Mask Maker Takuna

When is this thing gonna be a thing?

Yeah, there's definitely an elegance to limiting the number of powers. But in a story that started with Stone/Earth and Water/Ice as separate elements, and then added Fire/Plasma and Iron/Magnetism distinctions, I think BIONICLE is past that point. What other elements are you seeing overlap with crystal? I can see a case made for Stone and Earth, but that's where I see it. And I don't think 'making pointy rocks show up' is a fair representation of what people think Crystal could be. Just like Ice isn't just 'make ice show up,' we can use some imagination to expand the Crystal power set. Diamond is the hardest natural substance on earth; a Toa of Crystal could create impenetrable armor and impossibly sharp weapons. Crystals could also be used as information storage; a Toa of Crystal might have perfect memory, or be able to create and read information storage crystals. Lightstones and Heatstones are also special crystals we saw on Mata Nui; a Toa of Crystal could create these objects or even other similar objects (Waterstone, Focusstone, Strengthstone, whatever). There's potential there.

If you're looking for specific instances of where we see Toa of these extra Elements, you'll need to read the books and serials. For example, the first we heard of Lightning and Iron was as members of Lesovikk's team in one of his flashbacks. I believe Plasma, Plantlife, and Gravity were all from unnamed Toa in BIONICLE: Legends books, and obviously Krakua and Jovan gave us Sonics and Magnetism. Psionics was one of the latest, first appearing in one of the unfinished serials after it had been officially canonized by request. (Unless the Stasis Toa contest was first... my memory might be hazy.) The inspiration for many of these Elements did come from the Bohrok-Kal; Vacuum was the only power not to be officially canonized. There was also one new Bohrok power, Acid, that was never canonized as a Toa Element. At times, these have been referred to as non-Toa Elements, both by the fans and by Greg, but I think that terminology has fallen out of use. I've heard a lot of support over the years for Acid and Vacuum (yes, I agreed with it), and also Lava and Crystals. Along with Psionics, there were two other odd Elements that were being talked about by the fanbase back in 2010: Kinetics and Robotics. I think it's always been a big attraction of the original BIONICLE setting to expand the Elements: here's a set of powers, what else could fit? (The same holds true for Kanohi powers.) I remember as a kid, making up stories with my brothers of different Elemental tribes on Mata Nui (Electricity and Metal were two we thought of, long before they became canonized.) And, lest we forget Voriki, Toa of Energy, the first BIONICLE urban legend. So, I know back when G1 ended, a lot of people got sick of all the different Elemental proposals and discussions. But I've always had fun reading them, even when I didn't think they'd make great Elements. If you're looking for new potential new Elements, there are three places I've found interesting: Custom Bionicle Wikia. A lot of people have had ideas, and a few of them actually have potential, like Rahi, Radiation, or Technology. (Please ignore the Toa of Juice.) TVTropes Elemental Powers. It's a website that showcases common ideas in all kinds of stories. Stuff like Weather, Animals, Poison, Holy, and Aether all have been used as Elements in other stories.Ninjago. The main characters have always had Elements, but they expanded their number of Elements drastically a few years ago. Most of them were old BIONICLE Elements, but they did introduce Smoke, Form, Speed, Poison, and Amber.EDIT: Oh, how could I forget the Expanded Multiverse topic? It's right here in this forum! And it's got a bunch of new Elements and combination Elements.I think the underlying question, for making new Elements, is this: Would a Toa have a unique and interesting power set? Sure, it's not always the case for the canon Elements (you could argue Plasma is functionally Fire, and that Magnetism is too close to Iron), and sometimes there's overlap with Kanohi powers (see Psionics and Gravity), but if you can make a case for a set of really cool Elemental powers, then I say go ahead and share! (I've been particularly inspired by Ninjago's Master of Smoke; he can turn his body into smoke, making it almost impossible for anyone to hit him.)

