Who Is (And Isn't) The Great Being?

[Makuta Matata]

I kinda wish that Greg F would stop by just for a moment to tell us who the GB was...

[man774]

Well, Ahkmou's mind was wiped out too in 2004.

Ahkmou's pod was not rescued by the toa, but Teridax in a way. Teridax has been using Ahkmou, so he put him in a dud.

What do you mean? Are you saying that Ahkmou's pod didn't work? Because we know it did; his mind was wiped. Teridax wanted all the Matoran's minds wiped so he could do what he did with Ahkmou, which was tell him his version of history when he woke up.

oh, it did? I thought that he was working for teridax before thte dark time. I guess people do learn something new every day. thanks.

[bonesiii]

I think he was in a sense, but he was more useful "knowing" a false version of history. I forget exactly if he was intentionally working for Teridax but he did cause trouble back then.

[Tabby: Toa of Cats]

The GB cannot be the Kanohi Ignika for at least one reason-The GB's, not Mata Nui, are confirmed to be responsible for it's creation.

[fishers64]

Ahkmou was working for Nidhiki and Krekka before Teridax took over. And the GBs making the Mask of Life doesn't rule it out. After all, Matoran are made by the GBs, and they aren't ruled out. 

[Toa Of Virtues]

I like the theory of Keetongu, he seems like a good canidate. No mind wipes, great power, mysterious history, didn't feel bad killing sidorak, an eye that sees all in someone (observation), and respects the three virtues. Yeah, he might have been sleeping in the ice for who knows how many years, but maybe his eye let him see the outside world. Dume or Velika are also good choices, but i have a gut feeling its Keetongu.

Edited June 8, 2012 by Toa Of Virtues

[bonesiii]

didn't feel bad killing sidorak

That isn't surprising if he's just what we think he is, though, which is basically a beast. Also, not sure if killing Sidorak is a benefit for the Keetongu theory or not... it feels awful "get involved"ey and stuff. :POtherwise he does seem like a good candidate, yeah.Ignika is a fascinating candidate. Was that guessed in the original topic? I don't recall it. If not, then it can be ruled out. But yeah, if the GB was the Ignika I think most of the other problems with other candidates fall away... until you get to 2008 story. The mask's portrayed psychology there doesn't at all fit IMO. Prior to that it was the epitome of "don't get involved" yet probably (due to its incredible power over life) could observe events from afar easily. After that, it feels like the idea of acting heroically to save the day simply hadn't really occurred to it and it had a sort of innocence in the way it was inspired by Matoro's sacrifice. I don't see how a GB's mind being in there could continue to honor that.Also, it seems like a problem just from the beginning of its origin. It was made by GBs, and apparently because alive simply due to the nature of its power. This act had to be overseen by GBs so it seems highly unlikely to me that another GB could transfer himself in, unbeknownst to the others, just at the right moment. I think Ignika's mind has to be its own, created basically as a side effect of being the Mask of Life.Still, I have to admit I can imagine how both problems could be overcome plausibly, and if they were it could be really cool. And the Ignika is out there doing who knows what now under Mata Nui's influence -- if it was a GB, given Mata Nui's controlling role in the robot the GB was observing, this could make a lot of sense, that now they are both carrying out some plan relevant to the robot that might seem "evil" to someone who didn't know what they know.

[Voxumo]

Yeah, he might have been sleeping in the ice for who knows how many years, but maybe his eye let him see the outside world.

I think that he could have easily not actually been frozen and i think that was also just part of his legend. heck in real life there are myths that could just be used to add effect and drama

[fishers64]

Yeah, he might have been sleeping in the ice for who knows how many years, but maybe his eye let him see the outside world.

I think that he could have easily not actually been frozen and i think that was also just part of his legend. heck in real life there are myths that could just be used to add effect and drama

Yes, but it was actually shown in the movie and hinted at in the books that he was sleeping in ice. Although he could have been sleeping in a chamber below the lake that wasn't made of ice, although then it would be hard to explain the pillar of ice that he rode up on in the movie.

