How did the Kal know?

[TERIDAX941]

I have been following this post here and was contemplating posting this under it, since to me it seems very silly, but as I thought about it more, a lot more questions appeared regarding the topic so I decided to make a larger discussion about it.

But enough prattling, here goes:

 

How did the Bohrok-Kal know about the Nuva Symbols, particularly in regard to the fact that they would take away the Toa's powers if they were stolen? They had never seen them before, Toa Nuva never existed before, and the Nuva Symbols just happened to appear coincidentally when the Toa transformed, which they also had no way of knowing. On that note, the Nuva cube was created by Artahka too, which meant he purposefully made it possible for someone other than the Toa themselves to unlock the Bahrag queens. Was it all a failsafe to ensure the queens weren't stuck there forever if the Toa were incapacitated? Was he worried that the Toa would never willingly unleash the Bohrok again after their ordeal? Was he the one who planted the idea of stealing the symbols in the Kal's mind?

 

Anyways, please discuss I'm curious.

 

 

[ALVIS]

I don't believe Greg has ever stated for what purpose Artakha made the symbols, but I quite like your idea - that he was trying to ensure the Bahrag could eventually be freed. Perhaps he never foresaw that the theft of the symbols would cause the Nuva to lose their powers entirely.

[Cheesy Mac n Cheese]

Ever since Greg revealed that Artakha made the Nuva Cube and Nuva Symbols, it's bothered me that there was no logical explanation for a good character to create such dangerous and debilitating artifacts that could hinder the progress of the most important Toa in the universe. While your theory is plausible, as I recall, the Toa Nuva freed the Bahrag the same way they trapped them, rendering the Nuva Cube useless.

 

Perhaps the Nuva Cue was designed by the marketing department and then the story team was forced to make up a story about it, rather than the other way around.

[The Hip Historian Iaredios]

The whole Kal part of the lore was weak and I tend to forget about it. I like your theory though.

[TERIDAX941]

Perhaps the Nuva Cue was designed by the marketing department and then the story team was forced to make up a story about it, rather than the other way around.

I always thought that might hold true, story of the heroes getting new powers but then their new foes steal them away so they're forced to use their teamwork and brains for a change instead of just blasting their way to victory like they did before. Although it would've been cool to see the Toa's and the Kal's powers pitted against each other like that.

[SPIRIT]

What makes sense to me is that Artakha would've made the Nuva Cube and Symbols as a safeguard against the Bahrag, and never anticipated the Kal.  The Brotherhood of Makuta were worried about them too, placing Exo-Toa nearby to stand guard against them too.  No one really knew what the Bohrok were, but it was clear that they were numerous and that they posed a serious threat to Metru Nui and the safety and security of the Matoran Universe.

 

(Which is really weird because they were designed to remove the camouflage from the Giant Robot's face, but if there were Bohrok stored underneath Metru Nui, surely someone would've seen them marching off to complete this task.  Unless the camouflage was only ever used on Aqua Magna, which would also be weird because that's the point of having the system in the first place if it's never used?  And then how many Av-Matoran had to die for this really inefficient cleaning system to be functional?!)

Look, just don't go too far down the rabbit hole of retcons.

 

Lost my train of thought...

 

Okay, so Artakha makes the cage and the lock, because he knows Bohrok are important, but what he doesn't expect is that the Bahrag would be one step ahead of him by making six Elite Bohrok that are immune to the effects of the cage.  So either the Bahrag knew specifically about the cage, or they surmised that they might face some threat of that nature.

 

Now, as to who put the idea to steal the symbols in the Kal's head, we already know this.  They had a psychic connection to the Bahrag, since the Bahrag awakened them.  It stands to reason that the Bahrag would've also told the Kal to look for symbols that matched the lock on their cage.

[TERIDAX941]

  No one really knew what the Bohrok were, but it was clear that they were numerous and that they posed a serious threat to Metru Nui and the safety and security of the Matoran Universe.

 

Well we know that Teridax knew what the Bohrok were eventually... not sure if he knew from the get go, or if he did a lot of studying and figured it out. Maybe he learned it from Mutran and his Tren Krom experience?

 

 

Which is really weird because they were designed to remove the camouflage from the Giant Robot's face, but if there were Bohrok stored underneath Metru Nui, surely someone would've seen them marching off to complete this task.  Unless the camouflage was only ever used on Aqua Magna, which would also be weird because that's the point of having the system in the first place if it's never used?

Maybe the ones in Metru Nui were the backup groups, in case they ran into a big enough problem and a whole section of the swarms were taken out? It would appear that those under Metru Nui didn't awaken when the other Bohrok were needed to clean Mata Nui, because they were still asleep during Destiny War when Krakua awoke them, and by that time, the Mata Nui Bohrok had already finished cleaning the Island, and the Metru Nui inhabitants apparently didn't mention that those Bohrok had already been out and about.

