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Zaktan's Protodermis Mining & The Mu - A Theory


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"You've obviously never been in a real proto mine"Reidak answered. "I don't mean the kind Matoran work in - I mean real protodermis mines, where it's not just a job; it's a death sentence. "

 Recently, I was looking at another topic on this here forum ( :) ), which dealt with deceased Matoran. A lot of that debate deals in Matoran scavenging parts off their dead, which would apply if the Matoran Universe is a closed circle of matter and energy. If that were the case, I would imagine that said parts would have to be reused or recycled in some manner. But there is actually evidence to the contrary. I propose that the Matoran Universe is NOT a closed circle of matter and energy. There is actually energy inputs into this system. These inputs come in the form of protodermis, found on the planets that Mata Nui was visiting. These planetary deposits would, theoretically speaking, been placed there by the Great Beings prior to Mata Nui's departure of Spherus Magna. Why would the robot need inputs? The second law of thermodynamics seems to apply in Bionicle, seeing as the Matoran have to accept energy inputs. And the robot has to have heating systems, seeing as it is traveling through space with living beings inside it. While the robot does have an extermely thick hull to prevent such energy loss, we are talking about the difference between the temperature suitable for life and that of space, which is freezing cold (understatement). Multiplied by the robot's rather large surface area, this would translate to a small, if signifigant, amount of energy being lost over time. Greg has confirmed the existance of heating and ventilation systems, which would require energy to use, energy that might not be easily reabsorbed. (Not to mention the system of artificial gravity)I could also argue that the MU robot would likely need some sort of system to move when the robot is in space (to change direction). This would likely involve projecting energy into space. The Red Star might help with this process, but even it has to get its energy from somewhere ( who knows where). I think there was a reference to Makuta, while in command of the MU, using "rockets" to get from Aqua Magna to Bara Magna, but that could simply be a reference to him using the Red Star, so I'm not going to go overboard with that.  The entropy by its own is likely good enough reason.  Also, it would not be too far out of line for the Great Beings to try to influence where their creation should go; they might have given him a certain amount of free reign, but they wouldn't have wanted the MU to run amok like their other creations ( which would be a major league disaster that could destroy multiple planets; Makuta=Exhibit A). It would also conveniently explain why the GBs did not interfere major league (alternate GBs in the other universe are an exception here) in the big battle between the two giant robots, because even if Makuta won, he would be unable to do universe wrecking damage because his energy would run down. But, logically speaking, this energy loss would be rather small, especially when Mata Nui was on a planet (optimum temprature and air already there, especially on Aqua Magna), which meant that Makuta had enough energy to power up the robot when he did. (Passage between Mata Nui and Metru Nui= energy saving ventilation shafts?) Logically, energy reactors in the MU (fuel) would be protodermis, since everything in the MU (last I checked) is made of protodermis.  And the sophisticated sensors of the MU would likely pick up such deposits. ***Enter Zaktan, and that quote from Legacy of Evil. What confuses me is to why proto mining would be hazerdous; or even a death sentence in the MU. If proto is composing everything in the MU, then why is mining hazerdous? Inside the MU, I would imagine it as a strip mining operation to harvest the proto that's right beneath your feet. There were caves in Po-Metru; but those were made by Matoran. This "real proto mining" was deemed too hazerdous for Matoran, so much that they hired ill-tempered people like Zaktan to do it. The term "mining" refers to the extraction of one mineral from another; the only other time we see the term used is in Mata Nui, which is not in the MU. I propose that a certain number of individuals, like Zaktan and other Skakdi, who were considered expendable, were sent outside the MU when the robot landed on a planet with a protodermis deposit on it, which would occur, albeit infrequently. This would be "mined" from the surrounding areas. Said deposits would be placed underground in the first place to avoid the detection of the native inhabitants, but they might still have an interest in the mining operation. Said mining would likely occur in tunnel-mining fashion in order to quickly get what the robot needed with a minimum of attention (strip mines are pretty obvious!) The beings who did this mining would likely have to shield themselves from the natives, not to mention the possible tunnel collapse...hence the powerful beings and the danger involved. Even more important, and dangerous, would be the knowledge involved; possible exposure to aliens and learning that they are invaders; carrying of proto to fuel chambers, and just plain flat knowing that they move in and out of a universe that moves would be knowledge that nobody wants in the wrong hands. The easiest way to prevent that knowledge from being spread? Kill them all. Somehow, Zaktan slipped through the crack. Or maybe he was reserved enough, possibly horrified enough that he wouldn't talk; they just shoved a death threat in his face and shoved him on his way. (That, and I think TSO rescued him for some reason - there's evidence that some of the other Piraka, likely Reidak and Avak, were involved or at least familiar)  Maybe Zaktan didn't fully get it until he read Makuta's plan on the walls of the fortress. There was obviously joy in that moment; I think the mystery behind the horrors he had seen haunted him for years, and its resolution changed him from the retisent and creepy to the proud; he knew something everyone else did not, and that quickly went to his head. So go and like Mata Nui examine my theory, and consider the holes bigger than Zaktan that art present there. 
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The thing I don't get is protodermis being on other planets. Protodermis is a synthetic version of Energized Protodermis created by the Great Beings. Solid protodermis (a variant) wouldn't be a natural thing on other planets, as it was created by Great Beings.Also, I'm not too sure about the Great Beings and other planets. They certainly know they exist, but they've never known them in particular or have been able to study them, nevertheless plant protodermis there.Otherwise, it's a very logical theory. Must have taken a while to think of, even more type it all up!

