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If Bionicle was a TV/book/film series for young adults/adults.


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#1 Offline Cee Matrix

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Posted Jan 16 2013 - 01:51 PM

What do you think would have been changed in the story. I think we would see a lot more romance in the movie.

I also think that we would see a lot more major character deaths, good and bad. 

I personally feel the Toa non-killing code should definitely be kept in as it creates a boundary to be over stepped.

What do you think would have been changed? 

 


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#2 Offline Dralcax

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Posted Jan 16 2013 - 04:34 PM

I feel the plot could have gotten more involved, leaving out the cheesy morals and cutting right to the plot twists. For example, 2003 would have been more like 2008, and so on. The "Mystery" of Metru Nui could have been a real mystery instead of some a treasure hunt for six powerful herbicides, basically. Matoro's sacrifice might have been darker, he could have tossed the mask into where it was supposed to go, saving Mata Nui's life, and then was crushed by Voya Nui instead of donning the mask and disappearing. Also, a tv show would have been epic, I always felt that was the one crucial piece missing from Bionicle, which might have stayed strong with a tv show drawing in new fans.


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#3 Offline Axilus Prime

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Posted Jan 16 2013 - 05:13 PM

It would have, done a certain way, been the epicness I so often envision. Of course, everyone is set-like, not this "humanicle" Karz I've seen spouted around the place. But there would have been no more awkward plot contrivances, and the action would be uncensored, let loose.

 

I'd actually prefer that the Code be removed, it's unrealistic and is sort of an excuse by Lego to make Toa without overstepping the "violence rule."

 

And definitely, more deaths. Plus many villains would have been personally killed by the heroes, and vice versa.

 

Though there are a lot of ways it could be done, and different people would want it a different way.


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#4 Offline Cee Matrix

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Posted Jan 16 2013 - 05:52 PM

It would have, done a certain way, been the epicness I so often envision. Of course, everyone is set-like, not this "humanicle" Karz I've seen spouted around the place. But there would have been no more awkward plot contrivances, and the action would be uncensored, let loose.

 

I'd actually prefer that the Code be removed, it's unrealistic and is sort of an excuse by Lego to make Toa without overstepping the "violence rule."

 

And definitely, more deaths. Plus many villains would have been personally killed by the heroes, and vice versa.

 

Though there are a lot of ways it could be done, and different people would want it a different way.

I like the Toa code. I think we could see a lot of Toa that dont follow it and let their feelings get in the way, like Jedi of starwars.


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#5 Offline Cratak

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Posted Jan 16 2013 - 08:37 PM

I think that much more detail would have gone into pretty much everything, with minor edits to various plot devices used throughout the series. Some things would be introduced or at least spotlighted more, such as romance, side stories, and minor characters. I would hope that some amount of it would go over real-world issues like morality, but sticking to the bascs of it. Also, I think they would extend the years into at least a movie/season/two books each. And make the ending better. :3

As stated above, I would keep things like Unity, Duty, and Destiny. That is what determines good and bad in the series. Of course, killing might be absolutely necessary at times, but I would hope that they'd try to stick to it. And it keeps the same villains around to be used later.


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#6 Offline Makuta Matata

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Posted Jan 16 2013 - 09:13 PM

They wouldn't have ended it so abruptly. 


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#7 Offline ~Shockwave~

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Posted Jan 16 2013 - 09:52 PM

see, the problem isn't that it was for kids, it's that it was written as a simpler story, rather than say, a book series.

I will site AtLA here, that is by far one of the best tv shows I have ever seen. And it was a kids show.

there are a few cases that bionicle almost reaches a point like this, but I think the main thing keeping it from that is the fact that it's a toy line.

 

I really hate how a lot of people seem to think that romance and violence automatically make a better story. 

Though, to be perfectly fair, I kind of hate anything romantic, so maybe that's just me.


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#8 Offline Captain Caboose

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Posted Jan 16 2013 - 09:55 PM

Sure I can see that a bit, that way they could attract a more bigger audience.