 

 

Okay, so Artakha makes the cage and the lock, because he knows Bohrok are important, but what he doesn't expect is that the Bahrag would be one step ahead of him by making six Elite Bohrok that are immune to the effects of the cage.  So either the Bahrag knew specifically about the cage, or they surmised that they might face some threat of that nature.

 

Now, as to who put the idea to steal the symbols in the Kal's head, we already know this.  They had a psychic connection to the Bahrag, since the Bahrag awakened them.  It stands to reason that the Bahrag would've also told the Kal to look for symbols that matched the lock on their cage.

Well, he made the lock and key not necessarily the cage but I get what you're saying. Though I'm not 100% sure about how the Bahrag would communicate with the Kal. They were designed with the entire purpose of functioning without the Bahrag's guidance, (that's the entire reason the swarms were disabled in the first place, the cage cut off the mental link with their Krana). Now the Ca-Kal had the ability to sense their minds and was directly linked to them, so that they could sense their presence, but I'm not sure if that allowed communication. Also it appeared that the Bahrag went into a sort of hibernation after being locked because the entire purpose of the Xa-Kal was to reawaken the queens which according to the book and comic was done before the symbols were put on the cube. And even if all of that can be explained, how would the Bahrag know what a Toa Nuva was, and that there would be weird symbols that no one had ever seen before somewhere around that could fit into this cube lock that had materialized out of nowhere?

 

I like your theories though! Great insight!  

 

EDIT: I looked over at Biosector01 and it does confirm that the Bahrag informed the Kal about the symbols/cube etc. So I guess it just leads to the question of how the Bahrag knew about those I suppose...

Edited February 24, 2017 by Iron_Man5

[Cheesy Mac n Cheese]

(Which is really weird because they were designed to remove the camouflage from the Giant Robot's face, but if there were Bohrok stored underneath Metru Nui, surely someone would've seen them marching off to complete this task.  Unless the camouflage was only ever used on Aqua Magna, which would also be weird because that's the point of having the system in the first place if it's never used?  And then how many Av-Matoran had to die for this really inefficient cleaning system to be functional?!)

 

I actually just asked Greg about this because it was bothering me. but who knows if he'll answer it before the boards shut down? Maybe Mata Nui could normally clean himself off, but the Bohrok were intended as a failsafe in case he were unable to do so. The Great Beings thought of almost everything else, so why not that?

 

EDIT: From Chat with Greg Farshtey:

 

 

The original idea was that they would be the key to unlocking the Bahrag in the event they were trapped or hindered in some way. Yes, their loss causes potential problems, but so would stealing a Toa's Kanohi. Anything powerful has the potential to be taken and either used against you or hurt you by virtue of your no longer having access. I don't think you need to look for some deep, dark motivation here.

 

So at least now we have confirmation on why Artakha made the Nuva Symbols and Nuva Cube. Just waiting on whether or not the Bohrok were deployed and cleaned the island more than once now...

Edited February 25, 2017 by Cheesy Mac n Cheese

[Toa of Italy]

The explanation behind the Nuva Cube being that it was a mechanism to release the Bahrag should the Toa Nuva be dead or otherwise unable to do so seems reasonable enough. I would only add this one question: has it been confirmed that the only Toa that can undo a Toa Seal are those who created it? Or would any six Toa of the same elements suffice?

 

The creation of the Nuva Symbols isn't as easy to explain. Ok, to make the Nuva Cube work you need Nuva Symbols to fit into it, but it doesn't fully convince me. For a start, it would imply that Artakha can just take six Toa and bind their powers to a symbol which, if stolen, erases those same powers. It must also be taken into consideration that, while the Bahrag had an important role to play, so did the Toa Nuva: they were destined to awaken Mata Nui and save the universe. Given their importance, it seems odd that Artakha would purposefully weaken them in such a dramatic way (yes, Greg's argument was that a Kanohi is also a weakness, but the loss of a Kanohi doesn't mean a complete loss of elemental power and in any case can be dealt with more easily, for instance by finding a new mask to replace the old one, and masks were the one thing that the island of Mata Nui didn't seem to lack).

So now let me present a new theory: what if the symbols were actually necessary? In theory, the Toa Nuva had more power than ordinary Toa; it might be that such power was so great that their bodies couldn't actually contain it: after all, transformations caused by Energized Protodermis are far from perfect. Thus, the symbols could have been created to compensate for this, with the collateral effect that, should they wind up in enemy hands, the powers of the Toa Nuva would vanish. Having made the symbols, Artakha realized that he could kill two birds with one stone and therefore made the Nuva Cube so that the symbols could be fitted into it and release the Bahrag, should it prove necessary.