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Also, I'm not too sure about the Great Beings and other planets. They certainly know they exist, but they've never known them in particular or have been able to study them, nevertheless plant protodermis there.

I beg to differ. First of all, how do you know the GBs know nothing about other planets? Just because they sent Mata Nui to study planets doesn't mean they don't know anything about them. They must have a way of interplanetary travel, seeing as they got off of SM before it shattered, and it would seem that a race as creative and inteligent as they are would have the desire to explore other planets. Human beings are inteligent and creative, and we do space exploration; I don't think it would be too much of a stretch to say the GBs would likely try it out, at least. Further, the fact that they designed the MU to travel through space clearly indicates that they would likely have some sort of space travel technology. They certainly believed that studying other planets would allow Mata Nui to find the solution to fix the broken planet; so I wouldn't say they would not know anything about other planets. As for why the GBs would place these deposits on other planets, I kinda already explained that; the limitation in the MU bot was to keep the robot on a leash. It could only go so far before it needed refueling, which would likely influence its direction and prevent it from wandering off. If the robot went rogue, the Great Beings would know about where it was and could go in and shut it off before it killed a bunch of innocent intergalactic denizens.
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Also, I'm not too sure about the Great Beings and other planets. They certainly know they exist, but they've never known them in particular or have been able to study them, nevertheless plant protodermis there.

I beg to differ.First of all, how do you know the GBs know nothing about other planets? Just because they sent Mata Nui to study planets doesn't mean they don't know anything about them. They must have a way of interplanetary travel, seeing as they got off of SM before it shattered, and it would seem that a race as creative and inteligent as they are would have the desire to explore other planets. Human beings are inteligent and creative, and we do space exploration; I don't think it would be too much of a stretch to say the GBs would likely try it out, at least. Further, the fact that they designed the MU to travel through space clearly indicates that they would likely have some sort of space travel technology. They certainly believed that studying other planets would allow Mata Nui to find the solution to fix the broken planet; so I wouldn't say they would not know anything about other planets.As for why the GBs would place these deposits on other planets, I kinda already explained that; the limitation in the MU bot was to keep the robot on a leash. It could only go so far before it needed refueling, which would likely influence its direction and prevent it from wandering off. If the robot went rogue, the Great Beings would know about where it was and could go in and shut it off before it killed a bunch of innocent intergalactic denizens.
Well, that does make more sense. Also, we don't know if they got off Spherus Magna, we don't really know where they are, though some could theorize they are on Spherus Magna, due to Maraender breaking out onto the planet.I also don't know whether or not they would have restricted Mata Nui's wanderings, though you give so many good examples, it's hard to see why not.

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With regards to the probability of GB space exploration: do recall that they were capable of interdimensional telepathy, or at least the cursed GB was. Any civilization that can transmit messages across dimensions surely would have been able to transport objects to other planets.

"You are not entitled to your opinion. You are entitled to your informed opinion. No one is entitled to be ignorant."
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With regards to the probability of GB space exploration: do recall that they were capable of interdimensional telepathy, or at least the cursed GB was. Any civilization that can transmit messages across dimensions surely would have been able to transport objects to other planets.

That is a good point... that was a normal ability of his, wasn't it?

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Wow. That's a very good theory. It is also a really cool idea. Dangerous and rogue beings sent to strange planets to mine for protodermis, and getting killed afterwards. I can't find any loopholes at all. If Greg was still able to contact us, I propose this idea to the story squad.Also, it's only a matter of time before it gets bonesiii's Key to Nongu award.

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Not sure if I'm understanding all of this right, but it's a reasonable theory that Mata Nui would have to mine for more EP. But I doubt it, because draining EP from SM's core caused the Shattering. Admittedly he could take just a small amount but it seems unlikely to me he was supposed to go around risking causing Shatterings on every world he visited, when curing a Shattering was the whole reason he was made.Also, there are many ways EP might recharge its own energy, especially something like zero point energy. The Entity appears to be able to appear in any EP pool which to me implies abilities like this beyond normal physics.I don't think the GBs planted EP. It seems clear they discovered it or learned of it anew when others on SM did. I think either it really is fully natural or something like my Original Beings theory is the case (or both, if the EP is the original beings).Any mining in rock is hazardous. Usually protodermis mining seems to refer either to liquid purified protodermis, or to mining EP itself. It could also refer to mining any number of types of proto-rock and similar matter-mimicking materials just as we mine for a variety of solid materials. The key is to keep in mind that all protodermis is not the same, so you can't assume that the specific type of protodermic material right under their feet is the kind they want.So, are you saying that Zaktan's mines are from him and others being sent outside the MU to mine energized protodermis? I was a little unclear on that.

