Is there a way to add complexity to HF builds without adding Technic?

[fishers64]

If so, what do you think it is?

[>_<]

Hmm, it'd most likely involve exploiting several loopholes within HF's building system, by combining parts together that were never meant to be used together (perhaps combining elements from the different series?), after all, that produced a lot of rather interesting MOCs for Bionicle as well.

Oh, and just generally increasing the size a lot, so the previously big pieces become relatively tiny, enabling you to use them to create more detail instead of their default function of making a toy consisting out of about 5 parts.

[Sumiki]

I'm sure that the HF build will continue to change as the line ages, just as BIONICLE did. Designs change a lot over time - just compare the two Toa Nuva waves, just five years apart. Lines undergo massive (but gradual) changes to keep them interesting and to generate sales.Hero Factory has found its own distinct style, but compared to the first wave, they're hardly recognizable. The longer the line continues, the more and more it will change. Will this necessarily add complexity to the fold? I don't know. (I've followed HF very, very little, but it seems to me that the sets are getting a bit simpler - or, at least, staying at the same amount of complexity.)I think people often forget that Hero Factory is aimed at a slightly younger audience than BIONICLE was. BIONICLE had a bit more room for introducing complexity due to this. I'm not ruling out an increase in set complexity with Hero Factory in the coming years, but I think it's unlikely.

[AdaptingChaos]

If there was a to do so, Id do it

[Dual Cee]

Why would you not want to use technic?Basicle with HeroFactory it's all the same, the bigger the better.

[Hitoshura]

My guess: Maybe not, because for the (more) complicated Bionicle bodies they use pretty much Technic. Hero Factory's bodies are only like 2-3 large pieces. For the legs, maybe, you might have to add "pins", arms, probably the same as the legs.

[Van Hohenheim]

by technic, what do you mean? if you don't mean previous bionicle pieces, then scrap the regular torso armor and build your own. I did that, in fact, and my MOC feels better. it also has moving parts that can be positioned in different ways. a bit of advice: if you use a Malum lower-leg part for anywhere on the body, then use a Phantoka connector (one that connected the Matoran to the Toa) in conjunction with the Hahli upper armor piece, it will make nice looking armor for a piece that usually doesn't have armor. also, stay to the basic torso skeleton. trust me, it will help a lot.

[fishers64]

Why would you not want to use technic?

Me? Technic is a bit more complex than I like, and easier to make mistakes with.

 

But that's not why I asked the title question. I asked it because I had heard some complaints about HF builds being boring and not complicated enough. Technic seems to be the number one way to add complications, but it seems to be the villain for being too complicated.

 

Also, just sheer curiosity.

 

by technic, what do you mean? if you don't mean previous bionicle pieces, then scrap the regular torso armor and build your own. I did that, in fact, and my MOC feels better. it also has moving parts that can be positioned in different ways. a bit of advice: if you use a Malum lower-leg part for anywhere on the body, then use a Phantoka connector (one that connected the Matoran to the Toa) in conjunction with the Hahli upper armor piece, it will make nice looking armor for a piece that usually doesn't have armor. also, stay to the basic torso skeleton. trust me, it will help a lot.

 

This Technic:

 

 

But seriously, thanks for the MoCing advice. If I can find a Phantoka connector and a Mallum lower leg part, I will take that into consideration.

[Dralcax]

Personally, the easiest way for me is making a big convoluted skeleton and covering it with armor. Just grab a ton of pieces, with plenty of HF torsos and double sockets, and start clicking stuff together until it starts looking like what you want.

[fishers64]

Does anyone know which sets double sockets come in, if at all? I seem to be lacking those, and I would find them extremely valuable.

[Hitoshura]

Does anyone know which sets double sockets come in, if at all? I seem to be lacking those, and I would find them extremely valuable.

Bionicle? Or Hero Factory? I'm guessing it's the latter, but I'm just asking to be sure.

[Makuta of Time]

Well one, it will be hard to make a complex build without technic. You need something to give it support and stability at the same time. Rocka XL had Technic parts, and he was complex. Furno XL had Technic parts, and he was a bit complex, but if you want to make something big. You might as well put technic parts in it.

[Van Hohenheim]

Does anyone know which sets double sockets come in, if at all? I seem to be lacking those, and I would find them extremely valuable.

let's see...I know for a fact that Drill Dozer had one. there was another, I think, since I have two, but I can't remember the other one.

[fishers64]

 

Does anyone know which sets double sockets come in, if at all? I seem to be lacking those, and I would find them extremely valuable.

Bionicle? Or Hero Factory? I'm guessing it's the latter, but I'm just asking to be sure.

 

Either works. I actually would prefer Bionicle at the moment - I have enough HF for now.

[Hitoshura]

 

 

Does anyone know which sets double sockets come in, if at all? I seem to be lacking those, and I would find them extremely valuable.

Bionicle? Or Hero Factory? I'm guessing it's the latter, but I'm just asking to be sure.

Either works. I actually would prefer Bionicle at the moment - I have enough HF for now.

For the small ones: Toa Metru, Vahki, Toa Hordika, Piraka, and a bunch of other setsFor the big ones: Visorak, Toa Inika, Toa Mahri, Phantoka/Mistika, just to name a few.

[fishers64]

 

 

 

Does anyone know which sets double sockets come in, if at all? I seem to be lacking those, and I would find them extremely valuable.

Bionicle? Or Hero Factory? I'm guessing it's the latter, but I'm just asking to be sure.

Either works. I actually would prefer Bionicle at the moment - I have enough HF for now.

