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Greg's just confirmed that Velika has agents loyal to him on Bara Magna, who have been reporting the goings-on to him over the past 100,000 years. Most intriguingly, he's confirmed -- wait for it --

 

One or more of these agents are characters we met in 2009 story.

 

I'd have made a poll if I were able, but as I'm frugal with my money, I'm no Premier Member. :P I invite S&T to review all Bara Magna characters and consider who might have been an informant all along. Savvy?

 

I'm keeping track of who's suspected by whom on this handy-dandy "Suspicion Chart". The rankings are based on the number of posters vouching for or against that character being an informant. I've only recorded votes that used in-story evidence; people who say "not So-and-So, I don't want them to be the informant" will not be counted.

 

Currently, Vastus and Atakus are topping the charts, followed by Metus. The two least suspected people on the planet are Gresh and Tarduk.

 

(First page... excellent. Let the theorizing truly begin.)

Edited by Yaldabaoth
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I am immediately going to say no to the six element lords that fought in the cold war, as Velika blames them for all of Spherus Magna's problems.
I will also hesitate to believe that Raanu and Gresh are among his agents as they seemed to fear the idea of letting Mata Nui control the prototype robot.

Beyond that, I will need more time to think.

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I don't think Greg has put a lot of though behind this, probably he didn't really considered the idea until he was asked, so I would say there's no much help in readin the serieals or even books in order to find these agents, I don't think you would find clues save for the fact of a character having too much free time to do it or someone who didn't appear as much as other characters.

So, it could be almost anyone.

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Well, the agents really could have been anyone, doing anything, but keeping a record of anything going on. This could be Glatorian traveling places for arena matches, Agori going to other villages on business, wanderers like Tarduk and Berix going to hunt for treasure or scavenge. This could be any of the leaders who have an ear to the politics and goings-on in the villages. 

So, occupation doesn't rule out anyone. 

 

My thoughts, however, are with Raanu, as he was known to work for the GBs in the past, and is more likely than anyone else to have had contact with one of them. An agent of Velika, yes, but that doesn't mean those are his only loyalties--he still has to think of his people. As I understand it, he'd just be reporting back to Velika on the goings on in the world.

 

So, who else?

 

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I don't think Greg has put a lot of though behind this, probably he didn't really considered the idea until he was asked, so I would say there's no much help in readin the serieals or even books in order to find these agents, I don't think you would find clues save for the fact of a character having too much free time to do it or someone who didn't appear as much as other characters.

So, it could be almost anyone.

 

I'm not asking people to look through previous story for intentional clues of being an informant. But I think we can look at these characters, their personalities, their histories, and their affiliations, and try to get some idea of who would be most likely to have allied themselves with Velika.

 

Keep in mind, whoever was acting as an informant must have had some way to communicate with Velika across the void of space. Yet since telecommunications were never seen on Bara Magna in our story, this must have been kept secret from everyone else. I wonder where they hid their gadgets.


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My guess would be Metus. Velika could've told him to threated Tuma and put himself in a position to take over the Skrall Empire. Metus knew how to defeat the Baterra, but Velika could've been the one to tell him what he could do with the imformation. Having an agent controlling the most powerful force on the planet to take it over. That way, he would arrive on Bara-Magna with the planet ready to serve him, and he would only have the people of the MU to take care of. But there's nothing to really confirm this, it's just that Metus was the only one who directly showed himself to be evil (except Tuma/the Skrall).

 

Tuma is another possibility for reason like Metus'.

 

Fero showed he was too busy taking orders from Tuma to bother himself with the GB's. I don't see why he would take orders from Tuma if he worked for the GB's, so I think he's ruled out. Plus Bone Hunters live mostly to simply survive and pillage villages, and they only got the idea to take over the whole world from Tuma/Metus.

 

I don't know about Raanu; The 1st Shadow gave a good point about him but in Journey's End he said he has an idea about who Mata-Nui is and what he's trying to do, but he seemed like he didn't know a lot, and if he's keeping tabs with Velika he should know where he is.

 

I don't think it would be Tarduk or company because they went out looking for answers about the Great Beings, which shows they probably had no idea about who they were, let alone be in contact with one.

