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Biological Chronicle: The Complete Bionicle Collection

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#201 Offline OmegaLucasNuva

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Posted Mar 21 2018 - 10:12 AM

I have finished Book 8. Need to find the courage to edit my notes to post here.
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#202 Offline Surel-Nuva

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Posted Mar 22 2018 - 06:25 AM

 

On a separate note, does anyone have access to the guide where The Many Deaths of Toa Tuyet was first published? There are many occasions where it feels like some words in that story should be in italics, but the BS01 doesn’t italicize anything, so it would be nice to check from the original source (same applies for The Birth of a Dark Hunter).

 

I guess book 8 is next, then.

 

The Birth of a Dark Hunter was included in the first edition of the BIONICLE: Encyclopedia

 

And here's the original post where Greg revealed 'The Many Death of Toa Tuyet': http://web.archive.o...howtopic=252575


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#203 Offline Toa of Gallifrey

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Posted Mar 22 2018 - 12:10 PM

The comments from before GregF was BZP's eternal punchline feel like they're from such a distant past (even if 2007 was more than 10 years ago, oh God I feel old).


Edited by Toa of Gallifrey, Mar 22 2018 - 12:10 PM.

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#204 Offline Darth Jaller

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Posted Mar 22 2018 - 03:52 PM

One other thing I started to look at was making the way treespeak is written consistent. But I noticed that, other than maybe one or two words, there aren't really any treespeak phrases that are used both without a hyphen (in Books 1 and 2) and with a hyphen (in the other Books). Not only that, but there are a few instances of Greg using treespeak with a hyphen for some words, but without one for others. The Official Guide to Bionicle (outdated as it may be) also seems to indicate that some treespeak words have hyphens while others don't. Given all of this, I'm thinking I'll make any treespeak words that sometimes have a hyphen and sometimes don't consistent, but leave it at that. Thoughts?

 

With regards to the treespeak thing; I'm pretty sure I remember that, when it was first introduced in MNOG, treespeak words had no hyphens; it was only around-about 2003-04 that started becoming a thing. I would tentatively guess than all such words coined in the early years were forever spelled without hyphens, while any new ones that Greg invented from the Metru Nui era onwards were given hyphens for ease of understanding? Though this is only a guess based on half-remembered facts, as it's been ages since I seriously looked at any of the source material.


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"New legends awake, but old lessons must be remembered.

For that is the way

of the BIONICLE."


#205 Offline Pereki

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Posted Mar 22 2018 - 05:27 PM

With regards to the treespeak thing; I'm pretty sure I remember that, when it was first introduced in MNOG, treespeak words had no hyphens; it was only around-about 2003-04 that started becoming a thing. I would tentatively guess than all such words coined in the early years were forever spelled without hyphens, while any new ones that Greg invented from the Metru Nui era onwards were given hyphens for ease of understanding? Though this is only a guess based on half-remembered facts, as it's been ages since I seriously looked at any of the source material.

Sounds about right - the lexicon is like mnog and doesn't use hyphens.  If anyone has the Official Guide to Bionicle on-hand to check, It'd be interesting to know if there are hyphens there, since it's written by Greg.


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#206 Offline Tattorack

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Posted Mar 25 2018 - 10:52 AM

Good collection!


Edited by Tattorack, Mar 25 2018 - 10:52 AM.

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#207 Offline TuragaNuva

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Posted Mar 26 2018 - 02:52 PM

This took a lot longer than I imagined, but I've finally gone through book 7. The page numbers I use here refer to the pages of the new, updated version.
 
And, again... there are a ton of points to go through and fix.

Thanks so much for all the feedback! Everything should now be fixed that needed to be. Some notes:

  • I've transcribed some lines from the podcasts slightly differently than BS01 did, based on what it sounds like to me. After your feedback, I've changed a few things to more closely match BS01, but some are still different.
  • I moved the italics in "the universe needs it" from "needs" to "universe," as that seems to make more sense (and the way it was actually done was likely a mistake).
  • I fixed the inconsistency in how the Nuva arrived at Artakha by removing the sentence describing a long journey bringing them there. It seemed like the simplest way to fix it.

I've left the following things unchanged:

