Gold Good Guy is Now Canon! :D

[Zeb]

I just talked to Greg Farshtey on the LMBs inquiring about this promotional set:

 

 

For a long time this 2006 promotional set has been thought to be Turaga Lhikan, though it was never made canon.

 

Until now. Take a look what Greg Farshtey replied with:

 

 

 

xeara wrote:

xeara wrote:

Hey Greg? A lot of people often believe the set called "7216 Gold Good Guy" is Turaga Lhikan. This set was a small promotional one included with Duracell batteries in a 2006 promotion. (If you have no idea what I'm talking about, just search up the name on Google.)

Even if this set isn't Turaga Lhikan, it at least had to have had inspiration from that character. Not only is it the perfect size for a Turaga, it also has the correct color scheme of dark red and a gold mask. Actually, it has the exact same mask as Toa Lhikan. The character also carries a small staff, just like all other Turaga.

 

So is this canonically Turaga Lhikan? And if it isn't, could you make it canon?

I think this got buried.

Sure, go ahead.

 

Source: community.lego.com/t5/LEGO-General/Chat-with-Greg-Farshtey/m-p/11233939#M252886

 

I have just caused Gold Good Guy to become the official canon set version of Turaga Lhikan! YAY!!!        

 

So, does this make any difference to you, or am I just excited over nothing?

[Pohatu: Uniter of Stone]

This is actually pretty cool! Now another promo set is canon.

[Tea-rex]

\o.o/

Woo!

Now just to find it *shakes fist*

 

Wait I just found this: http://www.amazon.com/LEGO-Bionicle-Promo-Figure-Bagged/dp/B005AJX9SG

 

is this?

Edited September 25, 2014 by alijar

[Voltex]

Poor Lhikan. Demoted from riding on top of an awesome Rahi to being packed in with a bunch of batteries as an afterthought.

[TheSkeletonMan939]

Yaaaay.

 

I think everyone knew this already, though.

[Pohatu: Uniter of Stone]

Poor Lhikan. Demoted from riding on top of an awesome Rahi to being packed in with a bunch of batteries as an afterthought.

Well, I guess that's what a shadow hand will do to you.

[Zeb]

\o.o/

Woo!

Now just to find it *shakes fist*

 

Wait I just found this: http://www.amazon.com/LEGO-Bionicle-Promo-Figure-Bagged/dp/B005AJX9SG

 

###### is this?

(Is that a filtered word or just a placeholder? If its filtered, please try to avoid using bad words next time.)

 

That is Turaga Dume's predecessor, Turaga Nomask I have no idea.

[believe victims]

\o.o/

Woo!

Now just to find it *shakes fist*

 

Wait I just found this: http://www.amazon.com/LEGO-Bionicle-Promo-Figure-Bagged/dp/B005AJX9SG

 

###### is this?

 

That's clearly Axonn before he became an OoMN member. Quick! Get Greg to canonize it!

[Pohatu: Uniter of Stone]

 

\o.o/

Woo!

Now just to find it *shakes fist*

 

Wait I just found this: http://www.amazon.com/LEGO-Bionicle-Promo-Figure-Bagged/dp/B005AJX9SG

 

###### is this?

 

That's clearly Axonn before he became an OoMN member. Quick! Get Greg to canonize it!

 

Are you sure it isn't Toa Ingniter as a Matoran? Even though they share almost no similarities?

[Sir Kohran]

Interesting. It hasn't been very long since Aanchir told me Greg had said it wasn't Turaga Lhikan.

[Lyichir]

Interesting. It hasn't been very long since Aanchir told me Greg had said it wasn't Turaga Lhikan.

Maybe he did. Greg's had a habit of canonizing trivial things like this willy-nilly for a while. I don't have the patience to find Aanchir's purported answer, but then again, I doubt Greg does either–what are the chances that for each question he gets, he reviews all his previous answers just to make sure he doesn't contradict himself? I'd reckon pretty low, especially for a question like this where a "yes" doesn't affect any character's role in the story at all. Bionicle's story is essentially over, so it doesn't really matter whether an ancient promotional set with no story significance is chosen to represent an existing character with no previous set incarnation.

 

I certainly don't envy the folks at BioSector 01 who now have to decide whether their image guidelines will allow them to keep using the movie image of Turaga Lhikan or if they have to replace it with a poor-quality image of a box of batteries.