 

EDIT:

@Yaldabaoth: The point you made about tele-communication makes sense, but since Velika is a Great Being I'm sure he would've established a way of communicating with them before hand.

 

I think we all know for sure that Kabrua is in contact with Velika and is one of his agents, so him and his people could've been the ones Greg was referencing, though there could be more.  :shrugs:

Edited by Banana Gunz

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I don't know about Raanu; The 1st Shadow gave a good point about him but in Journey's End he said he has an idea about who Mata-Nui is and what he's trying to do, but he seemed like he didn't know a lot, and if he's keeping tabs with Velika he should know where he is.

 

I don't think it would be Tarduk or company because they went out looking for answers about the Great Beings, which shows they probably had no idea about who they were, let alone be in contact with one.

 

 

Those were examples. I was saying that occupation doesn't matter.

 

As for Raanu, if he told Mata Nui that he knew all about him, then everyone would suddenly be suspicious.  He could have been telling only part of the truth, you know.

 

But I have one other thought: Berix. Besides, Kiina, he was the only one who knew about eh GB's secret lab near Tajun, and, according to Kiina, it was "filled with weird ancient tools and equipment." Berix could have used the tech in there to communicate with Velika. 

 

Then again, someone else could have known about it and just not mentioned it. Tarix could have known, for example, and as a secret agent, he would make sure no one knew where he was going. After all, he was an important figure in the Core War. Velika could have approached him about it.

 

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Tarix seems like he could be interesting as an informant. He's heroic, but he's also very quiet, and we never really learned a lot about him. He could certainly be hiding something.

 

Perditus would be a good choice, especially since it would give him some actual characterization. :P


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Kiina. "Kiina's delusional, there's no such thing as other worlds!"

 

Yet if she were in contact with Velika, she would know that other worlds existed. Bingo. Although why Velika would choose loudmouthed Kiina as an informant would be debatable, but here's the thing about getting the town gossip - they tell you everything. And if Kiina actually opened her big mouth and started talking about her communications with a Great Being in another world, the Bara Magnans would definitely think she was bonkers, not that it was actually happening. 

 

Plus there's plenty of hiding places in that lab for stuff, and putting GB communication tech in there, since it was a GB installation to begin with, makes some degree of sense. 

 

I'd kick Tarduk off the list. If he could communicate with Velika, I'd think he'd recognize a Matoran letter A. 

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I think Kiina is actually one of the least likely people; she really seems like she was just hoping for other worlds. Kiina is a character that longs for something better than she has, and the fact that she dreams about visiting other worlds does not confirm that she knows for they existed or was in contact with anyone from one of them.

Edited by Banana Gunz
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Definitely Berix. I have one reason for saying that, and one reason only. I'll keep it to myself, though.

 

Mark my words... Berix.

Edited by Jakura Nuva
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I think Kiina is actually one of the least likely people; she really seems like she was just hoping for other worlds. Kiina is a character that longs for something better than she has, and the fact that she dreams about visiting other worlds does not confirm that she knows for they existed or was in contact with anyone from one of them.

 

Actually, it might.  She could know that they exist and want to go to them. After all, Mata Nui's been observing other worlds, and Velika could have tapped into his systems remotely somehow and monitored what he was seeing, and Kiina could have learned it from him.

 

But you're missing the point: Velika isn't reporting back to THEM--the agents are reporting BM business to HIM. He doesn't seem to care what they want, so long as it doesn't interfere with his goals.

 

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Tarix seems like he could be interesting as an informant. He's heroic, but he's also very quiet, and we never really learned a lot about him. He could certainly be hiding something.

 

Perditus would be a good choice, especially since it would give him some actual characterization. :P

 

I'd be happy if either of these turned out to be the informant.

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I think Kiina is actually one of the least likely people; she really seems like she was just hoping for other worlds. Kiina is a character that longs for something better than she has, and the fact that she dreams about visiting other worlds does not confirm that she knows for they existed or was in contact with anyone from one of them.

 

Plus, if you look at The Legend Reborn, she's not keen on the Great Beings, calling them "Great Destroyers" and all. Sure, Velika is also not a big fan of the GBs in general, but you'd think Kiina wouldn't be quite so harsh if she was personally reporting to one.