Actually, the "Master" terminology didn't appear until the Tournament of Elements storyline, which happened about the same time as BIONICLE's first new wave. I did think it was interesting at the time, and that it might have been a way to promote a thematic 'consistency' which would make it easy for fans of one line to go to the other. Remember, a big motive of the reboot was to make the story simpler and more accessible; even if Ninjago and BIONICLE don't share a continuity, if Lego consistently builds the concept of an Elemental Master, they can make it easier to use that concept in other, novel themes and stories. I don't think we've seen the last of the Masters. But, ultimately, I think similarities between G2 and Ninjago are because they both draw heavily on G1. When Bionicle ended, Hero Factory took its place in the set lineup while I feel Ninjago took over the storyline and collectible aspects. It was able to conquer some of the issues G1 had (like how to keep a consistent team with a need for varied sets every year, or how to have out-of-the-box playability by including both heroes and villains in a single set) due to the differences between Technic (and later CCBS) and System.

I wouldn't be too quick to trivialize the Vahi. Remember, G1 hid its biggest secret for eight years in plain sight, so I think it's very possible that G2 has its own deep secrets that we'll be able to look back and see. I also find it interesting how the island is personified in the post. What if Okoto is more than just an island? What if it has some sort of consciousness (like the island from LOST), and it's trying to communicate to its inhabitants by making the Vahi appear? The Mask of Time isn't just there for us; it's there for the Masters and Protectors, but they don't understand its significance.

[Emphasis added] You're saying that TLG would remove Mata Nui to differentiate G2 and G1. Thing is, it looks like they're doing the opposite; trying to thematically connect the two generations. Just look at their latest Facebook post; they're trying to get their new fans to find things from the old story! Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying they're making you look up the old story to follow the new. But they new story is supposed to "remind us of an ancient era in BIONICLE history," not ignore it. I don't think the set designers are terribly concerned with the storyline implications of including certain characters. TLG's motivations are somewhat alien to us. We, as S&T posters, are concerned with the storyline, so we tend to consider issues of canonicity as primary. (I've seen this in a few other franchises as well, where discussion forums are where storyline-focused fans tend to congregate.) But, for management, the story exists for one reason: to sell toys. (It's a bit cynical, but I don't think it's false.) Yes, leaving out Mata Nui would distinguish the storylines; but how would it sell more toys? On the other hand, reusing names is a plus in Lego's book; it is a move designed to draw upon good memories from ten years back. (I, myself, bought the Masters, but I don't plan on buying the Protectors or LoSS.) You imply that Lego is concerned with how fans would interpret reusing names as connecting the storylines. They've already opened the can of worms by reusing the Toa, Makuta, Masks of Power, an Elemental Island, so it doesn't appear TLG has made it a goal to expressly divorce the new and old stories. That's a very interesting view to have. If Lego had rebooted BIONICLE with an unfamiliar slate of heroes, would it have had as much of an explosive comeback? Remember the '09 soft reboot, when BIONICLE moved to new characters, doing new things, in a new place, but it was still called BIONICLE? It wasn't a great year for the franchise. Based on how quickly the new sets have been selling out, I think it shows that TLG made a good move going back to BIONICLE's roots. (Some great sets didn't hurt, either.) This line has succeeded by going back to 2001, not moving away from it. So, aside from distancing the new and old storylines, why else would TLG want to kick Mata Nui to the curb? Is there a set-based reason to leave him out?

