Who Is (And Isn't) The Great Being?

[Tahu5181]

Since this was suggested to be closed, I just wanna say that if I did close this, all it would do is open up the forum to a multitude of topics on it, which would then probably have to have an official topic. So either this will remain open, or we'll have an official topic for it.I would support doing an official topic that more clearly restates the rules of who is out in the first post (like, no strong females secretly being a guy, no clear evil characters, etc.), as well as the "guidelines" that are less clear, and a more complete list of who's out, and maybe in. So that we wouldn't have so many repetitive posts along those lines.Discuss whether this would be good or bad now.

I think that's a good idea.

[bonesiii]

Well, my thinking was that starting a new topic with the conclusions we've reached in this one would be more likely to draw people's attention to the first post, rather than just editing them into this one. In my experience once a topic has already had as much discussion as this one does, edits to the first post are pretty much ignored.

Yeah, BZPower's generally pretty bad at reading OPs--even with relatively few pages of discussion. It's pretty clear that people often aren't taking the time in this thread to look through the disqualified list (which they should be doing every time they post a new candidate, but I digress). Perhaps we could supplement that with some sort of a regular (e.g., weekly) "conclusion digest" post that would allow for alerts to any new information and even restate the basic premises. That might be the only way to ensure that people pay enough attention.~ BioGio

That might be a bit overboard. A little inattention isn't the end of the world, and it's not like this is a college class or anything. But if someone wants to do something similar informally, within reason, I wouldn't mind.So. Seems that we like the idea. Now to compose a list in addition to what's in this topic's first post. It should be fairly complete and based directly off of what Greg revealed. I don't know if I'll have time this week, so if anyone else wants to start on it, go ahead. Edited July 31, 2012 by bonesiii

[Click]

I think this sounds like a great idea, as long as the first post includes:-Possible candidates-Disqualified candidates-Reasons for each-Confirmed qualities of the GB

[Rahkshi Guurahk]

Since this was suggested to be closed, I just wanna say that if I did close this, all it would do is open up the forum to a multitude of topics on it, which would then probably have to have an official topic. So either this will remain open, or we'll have an official topic for it.I would support doing an official topic that more clearly restates the rules of who is out in the first post (like, no strong females secretly being a guy, no clear evil characters, etc.), as well as the "guidelines" that are less clear, and a more complete list of who's out, and maybe in. So that we wouldn't have so many repetitive posts along those lines.Discuss whether this would be good or bad now.

I also think an official topic would be good, for all the reasons you said.

yeah.

[Toa Of Virtues]

Can anyone give me a list of who is in the mad GB's fortress? I'm making a list of all possible characters the GB could be.

[Rahkshi Guurahk]

Herlyx , axonn, brutaka, lewa, artahka, meiserex, kapura, tuyet, I think hafu, and someone else, I remember it was a ga matoran

[Toa Of Virtues]

Herlyx , axonn, brutaka, lewa, artahka, meiserex, kapura, tuyet, I think hafu, and someone else, I remember it was a ga matoran

You got all of them, it was nine who went there.

[Rahkshi Guurahk]

Whoops. misspelled helryx. The ga-matoran might be macku.

Edited July 31, 2012 by rahkshi guurahk

[Toa Of Virtues]

I have completed the list, and it is very long. I included everyone not specifically stated they are not the Great Being. I put it into a format that I think would be good as the first post.

(everything stated in the first post of this topic)From what is stated about the Great Being, we can infer that it was probably not a Rahi said to be created by a Makuta. It is not someone that classifies themselves as “evil”. It would not be anyone that tried to stop Mata Nui from completing his mission. It is not a strong female character. Also, it is not someone who has had their memory wiped.Here are all possible characters not specifically stated they are not the Great Being. Likely possibilities are in bold. Unlikely possibilities are in red. It takes 10 votes to either add a name, bold a name, make a name red, un-red a name, or remove a name from the list. AirwatcherAmphibaxBaltaBomongaChargerConjurerDaluDarknessDefilakDekar/HydraxonDevastatorDumeDwellerEhlekEliminatorFiredracaxGaakiGaliGarGaranGathererGavlaGladiatorThe Golden-Skinned BeingGraalokIdrisThe Kanohi IgnikaIruiniJerbrazJohmakKaKalmahKaziKeetonguKiropKrakuaKrana-KalKualusKyrehxLariskaLurkerMantaxMatauMazekaMimicMinionMorakNokamaNorikNujuOnewaOnuaPewkuPhantomPhotokPirukPohatuPoisonPridakRadiakReysaRoodakaSardaSolekSpinaxTakadoxTanmaThuloxTrinumaUmbraVelikaVicanVoporakVultrazWhenuaZaria