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Wait... what if it's Malum? We know he's shady, but probably not completely evil. He might have gotten himself exiled on purpose just to get rid of his Glatorian duties and the attention from others. Or Strakk! He committed his arena crime RIGHT AFTER Makuta took over. Maybe as an excuse to leave society and prepare for Velika's arrival?

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I think Kiina is actually one of the least likely people; she really seems like she was just hoping for other worlds. Kiina is a character that longs for something better than she has, and the fact that she dreams about visiting other worlds does not confirm that she knows for they existed or was in contact with anyone from one of them.

 

Plus, if you look at The Legend Reborn, she's not keen on the Great Beings, calling them "Great Destroyers" and all. Sure, Velika is also not a big fan of the GBs in general, but you'd think Kiina wouldn't be quite so harsh if she was personally reporting to one.

 

Would she have to know that Velika is a Great Being to give him info?

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Wait... what if it's Malum? We know he's shady, but probably not completely evil. He might have gotten himself exiled on purpose just to get rid of his Glatorian duties and the attention from others. Or Strakk! He committed his arena crime RIGHT AFTER Makuta took over. Maybe as an excuse to leave society and prepare for Velika's arrival?

 

These are actually very good ideas. Malum as an informant would be an interesting story.

 

 

I think Kiina is actually one of the least likely people; she really seems like she was just hoping for other worlds. Kiina is a character that longs for something better than she has, and the fact that she dreams about visiting other worlds does not confirm that she knows for they existed or was in contact with anyone from one of them.

 

Plus, if you look at The Legend Reborn, she's not keen on the Great Beings, calling them "Great Destroyers" and all. Sure, Velika is also not a big fan of the GBs in general, but you'd think Kiina wouldn't be quite so harsh if she was personally reporting to one.

 

Would she have to know that Velika is a Great Being to give him info?

 

 

I would say yes. Why would she feel the need to give him information if she did not know who he was?

Edited by Jakura Nuva

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Would she have to know that Velika is a Great Being to give him info?

 

I would say yes. Why would she feel the need to give him information if she did not know who he was?

 

This is Kiina we're talking about here. She would tell him anything in exchange for a ticket off of Bara Magna.

 

As she wouldn't know who Velika was, he would qualify as an "otherworlder" to Kiina. 

Edited by fishers64
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Would she have to know that Velika is a Great Being to give him info?

 

I would say yes. Why would she feel the need to give him information if she did not know who he was?

 

This is Kiina we're talking about here. She would tell him anything in exchange for a ticket off of Bara Magna.

 

As she wouldn't know who Velika was, he would qualify as an "otherworlder" to Kiina. 

 

 

I honestly didn't consider that when I said such.

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Sisters of the Skrall maybe?

 

Don't think so, they were looking for Angonce, and if they knew where any Great Being was, or at least how to contact them, you can bet they would.

 

I honestly don't think Kiina is the one. She's highly suspicious and she "hates playing messenger" (Raid on Vulcanus!). Besides, most of the time she's been with Mata-Nui, Gresh, Berix, and Ackar. She seems too honest of a person to go around contacting Great Beings. And she wouldn't have been so excited when she saw Mata-Nui and learned he was alien, if she'd already been contacting one.

 

The blades Atakus has could be alien, but they're the same design as the ones the Skrall use (and he is a rock agori) so I don't think they're alien, though that brings up something interesting to look out for; Velika's agents may have some sort of alien gear. Looking at the sets, it seems like no.

 

Malum is an interesting choice. He's very likely, because the prospect that he might be insane has come up many times. If he's in contact with Velika, that contact might be the only thing keeping him sane. And Velika could've helped him to gain rule among the Vorox. Though I don't think it's Malum because I would guess that Velika would want agents that are in the villages to report back the major happenings; Malum is highly isolated.

 

I don't think it's possible that the agents aren't fully aware of what they are doing; they should know exactly what the plan is. The fact that they were mentioned to be "loyal" followers supports this.

 

It could be Berix because he's always very frantic and seemed jittery and scared whenever accused of being the traitor to the Skrall, and maybe it shakes him up because he is betraying them, to someone else. Though does seem more earnest in the movie, though this might be because he realized that they're not accusing him of working with Velika, and so he calmed down. You never know.

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Atakus' blades were called alien.