For the small ones: Toa Metru, Vahki, Toa Hordika, Piraka, and a bunch of other setsFor the big ones: Visorak, Toa Inika, Toa Mahri, Phantoka/Mistika, just to name a few.

 

Thanks. I will keep that in mind.

[Hitoshura]

I just remembered that the Barraki, most titan sets, and most Glatorian sets also have them.

[Klanadack]

I wouldn't know... I only have one post 2010 HF set... But there probably is some way.

[Van Hohenheim]

wait, double sockets? nearly every set has them post 2006.

[Hitoshura]

Correction: post-2004.

[Van Hohenheim]

Correction: post-2004.

forgot about those when you say Double-Socket, I usually think arms instead of legs

[fishers64]

Except for the HF I have, apparently. Do any of you all think that HF builds could be more complex (and/or improved) if there were more double sockets included/used?

Edited March 14, 2013 by fishers64

[Hitoshura]

IMO obviously. I looked at the 1.0 sets and the legs were like one piece inside another. If they had those then the legs could bend at the knees more easily and maybe add some(hopefully) new armor on there.

[Van Hohenheim]

Except for the HF I have, apparently. Do any of you all think that HF builds could be more complex (and/or improved) if there were more double sockets included/used?

in my opinion, yes. the center-ball combined with the double sockets could allow for bionicle limbs while retaining the Hero Factory armor pieces that are all the rage nowadays.

[Aanchir]

Well, it depends on what you mean by "without adding Technic". Most complex Hero Factory builds use some Technic, but then, so do a lot of complex System builds. The building system is designed so that Technic is able to supplement it-- otherwise Technic connection points would be omitted on a lot of parts that don't normally use them, like 6M beams.A good example of a set that has a certain amount of complexity without an overrreliance on Technic is Scorpio. I'm not fond of the Scorpio set due to the inconsistent design of its legs, but its torso build uses multiple default torso beams joined together in creative ways into a sturdy structure. But even it uses a few Technic parts to space the torso beams apart.As for MOCs that have a great deal of complexity without an overreliance on Technic, look no further than this MOC by BIONICLE and Hero Factory set design veteran Christoffer Raundahl. Its legs and feet are very complex, for instance, but fewer than half of their parts are Technic parts. The Hero Factory building system is still the foundation of the entire build; Technic is just as supplementary as it would be in an official Hero Factory set.Now, a complex Hero Factory model without ANY Technic? It could be done, certainly, but I don't see what the point would be other than as a somewhat excessive self-imposed challenge. Even basic Hero Factory sets don't shy from using basic Technic parts like pins or connectors.

Edited April 2, 2013 by Aanchir: Rachira of Time

[TechnicRage]

No. Not without making it look overweight.

[Lyichir]

It depends on what sort of builds we're talking. Norbert Labuguen (don't know if he has an account here) is a builder I've met at Brickfair who makes sizeable MOCs using the Hero Factory system. These range from masks or costumes which use the system as a framework to large-scale models of alien or prehistoric life forms. Very few of his MOCs are humanoid figures like you typically see in Hero Factory sets, but they nonetheless show the potential of the Hero Factory system for building at a larger scale.

[Aanchir]

No. Not without making it look overweight.

I disagree. You could just as easily look at a bunch of BIONICLE MOCs and suggest you can't make them complex without having mismatched armor pieces sticking off at all kinds of odd angles. Just because it's not necessarily easy to make a Hero Factory MOC complex without it becoming overweight doesn't mean that it can't be done.Here's a Hero Factory MOC of mine with a reasonably complex torso build, and I don't think anyone could argue she looks overweight. Here's another of mine who, yes, has a bit of roundness to her, but is far from overweight. I'm sure several MOCists could find even more elegant solutions for adding complexity to Hero Factory MOCs without adding unnecessary weight. Though to be honest, given some of the MOCs and sets I've heard called fat or overweight in the BIONICLE and Hero Factory fan community, I worry that some people have forgotten just what that means.

[TechnicRage]

 

No. Not without making it look overweight.

I disagree. You could just as easily look at a bunch of BIONICLE MOCs and suggest you can't make them complex without having mismatched armor pieces sticking off at all kinds of odd angles. Just because it's not necessarily easy to make a Hero Factory MOC complex without it becoming overweight doesn't mean that it can't be done.Here's a Hero Factory MOC of mine with a reasonably complex torso build, and I don't think anyone could argue she looks overweight. Here's another of mine who, yes, has a bit of roundness to her, but is far from overweight. I'm sure several MOCists could find even more elegant solutions for adding complexity to Hero Factory MOCs without adding unnecessary weight. Though to be honest, given some of the MOCs and sets I've heard called fat or overweight in the BIONICLE and Hero Factory fan community, I worry that some people have forgotten just what that means.

Well, I was trying to avoid using the term fat. As far as I have seen, which is just the sets, they look, well, rounded. But that's just my opinion.

[BioClay]

there should be a way to add the chest armor on the back aswell without the need of a weird looking body

[Aanchir]

there should be a way to add the chest armor on the back aswell without the need of a weird looking body

Personally, I think some of the best models use separate pieces for back armor than the ones they use for chest armor. The shield piece from the 2.0 hero sets is a popular one, but there are plenty of other options including certain foot pieces and other flat detail elements. And of course if you build at a larger scale than the scale defined by the basic torso beams, there aren't nearly as many limitations on the number of connection points available for armoring the back.

[Sybre]

There's a number of ways this could happen, but none I could think of.

[Ziontyro Metalhead]

The easy way is to make the frames huge. It's really hard to make complex ones without adding other types of pieces.