Edited July 31, 2012 by Toa Of Virtues

[I Exist]

Macku is not in the gb fortress, because she helped the other members of the Chronicler's Company to save people from the Dead Mu body.Remember that Lewa is also no longer in the fortress, as he left it and was captured by some sort of being from the forest.

Edited July 31, 2012 by Nicotheory

[Tahu5181]

I have completed the list, and it is very long. I included everyone not specifically stated they are not the Great Being. I put it into a format that I think would be good as the first post.

(everything stated in the first post of this topic)From what is stated about the Great Being, we can infer that it was probably not a Rahi said to be created by a Makuta. It is not someone that classifies themselves as “evil”. It would not be anyone that tried to stop Mata Nui from completing his mission. It is not a strong female character. Also, it is not someone who has had their memory wiped.Here are all possible characters not specifically stated they are not the Great Being. Likely possibilities are in bold. Unlikely possibilities are in red. It takes 10 votes to either add a name, bold a name, make a name red, un-red a name, or remove a name from the list.NujuWhenuaOnewaNokamaMatauTahuGaliOnuaPohatuGaranBaltaDaluVelikaPirukKaziSardaDefilakIdrisKyrehxDekar/HydraxonGarReysaTanmaPhotokSolekGavlaKiropRadiakGavlaKiropVicanVultrazNorikGaakiIruiniKualusPouksBomongaEhlekPridakKalmahTakadoxMantaxThe Golden-Skinned BeingUmbraJerbrazJohmakTrinumaMazekaZariaKrakuaDumeKeetonguPewkuGraalokSpinaxKaMorakThuloxVoporakRoodakaAirwatcherAmphibaxChargerConjurerDarknessDevastatorDwellerEliminatorFiredracaxGathererGladiatorKrana-KalLariskaLurkerMimicMinionPhantomPoisonThe Kanohi Ignika

Tahu's on the list, and he was specifically stated as not the Great Being. Otherwise, I think the list should be in alphabetical order.

[Dralcax]

Wait, why are we ruling out Dweller? He had ample, almost suspicious, opportunity to observe, both TSO and post-Cataclysm Metru Nui. Also, it makes sense that the GB would be capable of covertly manipulating TSO to give him the assignment that would allow him to observe. Don't forget, Dweller wasn't one of the clearly evil Dark Hunters, besides observing, the most he ever did was nudge events in the Order's favor by indirectly causing Takanuva to "walk the worlds of both light and shadow", which would then help the MU while remaining unnoticed in the background. Getting captured by Brutaka was just a minor miscalculation, but still, it would make sense that a GB would want strong telepathic powers that would allow him to secretly observe events. Plus, he was observing post-Cataclysm Metru Nui in particular. Doesn't that seem similar to doctors monitoring the brain of a comatose patient? So Dweller seems pretty likely to me.

[Toa Of Virtues]

Tahu's on the list, and he was specifically stated as not the Great Being. Otherwise, I think the list should be in alphabetical order.

Fixed, and I'll work on alphabatizing it

Wait, why are we ruling out Dweller?

I didn't rule him out, i simply marked him as "unlikely" but i can see your point, so I'll un-red him.

[Tahu5181]

Tahu's on the list, and he was specifically stated as not the Great Being. Otherwise, I think the list should be in alphabetical order.

Fixed, and I'll work on alphabatizing it

Wait, why are we ruling out Dweller?

I didn't rule him out, i simply marked him as "unlikely" but i can see your point, so I'll un-red him.

Good. Thanks. The list should be a lot easier to look through if it's alphabetized.

[Toa Of Virtues]

Good. Thanks. The list should be a lot easier to look through if it's alphabetized.

Done.