 

Oh, okay. In that case, Atakus would make sense, I suppose. But there's still a lot of other good reasons for why he's carrying alien blades.

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Kiina seems possible. She's easy to manipulate with her obsession to get off Bara, and Velika sure could do such a thing.

 

Berix knowing the GB Lab is very suspicious, which figures to Kiina's case as well.

 

Malum... Is a toss-up. Maybe Velika chose him since he was unstable, so no one would pay attention to him? :shrugs:

 

Certavus is very probable, if he counts. Thing is, he would be very stable as an informant. Glatorian system could have been a social control method to prevent anarchy for Velika's return.

 

How about Suriel, with his Iron Wolves. Believed to be dead but hiding up in he mountains? Very suspect. Who's to say he couldn't monitor with his wolves (or himself)occasionally foraging into Iconox.

Edited by Norik Of Celtania

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Vastus / Tarix

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I just read this while scrolling through the Greg chat, and was completely blown away. I rushed to BZ to create a topic if one didn't already exist, and instead I found the speculation well underway. I've just left a question asking Greg if he'd basically be willing to tell us who the contacts are, so we'll see if he replies.

 

Now, looking at the suspect list above, I'm going to say with a certain degree of confidence that it is not Tuma. He was too interested in the concerns of his own people to be focused on the rest of the planet. He wanted to conquer it only to ensure his own survival. Which brings me to my primary suspect... A person who also tried to conquer Bara Magna, and did it for personal gain. 

 

Metus.

 

Think about it. He wanted to control the Bone Hunters and the Skrall to rule over Bara Magna, but we've never had too much insight into why he wanted so much power. What if he was doing it for someone else... like Velika? With all of the power and prestige he already had, why would he need to take over? It would make sense if he was being pressured into it by someone else.

 

Also, Metus is known to be a very persuasive talker and negotiator. He's trained Glatorian and overseen arena matches. He has detailed knowledge of combat, and also worked in an Ice Army training camp before the Core War. He has the knowledge and skills and connections to know all about everything that was going on amidst the citizens of Bara Magna. Who better could Velika trust to raise an army before his arrival? Additionally, by allying himself with the Skrall, Metus then became aware of the movements of the Baterra, and the Bone Hunters let him know about other happenings out in the desert. 

 

I have no idea who else could be a contact of Velika, but I'm very certain Metus was one of them. We know Velika wants to rule Spherus Magna, and almost immediately after the MU robot comes back online, Metus starts manipulating the Bone Hunters and Skrall into forming an army strong enough to conquer all of Bara Magna. Coincidence? I think not. Metus has contacts in almost every part of Bara Magna, and is affiliated with all of the tribes. Everyone knows him, and he knows about everyone. He's the perfect person to use as a spy. 

 

EDIT: I'd also argue that it isn't Berix. Nobody trusts him, which makes him useless as a spy. I think Gresh is too naive, Ackar too loyal, and Kiina too eccentric. None of them are informants. Malum is too unstable, plus he can't really gain any information while he's camping out in the desert. The Bara Magna Vorox wouldn't make a very good army, and Malum doesn't control them anyway; he just survives alongside them. 

 

The Sisters of the Skrall are searching for Angonce, and they're too solitary to be of any use to Velika. Telluris wasn't a spy either. He was paranoid and fearful of others, and wouldn't be of any use as a spy. I don't think it would be any of the Skrall or Bone Hunters (Branar, Stronius, Fero or Attakus). Surel might be a spy keeping tabs on the Element Lords (it would make sense that Velika would want to know what they were doing as well). 

Edited by NatoGreavesy
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I just noticed: didn't one diorama picture in Journey's End show Ackar fighting in the Core War? Wouldn't he then have witnessed the Shattering --> know about other worlds? Why would he doubt Kiina then?

 

However, I vote Berix. He managed to heal/fix something in Gresh that caused him to have severe leg pain in a place with lots of GB tech.


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I would say Metus is a strong possibility. When Greg confirmed that Takanuva's destiny was to try and stop a Great Being civil war, he mentioned that Velika's side wanted autonomy over the people of Spherus Magna. Perhaps Metus was tasked with using the Skrall and Bone Hunters to take over in Velika's absence, and keep Velika's seat warm until the planet was reformed at the end of the 100,000 year cycle. Because of this I would also rule out Tuma, as if he was part of Velika's plan, then Metus would only have had a smaller role; he would still have been needed to betray Agori society, but Velika wouldn't have made him the revolution's leader.

