Most OP Villains?

[LewaLew]

That makes me wonder if he thought someone might be eavesdropping. Maybe they'd planned before ever stepping foot in Karda Nui to speak as if they wanted to kill the Toa and never let on otherwise just in case a spy might report the content of their internal meetings to the Toa.

Why would he think that, though. Both sides were regrouping at the time, and after Kirop was so easily fooled by the Toa Nuva, I'm sure they were careful not to let any Matoran near the meeting.

 

Unfortunately, I think if GregF were to be asked about this, he'd probably just say he couldn't remember. I think it was either to throw off the reader, or GregF forgot what the Makuta's priorities would have been when he was writing it.

 

If it was intentional though, and the Makuta had ensured that only Brotherhood members were present, why would he have said that, and why would Vamprah have been trying to kill Lewa?

 

As for Icarax, it's quite obvious why he attacked Ignika. He thought it was simply a toa wearing the mask, not the mask itself with the body of a toa. In that case, Ignika far overpowered the villains, but I'm more or less talking about the Toa Nuva than Ignika. Icarax already knew he could defeat the Toa Nuva one-on-six, and he had no reason to hold back. If self-preservation was his reason, then why didn't he just fly back to Destral? I see no reason why Icarax would have held back any of his powers, and I'm certain a Makuta like him would have had no problem fighting through the pain of Ignika's curse. At most, it was just a minor hindrance, unlike the Phantoka Makuta's blindness. He still had all of his powers short of shapeshifting, and he could see. Forty-one options at his disposal, and yet he never actually accomplished any major feat when in karda Nui.

[bonesiii]

Well, the population of Karda Nui can change their colors at will. In the Expanded Multiverse we have a character who's skilled at doing this so well he can camouflage himself (and could then be an effective spy). Even without great texturing, just making yourself a blanket rock-gray could work. Plus Av-Matoran are small so might be hard to spot. So what I meant is more that they may have prepared this as a strategy before coming in just as a caution.

 

They would not have needed to speak of the real mission once inside. They were all well aware prior to going in and surely met at least once before that, so it's plausible.

 

Or as Maxwell Smart would say, "The old 'plan a fake meeting after the real meeting' trick."

 

As for whether Greg would remember, wouldn't hurt to ask (except timewise and the like but hey).

 

Re: Icarax, was there any major feat TO accomplish? I mean, if you don't count the actual reason they're in there, which I'd say is pretty major -- succeeding in fooling the Toa into thinking they're opposing the awakening so they do it anyways. It still kinda seems like you might be downplaying the importance of this and expecting side goals that might actually hurt this, like killing Toa... But this is the only reason any of them were there.

[LewaLew]

Re: Icarax, was there any major feat TO accomplish? I mean, if you don't count the actual reason they're in there, which I'd say is pretty major -- succeeding in fooling the Toa into thinking they're opposing the awakening so they do it anyways. It still kinda seems like you might be downplaying the importance of this and expecting side goals that might actually hurt this, like killing Toa... But this is the only reason any of them were there.

Not for the Brotherhood, but for Icarax, sure. He didn't come to help the plan, he came to chew bubblegum and kick posterior. Yet no bubblegum was chewed nor posteriors kicked. By Icarax, anyway, though he had all the means and the motive to do so.

 

Come to think of it, Icarax never actually even fought the Toa Nuva in Karda Nui, unless Ignika was there with them. He died when fighting the other Makuta.

 

Oh, and he also had another reason for being down there, if you remember his conversation with Krika. He actually wanted to stop the Plan also. Which is another reason for him to kill one of the Toa Nuva.

[bonesiii]

What was the timing of that conversation? Was that later? See, I think he set out to do just that when he attacked the Ignika and then was humbled a bit -- talked big later (if I'm remembering the timing right which I'm probably not lol) but didn't really mean it because he was actually humbled by the Ignika thing (but too proud to admit it). Seems consistent with the judgment of "unstable" to me. I dunno, you do raise good points, just seems well within his personality.

