because matoran and I get that the build and peices i mean when solek is #1 on a top ten worst bionicle sets i thinks it over kill they are mediocer sets that are overhated in my opinion 

 

Come to think of it I remember the TTV video you pulled that Solek #1 Worst from. That is the thing, its the opinion on the guy on TTV who made the video. Nothing about what he said is "gospel" or "canon" or "official." In fact in the video he hinted that he likes to beat on the Av-Matoran builds for fun, so that shows he has a strong bias. It was an entertaining YouTube video, but not the golden rule to judge the whole community opinion on. And as Aanchir mentioned the Av-Matoran build was improved on with later sets (perhaps part the reason the build is hated is due to its association with the Stars which were the swansong for Gen 1 Bionicle), and set the size scale that Hero Factory followed for its first year, and that the new Protector figures are around the size of an Av-Matoran.

 

Not to mention the Av-Matoran have some interesting stories from what I have read on BS01, they seem like a hardy independent bunch. 

[abstractAgamid]

I think it's kind of weird that Solek was chosen as the worst, I think there are other Av-Matoran/Agori that are worse. Eh, opinions.

 

I think the 2006 Matoran are the best small sets we've had to date.

[Nescent]

The thing that bothered me most about the Av-Matoran was their limbs. The 90-degree angle limb pieces worked in 2004 because the limbs were so tiny, but on the Av-Matoran they made the sets extremely difficult to pose.

 

However, I appreciated the sets for their unique and well-designed masks.

[Kaburimasu 米]

yes , the av-matoran were very poor in design (as far as having multi-purpose pieces) , but after recently converting into the Church of Solekians , I realized that they were the greatest contributions towards the Bionicle franchise . Why , you may ask ?

 

1. Solek

2. Solek

3. Solek

 

All hail Lord Solek .

Edited December 14, 2015 by Kasaius Khan

[Ehksidian]

The worst thing about the Av-matoran are the really difficult-to-use body and limb pieces. Permanently bent at 90 degrees limits limb use dramatically, and the torso pieces (while they had many, many connection points) weren't that useful either. Also their heads were utterly ABYSMAL.

And after the Voya Nui and Mahri Nui matoran, they were a pretty sizable downgrade to many people. Not the worst sets, but after 2006/2007's matoran builds...it's not surprising a lot of people view the Av-matoran as pretty bad.

though they aren't that bad because they had the two-toed feet and orange Toa Mata feet.

[MrSciFiGuy]

I only hated them because their joints broke immediately. Loved their masks

[Quisoves Potoo]

I have mixed feelings on the Av-Matoran build. Aesthetically, I find it works, though the wider torso is perhaps a bit misshapen. Mechanically, it does run into troubles, in that it's not readily compatible with any other constraction-build. The torsos are overly complex and the limbs use both balls and ball-cups. I think it can be used for MOCing, but it doesn't offer much of an incentive to do so.

 

It's arguably the most interesting in an historic sense. On one end, it's the spiritual successor to, of all things, the McToran build. You can snap it together in a minute, but good luck MOCing with the torso and arms. On the other end, it's the second leg in LEGO's journey towards a simpler, more set-efficient, and more cost-effective building system, and the first attempt at adjusting the constraction system to this end. It's the feathered dinosaur to CCBS' bird. The monopiece torsos, the bi-connector limbs, the lack of Technic pins (save as weapon and mask connectors,) the ease of building, all these things have their origin in the Av-Matoran.

 

Had it not been for the Extinction Event of 2010, we would probably have seen a more gradual transition towards a CCBS-like system. As Telluris demonstrates, cross-pollination between the Av-Matoran and Inika-builds was something the designers were open to, and I imagine that, by 2011, we'd have seen a number of parts designed for both.

Speaking of which, I do hope that, one of these days, we get a detailed look at the original plans for post-2009 BIONICLE.

[Ghidora131]

I personally like the Av-Matoran to a degree, but the whole line's parts were weak, not just them. Solek was definitely not the worst of the sets.

 

However, the whole idea was to have the masks be the noble forms of the loved/treasured masks of yesteryear which was absolute garbage. Had they just been new masks, they would definitely be more appreciated.

 

Another thing to note is that the Toa weren't too much better, only bigger. Kopaka had a literal Nuju Metru mask redesign (which looked nice, for NUJU) while the other six Toa had masks that were only half good and didn't come close to resembling the old Toa.

 

So I dunno. I really like the Shadow Matoran masks, especially Radiak's, and Solek's mask is also a favorite. But it just wasn't that good.

[Erasmus Graves]

Masks and weapons are amazing. Articulation is very much appreciated. However, the torsos are big and clunky. Not enough pieces for a high price. They aren't that bad, just a bit of a downgrade compared to some of the other sets. Still, making a connecter with a Toa or Makuta is nice.