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#9 Offline Cratak

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Posted Jan 16 2013 - 09:59 PM

I really hate how a lot of people seem to think that romance and violence automatically make a better story. 

Though, to be perfectly fair, I kind of hate anything romantic, so maybe that's just me.

 

It's definately not just you. I prefer not to have much romance, if any, in films, but it is unfortunately inevitable for something of this nature aimed toward a(n) young adult/adult audience.


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#10 Offline Axilus Prime

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Posted Jan 16 2013 - 10:08 PM

Yeah, I'm not a fan of romance stories either.

 

And definitely keep the Three Virtues. But seriously, it would be illogical to not kill all those villains. Self-defense, the fact that the story is enough to qualify as a war (and was referred to as such by Vakama in MoL), and it would be impossible to imprison them all. Plus most of the villains could easily break out of any prison built by the heroes, and an ultimate prison built by Artahka or something would be such a huge cop-out.


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#11 Offline ~Shockwave~

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Posted Jan 16 2013 - 10:35 PM

Yeah, I'm not a fan of romance stories either.

 

And definitely keep the Three Virtues. But seriously, it would be illogical to not kill all those villains. Self-defense, the fact that the story is enough to qualify as a war (and was referred to as such by Vakama in MoL), and it would be impossible to imprison them all. Plus most of the villains could easily break out of any prison built by the heroes, and an ultimate prison built by Artahka or something would be such a huge cop-out.

and now we have the question of morality. If in fact is a war and you are on an open battle field, than yeah, off 'em. but outside of that scenario the lines between right and wrong start blurring. so many views can be substituted. (but I would tend to agree with you.) 

 

And I'm glad I'm not alone with my ill feelings toward romance. I thought it was just my awful luck with anything to do with that... ... .. yeah...


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#12 Offline Axilus Prime

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Posted Jan 17 2013 - 12:30 AM

Oh, trust me, I've had terrible luck there too. I just never really try too hard because it doesn't get to me, so yeah.

 

I believe, both in real life and fiction that the act of killing is not wrong in itself, but rather who and why determines whether or not it is good. It can be a great and heroic deed when directed against certain people, and is a horrible evil when directed against innocents.

 

I think they can rip the heads off the Dark Hunters/Visorak and their leaders/Piraka/Barraki/Makuta/Skrall/Just About Anything Evil, optionally with getting a kick out of it, but of course shouldn't kill or maim the enslaved Matoran created by the Piraka Zamors, Krana/Infected Mask-controlled people, or Just About Anything Forced.

 

Well, killing nonsentients such as Bohrok and Vahki is of course even easier than killing the sentient villains, but both villain classes should be killed with equal speed and not a shred of hesitation.

 

Horrifying sadistic torture, on the other hand, is something I don't think they should go around doing.


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#13 Offline Flex Till Death

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Posted Jan 17 2013 - 01:02 AM

It would of been darker, and more action, and yeah probably romance. I'd love to see Bionicle if Bionicle ever returns if they come out with a show. It could be like Ninjago but so, so much better. It can't be too much more expensive to create a 3D Bionicle show as it is to make that show. If the show was a bit like the Star Wars one on Cartoon Network, which had pretty good action and whatnot, I think it could of been really cool and bring in a lot of new and old fans.


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#14 Offline Cee Matrix

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Posted Jan 17 2013 - 04:05 AM

As for romance, I dont mean lovey dovey, but I think there should be something like that.


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#15 Offline toa kopaka4372

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Posted Jan 17 2013 - 07:06 AM

I don't think it'd be much different. BIONICLE was violent and dark enough, really, and if you factor in the Alt. dimensions, has an abnormally high death count that few other series have. The story team paid attention to the most minor details and foreshadowed almost everything very well, making the story amongst the most complex I've seen, so it was definitely not too simple. 

 

As for the Toa Code, I thought that provided a very interesting moral conflict with the methods of the Order of Mata Nui, who did not hesitate to kill whoever they needed to kill, so I would not remove that.

 

I guess there might be more romance and few parts of the earlier years edited, but not too much would be different IMO.


