Thank ye kindly, Dokuma and CF.

 

Now, more quotes!

 

I still don't see why adaptive armor has to make everyone dark bley, but oh well...

Well, it does work very well to create the armored appearance (on Lewa more than Kopaka, though), since there's nothing to suggest full body armor if they all have their original colors. Mind you, given free reign I'd just make all of them using their proper color schemes, but again this is working with the adaptive armor story...

 

Why the change in torso armor?

 

Just ditch the Nuva shoulders ...

Because Toa Nuva = Nuva armor. Basic point of all my redesigns. It's the single clearest way to establish the group identity, and it's also the single most defining trait of the Nuva. Nothing more to it.

Correction: Toa Nuva used to equal Nuva Armor. To be more specific, Toa Nuva equalled silver weapons and Nuva armor. Then came the Toa Nuva. Suddenly, Toa Nuva simply equalled Nuva Armor. And I was satisfied.

Enter Toa Norik. In one set LEGO managed to largely obliterate the exclusivity of Nuva armor. While I still prefer to avoid the use of Nuva torso armor on any Toa, or pretty much on anything besides Toa Nuva, the exclusivity of Nuva armor to the Nuva today looks to be only so much talk.

Not that this is necessarily a bad thing. I think the armor Kopaka Nuva wears in his Phantoka form is fabulous for him, but of course this is merely personal preference and I can't argue with your decision to maintain this aspect of continuity. Still, some further stylization would be nice, but you seem to discuss that below. Let's read on...

As to the stylistic mentions, the rest of him is quite smooth already (as you mentioned), notably the Piraka legs, and the Inika thigh armor's reasonably sleek as well. So, the general lack of texture on the chest and shoulder armor doesn't exactly stand out in a negative way. And again, the point is to be simple and sleek, just like the original Nuva armor.

 

Also bear in mind that a real piece would have more subtle texturing by its very nature; there's only so much you can do in a sketch to show general appearances...

True indeed. Still, it might be worthwhile just for the sake of maintaining that beautiful aspect of the set by modifying the lower part of the Nuva armor to reflect the more segmented look of his armor in the set. I'm certain nothing crucial would be lost from the stylistic consistency in his teammates, as the armor already bears the frame armor it needs for Pohatu, and Lewa has scarcely any consistency to his current torso that would not be found to a similar extent in your version. I might doodle a design sometime to show you how I think the design could be done without removing the recognition of this part as Nuva armor. "Simple and sleek," though, still exists in the lower part of the Jaller Inika style torso armor, even if it would need to be greatly modified to fit the shape of the Nuva armor.

Agreed about the subtle texturing.

One thing I'll definitely agree on is the Metru thigh armor, which is incessantly annoying that way. However, it's the only thing that works there – if I used Inika thigh armor (like the set), his arms would have to be disproportionately long; and the Nuva shoulder armor certainly isn't going anywhere. Ideally I'd like there to be a new Metru-thigh-armor-esque piece that's just smooth, but that would require a new mold, of course...

True, I suppose. Still, perhaps it is in your interest to redesign the shoulder armor piece in question so that it is able to stand alone without the need of the stylistically lacking Metru thigh armor.

Speaking of wings, I can't remember why you wanted avian wings. ...

This is one of those things that could go either way infinitely. I think the airplane wings look boring, ugly, and borrowed directly from the real world, and as a result I hate them, especially on Kopaka. You, by contrast, like them for exactly those reasons (except that you don't think they're boring and ugly). So nothing's going to change either of our thoughts on them.

 

But what I can say is this: this sort of avian-based design can fulfill all the "technological" requirements you list for Kopaka. They're certainly not soft and fluffy; they're made of sharp metal blades. They have plenty a machine look through the practical pistons you like so much, too – the only thing they borrow from the organic origin is the general principle; everything about them is metal and mechanized. So they count as both machine and cold, hard, and sharp as ice just as much as the airplane wings do, really.