  • "a group calling themselves Zyglak" - I think it's phrased that way in reference to how the characters had never heard of the Zyglak before (so to them, it's just a group of creatures that call themselves that).
  • "It was the Makuta who guarded Metru Nui" - this is a tricky one to change, since there's not another easy name to refer to Teridax by at this point in the story. Also, while he wasn't technically assigned to Metru Nui yet, he clearly had his eye on it, so that could be what the line refers to.
  • "These others I am not familiar with" - again, difficult to cleanly edit without changing a lot. It also seems to me that Teridax could be referring to his knowledge of them before the League of Six Kingdoms was formed.
  • "Then do it, Lewa." - this does very well seem like it could be an error, and if it were as simple as changing it from "Lewa used the Kakama" to "Pohatu used the Kakama," I probably would. But since the flow of the conversation would necessitate re-attributing Lewa's line to Pohatu, and it doesn't actually contradict any canon, I'd prefer to leave it as-is.
  • "Better listen to Takadox, masked ones" - this one does read a little oddly, but I think it does seem possible that Takadox is referring to himself in the third person, and since he used Pridak's name so shortly after (rather than just saying "he"), it seems unlikely to me that Greg accidently used Takadox's name in place of Pridak's.
  • "the myriad creatures" - this is proper grammar
  • "he struck at us from ambush" - this is proper grammar
  • "keeping its distance from two beings" - this is proper grammar
  • "it too will be restored to where it belongs" - this is proper grammar
  • "and all that was left him was revenge" - this is proper grammar
  • "I did what I could to ease its suffering then" - this is proper grammar (the comma was added by BS01, and wasn't in the original text)
  • "ask questions of your corpses" - this is proper grammar

 

One other thing I started to look at was making the way treespeak is written consistent. But I noticed that, other than maybe one or two words, there aren't really any treespeak phrases that are used both without a hyphen (in Books 1 and 2) and with a hyphen (in the other Books). Not only that, but there are a few instances of Greg using treespeak with a hyphen for some words, but without one for others. The Official Guide to Bionicle (outdated as it may be) also seems to indicate that some treespeak words have hyphens while others don't. Given all of this, I'm thinking I'll make any treespeak words that sometimes have a hyphen and sometimes don't consistent, but leave it at that. Thoughts?

 
With regards to the treespeak thing; I'm pretty sure I remember that, when it was first introduced in MNOG, treespeak words had no hyphens; it was only around-about 2003-04 that started becoming a thing. I would tentatively guess than all such words coined in the early years were forever spelled without hyphens, while any new ones that Greg invented from the Metru Nui era onwards were given hyphens for ease of understanding? Though this is only a guess based on half-remembered facts, as it's been ages since I seriously looked at any of the source material.

 

That's the thing, though: it's inconsistent. Some treespeak phrases that originally didn't have a hyphen were later used with one by Greg, but he did still spell the occasional one without a hyphen. But generally, yes: the early stuff didn't use hyphens, and all the later stuff by Greg did use them.
 
 

 

With regards to the treespeak thing; I'm pretty sure I remember that, when it was first introduced in MNOG, treespeak words had no hyphens; it was only around-about 2003-04 that started becoming a thing. I would tentatively guess than all such words coined in the early years were forever spelled without hyphens, while any new ones that Greg invented from the Metru Nui era onwards were given hyphens for ease of understanding? Though this is only a guess based on half-remembered facts, as it's been ages since I seriously looked at any of the source material.

Sounds about right - the lexicon is like mnog and doesn't use hyphens.  If anyone has the Official Guide to Bionicle on-hand to check, It'd be interesting to know if there are hyphens there, since it's written by Greg.

 

As I mentioned in my earlier post, the Official Guide to Bionicle uses both (though it leans heavily toward not using hyphens, oddly). I think Greg may have started using hyphens just to make it clear to his editor and/or readers that it wasn't a typo.


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#208 Offline Vrahno

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Posted Apr 11 2018 - 05:58 PM

I'm not sure if any of this is usable, but others have expressed interest in it, so I went ahead and translated the extra bits from the strange Hungarian "extended" edition of Tale of the Toa, and inserted them into the novel. It's a bit of a rush job, so forgive any typos or mangled sentences, but I tried to make it as accurate and readable as possible -- though at certain points I had to resort to guesswork when deciphering the writing (sadly, the translation work on these books was stupidly lazy and full of errors). Text exclusive to the Hungarian book is marked like this. Text found in the English version but not present in the Hungarian one like this.

 

https://www.dropbox.... (Hun).doc?dl=0

 

It's an interesting read, because as it turns out, this was probably how Hapka had originally written the novel, before it went through a major revision for the English release. Not only were about 50 pages removed, a lot of the surviving text had to be altered too because it had so many storyline contradictions. I'm not sure why the foreign release was based on Hapka's faultier original writing instead of the corrected and more up-to-date finalized one; maybe the publishers were in too big of a hurry to wait till the rewrite was done (like if they had a set deadline and the translation had to be done fast), or they just sent the wrong text by mistake. Whatever the case, here's some observations:

  • The Toa often use their Nuva tools. The first chapter even says Tahu's sword is made up of two pieces, and it's called a magma sword throughout. Pohatu has Climbing Claws, Gali has Aqua Axes and Lewa has green Air Katana. Seems Hapka wasn't told that the Mata and Nuva are different toylines, which is odd, since the first half of the book mentions stuff like Gali having hooks and the others having large fingers like the Mata sets.
  • There's a fair amount of foreshadowing in Tahu's visions to later storylines, up to the coming of Takanuva.
  • Unworn masks have colors matching their Toa. These were categorically corrected to being gray.
  • The Toa know of the Manas and the Golden Masks through their dreams, while the revised text says it was the Turaga who told them about these.
  • Almost every scene goes on for longer, Gali's introductory chapter being the most notable example, as it had over half of it deleted for the English release. There's other cut scenes too, like Kopaka fighting a Nui-Jaga and a fair bit of the Toa vs Shadow Toa battle.
  • The Shadow Toa's remains all recede into the tunnels after their defeat, as if they were still alive in some way. All of these sentences were cut.
  • Fist-bumping is a thing, but this too was removed from the finalized text.
  • While there's some nice character moments and lines, there's also annoying amounts of redundancy, exposition, and padding, so I can see why most of these got cut.

Edited by Vrahno, Apr 19 2018 - 11:10 PM.

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#209 Offline Planetperson

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Posted Apr 11 2018 - 09:08 PM

THANK YOU! Seriously, I can't thank you enough for taking the time to go through the ENTIRE Hungarian version of the book for my benefit. I was really fascinated by this discovery when I first found out about it... I just can't read a word of Hungarian. :) Your translations look fantastic. I look forward to reading the whole thing.


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#210 Offline ArchAngelleofJustice

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Posted Apr 19 2018 - 10:46 PM

>

  • The Toa often use their Nuva tools. The first chapter even says Tahu's sword is made up of two pieces, and it's called a magma sword throughout. Pohatu has Climbing Claws, Gali has Aqua Axes and Lewa has green Air Katana. Seem Hapka wasn't told that the Mata and Nuva are different toylines, which is odd, since the first half of the book mentions stuff like Gali having hooks and the others having large fingers like the Mata sets

That makes a lot of sense given the context. I always wondered why "Pohatu leaped to the ground and immediately swung his weapon at the boulder" when he fought his Shadow self in Tale of the Toa, and I figured Hapka hadn't paid a huge amount of attention to the sets.

 

I will have to give that a proper read at some point. I had a short skim, and even though some of it is redundant, I quite enjoyed it.


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#211 Offline TuragaNuva

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Posted May 07 2018 - 02:41 PM

So I know I've taken a while to make a statement on this, but, after giving it some thought, I don't plan to include the extra content from the Hungarian version of Tale of the Toa, given that, as others have said, it appears to be the original manuscript before it received some much-needed editing.

Also, small update: I've changed Book 1 so that its "Standard" version doesn't include Quest for the Toa, as I felt uncomfortable including a fan-transcription that had not been officially endorsed in the Standard version. The versions of Book 1 that contain it are now considered the "Complete" versions (like with Protection in Book 5). I hope this doesn't bother anyone, since all the same options are present, they're basically just titled differently.

 

I have finished Book 8. Need to find the courage to edit my notes to post here.

Been looking forward to your notes since you posted this. Do you still plan on posting them? They'd be really helpful.


EDIT: I'd like to make this a new post so that people will get an alert for it, but no one else has posted yet so I can't. Anyway: the entire compilation is now Justified rather than Left-aligned! I liked the idea ever since OmegaLucasNuva suggested it, and I finally got around to finding an easy way to do it. I did a quick once-over to make sure no formatting got messed up, but as always, let me know if you see anything wrong!

Edited by TuragaNuva, May 09 2018 - 02:04 PM.

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#212 Offline Planetperson

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Posted May 13 2018 - 02:50 AM

I decided to take a look at Dark Mirror again and randomly noticed a couple things:

  • Book 8 p. 139: “Help is exactly what you need[,] Toa,”
  • Book 8 p. 153: Tuyet has received word of the [a] plan to steal the Mask of Time.
  • Throughout Dark Mirror, Jaller's name is spelled as "Jaller," but logically it should still be "Jala." Same with Pewku/Puku.
  • There are still some excessive BS01 capitalizations, such as "Sub-Zero Spear."

Thank you for your continued maintenance!


Edited by Planetperson, May 13 2018 - 03:12 AM.

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#213 Offline TuragaNuva

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Posted May 14 2018 - 09:02 AM

I decided to take a look at Dark Mirror again and randomly noticed a couple things:

  • Book 8 p. 139: “Help is exactly what you need[,] Toa,”
  • Book 8 p. 153: Tuyet has received word of the [a] plan to steal the Mask of Time.
  • Throughout Dark Mirror, Jaller's name is spelled as "Jaller," but logically it should still be "Jala." Same with Pewku/Puku.
  • There are still some excessive BS01 capitalizations, such as "Sub-Zero Spear."
Thank you for your continued maintenance!

Thank you for your continued feedback!

The first two issues are now fixed. Unless there's something I missed or other people disagree with me, though, I think I'll leave Jaller and Pewku as-is in Dark Mirror, since, even if the Bohrok attack never happened, it's still possible that they did something else to earn new names.