 

Also, probably he was hoping Krika would get onboard and they could convince others. I looked up the exact number of when he chose a side at the Convocation and it was actually dead last. He's not a take-initiative kind of guy. Sure, he runs his mouth and occasionally tries something brash, but I don't think he has much motivation behind it.

[LewaLew]

What was the timing of that conversation? Was that later? See, I think he set out to do just that when he attacked the Ignika and then was humbled a bit -- talked big later (if I'm remembering the timing right which I'm probably not lol) but didn't really mean it because he was actually humbled by the Ignika thing (but too proud to admit it). Seems consistent with the judgment of "unstable" to me. I dunno, you do raise good points, just seems well within his personality.

 

Also, probably he was hoping Krika would get onboard and they could convince others. I looked up the exact number of when he chose a side at the Convocation and it was actually dead last. He's not a take-initiative kind of guy. Sure, he runs his mouth and occasionally tries something brash, but I don't think he has much motivation behind it.

He did think he could take on Ignika, but from the way the conversation was going, it sounded as if they just thought it was a regular Toa wearing the mask. Now still, that's formidable, but Teridax had gone one-on-one with a Toa wearing a Legendary Mask before and had only lost because the other Toa Metru showed up and locked him up with a Toa Seal. Icarax afterwards had a reason to fear Ignika, but not the Toa Nuva.

 

The conversation amongst the Makuta took place immediately before the last fight in the sky.

 

He generally does play it safe, but if he didn't stop the plan then, he wasn't going to stop it at all. And he did get Krika to his side, that's why Krika tried to penetrate the Codrex's barrier. When he was discovered, Icarax tried to teleport to stop the Toa Nuva, but Vamprah disrupted his power and killed him. That's what I read on BS01, anyway, I have to pull out The Final Battle sometime soon.

[Makuta Matata]

The Makuta in general. They have all 42 Rahkshi powers as well as shadow. That's a bit unfair, if you ask me.

[slifer3000]

No such thing as unfair when it's the bad guys.

[Baron Von Nebula]

That time where Brutaka knocked out all 6 Toa Nuva and the entire Voya Nui Resistance Team with one strike. Somehow.

[boston100]

Definatly the piraka. I mean Zaktan and Reidak were almost invinsible, also the had those crazy powers like bringing mountains 2 life or stealing other peoples power. When thok and hakaan stole Brutaka's power that was deffinatly one of my favourite moments in the whole Bionicle story line. ALso the way the destroyed the toa nuva like they were just destractions was so awsome. Looking back i wish that Lego had explored their sadistic nature a bit more. We got glimses of it but Bionicle was a kids toy line so i guess they couldent do it 2 much.

[Scanty Demon]

The Makuta in general. They have all 42 Rahkshi powers as well as shadow. That's a bit unfair, if you ask me.

 

^this^ Plus they were my favorite species now they're just annoying and leaves me wondering why they didn't take over the universe earlier.

No such thing as unfair when it's the bad guys.

At that point they just become annoying.

Edited June 8, 2013 by Scanty Demon

[LewaLew]

 

The Makuta in general. They have all 42 Rahkshi powers as well as shadow. That's a bit unfair, if you ask me.

 

^this^ Plus they were my favorite species now they're just annoying and leaves me wondering why they didn't take over the universe earlier.

That's exactly what Icarax was wondering.

 

And what I was wondering about Icarax. Although I don't think the Makuta were made cheap.by the Karda Nui Story.

[Makuta Matata]

 

 

The Makuta in general. They have all 42 Rahkshi powers as well as shadow. That's a bit unfair, if you ask me.

 

^this^ Plus they were my favorite species now they're just annoying and leaves me wondering why they didn't take over the universe earlier.

That's exactly what Icarax was wondering.

 

And what I was wondering about Icarax. Although I don't think the Makuta were made cheap.by the Karda Nui Story.

Yeah, the Karda Nui story evened out the odds between the Makuta and Toa Nuva.

[LewaLew]

 

 

 

The Makuta in general. They have all 42 Rahkshi powers as well as shadow. That's a bit unfair, if you ask me.

