Because it's the same thing as disagreeing with someone being black or ginger. It denies an intrinsic part of someone's being, one they didn't choose, and deminishes their humanity as a result.

It's a perfectly legitimate question that you're asking, and the distinction is kinda hard to make. What it boils down to is that being a homosexual isn't something that people can change. It's not as simple as saying "I disagree with you liking this thing." What those people are saying is that "I am disagreeing with something you cannot change and is a fundamental part of who you are." You cannot disagree with something unless you find it wrong. When you put it all together, they are saying "There is a part of you that you cannot change and is vital to who you are that is wrong." It demeans the other person for who they are, and therefore is harmful and disrespectful.

It's a perfectly legitimate question that you're asking, and the distinction is kinda hard to make. What it boils down to is that being a homosexual isn't something that people can change. It's not as simple as saying "I disagree with you liking this thing." What those people are saying is that "I am disagreeing with something you cannot change and is a fundamental part of who you are." You cannot disagree with something unless you find it wrong. When you put it all together, they are saying "There is a part of you that you cannot change and is vital to who you are that is wrong." It demeans the other person for who they are, and therefore is harmful and disrespectful.

Okay, thank you, that clears it up some. But I'm wondering why people get hurt over it?

I dunno, maybe I'm just really insensitive.

Just re-read the comments in Gato's entry, or ask Kohaku. I believe the point was made clear there.

I suppose it's one of those things where you don't understand how hurtful it can be until you experience it, but I'll do my best to explain. The saying of disagreeing with someone for being gay goes beyond just that simple statement. If I want to hug my boyfriend, I am doing something wrong. If I want to kiss my boyfriend, I am doing something wrong. The very existance of me loving another human being is wrong, and any expression of that love is wrong. I am basically being told that I am not allowed to love another person and doing so is something wrong. It's not just illogical, it's hurtful.

It's also with some irony that I note that I have a girlfriend as of this writing as opposed to a boyfriend, but the point still stands.

It's not.

I disagree with smoking, but I don't hate people who do it.

I disagree with homosexuality, but I don't hate people who are.

That's how I see it.

EDIT:

I have numerous gay friends who understand what I mean, so don't label me as homophobic. I know you will.

..I'm sorry, but you seriously have to ask why being told "an integral part of who you are which you cannot change is wrong" is hurtful to people?

EDIT: ninja'd with a better response

It's not.

 

I disagree with smoking, but I don't hate people who do it.

 

I disagree with homosexuality, but I don't hate people who are.

 

That's how I see it.

The difference is I choose to smoke and thus slowly kill myself one puff at a time. I did not choose to be bisexual.

..I'm sorry, but you seriously have to ask why being told "an integral part of who you are which you cannot change is wrong" is hurtful to people?

 

EDIT: ninja'd with a better response

Gonna ninja this one is as well. This is a question I'm not opposed to answering, as the answer stems out of a genuine curiosity as to why something is true. Some things just aren't as intuitive as someone might think, and we have the luxury of already understanding why something is. Four years ago I would have been asking the same question that Bambi is.

It's not.

 

I disagree with smoking, but I don't hate people who do it.

 

I disagree with homosexuality, but I don't hate people who are.

 

That's how I see it.

Read the posts preceding yours, as well as the whole discussion that took place originally, otherwise we end up going around in circles.

- Tilius

Gonna ninja this one is as well. This is a question I'm not opposed to answering, as the answer stems out of a genuine curiosity as to why something is true. Some things just aren't as intuitive as someone might think, and we have the luxury of already understanding why something is. Four years ago I would have been asking the same question that Bambi is.

fair enough, yeah.

I'm just horribly disheartened over the fact that this is all even an issue still.

@LM In a way, I'm afraid so. If someone said "I hate you for that" it would be harmful, versus "I think you're wrong". In my eyes, there's absolutely nothing wrong with saying someone is wrong, as long as you're not hating.

Like I said, I'm probably just really insensitive.

And like I said, I don't mean to harm anyone, but that's just how I see it.