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#16 Offline Lyichir

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Posted Jan 17 2013 - 08:12 AM

They wouldn't have ended it so abruptly. 

Yeah! No movies, books or TV series for young adults get ended abruptly! Just look at Twin Peaks, The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy, My Name is Earl, or The Sarah Connor Chronicles!

 

Maybe if it were a book series only it wouldn't be as likely end abruptly. But movie series and TV series get ended abruptly all the time, often with even less of a resolution than what Bionicle got.


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#17 Offline Podu

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Posted Jan 17 2013 - 08:22 AM

The only thing I would change is to not add dozens of characters into the story every year, and focus on characterization on individuals.


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#18 Offline -Jaller-

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Posted Jan 18 2013 - 12:03 AM

The story would deffinatly have more action to it, but at the same token, more deaths as well. the Hunters would probly be more orginized, and there would possibly be some romance in the story to. That show would be kind of interesting!


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#19 Offline Cee Matrix

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Posted Jan 18 2013 - 05:21 PM

The only thing I would change is to not add dozens of characters into the story every year, and focus on characterization on individuals.

YES!

Maybe have a few seasons with one Toa Team before moving onto the next.


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#20 Offline Ghabulous Ghoti

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Posted Jan 20 2013 - 09:08 PM

I could see it being darker and a bit more violent, but romance? Maybe as a side thing, and only if it didn't come out cheesy and stupid.

 

Also, remove the stupid things in the story, like the Kaita.


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#21 Offline TheSkeletonMan939

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Posted Jan 20 2013 - 10:01 PM

The problem is that without the toys selling like hot cakes, the story would never have taken off. No young adult would have wanted to read a book about robots.


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#22 Offline Cratak

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Posted Jan 20 2013 - 10:12 PM

No young adult would have wanted to read a book about robots.

 

*cough*Transformers*cough*


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#23 Offline TheSkeletonMan939

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Posted Jan 21 2013 - 07:16 AM

No young adult would have wanted to read a book about robots.

 

*cough*Transformers*cough*

But there are humans in that.

 

Megan Fox in in that, specifically.


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#24 Offline VeoiTheRascal

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Posted Jan 21 2013 - 12:16 PM

No young adult would have wanted to read a book about robots.

 

*cough*Transformers*cough*

But there are humans in that.

 

Megan Fox in in that, specifically.

 

Be that as it may, before the Bayformer movies? Yah, there was still a HUGE fanbase. And I will tell you a large chunk of them did NOT care for reading about the humans in their Transformers comic.

 

I don't think the lack of humans is the problem with Bionicle either.


Edited by VeoiTheRascal, Jan 21 2013 - 12:18 PM.

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#25 Offline Axilus Prime

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Posted Jan 21 2013 - 10:12 PM

Yeah, robots are actually a 'cool' subject for most young adults into 'epic' fiction.

 

 

 

I could see it being darker and a bit more violent, but romance? Maybe as a side thing, and only if it didn't come out cheesy and stupid.

 

Also, remove the stupid things in the story, like the Kaita.

Romance is kind of...overdone these days. But are you joking? The Kaita were epic! It could only be done in a TV show or movie properly if there was a cool combination sequence (and a better design more like the Nuva Kaita than the originals) kind of like what we see in the Transformers movies.


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#26 Offline Ghabulous Ghoti

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Posted Jan 21 2013 - 10:31 PM

Yeah, robots are actually a 'cool' subject for most young adults into 'epic' fiction.

 

 

 

I could see it being darker and a bit more violent, but romance? Maybe as a side thing, and only if it didn't come out cheesy and stupid.

 

Also, remove the stupid things in the story, like the Kaita.

Romance is kind of...overdone these days. But are you joking? The Kaita were epic! It could only be done in a TV show or movie properly if there was a cool combination sequence (and a better design more like the Nuva Kaita than the originals) kind of like what we see in the Transformers movies.

I thought it made the characters seem a bit too robotic :/


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#27 Offline Axilus Prime

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Posted Jan 22 2013 - 04:24 AM

Well, Greg said they're 85% robotic, 15% organic. I think that fits.