 

^this^ Plus they were my favorite species now they're just annoying and leaves me wondering why they didn't take over the universe earlier.

That's exactly what Icarax was wondering.

 

And what I was wondering about Icarax. Although I don't think the Makuta were made cheap.by the Karda Nui Story.

Yeah, the Karda Nui story evened out the odds between the Makuta and Toa Nuva.

That, and the Toa Nuva had Ignika. Who overpowers everybody.

 

Too bad he didn't know what he was doing half the time.

[Makuta Matata]

 

 

 

 

The Makuta in general. They have all 42 Rahkshi powers as well as shadow. That's a bit unfair, if you ask me.

 

^this^ Plus they were my favorite species now they're just annoying and leaves me wondering why they didn't take over the universe earlier.

That's exactly what Icarax was wondering.

 

And what I was wondering about Icarax. Although I don't think the Makuta were made cheap.by the Karda Nui Story.

Yeah, the Karda Nui story evened out the odds between the Makuta and Toa Nuva.

That, and the Toa Nuva had Ignika. Who overpowers everybody.

 

Too bad he didn't know what he was doing half the time.

And the fact that he was still a newbie was the Ignika's handicap, basically.

[LewaLew]

 

 

 

 

 

The Makuta in general. They have all 42 Rahkshi powers as well as shadow. That's a bit unfair, if you ask me.

 

^this^ Plus they were my favorite species now they're just annoying and leaves me wondering why they didn't take over the universe earlier.

That's exactly what Icarax was wondering.

 

And what I was wondering about Icarax. Although I don't think the Makuta were made cheap.by the Karda Nui Story.

Yeah, the Karda Nui story evened out the odds between the Makuta and Toa Nuva.

That, and the Toa Nuva had Ignika. Who overpowers everybody.

 

Too bad he didn't know what he was doing half the time.

And the fact that he was still a newbie was the Ignika's handicap, basically.

Newbie is a bit of an understatement. In a way, however, it made him more dangerous. He was willing to do things that other toa were not, like kill and devolve Makuta from antidermis into organic tissue in a very painful manner.

 

Then again, I suppose I'm getting off topic. This is about overpowered villains, not heroes. Of course, some of the things Ignika did lean more towards anti-hero.

[toa kopaka4372]

Probably the Makuta. I mean, 42 powers is pretty insane.

[Snoopy82]

My first thought on seeing the topic title was the Makuta, as a species in general. Obviously, controlling all of the powers that they did, they could have probably mopped the floor with the Toa, whether in 2001, 2003, or 2008. But, since this is a kids toy line that couldn't happen obviously

 

So, looking at the "villain of the year" types, I would go with the Bohrok-Kal. Rahi were just filler while the Toa got it together. The Bohrok had mass numbers, but weren't especially powerful and even Matoran could take them out. 2004-2005 are out, given that the villains were either eh like the Visorak, or we never say their true potential like Roodaka. The Piraka and Barakki were cool but kinda powerless, and the Makuta were problematic for what I just said. So, the Bohrok-Kal. IIRC they pretty much decimated the Toa (third book, right?) and were defeated with what pretty much amounted to a Deus-ex machina (a really cool one however ) so I'd go with them.

[~garnira returns~]

I'm very much with most of you, '08 makuta. They could have easily trashed the Toa, had they not been ordered to restrain their powers.

[LewaLew]

So, looking at the "villain of the year" types, I would go with the Bohrok-Kal. Rahi were just filler while the Toa got it together. The Bohrok had mass numbers, but weren't especially powerful and even Matoran could take them out. 2004-2005 are out, given that the villains were either eh like the Visorak, or we never say their true potential like Roodaka. The Piraka and Barakki were cool but kinda powerless, and the Makuta were problematic for what I just said. So, the Bohrok-Kal. IIRC they pretty much decimated the Toa (third book, right?) and were defeated with what pretty much amounted to a Deus-ex machina (a really cool one however ) so I'd go with them.

The main thing to remember about the Bohrok-Kal is that they were facing powerless Toa Nuva. The Toa Nuva were only able to use their Kanohi Nuva, and had they had their powers, they probably would have been matched up much better with the Kal.