[Zidonaro]

I like how he has the power of canonizing things by just saying "Sure, go ahead"

[Pohatu: Uniter of Stone]

I like how he has the power of canonizing things by just saying "Sure, go ahead"

Greg Farshtey: Toa of Canon!

[Zeb]

 

I like how he has the power of canonizing things by just saying "Sure, go ahead"

Greg Farshtey: Toa of Canon!

 

Armed with a shoulder-mounted Canon Cannon and Retcon-Weapon!  

Interesting. It hasn't been very long since Aanchir told me Greg had said it wasn't Turaga Lhikan.

Now that Bionicle's coming back, and it's very possibly a reboot, he apparently now has full power to make anything canon in the old universe.

[Sumiki]

I like how he has the power of canonizing things by just saying "Sure, go ahead"

I really don't. It almost gives the impression that he doesn't care about the story, and a lot of incredibly trivial things have come about by this canonization process.

 

Not saying that fan theory canonizations aren't good, but canonizing any fan theory that doesn't contradict established canon is not the way to run a fictional universe.

[Voltex]

 

I like how he has the power of canonizing things by just saying "Sure, go ahead"

I really don't. It almost gives the impression that he doesn't care about the story, and a lot of incredibly trivial things have come about by this canonization process.

 

Not saying that fan theory canonizations aren't good, but canonizing any fan theory that doesn't contradict established canon is not the way to run a fictional universe.

 

 

Thisthisthisthisthis so much this

 

If fan stuff is going to be integrated into canon, I would prefer it to be an extremely rare occurrence, such as "hey you won this story writing contest run by Lego, congrats, see you in four years for the next one"

[Chro]

 

I like how he has the power of canonizing things by just saying "Sure, go ahead"

I really don't. It almost gives the impression that he doesn't care about the story, and a lot of incredibly trivial things have come about by this canonization process.

 

Not saying that fan theory canonizations aren't good, but canonizing any fan theory that doesn't contradict established canon is not the way to run a fictional universe.

 

I agree.

(And I'm pretty sure Holo was being sarcastic.)

[Boidoh]

 

Interesting. It hasn't been very long since Aanchir told me Greg had said it wasn't Turaga Lhikan.

Maybe he did. Greg's had a habit of canonizing trivial things like this willy-nilly for a while. I don't have the patience to find Aanchir's purported answer, but then again, I doubt Greg does either–what are the chances that for each question he gets, he reviews all his previous answers just to make sure he doesn't contradict himself? I'd reckon pretty low, especially for a question like this where a "yes" doesn't affect any character's role in the story at all. Bionicle's story is essentially over, so it doesn't really matter whether an ancient promotional set with no story significance is chosen to represent an existing character with no previous set incarnation.

 

I certainly don't envy the folks at BioSector 01 who now have to decide whether their image guidelines will allow them to keep using the movie image of Turaga Lhikan or if they have to replace it with a poor-quality image of a box of batteries.

 

The 'folks at BS01' have bigger concerns. The big chief seems to have something against this and locked the Lhikan page.

 

 

I like how he has the power of canonizing things by just saying "Sure, go ahead"

I really don't. It almost gives the impression that he doesn't care about the story, and a lot of incredibly trivial things have come about by this canonization process.

 

Not saying that fan theory canonizations aren't good, but canonizing any fan theory that doesn't contradict established canon is not the way to run a fictional universe.

 

 

He doesn't 'canonize every fan theory', he has been bugged about this a million times and he probably just decided to google it or something... I asked him about it once and he said he didn't know anything about the set, or something to that effect. This was inevitable though. Like Lehvak-Kal's orbit confirmation

 

And I don't see any 'fan theory' in this. More like a paragraph to beg, and plead, for Greg to canonize an already existing set as a character... Plus what is he supposed to say? "Yeah, I personally think this is Turaga Lhikan also. Blah blah blah... blah blah" 200 words later - "blah blah blah, so sure. Yeah it is Lhikan."

 

I think his answers are good enough. And atleast we are getting new information.

[Wrinkledlion X]

 

 

I like how he has the power of canonizing things by just saying "Sure, go ahead"

I really don't. It almost gives the impression that he doesn't care about the story, and a lot of incredibly trivial things have come about by this canonization process.