The Destiny of Bionicle (chronological retelling of Bionicle original series, 9 PDFs of 10 chapters each on Google Drive)Part 1 - Warring with Fate | Part 2 - Year of Change | Part 3 - The Exploration Trap | Part 4 - Rise of the Warlords | Part 5 - A Busy Matoran | Part 6 - The Dark Time | Part 7 - Proving Grounds | Part 8 - A Rude Awakening | Part 9 - The Battle of Giants

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Not sure if I'm understanding all of this right, but it's a reasonable theory that Mata Nui would have to mine for more EP. But I doubt it, because draining EP from SM's core caused the Shattering. Admittedly he could take just a small amount but it seems unlikely to me he was supposed to go around risking causing Shatterings on every world he visited, when curing a Shattering was the whole reason he was made.Also, there are many ways EP might recharge its own energy, especially something like zero point energy. The Entity appears to be able to appear in any EP pool which to me implies abilities like this beyond normal physics.I don't think the GBs planted EP. It seems clear they discovered it or learned of it anew when others on SM did. I think either it really is fully natural or something like my Original Beings theory is the case (or both, if the EP is the original beings).Any mining in rock is hazardous. Usually protodermis mining seems to refer either to liquid purified protodermis, or to mining EP itself. It could also refer to mining any number of types of proto-rock and similar matter-mimicking materials just as we mine for a variety of solid materials. The key is to keep in mind that all protodermis is not the same, so you can't assume that the specific type of protodermic material right under their feet is the kind they want.So, are you saying that Zaktan's mines are from him and others being sent outside the MU to mine energized protodermis? I was a little unclear on that.

Not energized proto, bones. Standard solid proto. And yes, Zaktan was being sent outside the MU to mine said solid protodermis.Mining solid protodermis in the MU would be hazardous, but it would not be a death sentence. In order for that to be so, there would have to be a legitimate reason for them to kill the miners off.
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It could just as easily be deadly in either case, as it involves going down into caves. The "death sentence" line was probably poetic/figure of speech anyways, and Reidak trying to be impressive. :P It may also be more about who you are mining with (like Skakdi), versus Matoran who are generally kind and not warlike. Could be wrong though.

Edited by bonesiii

The Destiny of Bionicle (chronological retelling of Bionicle original series, 9 PDFs of 10 chapters each on Google Drive)Part 1 - Warring with Fate | Part 2 - Year of Change | Part 3 - The Exploration Trap | Part 4 - Rise of the Warlords | Part 5 - A Busy Matoran | Part 6 - The Dark Time | Part 7 - Proving Grounds | Part 8 - A Rude Awakening | Part 9 - The Battle of Giants

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Okay, I will freely admit that mining is hazerdous, okay? But we have seen Matoran mine before, on Mata Nui Island. There's also the tunnels in Po-Metru in Metru Nui, which would indicate, likely as not, some solid proto extraction going on (seeing as what the builders were making and all that).Now Matoran are pretty good workers; for something that Matoran would not be used for the mining, and instead Skakdi, who have to be forced into submission to do anything of forced labor, the cost in Matoran life would have be too high to merit their use, as they tend to be good workers and would be more productive than a bunch of miscrants in a mine. Also, because of said productivity rating, the Matoran would be valuable, but Skakdi would not. Whoever was in charge of said mining operation viewed the miners as expendable. Usually any well meaning enterprise wants its workers to keep kicking; dead people don't work. I don't think a Skakdi warlord, if he was running a mine, would hesitate to steal a number of nearby Matoran instead of hiring his less-than-reliable colleagues. I would imagine some other, more powerful organization would have ran the mine, like the Order or the Brotherhood (but not the Dark Hunters). Given that, I was trying to explain in my head why either would resort to using Skakdi for a mine. Granted, the Brotherhood might have done the whole thing out of pure spite, trying to get some extermely valuable mineral or something, but I'm blanking as to what that "extermely valuable mineral" might be. That kind of leaves the Unscrupulous Order of Mata Nui, and this theory. :shrugs:

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Keep in mind, though, that the Brotherhood was enforcing a quarantine on Zakaz, so the Skakdi weren't allowed to leave or bring in outside workers. Although there were exceptions (one was a theme in the recent S&T contest), it was usually enforced well. If they needed to mine, they would pretty much have to use Skakdi workers.So I think it's most likely he's simply talking about who you mine with, and probably poor mining conditions and safety precautions, as everything on Zakaz is generally crumbling due to extreme neglect, and the people running the mine probably care more about quick results than safety.

The Destiny of Bionicle (chronological retelling of Bionicle original series, 9 PDFs of 10 chapters each on Google Drive)Part 1 - Warring with Fate | Part 2 - Year of Change | Part 3 - The Exploration Trap | Part 4 - Rise of the Warlords | Part 5 - A Busy Matoran | Part 6 - The Dark Time | Part 7 - Proving Grounds | Part 8 - A Rude Awakening | Part 9 - The Battle of Giants

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