OFFICIAL Bionicle 2015 Topic

[masterchirox580]

Hey guys, I know I'm bringing up something quite old but I noticed in the teaser for summer 2015 the shrine the skull mask is placed on has protector mask symbols all around it with a different elemental beam coming out of them, does this have any story significance? 

[Aanchir]

Hey guys, I know I'm bringing up something quite old but I noticed in the teaser for summer 2015 the shrine the skull mask is placed on has protector mask symbols all around it with a different elemental beam coming out of them, does this have any story significance? 

Not sure at this point. It might be that the skull masks were created by combining multiple elements, kind of like the Mask of Ultimate Power. If so, that lends further credence to the idea that Makuta is alive and active. Alternatively, if the skull villains are in fact undead, it could be that their masks have to be charged with energy from other masks in order to give their bodies life. And that, in turn, could be the reason the Skull Spiders were stealing masks — to use them as energy or raw material so Makuta could build an army.

 

I wonder if the masks Makuta made in the past had a similar skull motif? That could explain why they weren't as well-loved by the villagers, which was the reason Makuta became jealous and bitter in the first place. These skull masks ARE pretty unsettling...

[masterchirox580]

 

Hey guys, I know I'm bringing up something quite old but I noticed in the teaser for summer 2015 the shrine the skull mask is placed on has protector mask symbols all around it with a different elemental beam coming out of them, does this have any story significance? 

Not sure at this point. It might be that the skull masks were created by combining multiple elements, kind of like the Mask of Ultimate Power. If so, that lends further credence to the idea that Makuta is alive and active. Alternatively, if the skull villains are in fact undead, it could be that their masks have to be charged with energy from other masks in order to give their bodies life. And that, in turn, could be the reason the Skull Spiders were stealing masks — to use them as energy or raw material so Makuta could build an army.

 

I wonder if the masks Makuta made in the past had a similar skull motif? That could explain why they weren't as well-loved by the villagers, which was the reason Makuta became jealous and bitter in the first place. These skull masks ARE pretty unsettling...

 

I'm not sure if they're even supposed to be masks, skull warrior (I think) has the same mask as skull grinder/basher/scorpion but it's broken in places which suggests those are actual skulls and not masks. 

[Blueblur21]

It's interesting how consistently G1 BIONICLE's later years are disparaged around here, when I personally consider them to have some of the theme's best storytelling, period. Hm.

 

My main beef with G2 so far is how non-existent the world feels. Okoto barely qualifies as a setting. Ok, we have the Temple of Time and the Ancient City, and then...what, exactly? There is no feel to the island, no atmosphere. There is not a single named inhabitant of the place, outside of Ekimu and Makuta. None of the villagers have names, and the Protectors who are supposed to apparently play the role of Turaga have no personalities. Nothing. We literally do not have a single character trait for a single one of them. Couple that with the webisodes that almost exclusively focus on Tahu, who has no actual personality there either, and you end up with a story that isn't there.

 

There are promising hints of things to come, such as the constant references to 'Time' and the Ancient City...but the problem is that nothing is being established. The Ancient City is clearly meant to house secrets and revelations...but I feel no real interest in discovering them. G2 is trying to build up a sense of mystery without establishing anything first. Why should I care about the truth behind this world or the adventures to come when I don't feel anything for...well, anything? Why should I care about these Toa? This island? The story team has put no effort into building investment in what we're seeing here.

 

There is simplification...and there is just poor story-telling. And try as some here might make it appear, 2015 is not equal to 2001, in any department (story-wise, of course. The sets rock.)

 

 

THIS. I haven't touched my Bionicle sets since getting them because everything's just so bare bones. What's Gali doing right now? Still trying to find her golden mask?

 

Yep. Oh, wait. She just found it. Now it'll take her another month to meet the others.

 

The Tahu Show isn't any fun, either. And why don't the Protectors have any personalities? They are literally just the definition of generic.

[Regitnui]

Generic=\=Bad. Sometimes the best stories are told from common or generic roots. Codex Alera is (famously) Lost Roman Legion crosse with Pokémon. It's still white-water good.

[Ford]

Generic=\=Bad. Sometimes the best stories are told from common or generic roots. Codex Alera is (famously) Lost Roman Legion crosse with Pokémon. It's still white-water good.

I agree. To play off of the perspective of Pokemon, characters in the game can be generic and still lovable. How many times can we call Joey and have him tell us about his super-cool Rattata? How many times have you heard that "shorts are comfy and easy to wear"?