[toa electro]

i wouldnt be surprised if it was artahka

Edited June 12, 2012 by toa electro

[fishers64]

i wouldnt be surprised if it was artahka

Artahka is ruled out because he was in the Mad GB's fortress.Also, does anyone think that Teridax or Mata Nui could have known who the GB was, or at least that a person's mind was acting oddly (shielded)? Edited June 13, 2012 by fishers64

[Toa Of Virtues]

Also, does anyone think that Teridax or Mata Nui could have known who the GB was, or at least that a person's mind was acting oddly (shielded)?

Well, the GB might have put on fake thoughts for Teridax/Mata Nui so they wouldn't be suspicious. As said before, we don't know how powerful the GB's are.

[darkslizer]

It stinks that it can't be Tren Krom, I liked his character. But anyway, I think it's a Makuta. We can't just assume that they all died. I mean, the power of adaptation means nothing to anyone anymore! They could have adapted to surviving the energy storm. Even Krika could have adapted to Gorast's mask of power

[bonesiii]

Pretty sure Greg confirmed all Makuta other than Teridax, alternate Teridax, and Miserix were killed at some point (and then Terry died... I don't recall what happened to the other two).

[Nuparu1995]

I'm hoping it's some Matoran that was right under everyone's noses the whole time, but was some how different enough to be the obvious choice. Like maybe...Ahkmou!!!

[fishers64]

Pretty sure Greg confirmed all Makuta other than Teridax, alternate Teridax, and Miserix were killed at some point (and then Terry died... I don't recall what happened to the other two).

Alt. Terry escaped MU robot; Miserix is still in the Mad GB's fortress. That's all I think we know...

I'm hoping it's some Matoran that was right under everyone's noses the whole time, but was some how different enough to be the obvious choice. Like maybe...Ahkmou!!!

Ahkmou is ruled out due to memory loss...

[darkslizer]

Initially, I was thinking Krakua, but now I just think Krika. Here are my reasons:Reasons Krika couldn't be the GB:Being a Makuta:Maybe he was a shapeshifter. Or maybe, when all the others in the Karda Swamp were stuck in one form, and the others were blind. He would just be assumed a Makuta, even by the others.Teridax would've known:Who says he didn't? He probably thought that Krika was going to die anyway. Which leads to my next point...He had the least likely death ever. He was dissipated, yes, but that would've meant he could just come back together when he had enough power, and while he was intangible he could go through the Storms and out of Karda.Besides, he always stood out among the Kardakuta.

Thank You! Thank You! Thank You! Pretty much nobody else though it was Krika! WOO HOO! I have a ton of faith in Krika being him, but my second choice would probably be Velika. (the riddle speaking, air-katana fixing Matoran we've all come to suspect.)

Pretty sure Greg confirmed all Makuta other than Teridax, alternate Teridax, and Miserix were killed at some point (and then Terry died... I don't recall what happened to the other two).

The 1st post said nothing about Makuta, but you might be right. But still, if Krika was a great being, he could most likely survive being attacked by a mask power of a giant, angry bug with shadow powers. Edited June 20, 2012 by darkslizer

[bonesiii]

But if the GB as Krika or anyone else could survive such a massive disaster, why not stop a little thing like a memory wipe? It seems to me the evidence says we should be thinking that the GB has no GB-related powers, that it's just his mind inhabiting a body, and whatever powers that body would normally have anyways are it.

[Aldian]

Ignika is a fascinating candidate. Was that guessed in the original topic? I don't recall it.

To answer your question Bonesii, yes, the Ignika was mentioned in the original topic. Edited June 22, 2012 by Aldian

[Tahu Nuva Master of Fire]

Can we please keep this topic alive? It is the last topic the we can debate the future offical storyline. Anyway I think it is Dume.