WARNING: MASSIVE SPECULATION AHEAD WARNING: GEN1 CONNECTION THEORY INCLUDED The Question When the new Legend was first revealed, I'm sure many others thought the same thing I did: "Where's Mata Nui?" For a storyline that is basically copying the outline from 2001, the absence of one of the most iconic names of the franchise was somewhat jarring. Mata Nui has been replaced not once, but twice: the revered patron is now Ekimu, and the Elemental island is now Okoto. At first glance, the character and the island have remained largely the same, so why the change in names? Why is the relaunched line distancing itself from Mata Nui? No Mata Nui? The simplest answer: there's no Mata Nui because there will be no Mata Nui. As Ekimu develops as a character, we may learn he's quite different from the Mata Nui we know and love, so the story team decided to divorce the two characters and abandon the old name entirely. But I find this possibility to be inconsistent with Lego's approach in the new BIONICLE. We can point at Makuta, where they used the name and the broad strokes of the character, but he has different motivations (and, as some think, may be corrupted more than evil). Nostalgia is the big word today: we've got the Toa on masks quests, fighting mind-controlled animals, to save the villagers after their legendary leader has been put to sleep. Everything has been re-used and simplified. We can also look at Lewa's change in Element or the personality changes in all the Toa to see that name recognition is not hindered by differences between generations. Mata Nui is the biggest in name recognition, being a major point of the story in every year of BIONICLE. Lego wouldn't abandon the name, so I think we'll definitely be seeing Mata Nui come back. There are several different ways I think this could happen, which I will lay out below. Mata Nui is another hero from the past Ekimu and Makuta appear to be Protectors in the Legend video. What if Mata Nui is a more powerful being? What if he will be summoned, much like the Toa were, from a time in the past? There isn't a lot of ground to stand on for this one, but it's the simplest way for Mata Nui to return. Who knows what other prophecies the Protectors have? When times get dire, they may need to call on another hero of legend to help the Toa. But I think there will be more to Mata Nui than that. Mata Nui is another Mask Maker We've seen two Mask Makers that are brothers, but what if there are more? What if the family is not limited to two brothers, but if there is another brother? Or a father? Not every Mask of Power has a known creator in the second generation. The Toa's masks were made by Ekimu, the MoUP was made by Makuta, but we don't know who made the Mask of Control or the Mask of Creation. It's possible Makuta or Ekimu made those, but we see them harnessing the Elemental powers of the island to make masks. Creation and Control don't fit this pattern (they're not Elements), so what if they were made by someone else, somewhere else, harnessing different power? Someone like Mata Nui? (Side note: if Mata Nui were a Mask Maker, he would probably wear the Mask of Life.) Mata Nui has Returned I will unabashedly admit that I hope for a connection between the Gen1 and Gen2 worlds. Not that the new storyline is continuing the rebuilding of Spherus Magna; just that there is a connection of some sorts. Lego has showed a tremendous amount of respect to their intellectual properties in stories like Ninjago (where TV-only characters like Dareth make their way into sets and current plots draw on Golden Weapons and Anacondrai from previous seasons) and the the LEGO Movie (featuring ancient astronauts and the Octan corpration), so I don't believe they will settle for mining the original BIONICLE storyline for ideas and inspiration. I feel there has to be a connection, much like Star Trek's new movies, where a main character from the earliest show appeared, along with an explanation of where the new universe came from. Actually, Star Trek is a very good comparison. I think that Mata Nui will be the Spock of Bionicle Gen2. If only one character could carry over, Mata Nui would be the one to pick. As I said, he's the most iconic, being the focus of the entire storyline until he became the main character for the last two years. Also, only one individual would possibly have the willpower to control the ever-present Vahi to its full extent, using it to go back in time. This explains best, to me, why we have two new names. Ekimu and Okoto replace both instances of Mata Nui so we didn't have three Mata Nui's (the Gen2 character, the island, and the Gen1 character) when the original one finally joins the story. The story team needed to make space to bring in our favorite Great Spirit. To Summarize: He'll Be Back Regardless of how it happens, I am confident that Mata Nui will eventually return. The story team would need a good reason to exclude him from the big comeback, and I can't think think of one for the life of me.

There has been some discussion of this already in this topic. However, it doesn't look like anyone has tried to recreate the model yet. (An Ice combiner has also been discovered, if you have those sets and want to try your hand at building that, too.)