(everything stated in the first post of this topic)From what is stated about the Great Being, we can infer that it was probably not a Rahi said to be created by a Makuta. It is not someone that classifies themselves as “evil”. It would not be anyone that tried to stop Mata Nui from completing his mission. It is not a strong female character. Also, it is not someone who has had their memory wiped.Here are all possible characters not specifically stated they are not the Great Being. Likely possibilities are in bold. Unlikely possibilities are in red. Vote +1 or -1 for a character, it takes 10 votes to change the characters' status. The most + voted one gets highlighted in blue.- Unlikely Possible Likely Most Voted +AirwatcherAmphibaxBaltaBomongaChargerConjurerDaluDarknessDefilakDekar/HydraxonDevastatorDumeDwellerEhlekEliminatorFiredracaxGaakiGaliGarGaranGathererGavlaGladiatorThe Golden-Skinned BeingGraalokIdrisThe Kanohi IgnikaIruiniJerbrazJohmakKaKalmahKaziKeetonguKiropKrakuaKrana-KalKualusKyrehxLariskaLurkerMantaxMatauMazekaMimicMinionMorakNokamaNorikNujuOnewaOnuaPewkuPhantomPhotokPirukPohatuPoisonPridakRadiakReysaRoodakaSardaSolekSpinaxTakadoxTanmaThuloxTrinumaUmbraVelikaVicanVoporakWhenuaZaria

Edited August 1, 2012 by Toa Of Virtues

[Rahkshi Guurahk]

^Vultraz won't work. He's in another dimension. And who is ka?

[Toa Of Virtues]

^Vultraz won't work. He's in another dimension. And who is ka?

Oh nearly fogot about him. Ka was Kongu's pet Kahu. It was the bird Takua rode in MNOLG. Edited July 31, 2012 by Toa Of Virtues

[Dralcax]

Ignika is unlikely. I'd say being trapped in an underground chamber for thousands of years with no connection to the outside world is definitely not GB-like. Also the Ignika was meant to selfdestruct the MU, I doubt the GB would want to be in that situation.

[Toa Of Virtues]

Ignika is unlikely. I'd say being trapped in an underground chamber for thousands of years with no connection to the outside world is definitely not GB-like. Also the Ignika was meant to selfdestruct the MU, I doubt the GB would want to be in that situation.

Maybe, but I remember a while ago that people were supporting the Ignika. Becides, if that becomes an offical topic, people will vote if it's unlikely or not.

[Rahkshi Guurahk]

Toa of virtues: sorry, thought it was named kah.

[Tahu5181]

Good. Thanks. The list should be a lot easier to look through if it's alphabetized.

Done.

(everything stated in the first post of this topic)From what is stated about the Great Being, we can infer that it was probably not a Rahi said to be created by a Makuta. It is not someone that classifies themselves as “evil”. It would not be anyone that tried to stop Mata Nui from completing his mission. It is not a strong female character. Also, it is not someone who has had their memory wiped.Here are all possible characters not specifically stated they are not the Great Being. Likely possibilities are in bold. Unlikely possibilities are in red. It takes 10 votes to either add a name, bold a name, un-bold a name, make a name red, un-red a name, or remove a name from the list. Vote on which one you think is the Great Being, and the one with the most votes gets highlighted in blue.AirwatcherAmphibaxBaltaBomongaChargerConjurerDaluDarknessDefilakDekar/HydraxonDevastatorDumeDwellerEhlekEliminatorFiredracaxGaakiGaliGarGaranGathererGavlaGladiatorThe Golden-Skinned BeingGraalokIdrisThe Kanohi IgnikaIruiniJerbrazJohmakKaKalmahKaziKeetonguKiropKrakuaKrana-KalKualusKyrehxLariskaLurkerMantaxMatauMazekaMimicMinionMorakNokamaNorikNujuOnewaOnuaPewkuPhantomPhotokPirukPohatuPoisonPridakRadiakReysaRoodakaSardaSolekSpinaxTakadoxTanmaThuloxTrinumaUmbraVelikaVicanVoporakWhenuaZaria

Thanks. Much, much better now.

[Toa Of Virtues]

Should that become the first post of the official topic? Would this voting system work?Vote +1 or -1 for a character, it takes 10 votes to change the characters' status. The most + voted one gets highlighted in blue.- Unlikely Possible Likely Most Voted +

[Tahu5181]

Should that become the first post of the official topic? Would this voting system work?Vote +1 or -1 for a character, it takes 10 votes to change the characters' status. The most + voted one gets highlighted in blue.- Unlikely Possible Likely Most Voted +

I think it would make a good first post for the topic.

