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Sir Keksalot

Designing the perfect set: Part 1, Hands

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Ok, so for the sake of making threads about this sort of thing, I've decided to make a series of topics discussing what, if we were to design the sets of a new generation, the ideal set of new parts and builds would be for certain aspects of a set. I know the wording of that sentence was a hot mess, but I think the point of this thread will become clearer in a bit. Basically, today, we're going to talk about what the perfect hands would be. Let's start with the core piece of the new hand.

 

We'll start with a Y-joint; AKA the piece that was used for hands on the Toa Metru. Now, let's remove the "leg" of the piece which gives it its name so that the only holes in the piece are the 2 axle holes perpendicular to the socket. Now, let's take the bar from this piece...

41UBYqoOSWL._SY300_.jpg (Note: I'm not saying to use the piece itself; rather, I mean the component which things can clip onto.)

...And attach it to one of the flat sides of the new piece so that it's perpendicular to the axle holes. This is where 3 of the hand's fingers will be attached, so that they may curl around the axle holes to simulate holding an object. The fingers would be this piece:

s-l300.jpg

(Note: If you're opposed to this particular piece, a new one could be made. This is only here because it's a versatile piece that could have claws or something for added detail.)

 

Now, let's travel to the side of the hand opposite to the bar. Behind where the axle holes are located, there's a hole to attach this thing (or a modified version of it):

459926.jpg

The thumb (which is the same piece as the fingers) can be attached to this piece. It was originally a T-joint, but this was changed by some users' suggestions.

 

This build enables the the fingers to move and make various gestures, such as pointing, grabbing, or a vulgar display of power. The thumb can move up or down; this allows for more possible poses (i.e. a thumbs-up), and the thumb can be positioned so that its tip goes over the index finger when the fist is clenched so as to make the "holding an object" pose more realistic.

 

That's my idea. What do you guys think? Can anything be changed about this hand design? Do I need to provide illustrations?

Edited by Sir Keksalot
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So basically something like this or this?

The former is similar; however, what I propose has axle holes to hold something.

 

 

Designing the perfect set

 

But…

300px-Kohrak.PNG300px-Gahlok.PNG

 

… there's already…?

 

Is this some sort of obscure in-joke I haven't heard of, or...? I mean, the Bohrok are fine, but they're flawed. Limited poseability and articulation are their main drawbacks.


Rule #1: Always listen to Kek.

Rule #2: If you break rule #1, kindly don't.

Rule #3: EVERYBODY TYPE IN THE CHAT "AVAK IS A STUPID TRIGGER"

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 Is this some sort of obscure in-joke I haven't heard of, or...? I mean, the Bohrok are fine, but they're flawed. Limited poseability and articulation are their main drawbacks.

 

 

The Bohrok are just really, really, REALLY cool. Remember, there's alot more to a set's design than poseabillity.

 

As for your idea on poseable hand design, I think I could really get behind this notion, but not with that Exo-arm. Something about just reminds me of, well, Exo-Force. Namely sets like Supernova and Cyclone Defender's hand designs.

It's not that Exo-Force is bad, its just I'd prefer BIONICLE to have a new design for the fingers. Anything would do, aslong as its a new piece.


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 Is this some sort of obscure in-joke I haven't heard of, or...? I mean, the Bohrok are fine, but they're flawed. Limited poseability and articulation are their main drawbacks.

 

 

The Bohrok are just really, really, REALLY cool. Remember, there's alot more to a set's design than poseabillity.

They're certainly ahead of their time in terms of appearance, but they still lack a poseable gear function and jointed limbs--intricacies that have only sprung up recently.

 

 

And the elbows? Poseable gears? A joint in the waist? The Rahkshi do not have these. From an objective standpoint, some of the recent Uniter sets are probably the best normal-sized sets Bionicle has yet seen; though, if you ask me to say which in particular, I cannot name them because I've heavily modded mine and I forget who came with the best articulation and such.


Rule #1: Always listen to Kek.

Rule #2: If you break rule #1, kindly don't.

Rule #3: EVERYBODY TYPE IN THE CHAT "AVAK IS A STUPID TRIGGER"

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Hey, guys, is there any chance we can get back on-topic? I created this thread for the sake of cooking up the ideal Bionicle hands--functional and poseable, and with a pleasing visual design. I legitimately want to hear what you guys think can be changed to make this design better.

 

I was just continuing the Bohrok joke.

THAT'S IT. I DON'T KNOW WHAT TO BELIEVE ANYMORE.


Rule #1: Always listen to Kek.

Rule #2: If you break rule #1, kindly don't.