 

Not saying that fan theory canonizations aren't good, but canonizing any fan theory that doesn't contradict established canon is not the way to run a fictional universe.

 

 

Thisthisthisthisthis so much this

 

If fan stuff is going to be integrated into canon, I would prefer it to be an extremely rare occurrence, such as "hey you won this story writing contest run by Lego, congrats, see you in four years for the next one"

 

 

I agree 100%, though I can't blame Greg for not caring about this instance. The character's been dead for ten years, and it's an eight-year-old promo set that all of ten people ever bought.

 

Has Greg canonized any actual story content lately or just stuff like this? 

[Voltex]

I think it's mostly stuff like this. As far as confirming this I'm fine (since I just assumed it anyway), but even still, especially with a reboot/relaunch on the horizon, I wish we could just leave the old storyline be.

[Toa Smoke Monster]

I think it's mostly stuff like this. As far as confirming this I'm fine (since I just assumed it anyway), but even still, especially with a reboot/relaunch on the horizon, I wish we could just leave the old storyline be.

I agree with this. While I don't have a problem with this set being made Turaga Lhikan's canon Turaga set (it was that way anyway in my headcanon), I also want the old story to be left alone. If only to keep it from getting even more confusing.

[Manducus]

Poor Lhikan. Demoted from riding on top of an awesome Rahi to being packed in with a bunch of batteries as an afterthought.

 

Think of it as his part time job.

[Takhamavahu]

I'm almost very happy about this.
I have always used this as the basis for what a non-movie Turaga Lhikan would look like, but I wouldn't have liked to take it exactly.
I wuold rather it be given a right hand, a better head, and some better feet before being canon.
But I do like that this supports my headcanon that Lhikan's Hau is in the shae of a noble hau, rather than just a random unique shape.

 

Then again, do we really need to take a "meh" from Greg as gospel?

Edited September 26, 2014 by Takhamavahu

[Toatapio Nuva]

 

I like how he has the power of canonizing things by just saying "Sure, go ahead"

I really don't. It almost gives the impression that he doesn't care about the story, and a lot of incredibly trivial things have come about by this canonization process.

 

Not saying that fan theory canonizations aren't good, but canonizing any fan theory that doesn't contradict established canon is not the way to run a fictional universe.

 

 

I agree with this 100%.

 

I always thought of the Good Guy set as Lhikan, but it being officially canonized doesn't mean anything to me.

[Zidonaro]

 

I like how he has the power of canonizing things by just saying "Sure, go ahead"

I really don't. It almost gives the impression that he doesn't care about the story, and a lot of incredibly trivial things have come about by this canonization process.

 

Not saying that fan theory canonizations aren't good, but canonizing any fan theory that doesn't contradict established canon is not the way to run a fictional universe.

 

 

It was sarcasm... And yeah, I must agree with you there. It looks like he's just saying "Yeah whatever, I don't care".

[Pomegranate]

I dunno, I think it looks pretty... lame. Why would we want Duracell Turaga who are missing a hand canonized? Guess it's too late now  

[Zeb]

I dunno, I think it looks pretty... lame. Why would we want Duracell Turaga who are missing a hand canonized? Guess it's too late now

I think it looks good... and it's only one hand... *slaps a hand on his arm* There. Fixed.

[Ektris]

 

I like how he has the power of canonizing things by just saying "Sure, go ahead"

I really don't. It almost gives the impression that he doesn't care about the story, and a lot of incredibly trivial things have come about by this canonization process.

 

Not saying that fan theory canonizations aren't good, but canonizing any fan theory that doesn't contradict established canon is not the way to run a fictional universe.

 

And this is why I backed out of my heavy involvement with this storyline stuff for so, so very long... Because I got just tired of stuff (Edit note: Heh, thought that word had been removed from the filter too. Fixed that. ) like this happening.

 

We had an answer. We had an explanation. Most people were content with the status quo. But no, somebody (or maybe multiple bodies) had to keep pressing. Or present things in a construed way. Or try again and hope he's forgotten an old answer or explanation (so incredibly likely, especially now). Just to get a "yeah, sure" out of Greg and praise the suns that what they think is finally "right." Not just in this case, but it is the most recent.