 

So in this case it really is just a matter of taste. You like the airplane wings. I hate them and like angelic wings better (and also think Kopaka with angel wings is glorious). Both fulfill Kopaka-requirements. End of story. : /

Still, I have to say that even avian wings need a bit of stylization. Of course they aren't going to look in the set as they do in your pic, but still a little of the sharpness might be worth toning down so as to make him look less villainous. It is his role as a hero that leads me to prefer the airplane wings, and even with avian wings that role must be preserved.

On a related note, who here thinks Greg should have skipped the story explanation for the eye color change and just say "yeah, they changed, it just happened like that"? No offense, but the "eye filter" explanation is so dodgy that it becomes more of a problem than the color change itself was.

Yes and no. Just saying "it happened; deal with it" is instant death in the realm of plots. The obvious solution was just to give them their original eye colors and not have to make up an awkward explanation for the rest – the "filter" works from the front, but not from any other angle...

Yes but as I said, we don't even know that they'll be using Metru-styled heads again next year, so for all we know it's too late for the introduction of proper eye colors to be a sound decision. Then again, I suppose the truncated variety is useable in other Technic or System sets, but who knows how long it would be before even those uses got tiresome?

Dokuma – Yeah, I've considered doing that on Lewa (with the reversed-armor thing); I'll have to sketch it more to decide how it looks on him... Eh, I think red with Kopaka and blue with Gali is slightly better, if one of them has to have red – Gali has all her blue to stand as her saturated color; Kopaka doesn't have any of that, so the red both works better appeal-wise and color-wise on him. Shame they couldn't both have blue.

Karzahni's Servant – No Jaller Mahri armor anywhere around here... it's just a single new chest piece.

Aanchir!

Correction: Toa Nuva used to equal Nuva Armor. To be more specific, Toa Nuva equalled silver weapons and Nuva armor. Then came the Toa Nuva. Suddenly, Toa Nuva simply equalled Nuva Armor. And I was satisfied.

 

Enter Toa Norik. In one set LEGO managed to largely obliterate the exclusivity of Nuva armor. While I still prefer to avoid the use of Nuva torso armor on any Toa, or pretty much on anything besides Toa Nuva, the exclusivity of Nuva armor to the Nuva today looks to be only so much talk.

Well, to date only the Nuva have had both Nuva chest and shoulder armor combined – I think you're misremembering Norik's Metrutoran chest as a Nuva chest.

But regardless, the point is this: the full Nuva armor assembly immediately makes one think of Toa Nuva, regardless of who it's on. Thus, it's the simplest and most straightforward way to communicate the Toa Phantoka and Mistika's identity.

True, I suppose. Still, perhaps it is in your interest to redesign the shoulder armor piece in question so that it is able to stand alone without the need of the stylistically lacking Metru thigh armor.

I had it that way originally, attaching like the Inika shoulder armor – but it looked worse that way. Like that, there's only silver over grey on his upper arms; he desperately needed white there (and Pohatu needed orange) to balance out his color scheme. So it's a slight stylistic inconsistency to fix a far worse color scheme problem.

Still, I have to say that even avian wings need a bit of stylization. Of course they aren't going to look in the set as they do in your pic, but still a little of the sharpness might be worth toning down so as to make him look less villainous. It is his role as a hero that leads me to prefer the airplane wings, and even with avian wings that role must be preserved.

Again, stylization would be better handled in a real mold than just a concept picture, since I'm awful at designing such things from scratch... And I really doubt his allegiance would be called into question just because his wings are (to use Bones's phrase) ruthlessly elegant while the rest is smooth and streamlined and typically heroic.

Yes but as I said, we don't even know that they'll be using Metru-styled heads again next year, so for all we know it's too late for the introduction of proper eye colors to be a sound decision. Then again, I suppose the truncated variety is useable in other Technic or System sets, but who knows how long it would be before even those uses got tiresome?

I'd be shocked if they stopped using them any time soon. They're simple, practical in all respects, and have worked for four years now; no evident need to change...