But it doesn't make much sense to say it's 'wrong', does it? I mean it makes no sense to say that someone being short is 'wrong' - it's a nonsense statement. And, as has been put more eloquently, it's just as nonsensical to say being gay is 'wrong'.

When you think about it in those terms, you start to understand a bit more. For some reason there's debate around it, so people say that they think it's 'wrong' and think that's a valid thing to say. When it's a nonsense statement.

- Tilius

@LM In a way, I'm afraid so. If someone said "I hate you for that" it would be harmful, versus "I think you're wrong". In my eyes, there's absolutely nothing wrong with saying someone is wrong, as long as you're not hating.

Like I said, I'm probably just really insensitive.

And like I said, I don't mean to harm anyone, but that's just how I see it.

On some level one is more harmful than the other, but in the end both are harmful. I recommend reading my most recent blog entry that I'm about to link, as the question you are rasing is discussed in detail. Deevs post express why it is hurtful much more eloquently than I ever could.

http://www.bzpower.com/board/index.php?app=blog&module=display&section=blog&blogid=146&showentry=120232

Why is the BZP text editor so hard to figure out how do I link this? Help I am twelve and what is this.

@Tilius If it's nonsense, why are people upset about it? That's all I'm wondering.

Something can be harmful while still being nonsense. Just because something does not make logical sense does not mean that it is not potentially harmful. Racisim in and of itself is absolute poppycock, but much like homophobia its negative impact cannot be overstated.

I'm not going to make my point over the internet. It's impossible.

I want to say this.

Why do we continue to talk about this stuff on a LEGO site, for God's sake? Why can't we just talk about anything but topics concerning our sexuality or view points on the great, green world? Why?

I'm not going to make my point over the internet. It's impossible.

 

I want to say this.

 

 

Why do we continue to talk about this stuff on a LEGO site, for God's sake? Why can't we just talk about anything but topics concerning our sexuality or view points on the great, green world? Why?

Because it is a fundamental part of who I am. All of this stemmed from me posting an entry about my bisexuality and growing up in a homophobic family. To say that I cannot talk about myself due to the fact that some people cannot control themselves is pretty silly.

Because it's hurtful.

@Tilius If it's nonsense, why are people upset about it? That's all I'm wondering.

Well, how would you like it if everyone around you thought that you being straight was 'wrong'? It doesn't have to make sense - it's the fact that it being 'wrong' suggests some sort of negativity - like it's morally 'wrong'. Such a statement makes no sense, but the negative connotations (as well as the fact that so many people seem to GENUINELY believe that) make it hurtful.

Say you're tall - if everyone around you said that you being tall was 'wrong', and they genuinely believed it and perhaps looked down on you for it (metaphorically, because you'd be tall....) you probably wouldn't be best pleased. Kinda common sense. It being nonsense doesn't make it less hurtful. I mean, we all know that racism is nonsense, but it's still hurtful.

- Tilius

Something can be harmful while still being nonsense. Just because something does not make logical sense does not mean that it is not potentially harmful. Racisim in and of itself is absolute poppycock, but much like homophobia its negative impact cannot be overstated.

Okay, thank you Gato, you've answered my question.

My God, you people reply FAST. Or maybe I type slowly.

But anyway.

I'm not going to make my point over the internet. It's impossible.

It certainly can be impossible if your points don't hold up.

I want to say this.

 

 

Why do we continue to talk about this stuff on a LEGO site, for God's sake? Why can't we just talk about anything but topics concerning our sexuality or view points on the great, green world? Why?

Because this stuff is more important, and there are fundamentals of LIFE which people need to start grasping.

- Tilius

Okay, my question has been answered. When I get back to my computer, I'm going to lock this entry, so please no more comments.

EDIT: Useless. Just Useless.

Since this conversation just inflates really fast, I'll go ahead and lock it for you now to prevent any further, unneeded discussion and possible issues. I hope this is all right with you.

Since this conversation just inflates really fast, I'll go ahead and lock it for you now to prevent any further, unneeded discussion and possible issues. I hope this is all right with you.

kthx