 

And now, to the original question: how did the Kal know? Ok, BS01 says the Bahrag told them. Does anyone know the source of that information? Because it's odd. It took the Bohrok-Kal some time to track down the Bahrag. If the queens had been capable of communicating such detailed information to the Kal, perhaps via the Krana Ca-Kal, surely they could have told them where they were. Plus, as someone has already said, how did the queens know that the cube that appeared in front of their cage was capable of unlocking it? And even if they had guessed it, how were they supposed to know that it worked by fitting six symbols that appeared on Mata Nui after their imprisonment? True, we could theorize that Artakha himself told them and so on, but it still doesn't solve the first issue and, in addition, I don't see why Artakha should have wanted to endanger the Matoran of Mata Nui by having the Bohrok swarms released while they were still on the island.

 

Let me therefore, again, propose another theory. What if, instead, it was Makuta who told the Bohrok-Kal about the symbols? We know he was lurking beneath the island at the time, rebuilding his strength after his first defeat at the hands of the Toa Mata. In BIONICLE Chronicles #3: Makuta's Revenge he even appears, announcing the release of the Kal and observing with amusement the numerous defeats of the Toa Nuva at their hands (true, those books are semi-canon, but I don't see any reason to dismiss that particular scene). Makuta, at that time, was still intent on delaying the Toa and the Matoran as much as he could, just as he had done by releasing the Bohrok swarms ahead of schedule, so it is reasonable to assume that he would have done (almost) all he could to aid the Bohrok-Kal in their mission. We could wonder how Makuta knew how the symbols and the cube worked. However, unlike the Bahrag, he was free to observe everything occurring on the island and I think that, given his intellect and knowledge, he was in a far better position than the queens to figure out everything. As for why the Kal trusted his information, the answer is that Makuta gave it to them the same way he communicated to the Piraka the existence of the Mask of Life. The Bohrok-Kal didn't know where the information had come from, but they instinctively trusted it (again, like the Piraka); they might even have assumed it came from the Bahrag. But it was actually Makuta, using them as his pawns, just as he had done many times before.

 

This is my theory. Feel free to comment upon it (or take it apart).

[TERIDAX941]

Well, I applaud you for the very thorough detail of your theory. It definitely makes sense, I hadn't read "Makuta's Revenge" in awhile (come to think of it, that's an odd title considering that the Kal weren't necessarily his revenge *unless* the revenge was the Kal stealing the powers and defeating the Toa again and again and again).

 

I like what you said about the Nuva powers being too much to contain in their bodies, I could be wrong, but wasn't that discussed/confirmed elsewhere? Something about the Symbols being extra batteries to store all the excess power that a normal Toa couldn't hold, and that's why they were able to overload the Kal with the energy? Not 100% sure, so feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.

 

I like your theory definitely, I think I'll consider that my head-canon, whether it's true or not. I think someone above said they were going to ask Greg, so I'm still curious as to what he might say on the matter, even though it may or may not be to our likings *coughglatoriangreatbeingscough* 

[Wiriamu]

You could also consider that, at least according to BIONICLE World, Mata Nui was never supposed to be inhabited. Undoubtedly the idea was that the Kal would function as a safeguard in the event that the Bahrag were impaired, and would have sought out the Toa Nuva on Metru Nui or wherever to obtain the symbols, which would probably have gone a lot more peaceably since it wouldn't be the Nuva turning over their power symbols to a group of beings they had just fought to save an island from. The idea was probably that, were the Kal needed, they could go, obtain the Nuva symbols, free the Bahrag, and then return the symbols to the Nuva so that the Nuva could wake up Mata Nui.

[TERIDAX941]

The only problem is that their still robbing to Nuva of their powers for a particular length of time, wouldn't it be easier for the Nuva to just go and free the Bahrag themselves? Or are you saying that the Nuva Symbols were needed no matter who or what trapped the Bahrag?

 

That makes me wonder then, what if the Kal and the Nuva were on friendly terms, and they gave them the symbols willingly, would that still rob their powers away? Also, there's the question of what if the Bahrag weren't just trapped but seriously injured or similarly incapacitated? The Kal have no healing abilities, how would they have been useful then? Did the Bahrag just assume the only way the swarms would be stopped is to block the mental connection one way or another, in which the Kal would basically muscle their way through whoever/whatever did such a thing and set things right somehow?

[Toa of Ice - 1987]

The whole Kal part of the lore was weak and I tend to forget about it. I like your theory though.

Yea i too prefer to think that it never really happened. It was so short and pointless and a terrible weakness for newly revealed nuva.

[Wiriamu]

It does occur to me that the Kal really were a desperate last resort-I get the impression that the Toa Nuva were always meant to free/unleash the Bahrag, given that it was on that scroll. Most likely the Kal were created as a safeguard against the Nuva being killed or even corrupted and interfering with the mission of the Bohrok.

[TERIDAX941]

Fair enough! Although I often wonder what the Kal would've done if the EP killed the Toa Mata after they trapped the Bahrag instead of transforming them. (Alternate Universe anyone)