I'm still trying to decide what to do about those weapon capitalizations (Sub-Zero Spear and Seismic Spear), since some weapons in Bionicle get capitalized names (Spear of Fusion, Staff of Light), but others don't (magma swords, air katana), and since Dark Mirror was released as a podcast rather than text, there's no way to know how Greg actually wrote the names of those two weapons. I'm leaning toward leaving them as-is because I think it reads a little better, but I'd appreciate other people's opinions on this.

I also still need to read through Dark Mirror for other potentially unnecessary capitalizations.

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#214 Offline Downfall

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Posted May 18 2018 - 06:48 AM

Maybe the product descriptions for the Hagah would help? Although, they would be presented as a play-type feature, and that means that they would be capitalized as they were important parts. It seems likely that they would be capitalized, though, as they seem to be an important tool. 

 

I noticed all of your examples for capitalization appeared after 2002. Does that have anything to do with it?


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#215 Offline TuragaNuva

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Posted May 18 2018 - 08:31 AM

Maybe the product descriptions for the Hagah would help? Although, they would be presented as a play-type feature, and that means that they would be capitalized as they were important parts. It seems likely that they would be capitalized, though, as they seem to be an important tool. 
 
I noticed all of your examples for capitalization appeared after 2002. Does that have anything to do with it?

Checking the product descriptions is an interesting idea, though I can't seem to track them down anywhere. Also, I checked: the terms "magma sword" and "air katana" are both used in 2006, again without capitalization.

However, after doing some digging in the Greg Archives, I found this:

7. Are tool names like “blazer claws” and “cyclone spear” supposed to be capitalized? I’m pretty sure I’ve seen them capitalized some places, but others not. Which is correct? And are Rahi names like "frost leech" proper names or nicknames of sorts? Kind of the way Canis lupus familiaris is commonly called a poodle.

Those are proper names, because they do not have standard BIONICLE names. I usually don't capitalize Toa tool names.

He doesn't specifically say whether the cyclone spear should be capitalized, but his response that he usually doesn't capitalize Toa Tool names sounds to me like he's saying it should be lower-case. I've changed the spears accordingly.

Also, bonus:

8. Are the names “krana” and “krana-kal” supposed to be capitalized? Again, I’ve seen it both ways.

Not normally, no.

I had decided a while back to make all instances of "krana" and "krana-kal" (other than names of specific types, like "Krana Xa") lower-case, so I'm glad to see that Greg confirmed that's correct.

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#216 Offline Toatapio Nuva

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Posted May 20 2018 - 10:05 AM

So, finally, I’ve gone through the entirety of book 8. I know it took quite a bit of time, so apologies for that. Anyway, there’s quite a bit of stuff to point about the book. I mostly like the order you put the different parts of the story in, but I have many major points on the structuring of the chapters.

 

The big point I have in general is that most of the chapters, especially in the latter half of the book, are way too long, to the point that it started to affect the reading experience. This is because at some point the chapters start to combine book chapters with chapters from multiple serials. It would be a lot better to have a separate chapter for each book/serial chapter in this compilation. At the very least, book chapters should be separated from serial chapters. Some of my points further down the line link to the issue I have with the length of the chapters, but this is the gist of it.

 

Then the more detailed feedback:

 

Introduction

Spoiler

 

The Mutran Chronicles

Spoiler

 

Federation of Fear

Spoiler

 

Shadows in the Sky & Swamp of Secrets + serials

Spoiler

 

The Final Battle + serials

[spoiler]I noticed that you omitted the introduction chapter to The Final Battle book, that talks about the creation of Karda Nui. It doesn’t bother me at all and is not necessary to include, but I was curious as to why it’s not included.

 

Page 166: “…he adruptly shut the field off” – “adruptly” should be “abruptly

Page 166: “…probably [into] something worse than what they were…” – add “into” where indicated (this is a mistake in the original text)

Page 166: “Let’s just give the berries to them.[‘] Well, everyone thought…” – add apostrophe where indicated

Page 167: “…incredible power far out-classing any Toa” – “out-classing” should be “outclassing

Page 167: “…it seemed like – ow! – a good idea at the time” – “ow!” should be in italics

 

Page 170: “…and a sphere of Water around the Dark Hunter's head…” – “Water” should not be capitalized

Page 170: “Kopaka flash-froze Akhmou…” – “Akhmou” should be “Ahkmou

Page 170: “…into little pieces of crystalline Protodermis” – Protodermis is usually not capitalized in other story material

Page 171: The paragraph starting with “Takanuva took one last look around” requires several paragraph divisions. They’re all on biosector, so I’m not gonna elaborate on each one here

Page 171: “Krika used his Vacuum power…” – “Vacuum” should not be capitalized

Page 171: …she said, “Or rather…” – replace comma with full stop

Page 171: “I am much more... competent” – formatting of the three dots

Page 171: …she replied, “How unfortunate for you” – replace comma with full stop

 