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#28 Offline Ptah

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Posted Jan 22 2013 - 09:15 AM

As I read the question, you see the storylines given as children's fiction and wonder what it would look like if it were geared for Young Adult that age range between 10 and 17.

 

More death and love aren't required in fact on death we got the right amount to satisfy even YA appetites.  In YA, a singular death carries more meaning than a string of dead bodies.  In the storyline, we got Toa Lhikan, Jala (temporarily), Matoro (permanently) deaths that leave their mark on the fictional world and on the readers.

 

I think if the Bionicle storyline was written now, without the need to contort and fold at odd angles to fit the next series of toys coming out, then more drama can come through.  Like the Toa Metru working to clear their name is a strong YA theme.  If it didn't get cut short for the upcoming line of Visorak/Hordika, that story could have played out to greater effect.

 

Bionicle straddled that border between kiddie lit and YA.  The young adult elements are there if you have a solid hankering for them.


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#29 Offline Toa Zaz

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Posted Jan 22 2013 - 12:12 PM

It'd probably be like Transformers.


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#30 Offline Lyichir

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Posted Jan 22 2013 - 12:24 PM

Everyone keeps bringing up Transformers as an example of how a mythology-laden story about robots can appeal to adults and young adults on its own, ignoring the fact that by and large, Transformers is a toy for kids just like Bionicle. Yeah, the Michael Bay movies were aimed less at kids. But two types of people watched those: people who would have watched any movie with a requisite number of explosions, and people who were or had been fans of the kids' cartoon or toy series. In other words, they didn't arise in a vacuum as this question postulates, but in fact may not have enjoyed the same sort of success had it not been for the franchise's roots as a toyline. I doubt an adult incarnation of Bionicle would be able to take off without the precedent set by the kid-focused origins of the series.


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Posted Jan 23 2013 - 11:27 AM

It would of been darker, and more action, and yeah probably romance. I'd love to see Bionicle if Bionicle ever returns if they come out with a show. It could be like Ninjago but so, so much better. It can't be too much more expensive to create a 3D Bionicle show as it is to make that show. If the show was a bit like the Star Wars one on Cartoon Network, which had pretty good action and whatnot, I think it could of been really cool and bring in a lot of new and old fans.

Bionicle growed much darker after 2010 when the toyline ended, as you can notice in the serials like the Powers that Be and Yesterday Quest, and it's good because after bionicle started, there were many little kids who liked bionicle(like me) but now in 2013, bionicle fans that have been fans in a long time have grown up so much that the darker story fits better, with darker i mean this with the murder of Tren Krom and Karzahni and the fortress with the great being(you don't know what will happen to the guys inside) and etc etc etc


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#32 Offline Paleo

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Posted Jan 23 2013 - 10:06 PM

Quite a few things would need to be changed .

I've compiled a list :P

(BTW, I'm basing this on a possible TV series)

 

1. Sleeker, more human designs: Characters would have to look the part of a biomechanical being, with a more proportionally human figure.

2. Change setting: This may sound a bit drastic, but it really isn't. There would just need to be more of a sci fi element to the story. Not as much open wilderness, and more integration with Metru-Nui style technology.

3. Villians: They'd have to be MUCH creepier. Rahkshi: go all out. Spines, poison, tongues, jawless maws, everything. Same with Visorak and Barraki.

4. Powers: Less of a focus on elemental powers. Possibly even replace them with less close-to-omnipotent powers, even possibly just their mask powers ('cus I mean, judging by the theories in this forum, most Toa are super-powered).

5. Phasers: To make up for fewer powers, and to add some thrill of a fire-fight, add phasers you can set to stun.

6. More mature jokes: Bionicle has some pretty lame jokes. You'd need to make 'em mature to appeal to a more adult audience.

7. Romance: This is pretty much a requirement for a young adult or adult audience. No romance = no interest.

 

I'm probably missing quite a bit, but Bionicle would have to change quite a bit to fit into a TV series that would appeal to adults (however, I would LOVE to watch it).