[bleedingshadows94]

I agree, this topic is dying, and I would like for it to live. I've been hypocritical in not posting, so I'm going to do my best. Now, back to the topic at hand.Lots of people have assumed Dume, and although I might agree with you there, he was a Toa in the past. He also tried to prevent the Nuva from leaving Metru Nui in order to complete their destiny, which would mean he tried to mess with the natural order of things, so I think that takes a lot of credibility away from him.~Tobi

[Toa Of Virtues]

Let's narrow it down to our possible suspects:Keetongu: Mysterious being who respects the three virtues.Krika: possibly just pretended to be a MakutaDume: Not much is told about his pastVelika: Riddle speaking and sword fixing matoranI personally think it's Keetongu, the most evidence points to him. Greg even said that any Ko-character would be a good guess, and he did live in Ko-Metru. He has an eye that would be perfect for observing the MU. He didn't get involved much, and when he did, he just helped what was destined to be. He even refused to cure the Toa Hordika at first, and did it only when he was sure he had to, so they could complete their destiny. Also as I said before, he didn't feel bad killing, or "shutting down", Sidorak. Other than helping the Toa Hordika, Keetongu did hardly anything else, and didn't get involved in much. All the other canidates are canidates based on what we assume to know about them, like Krika not being a Makuta. We know that Keetongu is a being of great power, built for observation, and respects the three virtues. Thoes are perfect qualifications to be the GB.

[Tahu Nuva Master of Fire]

Let's narrow it down to our possible suspects:Keetongu: Mysterious being who respects the three virtues.Krika: possibly just pretended to be a MakutaDume: Not much is told about his pastVelika: Riddle speaking and sword fixing matoranI personally think it's Keetongu, the most evidence points to him. Greg even said that any Ko-character would be a good guess, and he did live in Ko-Metru. He has an eye that would be perfect for observing the MU. He didn't get involved much, and when he did, he just helped what was destined to be. He even refused to cure the Toa Hordika at first, and did it only when he was sure he had to, so they could complete their destiny. Also as I said before, he didn't feel bad killing, or "shutting down", Sidorak. Other than helping the Toa Hordika, Keetongu did hardly anything else, and didn't get involved in much. All the other canidates are canidates based on what we assume to know about them, like Krika not being a Makuta. We know that Keetongu is a being of great power, built for observation, and respects the three virtues. Thoes are perfect qualifications to be the GB.

Keetongu is a great candidate we don't know much about him and he has seen a lot of the MU.Krika has been killed so he is off the list.I agree with Dume beening on the list.Velika is difficult. I feel we did not know him well enough to write off as a possible GB, but there is enough evidence against him too.But there is one more suspect I would like to add and the most obvious of them all which is Lesovikk. He doesn't follow the Toa code, he has been around the MU for years and his air sword was found next to Karzahni's corpse.

[The Iron Toa]

I recall Greg saying Lesovikk would not make sense because a Great Being wouldn't feel guilt over Toa dying as Lesovikk did. As for Keetongu, an argument against him as a candidate is the fact that he hid himself all alone. Hiding under a lot of ice isn't a good way to observe the universe. Though one could justify that, for example if he foresaw he needed to be there to help the Toa Metru.

[Dralcax]

Let's narrow it down to our possible suspects:Keetongu: Mysterious being who respects the three virtues.Krika: possibly just pretended to be a MakutaDume: Not much is told about his pastVelika: Riddle speaking and sword fixing matoranI personally think it's Keetongu, the most evidence points to him. Greg even said that any Ko-character would be a good guess, and he did live in Ko-Metru. He has an eye that would be perfect for observing the MU. He didn't get involved much, and when he did, he just helped what was destined to be. He even refused to cure the Toa Hordika at first, and did it only when he was sure he had to, so they could complete their destiny. Also as I said before, he didn't feel bad killing, or "shutting down", Sidorak. Other than helping the Toa Hordika, Keetongu did hardly anything else, and didn't get involved in much. All the other canidates are canidates based on what we assume to know about them, like Krika not being a Makuta. We know that Keetongu is a being of great power, built for observation, and respects the three virtues. Thoes are perfect qualifications to be the GB.