Page 174: “Some attempt to weaken the boa’s ranks?” – “boa’s” should be “Toa’s

Page 174: “Turaga Matau had said some-thing about…” – “some-thing” should be “something

Page 174: “If you would – ow – not flatten me…” – “ow” should be in italics

Page 175: “…and it just looked like he was taking a nap” – “looked” should be in italics

Page 175: “Wish I had a Mask of X-Ray Vision right about now,” Pohatu muttered – It might be a bit confusing to readers not familiar with the most detailed lore why Pohatu doesn’t mention him actually having an Akaku, and just not being able to call on it in Karda Nui. One way to address this would be to change “a Mask” to “my Mask”. I know you may not wanna do that, since we’re trying to keep the original text intact as much as possible, but this change would at least attempt to address the issue

Page 175: “Does the `Toa of Life’…” – reverse the first apostrophe

Page 175: “I’ll only be beat-ing everyone else here…” – “beat-ing” should be “beating

Page 175: “…for what might all Mata Nui” – “all” should be “ail

Page 176: “…can start again some-where else” – “some-where” should be “somewhere

 

Returning again to the point I made about separating chapters more, I found chapter 29 to be particularly long.

 

Page 177: “…he said in disbelief, “Is that what you call…” – replace comma with full stop

Page 178: Takanuva asked, “Or maybe it’s just beginning” – replace comma with full stop

Page 178: Remove line division between “Takanuva looked right into Tuyet’s eyes” and “Then who would there be left to protect?”

Page 178: Same as above, but between “Tuyet smiled” and “Very clever, Toa”

Page 178: “…one where they might welcome a ruler like you.[“] – add quotation marks at the end

 

Page 178: “…yanking him away from his fate.  A moment later he felt the hard stone…” – remove the additional space between “fate.” and “A moment”

Page 179: …asked Ancient, “And why would a Vortixx…” – replace comma with full stop

Page 179: “Two beams of power lanced out of The Shadowed Ones’ eyes” – “The” should not be capitalized

Page 179: “Two beams of power lanced out of The Shadowed Ones’ eyes” – Ones’ should be One’s

Page 180: “…hurled a blast of Shadow at Vezon” – “Shadow” should not be capitalized

Page 180: …he said, “I prefer seashells, myself” – replace comma with full stop

Page 180: “…a creature that could drain the Light out of others and turn them into beings of Shadow” – “Light” and “Shadow” should not be capitalized

Page 180: “…and feeding his Light to my pets” – same as above

Page 180: “Startled, he let his Shadow power lapse” – and again

Page 180: “…and his Antidermis was leaking out into the air” – I also think antidermis hasn’t been capitalized before

 

Now we get to Takanuva’s Blog. First of all, I think it might be good to add “Takanuva’s Blog” or “From Takanuva’s Blog”, for the same reason I suggested doing it with The Mutran Chronicles.

 

Secondly, many of the entries throughout the book are completely redundant and only serve to pause the momentum of the story. It’s not very exciting to read a same scene twice, especially since Takanuva’s Blog doesn’t really include much introspection that wouldn’t be covered by the books already. So I would suggest removing the entries, unless they depict events not depicted elsewhere. Since that doesn’t leave many entries, it might make sense to have the “Takanuva’s Blog” heading before each one. If there are consecutive entries though, just clarifying before the first of them would be necessary, and the rest could be separated by paragraph divisons. In fact, I think the entries won’t need to be labelled as “Entry #”, but just included as paragraphs under the “Takanuva’s Blog” heading.

 

Page 181: “His journey had begun in the city of Metru Nui, courtesy of a Great Mask worn by a being named Brutaka. His mission was to travel to Karda Nui and bring vital information to the Toa Nuva.” – since you’ve already edited the beginning of the chapter, I think the section quoted here should also be removed. It’s kinda odd and out of place in the current version (besides, by this time the beginning and reason for Takanuva’s journey has already been repeated many times throughout the book)

Page 181: “Gali was going to ask more questions. but she was distracted…” – replace full stop with comma

Page 181-183: Entries 3-9 should be removed, since they only repeat what the reader just read

Page 183: “…using whatever extra equipment he’d had stored outside the hive” – “he’d” should be “he

Page 183: “But they come here and risk their lives for Matoron they don’t even know” – “Matoron” should be “Matoran

Page 183: “And what have [I] done?” – add “I” where indicated

Page 183: “no, everything I was told to do” – “told” should not be in italics (cause it’s emphasis within italics)

Page 184: “…even at the cost  of my own life” – remove additional space between “cost” and “of”

Page 184: “We had only be flying a few minutes…” – “be” should be “been

Page 184: “…Makuta who got transformed somehow into [the] big pests you see” – add “the” where indicated