First of all, the easy one: I imagine that there were many more Matoran tribes scattered across the MU, in small pockets. Acid, Smoke, Lava, Time, Vacuum, Rahi, etc... Elements that are "classically forbidden" to the population at large, but will have one small group of inhabitants. Toa of these Elements exist, but are super rare, considering the Matoran pool to draw from is so small. They hold nice roles in supporting the Great Spirit robot; for example, Matoran of Vacuum patrol outside the Matoran Universe to fight off external invaders, or Matoran of Lava maintain the heat dissipation system in the Southern Islands. I've also tossed around the idea that the Matoran species was not supposed to coexist with the other races of the Great Spirit Robot. To explain a little further: The original plan called for two Great Spirit robots: The "Makuta" robot, and the "Mata Nui" robot.The Makuta Robot had many different species, designed to play different roles in the functioning of the robot. (Skakdi, Vortixx, the six Barraki species, all that good stuff). The Makuta species had an oversight role. Teridax would be the mind that controlled the entire robot (not a member of the Makuta species), while Miserix was the leader of the Brotherhood of Makuta and would communicate with Teridax. The concepts of Elements and Kanohi were being developed while this robot was designed, so some of these species could use one or the other, but widespread use was uncommon.The Mata Nui robot would be inhabited solely by Matoran. It was a more technologically advanced machine; more compact, but more powerful. The Matoran are smaller in stature because they were supposed to inhabit this smaller universe. The Matoran tribes replicated the effect of different species, with Turaga and Toa taking the place of the Makuta species. The Matoran were also a more advanced creation than the Makuta Robot's species; they had fully implemented Elemental and Kanohi compatibility.As the Great Beings began construction on the Great Spirit robots, they uncovered some fundamental flaw in their plans. (Or maybe they just ran out of money.) As a result, they combined the pieces of the partially built Great Spirit robots: head and heart (Metru Nui and Karda Nui) were from the Matoran Universe, while the torso and limbs (continents and islands with other species) were from the Non-Matoran Universe.Mata Nui was given control of the combined robot, while Teridax was repurposed as the Makuta of the new region of Metru Nui.I hold this "headcanon" because I feel the Matoran deserve a special connection to Mata Nui. In the canon, the Matoran (almost) worship Mata Nui, more so than any other inhabitants we see. The Piraka, the Dark Hunters, the Brotherhood of Makuta - none of them care that Mata Nui is dying. It also explains Makuta's desire for the Matoran's adoration. Whether or not he knows it, he was created to rule a universe, which is why it galls him to see his "subjects" pay homage to the one who took his role.

As I recall, the term "soft reboot" was explicitly used by TLG to describe '09. Greg made sure to say that it would eventually connect to the universe and story of '01-'08, but he did say that, for the first wave, it would seem that there was no connection to the previous line.

A few nights ago, my friends and I were running a playtest with the new Dungeons and Dragons materials, and I was building a cleric. I decided that my character would worship Mata Nui, and throughout the entire mission I was having my character compare what we were doing to the adventures that Toa had. He was stressing the importance of Unity, Duty, and Destiny; searches for secret walls were inspried by the Toa Mata's actions on their way to fight the Bahrag; he compared traitorous double-agents to the Toa Hagah; an amnesiac character was comforted by the Toa Mata's plight when they first arrived on Mata Nui. So on and so forth. I was exercising my knowledge of the BIONICLE mythos through my character. My references were spot-on and quickly delivered because of how much the BIONICLE story was impacted on me during the years I followed it, and to this day I can slip right back in to the obsessive fanset mind.BIONICLE was the first in-depth, growing storyline that I partook of as a fan. Before that, I read stuff like Hardy Boys, which were one-shot adventures without an overarching story. But with BIONICLE, I discovered a world. I followed it from the beginning, and I stayed with it right up until the end. It was my first love, and I don't think I'll ever be able to forget it, nor give it up. I've discovered other expanding storylines, like Brandon Sanderson's Cosmere or the Star Wars Expanded Universe, but none hold the same place in my heart as BIONICLE does.

Yeah, that part pretty much blew my mind, as well. I wonder what possibilities were discussed about it. or if it was an early concept of Voya Nui.

I'd hazard a guess that he probably didn't make them all on his own, (although that would explain the drawn-out nature of the Plan; he needed a lot of free time to make all those pods), but that instead, he turned to some of the manufacturers in the Matoran Universe that already worked for the Brotherhood, like the Nynrah Ghosts or the Vortixx.

Well, his broad scheme was to cast Mata Nui to sleep, only to take over his body when he woke up. So, for that, the Matoran Pods were necessary to remove the Matoran from working in Metru Nui, Mata Nui's brain, with no actual need for them to lose their memories.However, I do seem to recall some lines from Legends of Metru Nui about Makuta planning to use their memory loss to establish himself as their hero, but I can't recall the exact words used. However, since he was establishing himself as the ruler of the entire Matoran Universe, it would definitely serve him in that respect. After all, when you establish your tyrannical hold over a universe, you don't want your people remembering the idyllic near-utopia that you just supplanted.