[Toa Of Virtues]

Sooo, are we planning to close this topic and start an offical topic soon or what?

[Voxumo]

Should that become the first post of the official topic? Would this voting system work?Vote +1 or -1 for a character, it takes 10 votes to change the characters' status. The most + voted one gets highlighted in blue.- Unlikely Possible Likely Most Voted +

I think it would make a good first post for the topic.

i must say i see a problem with this idea. what i see wrong is that the way you presented this it seems as though your saying if we vote for a character that they will automatically become a possibly option but what if you have someone who really wants a character to be an option all they would have to do is somehow convince 9 other members to vote for that character and there you go character goes from unlikely to possible and so on. the exact same can be said for demoting a character. In short i'm just saying i see some of flaws in this plan, now i think if it were refined a bit it would work, like maybe a staff member would have to approve the promotion/demotion of a character.

[Klak]

You know, someone should compile a list of suggested Beings, and repost it every page, so we'll stop going in circles. Let's see, the ones I remember:1. Velika: Likely canidate, lots of reasons for him.2. Kazi: Fairly likely, about as much as Velika3. Keetongu: Some very interesting evidence brought up for him4. Darkness: He sits there, all day, observing TSO.5. The Recorder: He just records various things and has many chances to observe with TSO.6. Pewku: A joke, really.7. Roodaka (I think somewhere): She's a girl, so extremely unlikely.Anyone want to look through the 15 pgs. and figure out the rest of the list?

One of the holes I see in the Velika theory is the fact that he was not probably present during the Mata Nui saga, meaning the GB would have been unable to observe any of it.

This has possibly been brought up before, but doesn't the quote about the Shadowed One mean we can rule out (a lot of) evil beings?

Shadowed One -- "I never really considered TSO for a few reasons. One, Orde was defining the GB as evil, he was not defining himself that way. Two, he was in the MU to observe, not sabotage its running by causing trouble and disruption. And three, I have other plans for TSO that don't involve this."

If the GB doesn't define himself as evil, then it can't be a really evil character, could it? It could still be someone who doesn't think of himself as evil, I suppose... but that still seems to rule out a bunch of characters.

I can't really think of any villain who thought he was doing the right thing other than maybe Krika and Brutaka. Though the fact that Orde assumed he was evil sort of implies that it might have been someone who is a known villain or troublemaker, right?

Since this was suggested to be closed, I just wanna say that if I did close this, all it would do is open up the forum to a multitude of topics on it, which would then probably have to have an official topic. So either this will remain open, or we'll have an official topic for it.I would support doing an official topic that more clearly restates the rules of who is out in the first post (like, no strong females secretly being a guy, no clear evil characters, etc.), as well as the "guidelines" that are less clear, and a more complete list of who's out, and maybe in. So that we wouldn't have so many repetitive posts along those lines.Discuss whether this would be good or bad now.

I vote Aye.

[Voxumo]

You know, someone should compile a list of suggested Beings, and repost it every page, so we'll stop going in circles. Let's see, the ones I remember:1. Velika: Likely canidate, lots of reasons for him.2. Kazi: Fairly likely, about as much as Velika3. Keetongu: Some very interesting evidence brought up for him4. Darkness: He sits there, all day, observing TSO.5. The Recorder: He just records various things and has many chances to observe with TSO.6. Pewku: A joke, really.7. Roodaka (I think somewhere): She's a girl, so extremely unlikely.Anyone want to look through the 15 pgs. and figure out the rest of the list?

One of the holes I see in the Velika theory is the fact that he was not probably present during the Mata Nui saga, meaning the GB would have been unable to observe any of it.

i must say that your wrong, as far as i know for a being to be the great being it does not mean he has to be at every major event physically as we have seen the mad great being can view into other dimensions. And even though i dislike supporting the idea that it is velika i still believe that even if he was on voya-nui given the known powers of some great beings he could have easily seen all that went on in that time frame/area.