Page 184: “Better off staying away from them, they’re –-” – remove the second dash

Page 184: “I didn’t need to be told that [a] sting from one of them could do more than itch” – add “a” where indicated

Page 184: “…a light blast against them…but then I thought…” – add a space before “but then”

Page 184: Entry 13 requires multiple line divisions

Page 184: “Frankley, if I had been a Makuta…” – “Frankley” should be “Frankly

Page 184: “1…2…3…” – add spaces between the dots and numbers

Page 185: “your journey here was… eventful, Takanuva[.]” – add full stop where indicated

Page 185: “Then he is –-?” asked Pohatu – remove the second dash

Page 185: The beginning of Entry 17 is a useful addition, but the paragraph “Tahu wasted no time on welcoming me. He produced six fragments of stone and asked us all to read them. They contained, he said, the secret to awakening the Great Spirit. I really wished I could share in the moment… so close to achieving their destiny… but the time had come to tell what I knew” overlaps with other writing and should be removed

Page 186: “…it has changed color.” Kopaka said – replace full stop with comma

Page 186: “…he described it as a ‘golden mask.’ – turn the last quotation marks around

Page 186: Entry 18 is redundant

 

Page 187: “…not the best day the Toa Mahri ever had …” – remove the space between “had” and the three dots at the end

Page 187: “the arrogant one was the same” – “one” should be “tone

Page 187-188: “Paralyzed on a beach, about to be slain by Visorak or incinerated by lava? Is that the stuff of which legends are made? I think not. No, don’t bother looking around for me… not that you could, in your condition. I am not on Artidax, but somewhere far away. Still, my powers have increased, so I can see and speak to you just the same. Jaller, Jaller… Vakama had such hopes for you, and look at you now. As a Toa, you make a good statue. Of course, I should object to what you had planned for my Visorak… you and whoever set the volcano to erupt. But you didn’t know about that, did you? And it would be such a shame to miss “seeing” your expression when you find out the truth …” – all of this should be in italics

Page 188: “your expression when you find out the truth …” – remove the space between “truth” and the dots

Page 188: “Well ….” Vezon said – remove the space after “Well” and one of the dots (there’s 4 instead of 3)

 

Page 190: “…a rain of rubble on the assem-bled Makuta” – “assem-bled” should be “assembled

Page 191: “…peppering the Makuta with elemen-tal energy” – “elemen-tal” should be “elemental

Page 191: “Employing only a minor surge of power. he repaired the armor” – replace full stop with comma

Page 191: “I seem to remember fighting here. arguing” – replace full stop with comma

Page 192: “…six huge lightstones rose out of its sur-face” – “sur-face” should be “surface

Page 192: “…his ability to dis-guise his presence…” – “dis-guise” should be “disguise

Page 192: “As soon [as] his armored foot touched…” – add “as” where indicated

Page 192: “Tahu was more interested in the ring of light-stones” – “light-stones” should be “lightstones

Page 192: “…we may have been here before.” said Lewa – replace full stop with comma

Page 192-193: Entries 19-21 are redundant (even if you were to keep Entry 21, that one mistakenly claims that Lewa found the Axalara, even though it was Pohatu)

Page 193: “…a better plan than the cur-rent leader” – “cur-rent” should be “current

Page 193: “I expect us to act” – “us” should be in italics

Page 194: “The tip of his foreleg struck the field . . . and made it through!” – remove the spaces between the dots

Page 194: There should be a paragraph division b

Edited by Toatapio Nuva, May 20 2018 - 10:09 AM.

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#217 Offline TuragaNuva

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Posted May 23 2018 - 10:12 AM

Okay, MAJOR update time! Read on for details.
 

So, finally, I’ve gone through the entirety of book 8. I know it took quite a bit of time, so apologies for that. Anyway, there’s quite a bit of stuff to point about the book. I mostly like the order you put the different parts of the story in, but I have many major points on the structuring of the chapters.
 
The big point I have in general is that most of the chapters, especially in the latter half of the book, are way too long, to the point that it started to affect the reading experience. This is because at some point the chapters start to combine book chapters with chapters from multiple serials. It would be a lot better to have a separate chapter for each book/serial chapter in this compilation. At the very least, book chapters should be separated from serial chapters. Some of my points further down the line link to the issue I have with the length of the chapters, but this is the gist of it.
 
Then the more detailed feedback:
 
Introduction

Spoiler

 
The Mutran Chronicles
Spoiler

 
Federation of Fear
Spoiler

 
Shadows in the Sky & Swamp of Secrets + serials
Spoiler

 
The Final Battle + serials
Spoiler


Since doing this book took me so long, and book 9 will undoubtedly take much longer for various reasons, I think I'll post the feedback on that in chunks. Perhaps book-by-book and serial-by-serial style.