Rule #3: EVERYBODY TYPE IN THE CHAT "AVAK IS A STUPID TRIGGER"

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Is this some sort of obscure in-joke I haven't heard of, or...? I mean, the Bohrok are fine, but they're flawed. Limited poseability and articulation are their main drawbacks.

It was a bit of a joke, but the Bohrok are my favorite sets.  Honestly I don't think they could've been improved by adding articulation, since their limbs both added to their stocky look and let them roll into a ball, and they could pose fine.  The quality of a set isn't just based on how much articulation it has.

 

As far as improved articulation for humanoid sets, though, the first link Katanga posted would be something like my choice for hand design.  It accepts posable fingers and can still be used to hold tools and weapons.  Of course, it would depend on the theme of the set overall.

Edited by Bfahome
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OpAXNpl.jpg

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not to sound rude or anything but you literally described exactly what i drew the last time hand designs were discussed:

handconcept.png

Right down to the use of the "T" technic pin to givethe thumb some swivel to it! O:

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The design you propose is one I like, however I'd suggest one modification. On the existing y-joint, the two axles holes on the side of it (not the one on the "leg") have a soft of block in between them, preventing you from pushing a longer axel all the was through. I suggest this block be removed, since it sometimes messes with staff designs.

 

Overall though I like the suggestion. I don't see any issue using the exo-force robo arms as fingers, since they actually look like robotic fingers. As for the thumb however, in my experience those t-shaped pieces fall out of axel holes very easily. Maybe a pistol or hose-end piece would be better suited for this? Either that, or a modified high-friction version of the t-piece. 

 

Another idea would be that instead of those plate+bar pieces (from the 20 stück picture), the newer version which is angled would be used.

 

Overall though, good concept. Looking forward to the other threads!

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A hand like this seems like a great idea, but it can be tricky to tell with new molds. There are a lot of engineering considerations people (including me!) rarely think about with new parts, such as: are all the "walls" of the part thin enough that it will cool properly? Will the varying states of compression on a ball or ball cup make the other connection points on the part too tight or too loose? Etc. Your hand design seems like it'd work just fine when compared to other similar parts, but I'm no expert and I've had my own part ideas shot down by people wiser than me about these matters.

 

One slight change I'd suggest would be to use this piece for the thumb attachment instead of the pneumatic T. It's a piece I've seen a lot of AFOLs use for mecha builds, and I've learned from experience it is useful for Bionicle thumb joints since the "foot" of the piece helps keep the thumb from falling off.

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not to sound rude or anything but you literally described exactly what i drew the last time hand designs were discussed:

 

Right down to the use of the "T" technic pin to givethe thumb some swivel to it! O:

Whoops, my bad, man. I'd entirely forgotten about that thread. However, my idea does vary in that the base of the finger isn't immediately in front of where something would be held; this is because, on actual human hands, our knuckles aren't in front of what we're holding, but to the side of where it's held.

 

The design you propose is one I like, however I'd suggest one modification. On the existing y-joint, the two axles holes on the side of it (not the one on the "leg") have a soft of block in between them, preventing you from pushing a longer axel all the was through. I suggest this block be removed, since it sometimes messes with staff designs.

I think the reason for that might be for the sake of keeping any long axles from being pushed so far deep that there's too much friction on them to pull them out; however, this could also be solved with some internal engineering of the holes, and I'd also like to see improvements to how polearms work in constraction, so I'm with you there.

 

One slight change I'd suggest would be to use this piece for the thumb attachment instead of the pneumatic T. It's a piece I've seen a lot of AFOLs use for mecha builds, and I've learned from experience it is useful for Bionicle thumb joints since the "foot" of the piece helps keep the thumb from falling off.

I've made the change. I've had some pretty annoying experiences with T-joints myself, and I only use them because I'm cheap and that's what I have to work with.


Rule #1: Always listen to Kek.

Rule #2: If you break rule #1, kindly don't.

Rule #3: EVERYBODY TYPE IN THE CHAT "AVAK IS A STUPID TRIGGER"

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not to sound rude or anything but you literally described exactly what i drew the last time hand designs were discussed:

handconcept.png

Right down to the use of the "T" technic pin to givethe thumb some swivel to it! O:

I want this design. i can hab pweeze? ey b0ss ?


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I vote the perfect set has no hands and instead has four feet. Or two feet and no arms. Just take hands out of the equation entirely and poof! Perfection.


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I vote the perfect set has no hands and instead has four feet. Or two feet and no arms. Just take hands out of the equation entirely and poof! Perfection.

As an artist I can indeed confirm hands are the devils of design.


"Whether that is right or not...I also...as a Rider...have a wish that I want to fulfill."

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