Dokuma – Yeah, I've considered doing that on Lewa (with the reversed-armor thing); I'll have to sketch it more to decide how it looks on him... Eh, I think red with Kopaka and blue with Gali is slightly better, if one of them has to have red – Gali has all her blue to stand as her saturated color; Kopaka doesn't have any of that, so the red both works better appeal-wise and color-wise on him. Shame they couldn't both have blue.

 

Karzahni's Servant – No Jaller Mahri armor anywhere around here... it's just a single new chest piece.

 

Aanchir!

 

Correction: Toa Nuva used to equal Nuva Armor. To be more specific, Toa Nuva equalled silver weapons and Nuva armor. Then came the Toa Nuva. Suddenly, Toa Nuva simply equalled Nuva Armor. And I was satisfied.

 

Enter Toa Norik. In one set LEGO managed to largely obliterate the exclusivity of Nuva armor. While I still prefer to avoid the use of Nuva torso armor on any Toa, or pretty much on anything besides Toa Nuva, the exclusivity of Nuva armor to the Nuva today looks to be only so much talk.

Well, to date only the Nuva have had both Nuva chest and shoulder armor combined – I think you're misremembering Norik's Metrutoran chest as a Nuva chest.

Nay, I acknowledge that Norik had Metruan chest armor. Nevertheless, it's kind of a stretch any more to talk about the Nuva armor being some defining trait of the Nuva. It used to be special, as I noted, simply for being metallic, and of course that has no meaning any more. So while the Nuva did have Nuva armor, there is very little that remains "special" about it and I don't find it critical to defining these sets as Nuva. Still, as I said, further stylization can fix it to be more reflective of the Nuva's other motifs.

But regardless, the point is this: the full Nuva armor assembly immediately makes one think of Toa Nuva, regardless of who it's on. Thus, it's the simplest and most straightforward way to communicate the Toa Phantoka and Mistika's identity.

True enough. All I want to make clear is that it doesn't need to be quite so simple as you have depicted it. I'd just like to see some reflection of the Jaller Inika lower torso armor in the Nuva lower torso armor, which really isn't much of a stretch because all it really takes is replacing the thin texture of the lower half of the Nuva torso armor with Jaller Inika's more substantial texture. Also might help in making the armor at least seem more poseable-- Nuva armor can be somewhat irritating in drawings that way.

True, I suppose. Still, perhaps it is in your interest to redesign the shoulder armor piece in question so that it is able to stand alone without the need of the stylistically lacking Metru thigh armor.

I had it that way originally, attaching like the Inika shoulder armor – but it looked worse that way. Like that, there's only silver over grey on his upper arms; he desperately needed white there (and Pohatu needed orange) to balance out his color scheme. So it's a slight stylistic inconsistency to fix a far worse color scheme problem.

True enough. Wait, hold on, did you say you have conceptualized Pohatu? I can't wait to see that, though it will be hard to make his quality match that of the set. Still, since these tend to focus greatly on set flaws and continuity I'll love to see how you tackle some of his failures to be consistent with his older form-- not sure if the "budget" will allow for the use of the winged visor that early, however fabulous it might be.

Still, I have to say that even avian wings need a bit of stylization. Of course they aren't going to look in the set as they do in your pic, but still a little of the sharpness might be worth toning down so as to make him look less villainous. It is his role as a hero that leads me to prefer the airplane wings, and even with avian wings that role must be preserved.

Again, stylization would be better handled in a real mold than just a concept picture, since I'm awful at designing such things from scratch... And I really doubt his allegiance would be called into question just because his wings are (to use Bones's phrase) ruthlessly elegant while the rest is smooth and streamlined and typically heroic.

Nonsense; you've done a good job designing plenty of this sort of stuff from scratch. Admittedly, though, you have left out quite a few texture areas elsewhere, and not just ones you don't notice in pictures, so I guess I have to give you some leeway in that department. Ehhh... Not entirely sure about the blend of ruthless elegance and noble heroism, as you certainly see enough villains in Final Fantasy and the like who wear fancy gold or white robes and have angellike wings and are basically pure evil. (Random tangent, but have you read anything by Neil Gaiman?)