Thank you so much for all this feedback! It took me a few days, but I've fixed all of it (plus a few extra things, to boot). Some details:

  • Book 8 now has Standard and Complete versions, with the differences being the redundant Takanuva's Blog posts and the line from Makuta's Diary referencing events from the cancelled chapter book.
  • I decided to take your suggestion and remove the Entry headers from the Takanuva Blog posts, and I've extended this to the few entries in Book 9 as well.
  • I moved the passage about Teridax entering the Core Processor to just after the first chapter of Shadows in the Sky, which itself is now right after the Mutran Chronicles. I made a small edit to the Teridax passage to make this work (now refers to the Toa battling the Makuta "soon" rather than "right now").
  • I've split up most of the Book 8 chapters (the long ones are now roughly halved).

 

Here are the things you mentioned that I've left unchanged:

  • Journey of Takanuva placement: This was brought up previously (I want to say by Planetperson, but I'm not certain), and I'm standing firm on the canon placement. Takanuva's series of alternate universe journeys serve to show him the many ways in which good and evil aren't always obvious and clear-cut, and he's very clearly the most naive about that concept in Journey of Takanuva. It undercuts his entire character progression to put JoT after the others, since it makes it seem like he's learned nothing.
  • "their improvised booster": with the context of the rest of the sentence, the grammar is correct
  • "Teridax ordered part of the island": first item is proper grammar
  • readying himself for the prophesied: proper grammar
  • the trader smiled and invited: proper grammar
  • I would know what has gone on: proper grammar
  • his mask of power matched the description: decided to leave as-is
  • there would be no one to do what had to be done: proper grammar, as the event he's referring to might not happen
  • oh, by the way, have you met tall, green: since it technically doesn't contradict anything in the compilation, I'm leaving it
  • but now, Fate had sent her a Toa: decided to leave as-is
  • the Toa who had been granted that rarest: proper grammar
  • There were other statues, too,: proper grammar, though the sentence is confusing. They're statues "of Toa" which "Takanuva did not recognize"
  • but it did little to dispel the grief: decided to leave as-is
  • teleport the island off the shores of Metru Nui: correct, since "off the shores" refers to being in the water near the shore
  • Takanuva looked right into Tuyet's eyes: this is how it is in the Makuta's Guide to the Universe transcription
  • Tuyet smiled.: see above
  • using whatever extra equipment he'd had stored: proper grammar
  • in a way that obviously made Keetongu uneasy: decided to leave as-is
  • their old dream of overthrowing a great spirit: decided to leave as-is
  • who had given his life that mata nui might live: proper grammar
  • and they brushed aside Toa Nuva: decided to leave as-is
  • i had been to the places no one else had ever: decided to leave as-is
  • I have a feeling a really long trip: not in the original text
  • you had the whole order of mata nui: not in the original text
  • we do not envy you your journey or your destination: proper grammar
  • Rhotuka disk: decided to leave as-is, since a Rhotuka is vaguely disk-shaped
  • Kingdom italics: I don't have the original text to check
  • capitalized "Life": decided to leave as-is, as it's more significant than the standard elements
  • Final Battle introduction: I couldn't find anywhere that it fit naturally, since it's entirely recap. I might still try to squeeze it into the Complete version.
  • Additionally, there were some podcast transcription items you said to change that I either left as-is, or changed to be something between my original transcription and your suggestion. I've based my transcriptions entirely on what Greg's reading of the podcasts sounds like to me.

Everything that I haven't mentioned was fixed according to your suggestion.

 

Bonus compilation updates, unrelated to your feedback:

  • Mark Durham (author of the MNOG walkthrough) is now in the author credits across all books and versions (I also finally alphabetized the author credits)
  • Fixed a blank page in Book 7
  • Fixed some incorrectly-aligned text in Book 7

 
I think that covers everything. Again, thanks so much for your continued feedback! It's incredibly helpful.


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#218 Offline Toatapio Nuva

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Posted May 23 2018 - 12:46 PM

*sees that every single book and book version has been updated*

Me: *sigh* Time to download each book all over again...

:P

 

In all seriousness, all the books are looking better than ever, and especially book 8 is now a lot better than before. I especially love what you did with the part about Teridax entering the Core Processor, it fixes the problem I've always had with it being an epilogue to Shadows in the Sky!

 

Just to address a few things:

 

I would know what has gone on: proper grammar

 

I'm still a bit confused about what exactly that sentence is trying to convey. If Tren Krom intends to say that he knows what's going on in the universe, why would he want to scan the minds of Brutaka's group to learn about what's going on in the universe?

 

and they brushed aside Toa Nuva: decided to leave as-is

 

This one also puzzles me. Isn't it clearly supposed to have "the" before Toa Nuva?

 

we do not envy you your journey or your destination: proper grammar

 

Likewise, this doesn't strike me as proper grammar. Am I missing something here?