 

~|ET|~

Edited September 26, 2014 by Electric Turahk

[Archon~]

 

 

 

I like how he has the power of canonizing things by just saying "Sure, go ahead"

I really don't. It almost gives the impression that he doesn't care about the story, and a lot of incredibly trivial things have come about by this canonization process.

 

Not saying that fan theory canonizations aren't good, but canonizing any fan theory that doesn't contradict established canon is not the way to run a fictional universe.

And this is why I backed out of my heavy involvement with this storyline stuff for so, so very long... Because I got just tired of ###### like this happening.

 

We had an answer. We had an explanation. Most people were content with the status quo. But no, somebody (or maybe muptiple bodies) had to keep pressing. Or present things in a construed way. Or try again and hope he's forgotten an old answer or explanation (so incredibly likely, especially now). Just to get a "yeah, sure" out of Greg and praise the suns that what they think is finally "right." Not just in this case, but it is the most recent.

 

~|ET|~

*drops mic*

 

But seriously, we have a Turaga presentation of him in the movie and that duracell thing sucks. So yeah. That's my 2cents

[Banana Gunz]

I'd honestly be surprised if he still remembers who Turaga Lhikan was. 

[Illuminatus]

So, no one's concerned that Lhikan's stylized Hau looks the same way in both Great and Noble form?

 

Cause that's a little weak, to be honest.

[Rider Of Spiders]

So, no one's concerned that Lhikan's stylized Hau looks the same way in both Great and Noble form?

 

Cause that's a little weak, to be honest.

Considering that this mask looked like a Great one while being Noble even after switching owners, I don't think it matters.

 

As a financial view, TLG most likely does not make new molds for battery promos.

[Takhamavahu]

I like the implication that Lhikan's Hau has been the noble shape all along. Otherwise we have no canon noble Hau part, but an extra, superfluous great Hau mold for no reason.

[Zeb]

I like the implication that Lhikan's Hau has been the noble shape all along. Otherwise we have no canon noble Hau part, but an extra, superfluous great Hau mold for no reason.

Agreed. The Movie version of Toa Lhikan's Hau looks more like a regular Tahu-style Hau to me, and his movie Noble Hau looks like both of his set's Haus. So in my headcanon, Lhikan wears a standard Great Hau as a Toa, and the "Lhikan" Hau as a Turaga.

[NorikSigma]

This is pretty cool! Now I know how Lhikan's Turaga set looks like.

[Illuminatus]

I somewhat like the idea of this Hau design being Noble, but that would mean Toa Lhikan's set form is not canon. And that's a little negligee.

 

It's all about continuity. "Sure, go ahead" just doesn't cut it sometimes.

[Pohatu: Uniter of Stone]

While it is kind of cool that a promo set is canon, it really serves no storyline purpose. The only story purpose I can see with this is saying, "Yeah this is Turaga Lhikan in set form," which doesn't really matter.

[Thormen]

 

So, no one's concerned that Lhikan's stylized Hau looks the same way in both Great and Noble form?

 

Cause that's a little weak, to be honest.

Considering that this mask looked like a Great one while being Noble even after switching owners, I don't think it matters.

 

As a financial view, TLG most likely does not make new molds for battery promos.

 

I don't think the set representation of this Hau is to be considered an accurate representation of its canon form, considering the fact that this exact same Hau was released in two Jala/Jaller sets before but with a different shape. We can say with 100% certainty that the 2001 McToran Jala and the 2003 sets Jaller & Gukko and Takanuva & the Ussanui came with the noble Kanohi Hau that Turaga Lhikan wore. This piece used the same mold as the set forms of the great Hau of the Toa Mata. The Toa Lhikan & Kikanalo set also featured a great Hau which has the exact same mold as the noble Hau of this Gold Good Guy. Now, if we disregard this tentative decision to canonize the GGG as Turaga Lhikan's set form and if we want there to be exactly one set representation per object or person in a phase of the storyline, we can explain it this way: the great Hau of the Toa Mata is shaped like a regular great Hau, but Lhikan's Hau was carved differently (similar to Norik's Pehkui, but not necessarily for the same reason; it could be just for decorative reasons); Lhikan's differently shaped great Hau then transformed into a differently shaped noble one, which coincidentally has the same shape as a regular great Hau. However, if the GGG is Turaga Lhikan this explanation doesn't work anymore, since we now have two set representations of the exact same noble Kanohi Hau (the GGG's one shaped like Lhikan's great Hau and Jala/Jaller's one shaped like the Mata's great Hau). The only way to fix this is to say that the shape of Lhikan's noble mask was altered somewhere in between the death of Turaga Lhikan and the moment Vakama gave it to Jaller. In that explanation the only likely culprit would be Toa Vakama since he was the one carrying the mask and could've carved masks in different shapes being a former mask maker, but IMO that is very improbable since Vakama carried the mask to honor Lhikan's memory, not to recycle its Protodermis.