Yes but as I said, we don't even know that they'll be using Metru-styled heads again next year, so for all we know it's too late for the introduction of proper eye colors to be a sound decision. Then again, I suppose the truncated variety is useable in other Technic or System sets, but who knows how long it would be before even those uses got tiresome?

I'd be shocked if they stopped using them any time soon. They're simple, practical in all respects, and have worked for four years now; no evident need to change...

I know at least one person who dislikes them *coughChocolateFrogscough*, and anyway you never know what could be coming next year. I'm inclined to expect big changes.

lol, Aanchir, you're totally right about Chocolate Frogs. I received his bio so I could MOC him [still have to do that..] and he's like: TOA MATA HEAD FTW!!!!!

I'm just like: "alright, alright, I'll give you a Mata head"

[note: I did not copy in paste, I was mostly joking ]

{The Chronicles of Velox :: Review :: Characters}

Sorry, but I've got a few gripes with your design, it's great, but certain elements are about as practical as hands on giant mecha.

A) The Sheild: Could you imagine the drag on that thing? That's some serious slowdown right there, not to mention there's no point giving it to someone who is literally and stylistically a sniper. Actually, now thinking about it, it could work if you were to make it a two-peice deal, a small silver/white "Emittor" peice, and a big circular transprarent energy sheild, kinda like the Jackals from Halo/2/3.

B ) The Avian Wings: Not only would those be a pain to animate(Not animating them would look bad in my opinion.), but from my experience from the Makuta, I have a real hard time seeing it work in execution, set-wise. Adding to that, he would have a heck of a time keeping up with Lewa and Pohatu, and add onto his sheild, it's like asking a Jumbo Jet to keep up with an F-22. Sure it looks nice, but I have trouble with seeing him compare flightwise to the other to. And why not just change the wings given to him?

C) The Armor: Great, I just hope you make it like Jaller Mahri's armor, two peiced and all, that's be great.

But cool design nonetheless, the things I didn't gripe about I liked.

Sorry, but I've got a few gripes with your design, it's great, but certain elements are about as practical as hands on giant mecha.

 

A) The Sheild: Could you imagine the drag on that thing? That's some serious slowdown right there, not to mention there's no point giving it to someone who is literally and stylistically a sniper. Actually, now thinking about it, it could work if you were to make it a two-peice deal, a small silver/white "Emittor" peice, and a big circular transprarent energy sheild, kinda like the Jackals from Halo/2/3.

 

B ) The Avian Wings: Not only would those be a pain to animate(Not animating them would look bad in my opinion.), but from my experience from the Makuta, I have a real hard time seeing it work in execution, set-wise. Adding to that, he would have a heck of a time keeping up with Lewa and Pohatu, and add onto his sheild, it's like asking a Jumbo Jet to keep up with an F-22. Sure it looks nice, but I have trouble with seeing him compare flightwise to the other to. And why not just change the wings given to him?

 

C) The Armor: Great, I just hope you make it like Jaller Mahri's armor, two peiced and all, that's be great.

 

But cool design nonetheless, the things I didn't gripe about I liked.

A) You have a good point concerning the shield, but might I inquire what sort of sniper would use a bayonet? Seems kinda silly, and makes me think of him more as a soldier-of-all-trades.

B) Again, good points, though not the ones that particularly matter to me and certainly not the ones that lead me to agree with his current wings.

C) Two-pieced armor means more new pieces. Unless the lower part could be an existing piece (Hordika foot with the toes facing down would look incredible and solve the stylistic consistency problem, as I discovered yesterday when brainstorming for Tahu Phantoka).

Dokuma – Yeah, I've considered doing that on Lewa (with the reversed-armor thing); I'll have to sketch it more to decide how it looks on him... Eh, I think red with Kopaka and blue with Gali is slightly better, if one of them has to have red – Gali has all her blue to stand as her saturated color; Kopaka doesn't have any of that, so the red both works better appeal-wise and color-wise on him. Shame they couldn't both have blue.

Oh yes, certainly--I was just speaking hypothetically about if someone like me were to buy these sets and want to give Kopaka blue rods.