 

capitalized "Life": decided to leave as-is, as it's more significant than the standard elements

 

Fair enough, that makes sense. I hadn't thought of it that way.

 

Other comments:

- I'm really happy about the chapters being more split now, and it's certainly better already, but I think they could be spliced even more. For example with the Takanuva segments, each of them is longer than any of the serial chapters, justifying them being their own chapters. And there are still many chapters where the serial and book chapters are combined. Is there a particular reason for you to want to keep it that way? (like not creating too many chapters or something of the sort?) I do think that combining some of the serial chapters is reasonable, just that the book chapters should remain separate, being longer and representing the main story and all that

- Page 89 is blank

- On page 243, the line starting with "With that done, I set to work crafting the virus that would send Mata Nui into an unending sleep" should be indented, but isn't


Edited by Toatapio Nuva, May 23 2018 - 12:49 PM.

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#219 Offline TuragaNuva

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Posted May 23 2018 - 01:59 PM

*sees that every single book and book version has been updated*
Me: *sigh* Time to download each book all over again...
:P

Ha! Rest assured that it takes even longer for me to export all those PDFs from Word. I dread the changes that have to happen in every Book :P
 

In all seriousness, all the books are looking better than ever, and especially book 8 is now a lot better than before. I especially love what you did with the part about Teridax entering the Core Processor, it fixes the problem I've always had with it being an epilogue to Shadows in the Sky!

Thank you! I've been bothered by that for a long time as well; I was surprised when I went back to look at it and realized I could put it somewhere else by changing like 2 words.
 

Just to address a few things:
 

I would know what has gone on: proper grammar

 
I'm still a bit confused about what exactly that sentence is trying to convey. If Tren Krom intends to say that he knows what's going on in the universe, why would he want to scan the minds of Brutaka's group to learn about what's going on in the universe?

The phrasing Tren Krom uses can refer to requesting that the specified thing happen. Think of it as equivalent to him saying "I will know what has gone on", if that makes sense. It's not really used this way in common speech, but it is correct.
 

and they brushed aside Toa Nuva: decided to leave as-is

 
This one also puzzles me. Isn't it clearly supposed to have "the" before Toa Nuva?

Why does there need to be one? If he said "they brushed aside Matoran" or even "they brushed aside trees", it would work without "the" (and I think it sounds more like Teridax this way, personally).
 

we do not envy you your journey or your destination: proper grammar

 
Likewise, this doesn't strike me as proper grammar. Am I missing something here?

This is just a weird grammar thing. Basically, you could eliminate the "you" and it would mean the same thing. But it's still considered correct with the "you" there.
 

capitalized "Life": decided to leave as-is, as it's more significant than the standard elements

 
Fair enough, that makes sense. I hadn't thought of it that way.

I didn't mention this because I was writing down my notes pretty quickly, but I also left Life capitalized because it looks weirder lower-case (at least to me).
 

Other comments:
- I'm really happy about the chapters being more split now, and it's certainly better already, but I think they could be spliced even more. For example with the Takanuva segments, each of them is longer than any of the serial chapters, justifying them being their own chapters. And there are still many chapters where the serial and book chapters are combined. Is there a particular reason for you to want to keep it that way? (like not creating too many chapters or something of the sort?) I do think that combining some of the serial chapters is reasonable, just that the book chapters should remain separate, being longer and representing the main story and all that

This is fair, and I'll consider it. I prefer to keep the serial chapters bundled with other things into larger chapters, since they're relatively short (and to keep the overall chapter count from being crazy high (much higher and I'll have to start making more chapter number graphics :P)). But leaving the book chapters as their own chapters could work, at least for the most part.
 

- Page 89 is blank
- On page 243, the line starting with "With that done, I set to work crafting the virus that would send Mata Nui into an unending sleep" should be indented, but isn't

Fixed!

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#220 Offline Toatapio Nuva

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Posted May 24 2018 - 01:25 AM

 

Ha! Rest assured that it takes even longer for me to export all those PDFs from Word. I dread the changes that have to happen in every Book :P

 

I can imagine... I do feel kinda bad for you whenever I post my massive lists of corrections here haha. :guilty:

 

Ah, now I understand how the grammar in those few sentences work, thanks for the clarifications! It just took a moment for me to grasp what was going on in them. :P


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#221 Offline ArchAngelleofJustice

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Posted May 26 2018 - 03:35 AM

 

 

  • Book 8 now has Standard and Complete versions, with the differences being the redundant Takanuva's Blog posts and the line from Makuta's Diary referencing events from the cancelled chapter book.

 

YAY YAY YAY. Those were annoying.

 

Are you likely to do many more major edits to Book 8? I may make a personalized version that compiles the serials together for my own use.

 

Oh, and is anyone else having difficulty downloading Book 9? I've tried a few times but Google Drive keeps failing.


Edited by ArchAngelleofJustice, May 27 2018 - 12:13 AM.

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