Keetongu is a great candidate we don't know much about him and he has seen a lot of the MU.Krika has been killed so he is off the list.I agree with Dume beening on the list.Velika is difficult. I feel we did not know him well enough to write off as a possible GB, but there is enough evidence against him too.But there is one more suspect I would like to add and the most obvious of them all which is Lesovikk. He doesn't follow the Toa code, he has been around the MU for years and his air sword was found next to Karzahni's corpse.

But one problem: Lesovikk's reaction to the death of his friends... doesn't seem very GB-like. Velika is better, he doesn't really have friends, he just happens to be in the same boat and helps out of self-preservation rather than to save the others in that situation.EDIT: Dang, ninja'ed Edited July 16, 2012 by Chaos Dralcax

[bonesiii]

Velika is difficult. I feel we did not know him well enough to write off as a possible GB, but there is enough evidence against him too.

Wait... remind me, what evidence is there against Velika?

[bleedingshadows94]

Oh, wait, I totally just thought of this while going the bathroom. Just FYI, that happens to my family alot. I also know that it's probably TMI, but whatever. I'm an open book on the internet. Anyways, what about the Recorder? I mean, it's his job to write down everything the Shadowed One says and does, am I right? Well, the Shadowed One doesn't stay cooped up in his fortress all day, he has to go traveling. He's probably been pretty much everywhere. And where he goes, the Recorder follows. Although the Recorder seems timid, that could just be a ruse. Does anyone see what I'm getting at, here? He never had a mission, so he never interfered with anything. He just writes. And he sees a lot of things...~Tobi

[Dralcax]

But the scope of the Recorder is quite limited, following around a single being, and writing down whatever TSO wishes, resulting in seeing mostly just TSO's twisted world view. Wouldn't it make more sense to be an average matoran than some weird being stalking another being exclusively?

[bleedingshadows94]

But the scope of the Recorder is quite limited, following around a single being, and writing down whatever TSO wishes, resulting in seeing mostly just TSO's twisted world view. Wouldn't it make more sense to be an average matoran than some weird being stalking another being exclusively?

Not necessarily. Again, he would write down whatever TSO said, yes, but that doesn't mean it would influence him. Like those recorders during jury trials. They aren't necessarily influenced by what each person is saying; their job is to simply write down what is said. You see what I mean? And since TSO went pretty much everywhere, he's seen pretty much everything.~Tobi

[Voxumo]

But the scope of the Recorder is quite limited, following around a single being, and writing down whatever TSO wishes, resulting in seeing mostly just TSO's twisted world view. Wouldn't it make more sense to be an average matoran than some weird being stalking another being exclusively?

Not necessarily. Again, he would write down whatever TSO said, yes, but that doesn't mean it would influence him. Like those recorders during jury trials. They aren't necessarily influenced by what each person is saying; their job is to simply write down what is said. You see what I mean? And since TSO went pretty much everywhere, he's seen pretty much everything.~Tobi

but alot of examples you are giving to support Recorder as a candidate is alot of the same thing i have said about Darkness. but none the less i feel that Recorder and Darkness could be candidates for many of the same reasons.And as far as i know i'm the first and only person to suggest Darkness as a possibility for the Great Being and i have given many reasons in previous posts so i'm not gonna write down each reason again.