The main reason that I thought of them as a form of pure proto was because they actively convert energy into a useable form, something that natural proto doesn't do. Also, the fact that we're pretty much pulling this classifications out of thin air makes it pretty hard for anyone to correct anyone else as to which it would better fall as, so both do work equally as well.

Awesome idea. S&T could use some good discussion, and I think this has a lot of open space that we can work with.I think the idea of Protodermis as actually some kind of super-molecule that reacts with other molecules is a great one - it explains why we have so many different kind of protodermis without getting into it being some new kind of subatomic substance (which is what I'd always assumed).Before I go into depth on what ideas you've sparked in me, I'd like to look at why the Great Beings created protodermis. Without an understanding of what protodermis exists for, I don't think we'll ever really be able to get down to its nature. So, what did the Great Beings need to synthesize protodermis for?Now, operating on memory here, but didn't they need to purify protodermis so that they could actually power the Mata Nui robot? The nature of the power source notwithstanding (zero point energy, anybody?), the omnipresence of the robot implies that it has something to do with every aspect of the machine, not just a power source. So, it appears that protodermis is a powerful conductor of energy, which takes the power produced in Karda Nui in its Energy Storms and transports it across all of Mata Nui's body. So, that would mean that the protodermis molecule would have one part of it that is involved in energy transference. This makes sense with Kanohi: Protodermis is purified, and then formed into these impressive masks that can convert energy into supernatural abilities, like seeing through objects or flight. Lightstones and heatstones would probably be a special kind of purified protodermis, that converts that energy into heat or light instead of controlled energies.Now, the second reason I see for protodermis being essential for Mata Nui's construction: mass-production. The Great Beings built a world from scratch; this being was massive. Now, let's say that protodermis bonds with other atoms and molecules, imitating their chemical activity. Now, let's also say that the Great Beings could produce massive amounts of pure protodermis, much faster than they could produce the materials needed for the Great Spirit project. Now, let's also say that, when protodermis 'absorbs' a molecule, you get much more 'protodermic' substance than you did the original (ie, react 4 grams of water with 20 kilograms of protodermis to get 20 kilograms of protodermic water). They could use take their protodermis, have it imitate comparatively tiny amounts of 'real' substances, and mass-produce 'protodermic' substances for use in the Great Spirit project.So, to sum these two points up: The Great Beings used Protodermis to mass-produce a highly imitative conductor that would distribute power across the robot while simulating the environment of Spherus Magna.So, I'd go with different terminology than what you've been using. While, from the Matoran's point of view, it is "impure protodermis," I'd go with the Great Beings looking at it as something along the lines of 'infused protodermis.' This also explains why Toa have power over both natural and protodermic forms of elements: the protodermis actually containts and mimics the natural element that Toa controls, so it falls under the same category.So, as to how this fits in with the kinds of protodermis we have: [*]Pure Protodermis: A solid that can be formed to be either metallic (in the case of Kanohi and Kanoka) or crystalline (as per TSO's staff and Lightstones). Pure protodermis takes energy and converts it directly into some other useable form.[*]Natural Protodermis: water, earth, stone, etc. in the Matoran Universe. This is the Protodermis molecule that imitates natural molecules, incorporating them into its structure. Through various processes, the natural parts can be removed, leaving behind Pure Protodermis.[*]Organic Protodermis: Like you said, it's just cells made out of Natural Protodermis.[*]Metallic Protodermis: This is the stuff that rusts, that Toa of Iron can control. It might not actually be Pure Protodermis (In fact, have we ever seen a Toa of Iron manipulate a Kanohi or a Kanoka?). It might just be natural protodermis that has absorbed metals; when those metals rust, the protodermis is now imitating a rusted molecule.So, yeah, those are my two cents. It's an interesting idea, protodermis being a chemical imitator. I definitely like the broad concept; I'll have to sleep on some of the details, though.