Edited by Paleo, Jan 23 2013 - 10:08 PM.

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#33 Offline Wazdakka

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Posted Jan 24 2013 - 01:33 PM

Moar elemental powers. Also, mostly what Paleo said. 


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#34 Offline Neelh

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Posted Jan 26 2013 - 07:21 AM

On the subject of romance, I believe that allowing the original pairings that would have become canon if not for the retconning that took place when it was revealed that there was no romance in the MU would have been enough.


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#35 Offline Cee Matrix

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Posted Jan 26 2013 - 07:51 AM

On the subject of romance, I believe that allowing the original pairings that would have become canon if not for the retconning that took place when it was revealed that there was no romance in the MU would have been enough.

Well yeah, although I also think there would have been more elements that were girls, or make elements non-gender specific. As well all know the only reason why there was only one girl in a set becuase girls never sold as well for some reason.


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#36 Offline Neelh

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Posted Jan 26 2013 - 08:24 AM

On the subject of romance, I believe that allowing the original pairings that would have become canon if not for the retconning that took place when it was revealed that there was no romance in the MU would have been enough.

Well yeah, although I also think there would have been more elements that were girls, or make elements non-gender specific. As well all know the only reason why there was only one girl in a set becuase girls never sold as well for some reason.

I'd have bought so many more Bionicle sets if they weren't gender-specific. However, that is off-topic. I do agree that Bionicle would, if it was a YA series, be improved with more gender equality.


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#37 Offline Jedi Knight Krazy

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Posted Jan 26 2013 - 10:11 AM

On the Toa Code: Keep it - although Toa should break it from time to time. But it should be a big deal when they do.

 

Keep the morals, Three Virtues, etc. We need more stories of good vs. evil. There's too much grey-moral stuff already in the YA genres.

 

Add some humans. This should be carefully balanced, because the whole cool thing about Bionicle is that the main characters are bio-mechanical. The easiest route would be to make the Great Beings human and give them a more active role in the story.

 

We'd need some romance to make the characters less robotic, but Bionicle is still primarily an action series. We don't need Twilight: Bionicle Edition. Along the same lines, gender rules for the Matoran elements should be removed.

 

Keep the island setting as long as possible. One of the great things about Bionicle was the dissonance between the tribal setting (in the early years), the mythology, and the fact that the characters were bio-mechanical. The introduction to Metru Nui and other more sci-fi stuff, which is necessary for the plot to advance, should be done gradually and delicately. More like LOST, where you knew about halfway through the first season that there was some technology behind all of this mystery, and it gradually introduced more sci-fi from there.

 

I apologize for any and all rambling and incoherent trains of thought, I'm not quite awake yet today...


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#38 Offline Grandmaster Lehvorak

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Posted Jan 26 2013 - 01:39 PM

[color=#000080;]There is going to be more violence possibly, but I can see it as a fantasy, sci-fi, and adventure thing. Well, there boundaries that must be broken, and I bet we see some of them in the fan fictions sometimes.[/color]

 

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#39 Offline Ghabulous Ghoti

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Posted Jan 27 2013 - 12:23 AM

Add some humans. This should be carefully balanced, because the whole cool thing about Bionicle is that the main characters are bio-mechanical. The easiest route would be to make the Great Beings human and give them a more active role in the story.

While I love the idea of making them human, I don't want them to have any more role than they did in the actually BIONICLE saga in this hypothetical series.

Do you guys think LEGO would respond positively to something like this more mature series?


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#40 Offline Cee Matrix

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Posted Jan 27 2013 - 05:49 AM

Add some humans. This should be carefully balanced, because the whole cool thing about Bionicle is that the main characters are bio-mechanical. The easiest route would be to make the Great Beings human and give them a more active role in the story.

While I love the idea of making them human, I don't want them to have any more role than they did in the actually BIONICLE saga in this hypothetical series.

Do you guys think LEGO would respond positively to something like this more mature series?

If I understand you correctly, Lego wouldnt need to be involved. This would just be some guy writing the story of Bionicle as a book/fiml/TV series for the adult audience.


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