 

That's why I think it's more likely there isn't a one on one correspondence between the Hau set form and its canonical shape. Both the 2001 Hau mold and that of the Lhikan set (and actually the Stars Hau, which is slightly different from the 2001 Hau) are set representations of the Kanohi Hau in all three stages (Matoran, great and noble, obviously excluding Nuva here). It is not unheard of that a person or object in-story has multiple set representations. Take the Stars for example: there is absolutely no reason why Takanuva, Gresh and the Skrall would look differently in-story as the Stars from how they looked in 2003 and 2009 respectively; in the case of the other three stars, we might explain their alternative set form with in-story reasons, but are these explanations really that convincing? Tahu was returned to his Mata form, so he should've looked the same as he did in 2001; of course Greg has recently said that he still has his adaptive armor and weapon, so we could explain his different Stars form that way, but how likely is that really? The Rahkshi of heat vision had never been released before so we could say it has a different body structure than the six remarkably similar Rahkshi released in 2003, but how likely is that really? The same goes for Nektann and the 2006 Piraka. And then there are the BIONICLE minifigs that came with the playsets: they featured different set forms of a lot of Toa, the Piraka etc.

 

So bottom line is, one canon instance of the Hau can have multiple set forms.

 

Of course, this also means that even if Greg says the GGG is Turaga Lhikan's set form, it isn't necessarily the only set form. For all we know BIONICLE 2015 is going to give us a new Turaga Lhikan set (although based on Greg's "go ahead" regarding this question that seems unlikely, but that's beside the point).

 

That's also why I find this whole issue a little pointless. Set forms of BIONICLE characters are tools to sell the corresponding sets to us, the fans. The set form is never a 100% accurate representation of the character in-story, we are meant to play with the sets and use our imagination to replace them with the actual in-story characters. If you want to use your imagination to replace the GGG with the Turaga Lhikan character, go ahead, but I don't see a point in asking official approval from a LEGO employee on this matter. The set hasn't been sold for seven years and the character died ten years ago, there is no need for LEGO to consider this set to be Lhikan's set form.

[Takhamavahu]

I somewhat like the idea of this Hau design being Noble, but that would mean Toa Lhikan's set form is not canon. And that's a little negligee.

 

It's all about continuity. "Sure, go ahead" just doesn't cut it sometimes.

 

It doesn't mean it's not canon, it just means that his unique Hau finally has an explaination- that he elected to have it molded into the noble shape, like how Norik's Pehuki looks like a noble Kiril.

[Friend of Fire]

 

I like the implication that Lhikan's Hau has been the noble shape all along. Otherwise we have no canon noble Hau part, but an extra, superfluous great Hau mold for no reason.

Agreed. The Movie version of Toa Lhikan's Hau looks more like a regular Tahu-style Hau to me, and his movie Noble Hau looks like both of his set's Haus. So in my headcanon, Lhikan wears a standard Great Hau as a Toa, and the "Lhikan" Hau as a Turaga.

 

 

 

 

I somewhat like the idea of this Hau design being Noble, but that would mean Toa Lhikan's set form is not canon. And that's a little negligee.

 

It's all about continuity. "Sure, go ahead" just doesn't cut it sometimes.

 

It doesn't mean it's not canon, it just means that his unique Hau finally has an explaination- that he elected to have it molded into the noble shape, like how Norik's Pehuki looks like a noble Kiril.

 

 

I just always preferred to think of it as a noble version. And Toa wearing masks that weren't there proper shape was a thing (like always, look to Toa Norik). Plus, what exactly would be the point behind marking noble masks with a black top if it wasn't to discern it from a great one that looked just like the noble version. Remember, there is a reason behind things being done a certain way, even if that certain way was never fully explained in relation to certain characters.