 

And the Piraka were certainly not powerless. Each one had a vision power, a secondary power, and an elemental power that could only be used in cooperation with another Skakdi. Besides that, they were former Dark Hunters, and were skilled enough to match up with the Toa Nuva and later the Toa Inika. The Barakki on the other hand were on the powerless side, with only Takadox and Ehlek possessing powers, though their armies more or less made up for it. Whether one wants to count their armies as part of the equation is up to that particular person. I don't, for the most part.

[DuplexBeGreat]

As a side note on the powerlessness of certain villains, Takadox didn't really use that hypnosis power enough. IIRC, he didn't use it ONCE on any of the Mahri.

[SonicBOOM XS]

There's no way around it, the 2008 Makuta would've destroyed the Nuva if:

 

1) They weren't specifically ordered to hold back by Teridax.

2) The Toa Ignika didn't make an appearance (and even then it would've been a stretch)

3) They weren't blinded (which didn't make much of a difference anyways)

4) Teridax didn't betray them in the end.

 

If we discount those, the Piraka utterly annihilated the Nuva too, as well as Voya Nui entirely, and the Inika already had a tough time just trying to stand up to them. Bohrok-Kal don't come close.

[Hexann]

The only reason he was even there was that he was bored with the Makuta version of Spider Solitaire.

Visorak *Cough* Solitaire *Cough*

 

Definitely the 08 Makuta.

[Radagast367]

While not technically the most OP, I would actually say the barraki (minus carapar). After all, they are the only villian to have actually survived, (not counting the Piraka, I count them as dead.) they are currantly wandering around Spherus Magna, (to my knowledge) while the Makuta were defeated eventually. Athough in terms of sheer power, the 08 Makuta were the strongest. Yet again, if you pitted EVERY Bohrok against the Makuta, the Bohrok would destroy them.

Edited June 27, 2013 by Radagast367

[Toa Zaz]

The Bohrok, because of their massive numbers, their elemental abilities, and their unnecessary Krana powers. And, of course, the Makuta's abilities were ridiculous.

 

I would say the Rahkshi were by far the most underpowered. They were supposed to be this terrible threat that even Makuta hesitated to unleash, but there were only a few of them and they could barely do anything. Lerahk couldn't even poison anything unless he touched it directly.

As a side note on the powerlessness of certain villains, Takadox didn't really use that hypnosis power enough. IIRC, he didn't use it ONCE on any of the Mahri.

Actually, he did. In Dwellers in Darkness he hypnotized Jaller, Hahli, and Nuparu.

[DuplexBeGreat]

I meant during the main 07 story, and besides that he didn't even make them his slaves in DiD, he just immobilized them so he could get away, which is a pretty underwhelming use of that power the way I see it.

[man774]

To me, it's the piraka. Think about how unevenly matched the (powerless) toa nuva (possibly the mightiest toa) were against the bohrok-kal. Then imagine how powerful someone would have to be to defeat the same toa (but much more easily), but with powers and more experience. Then send that insane amount of power up against the newest, most inexperienced group of toa. It'd be like Samson taking on goliath, and then david.

Edited July 10, 2013 by man774

[The Lorax]

Of the canister villains, my order would go something like this. In order of power from most to least:

 

Phantoka Makuta

Mistika Makuta

Piraka

Bohrok-Kal

Rahkshi

Bohrok

Vahki

Visorak

Barraki

Rahi

[Katuko]

The Bohrok, because of their massive numbers, their elemental abilities, and their unnecessary Krana powers. And, of course, the Makuta's abilities were ridiculous.