[bleedingshadows94]

One of the main reasons I wouldn't assume Darkness, Voxumo, is that Darkness is exhibiting powers that almost no other beings possess that we know of, while the Recorded has absolutely no powers to speak of. He's just a normal guy.~Tobi

[Tahu Nuva Master of Fire]

Let's narrow it down to our possible suspects:Keetongu: Mysterious being who respects the three virtues.Krika: possibly just pretended to be a MakutaDume: Not much is told about his pastVelika: Riddle speaking and sword fixing matoranI personally think it's Keetongu, the most evidence points to him. Greg even said that any Ko-character would be a good guess, and he did live in Ko-Metru. He has an eye that would be perfect for observing the MU. He didn't get involved much, and when he did, he just helped what was destined to be. He even refused to cure the Toa Hordika at first, and did it only when he was sure he had to, so they could complete their destiny. Also as I said before, he didn't feel bad killing, or "shutting down", Sidorak. Other than helping the Toa Hordika, Keetongu did hardly anything else, and didn't get involved in much. All the other canidates are canidates based on what we assume to know about them, like Krika not being a Makuta. We know that Keetongu is a being of great power, built for observation, and respects the three virtues. Thoes are perfect qualifications to be the GB.

Keetongu is a great candidate we don't know much about him and he has seen a lot of the MU.Krika has been killed so he is off the list.I agree with Dume beening on the list.Velika is difficult. I feel we did not know him well enough to write off as a possible GB, but there is enough evidence against him too.But there is one more suspect I would like to add and the most obvious of them all which is Lesovikk. He doesn't follow the Toa code, he has been around the MU for years and his air sword was found next to Karzahni's corpse.

But one problem: Lesovikk's reaction to the death of his friends... doesn't seem very GB-like. Velika is better, he doesn't really have friends, he just happens to be in the same boat and helps out of self-preservation rather than to save the others in that situation.EDIT: Dang, ninja'ed

So Great Beings can not have or gain friends in the MU?

Velika is difficult. I feel we did not know him well enough to write off as a possible GB, but there is enough evidence against him too.

Wait... remind me, what evidence is there against Velika?

I doubt the GB is Velika but everyone said he is a mysterious loner who speeks in riddles.Just because he speaks in riddles it does not mean he is a GB. If so why is Nuju forspeeking like Rahi birds isn't on this list. The fact that Velika is mysterious doesn'twrite him off as a GB either. The spotlight over the Voya Nui matoran stood forabout half a year and we did not learn about all the Voya Nui matoran enough sothey are all mysterious in my opinion. But then again practically everyone on this listis mysterious.

[bonesiii]

Actually, I did consider Nuju. And what you said isn't really evidence against Velika, just reasons that it's not proven to be him and could be others. :)Off the top of my head I don't remember what was concluded about the Turaga Mata like Nuju. They may be candidates unless something I've forgotten DQs them.

[Klak]

Wow. Haven't been on here in a while.

Let's narrow it down to our possible suspects:Keetongu: Mysterious being who respects the three virtues.Krika: possibly just pretended to be a MakutaDume: Not much is told about his pastVelika: Riddle speaking and sword fixing matoranI personally think it's Keetongu, the most evidence points to him. Greg even said that any Ko-character would be a good guess, and he did live in Ko-Metru. He has an eye that would be perfect for observing the MU. He didn't get involved much, and when he did, he just helped what was destined to be. He even refused to cure the Toa Hordika at first, and did it only when he was sure he had to, so they could complete their destiny. Also as I said before, he didn't feel bad killing, or "shutting down", Sidorak. Other than helping the Toa Hordika, Keetongu did hardly anything else, and didn't get involved in much. All the other canidates are canidates based on what we assume to know about them, like Krika not being a Makuta. We know that Keetongu is a being of great power, built for observation, and respects the three virtues. Thoes are perfect qualifications to be the GB.

Keetongu is a great candidate we don't know much about him and he has seen a lot of the MU.Krika has been killed so he is off the list.I agree with Dume beening on the list.Velika is difficult. I feel we did not know him well enough to write off as a possible GB, but there is enough evidence against him too.But there is one more suspect I would like to add and the most obvious of them all which is Lesovikk. He doesn't follow the Toa code, he has been around the MU for years and his air sword was found next to Karzahni's corpse.