Well, out-of-story, those were the only masks that existed back in 2001, so the sets of course had to have the masks.As for the in-universe explanation: in all we saw of Metru Nui, there were only twelve masks that were popular among the Matoran. Yes, Dume and Nidhiki had other masks than just the twelve from '01, but neither of them were from Metru Nui; their masks came from elsewhere. Every Matoran from Metru Nui that we saw had twelve masks, so it seems that Metru Nui didn't have widespread use of any masks that weren't those twelve. Now, the Toa were originally supposed to go to Metru Nui to awaken Mata Nui, so it would make sense that the masks they wore were the masks of Metru Nui. And when the Turaga took masks from the Great Temple, they would have, by necessity, had to take only those twelve masks.Now, the question in my mind: if they were just grabbing random masks, how did it turn out that the six Noble were the ones the Toa Metru had, and the six Great were the ones the Toa Mata had? I'm wondering if there might have been some prophetic allusion that the Mask Makers who supplied the masks to the temple had access to. The Toa Metru and the Toa Mata were both prophesied; I think that part of the prophecies evidenced themselves in the masks in the Great Temple.Now, bear with me a minute: We know that both teams were prophesied, and that, on Metru Nui, they had knowledge of these two coming teams of Toa. The Toa Metru even had a false group of Matoran, the Great Disk Matoran, that were acclaimed as the prophesied Toa. As for the Toa Mata: in order for the Turaga to know about the Toa Mata, they would have had to found out about them on Metru Nui, since after they turned into Turaga and fled from the Great Cataclysm, they had no contact with either Mata Nui or the rest of the Matoran Universe. However, even in their isolation, they still knew that a prophesied team of Toa were coming.Now, as to how the masks fit in.The masks in the Great Temple referred to two teams of six: one Noble team [the Toa Metru], and one Great team [the Toa Mata]. These groups would be recognized by their masks. The Great Disk Matoran had the six Noble Masks that were in the Great Temple, the same as the true Toa Metru team had. And the Toa Mata, the 'greater' team of Toa, had the six Great Masks in the temple.All right: that turned out better than expected. It just hit me on the fly, so I figured I'd throw it out there, see what people think. I don't have any books or comics, so I'm running on memory when it comes to prophesies - does anyone know anything more specific about the prophesies for either team of Toa? Or maybe more about the Toa Metru collecting masks in Challenge of the Hordika?Also, to add one thing to the Vahi discussion: people have been saying that the Vahi was too important to leave laying around the island, but I think there's a little more to it than that. The entire point of the 2004 storyline was Vakama protecting the Vahi from Makuta; it wasn't the same as the other masks, which Makuta had no desire for and which Vakama had no mission to guard. When he gave the Vahi to Tahu, he might not just have been giving him another powerful tool. I think the Turaga had an ulterior motive: giving the Vahi to the most powerful being he could get to protect it. It wasn't part of Tahu's training, like his other masks were; it was actually another mission for him. Also, like Takatu said, Makuta had no desire for the scattered Kanohi, just the Vahi.

The Turaga hid the masks as a kind of training exercise for the Toa. If they had just straight-up given them the masks, the Toa would have had all this power, but no skill to use it with. Through the challenges of retrieving the Kanohi, the Toa also learned how to use their masks. So, despite the fact that it was inconvenient, it actually helped the Toa in the long run.The Kanohi Nuva, however, came from Artakha: he teleported them to various locations on the island after the Toa transformed. I don't recall why, but I believe it was with a similar idea in mind: not just handouts.As for BS01: you could always check Saga Guides or Timelines, or the summaries on individual book/comic pages. And, like you said, even if the stuff you're looking for isn't there, it's always a good read.

Hah... #5 is totally made of win.

It's the top of an ad.

Greg, I'd like to thank you for this serial. I was worried about what the BIONICLE story post-cancellation would be; I must confess, I thought it would be some very cheesy quests about Matoran and Agori cultures combining. But TPTB has got me excited in a way that I haven't been since 2004. I found myself wishing that Sahmad's Tale and The Yesterday Quest were over so that you could put more time into The Powers That Be; which doesn't make too much sense, since it's you as the author that makes them good, not the serials themselves, but, hey, TPTB is just that good. So, thanks for pushing ahead the next chapter.