[Toa Of Virtues]

Should that become the first post of the official topic? Would this voting system work?Vote +1 or -1 for a character, it takes 10 votes to change the characters' status. The most + voted one gets highlighted in blue.- Unlikely Possible Likely Most Voted +

I think it would make a good first post for the topic.

i must say i see a problem with this idea. what i see wrong is that the way you presented this it seems as though your saying if we vote for a character that they will automatically become a possibly option but what if you have someone who really wants a character to be an option all they would have to do is somehow convince 9 other members to vote for that character and there you go character goes from unlikely to possible and so on. the exact same can be said for demoting a character. In short i'm just saying i see some of flaws in this plan, now i think if it were refined a bit it would work, like maybe a staff member would have to approve the promotion/demotion of a character.

Hmm, sounds like a good idea. but which staff member?

[bonesiii]

I'm unsure about the voting concept. I can use that list, but the voting I'll have to think about...For one, why ten votes and different color codes and the like? Why not just list the number of votes for/against, perhaps in a color-coded tally after their name.And personally I would not want to discuss it as much if it was turned into a voting system, as I wouldn't know in many cases whether to vote either way. Although I suppose that doesn't rule out voting for those who are more sure about some. But if you guys want a vote system, I'll include it. And I would add a note of course that "wins" or "losses" don't actually mean anything canonically per se, more of a headcanon thing.Vote about voting now.

Edited August 2, 2012 by bonesiii

[Toa Of Virtues]

Maybe we can have the results under a spoiler tag, so people will view the resuls AFTER they vote, but then again, people may not follow directions. The colors, i think, would help people not have to vote - for the many characters that are obviously not the GB. If ou want to eliminate the color-system, ok, but if we are voting, i suggest we start each character with a given number so people can ingnore characters that are obviously not the GB. it would get tireing if everyone had to vote on every character.

[Click]

I don't think voting really applies here, considering it's a "Why?" kind of topic. I think that just when someone suggests a name, we put their reasons under it, and then keep listing reasons that others come up with. If someone has some good reasons why someone isn't the GB, then we put those reasons in red or something. Maybe put all of this under Spoiler tags so we don't have a page-long first post.

[Voxumo]

Should that become the first post of the official topic? Would this voting system work?Vote +1 or -1 for a character, it takes 10 votes to change the characters' status. The most + voted one gets highlighted in blue.- Unlikely Possible Likely Most Voted +

I think it would make a good first post for the topic.

i must say i see a problem with this idea. what i see wrong is that the way you presented this it seems as though your saying if we vote for a character that they will automatically become a possibly option but what if you have someone who really wants a character to be an option all they would have to do is somehow convince 9 other members to vote for that character and there you go character goes from unlikely to possible and so on. the exact same can be said for demoting a character. In short i'm just saying i see some of flaws in this plan, now i think if it were refined a bit it would work, like maybe a staff member would have to approve the promotion/demotion of a character.

Hmm, sounds like a good idea. but which staff member?

i don't know i just thought it would sound good. ......... Wait i've got it. we could give the glorious task to one particular lucky staff member who i've seen on this topic alot bonesiii, you just got to love that guy.......LOL but seriously if i had to choose a staff i would choose bonesii

[fishers64]

We just need a concise list of guidelines and list of possible characters and characters ruled out, not some crazy character list/vote system.Further, I don't think that the official topic should be tied up with "I vote this." and "I vote that." posts. It should be dicussion of who the GB is based on actual storyline evidence, not voting systems. If someone wants a poll on this, we can get a Premier member to make us one; no need to tie up the OT with it.

Edited August 7, 2012 by fishers64

[rollabar]

Ok, sorry if someone already mentioned this(though I haven't seen it mentioned), but I thought Dume was mine wiped as well. He WAS put in a matoran sphere, which was what erased the matoran's memories.

[flynn58]

Nope, he wasn't in long enough. Dume's in the clear, and is probably the GB.

[Toa Of Virtues]

I got to discuss this at makutafest! anyways... I am fine with no voting system, it was just somthing I came up with on the spot.

[Duarack5]

I still have hopes for Velika. That'd just be awesome

[Voxumo]

yeah i still hope for darkness to be a contender." I could have been a contender."

[rollabar]

Nope, he wasn't in long enough. Dume's in the clear, and is probably the GB.

Ok thanks that helps.

[Tahu5181]

Could Mavrah be the Great Being? As far as I know, he never lost his memory.