I never saw the Bohrok as particularly threatening in and of themselves, since the Toa seemed to stop packs of them rather easily with some clever thinking. Nuhvok-Kal's power, however, is pretty "overpowered" if used correctly, as he casually sent things into orbit. If I was a villain and I had that power, I would just fling everyone into space all the time. I mean, why even give them a chance to retaliate if I can kill them in a surprise round?The Makuta did have an extreme amount of powers, but at least they are supposed to be the main villains; top of the food chain. They also have some weaknesses, like only being able to use one power at a time and also being devastated by any metal power. Then again, any being in BIONICLE would be completely owned by directly applied metal powers. The only thing keeping the Makuta from being absolutely unfairly powerful is the fact that just about every hero in this universe has multiple powers too.The Rahkshi could have used more screen-time as high-level troops, I agree. Of course, fiction has always had the "Inverse Ninja Law", aka the "Conservation of Ninjutsu". There is only so much "elite power" to go around. A single unique character - like a Toa - can be allowed massive power, while even similarly powered beings - such as Bohrok - get progressively less of a threat the more there are. If they are overwhelming (like the Vahki were at first), then the heroes will flee before gaining some advantage to turn the tide and kill them in spades.I found Lehrak threatening enough when he collapsed a mountainside in one of the comics, and again in MoL when he apparently weakened the foundation of the entire area by letting loose with acidic poison into the ground. His battle with Tahu was pretty weak, however. It should at the very least have been able to spray some poison on the being it was in melee combat with. Rahkshi can use their powers without a staff even though it gets weakened, which implies to be that it is not just the staff head that should be deadly.

[Master Inika]

Recall that Teridax defeated Icarax when Icarax tried to take over the Northern Continent. After that, Icarax probably decided not to move against Teridax until he realized Teridax was going to betray him.

 

I think that the Bohrok-Kal weren't any more powerful that the Toa Nva at full power. Of course they seemed powerful compared to characters on par with Matoran with mask powers (actually, less than Matoran with mask powers, because their elemental attributes were gone, too).

 

I agree that the Makuta were the most OP. They would have won easily if they weren't holding back. The Piraka, too, since they defeated the Nuva with their combination of raw power and strategy.

[darkslizer]

Realistically, the Toa didn't defeat a lot of the most powerful villains. Gorast died in the storm, the Bahrag were never beaten, and, as far as we know, the Toa didn't do away with Tren Krom. Same with all 6 of the Barraki. So, set wise, either Gorast or Pridak. Outside of sets, Tren Krom, as if that needed to be mentioned.

[25K Now!]

OP villains?

 

It'd really be the Makuta.

 

And possibly the EP Being.

[Tahu's Courage]

We've had a lot of nasty bad guy sets during Bionicle's life span. The most dangerous ones in my book would be 3) the Rahkshi, 2) the Piraka, and 1) the Makuta. Considering the fact that three Rahkshi destroyed Ta-Koro in their search for the Mask of Light, you can bet that they could destroy much more, but they don't have the merciless cunning of the Piraka. Not only were the Piraka smart, but they were also deadly, each one possessing strange supernatural powers in addition to the deadly weapons they used for combat. Each Piraka also had experience in a certain field and were experts at what they did, and all six of them were veterans in some of the things they did.

 

That being said, the Piraka had a major drawback, which was maintaining the unity of the entire team. Zaktan tried to enforce this unity through fear and harsh punishment, but no matter what he did, he never really was able to read every single Piraka's mind. They all wanted power for themselves. The Makuta, on the other hand, had much better team work, and each one had deadly powers.

 

Set wise, I'd say that the Makuta were the deadliest villains, but the Piraka are still my favorite.

 

 

[Radagast367]

Although, if you set EVERY bohrok in the entire hive all at ounce against any of the main baddies, I reckon the Bohrok would beat them after a while. The overwhelming numbers would weigh down even the mighty 08' Makuta.

[Mr. Cup of Fail]

I was going to say Teridax but when i think about him Getting Killed By A Rock, so i think it Vezon or the Barraki that is OP.

Edited July 17, 2013 by ShadowWolfHount

[Tahu's Courage]

Although, if you set EVERY bohrok in the entire hive all at ounce against any of the main baddies, I reckon the Bohrok would beat them after a while. The overwhelming numbers would weigh down even the mighty 08' Makuta.

If you're talking about just six Makuta, then yes, the Bohrok would destroy them, as long as it's a massive army. But if you consider the other members of the Brotherhood of Makuta, the Bohrok wouldn't stand a chance.