But one problem: Lesovikk's reaction to the death of his friends... doesn't seem very GB-like. Velika is better, he doesn't really have friends, he just happens to be in the same boat and helps out of self-preservation rather than to save the others in that situation.EDIT: Dang, ninja'ed

So Great Beings can not have or gain friends in the MU?

Velika is difficult. I feel we did not know him well enough to write off as a possible GB, but there is enough evidence against him too.

Wait... remind me, what evidence is there against Velika?

I doubt the GB is Velika but everyone said he is a mysterious loner who speeks in riddles.Just because he speaks in riddles it does not mean he is a GB. If so why is Nuju forspeeking like Rahi birds isn't on this list. The fact that Velika is mysterious doesn'twrite him off as a GB either. The spotlight over the Voya Nui matoran stood forabout half a year and we did not learn about all the Voya Nui matoran enough sothey are all mysterious in my opinion. But then again practically everyone on this listis mysterious.

Since Velika speaks in riddles, he would be suspicious. I doubt the GB would want to be someone suspicious, or an outsider. They need to be someone that is involved.The Recorder was a good guess, as well as Nuju. Was Lesovikk ruled out already?

I kinda wish that Greg F would stop by just for a moment to tell us who the GB was...

Indeed. At least that!

[Tahu Nuva Master of Fire]

Actually, I did consider Nuju. And what you said isn't really evidence against Velika, just reasons that it's not proven to be him and could be others. :)Off the top of my head I don't remember what was concluded about the Turaga Mata like Nuju. They may be candidates unless something I've forgotten DQs them.

That was my point.

[rollabar]

Let's narrow it down to our possible suspects:Keetongu: Mysterious being who respects the three virtues.Krika: possibly just pretended to be a MakutaDume: Not much is told about his pastVelika: Riddle speaking and sword fixing matoranI personally think it's Keetongu, the most evidence points to him. Greg even said that any Ko-character would be a good guess, and he did live in Ko-Metru. He has an eye that would be perfect for observing the MU. He didn't get involved much, and when he did, he just helped what was destined to be. He even refused to cure the Toa Hordika at first, and did it only when he was sure he had to, so they could complete their destiny. Also as I said before, he didn't feel bad killing, or "shutting down", Sidorak. Other than helping the Toa Hordika, Keetongu did hardly anything else, and didn't get involved in much. All the other canidates are canidates based on what we assume to know about them, like Krika not being a Makuta. We know that Keetongu is a being of great power, built for observation, and respects the three virtues. Thoes are perfect qualifications to be the GB.

Keetongu is a great candidate we don't know much about him and he has seen a lot of the MU.Krika has been killed so he is off the list.I agree with Dume beening on the list.Velika is difficult. I feel we did not know him well enough to write off as a possible GB, but there is enough evidence against him too.But there is one more suspect I would like to add and the most obvious of them all which is Lesovikk. He doesn't follow the Toa code, he has been around the MU for years and his air sword was found next to Karzahni's corpse.

It actually wasn't proven that Lesovikk killed Karzahni. I doubt he was the one that killed Karzahni, because if he wanted Karzahni dead, he would have killed him before when he, Sarda, and Idris captured him. Also, Lesovikk wasn't in the story that much, possibly even less then Velika. Lezovikk only appeared in Dreams of Destruction from what I recall(aside from when Kopaka and Pohatu found his sword next to Karzhani).

[Tahu Nuva Master of Fire]

Question: Were any of the Barraki considered?

[Ice the Great]

Question: Were any of the Barraki considered?

Several of them. We decided against it under the idea that the GB wouldn't try to negatively affect MU affairs or try to take over.

[fishers64]

I don't recall any soild evidence against Velika being brought up. Nuju is quirky...could be, although how an old Turaga could contact Kabrua without hassle or making a stir is sketchy...

[ActivePalpitation]

I think It would be velika,the Voya Nui Matoran that speaks in riddles or Mezeka (just a geuss)