 

My next guess would be Atakus, because of the alien blade he carries. It was a tiny hint that the character would play a larger role, but it was never followed up.

 

Throwaway suggestions would be Tarix (respected but reserved), Perditus (who never had a big role but still got a set) and Telluris. My reason for Telluris is that he was a bit of a nomad, so saw a lot of Bara Magna, but as an active and powerful threat few would question any 'snooping' or strange activities he performed.

 

Definitie no's would be Kiina (she'd know about other worlds rather than wishing for them), Tuma (for reasons I've already stated), Tarduk (for reasons other people have stated), and Berix (you can't get away with the is-he-or-isn't-he-bad device more than once).


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My guess would be Atakus (those alien blades he had) or Kiina (she was fascinated with anything off-world - was that interest sparked by her relationship with a Great Being?).


 

 

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I've got to disagree with a few points hat have been made so far. 

 

Stronius sided with Makuta to get revenge on Mata Nui. It says as much in Journey's End. Besides, Velika wanted Makuta defeated as well (if Makuta was still in control, how was Velika supposed to rule Sherus Magna? If Makuta won, Spherus Magna would never have existed), so that doesn't prove anything. 

 

Telluris was paranoid, fearful, and insane. He lived in isolation, and only really crossed paths with other Agori when he was trying to kill them. I see Velika as a fairly sensible being, so I don't see a logical reason why he would hire a loner lunatic to serve as a spy. 

 

Now, Atakus could well be a spy. I can't think of a reason to say it isn't him, but there's nothing to say he was, either. The so-called "alien blades", don't really prove anything. He found his by accident in what the Skrall thought was a Baterra camp. The exact same weapons are used by several Bone Hunters and almost every single member of the Skrall tribe.

 

That minor quibble aside, Atakus would make for a fairly useful spy. He was closely connected with the Skrall and the Rock Agori, and also acted as a liaison with the other villagers. If, as I suspect, Metus was a spy as well, perhaps he and Atakus worked together to keep the Skrall in check. 

 

Finally, Berix. As I mentioned in my earlier spiel, he'd be a useless spy, because NO ONE TRUSTS HIM!!!

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Yar, Nato's got it pretty much down. Metus is the number one contendor in my opinion (though I still feel like it could be possibly Tuma, though not both).

 

I personally don't think it would be any minor agori like Kyry and such. Even though they never got much story relevance, they are very unexplored characters and making them agents of Velika would make it feel like that's their only real purpose in the story. I would rather see a character we already know somewhat so that their character gets more explored.

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I'd say Metus could be one, since he is always around and about, you know.

 

I'd say the Hero Agori could be marked out, loving solitude and showed nomadic tendencies and all. Especially with most tribes being "complete strangers" to him, I couldn't see how he would provide any good information for Velika.


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Metus seems to be popular nowadays, but I fail to see the point of Metus being an answer to everything on Bara/Spherus Magna: "Who found Mata Nui? Metus. Who was the snitch? Metus. Who truly leaded the Skrall? Metus. Who was around when Annona showed herself again after a gazillion years? Metus." Just gets a bit bland.

 

As for Glatorian, in Legend Reborn Metus never mentions when the Agori started having Glatorian fights instead of messy wars. Having Glatorian agents before they were able to get around other villages in means of fighting without getting looked at and being suspected seems odd. We also don't know what Velika might have to say to these agents, which makes things hard.

 

I throw in a wild card and suspect Annona. She has the capability of getting inside others' minds, and thus makes a great spy. Yeah, she wasn't around in 2009, but she should also be considered in my opinion. Velika also seems to avoid/despise other GBs, making him and Annona share a common enemy. Maybe he promised the minds of other GBs to her as a way of gaining trust?


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What if there is more than one agent? I mean, Atakus was with the Skrall, isolated from the others for a good long while. They were just barely moving south when we reached Bara Magna in the story. I think Velika would choose agori, as he chose to hide in Matoran form as well. It is always the little one you don't expect. So I think it is Atakus and Berix at the very least feeding Velika information.


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