The same goes for Bionicle. Sure, there are generic characters now and there have been in the past. For example, I like Tamaru despite his story not being fully fleshed out. I particularly like the scene he has in MNOG where he is pretending that he is flying in a plane and sitting away from the other partying Le-Matoran. In Gen 2, I just so happen to love PoF. He seems to be the only person on the island who knows what is really going on.

[Tahu5181]

What exactly is "adrenaline mode?" Is it an official thing, or a fan term? From what I've read on here, it sounds like it has something to do with a Toa's weapons, but I haven't seen/heard anything about it on my sets or the BIONICLE website.

[Ford]

What exactly is "adrenaline mode?" Is it an official thing, or a fan term? From what I've read on here, it sounds like it has something to do with a Toa's weapons, but I haven't seen/heard anything about it on my sets or the BIONICLE website.

"Adrenaline mode" is the term used to describe the Toa's dual-functioning weapons. 

Tahu: Fire swords -> Lava surfboard w/ small swords

Gali: Elemental Staff (I can't remember the exact name) -> Trident and Shark Fins

Pohatu: Boomerangs (a.k.a. "Stormerangs") -> "Jeterangs" and Dagger

Onua: Earthquake Hammer -> Turbo Shovelers

Kopaka: Spear and Shield -> Skis and Ski Pole

Lewa -> Dual Axes -> X-Glider (swords and "wings")

[Aanchir]

 

What exactly is "adrenaline mode?" Is it an official thing, or a fan term? From what I've read on here, it sounds like it has something to do with a Toa's weapons, but I haven't seen/heard anything about it on my sets or the BIONICLE website.

"Adrenaline mode" is the term used to describe the Toa's dual-functioning weapons. 

Tahu: Fire swords -> Lava surfboard w/ small swords

Gali: Elemental Staff (I can't remember the exact name) -> Trident and Shark Fins

Pohatu: Boomerangs (a.k.a. "Stormerangs") -> "Jeterangs" and Dagger

Onua: Earthquake Hammer -> Turbo Shovelers

Kopaka: Spear and Shield -> Skis and Ski Pole

Lewa -> Dual Axes -> X-Glider (swords and "wings")

 

Yep. And it is official — it was used in both the NYCC panel and in Tahu's product description.

[Tahu5181]

Thanks guys. That makes a lot more sense, now. By the way, I can't decide whether to get Pohatu or Lewa next. Any suggestions?

[Swanka]

Personally, I think this reboot has a TON of potential. Unfortunately, I feel LEGO is not using it. As some of you mentioned, there is next to no background information, leaving us wondering details that probably should have been spelled out by now. This could very well change in the new novels that are being released this year, as well as with the upcoming summer storyline.

 

Also, notice the Games tab on the official website and notice the word "Games". Is there more to come?

 

And the Okoto section is essentially useless.

 

But other than that, the sets look great, and I hope to get my first G2 set soon (AKA I'm cheap and have no money).

Edited March 9, 2015 by Swanka

[Makuta Miras]

Tahu5181- get Lewa. Pohatu is terrible, unless you want him for parts.

Edited March 9, 2015 by Miras: Makuta of Awesome

[dotcom]

Pohatu really isn't terrible by any stretch of the imagination. Being the least exciting out of a group of outstanding sets means he's still actually pretty good.The harsh criticism Pohatu sometimes gets is generally unwarranted, honestly.

[fishers64]

I'd like to point out that the "older group" note goes both ways - we might be more critical of Gen 2 because we're older, but that same principle can apply to Gen 1.
 

I'm still not seeing how this story is inherently worse than the previous one. Could it be told better? Of course! But 2001 wasn't told perfectly either; we didn't even get a cohesive plot line for it until 2003! Ignoring how they're being told, the stories, outside of meaningless fluff like a million mask powers and characters, are really on the same level. Sure, Okoto isn't quite as filled out as Mata Nui, but I find that an odd reason to declare this story will forever be inferior to the sluggish behemoth of useless information and tryhard edginess that was Bionicle G1.

Bionicle Gen 1 having a certain flaw doesn't excuse Bionicle Gen 2 from having the same flaw, though. 
 

For my part, I'd much rather we had these genuinely likeable animations (though I do wish they'd gotten an English narrator as strong as the Italian fellow,) however few there are, than a cringe-worthy TV series in the vein of those of Ninjago and Chima.

But I like Ninjago and Chima...
 
Welp, okay, Chima wasn't the best thing since sliced cheese, but at least it actually had a story and a world and stuff. 
 
Although my complaints with the new animations have less to do with what is there than what isn't there, admittedly. What we have gotten is cool, I just want more of it.

Edited March 9, 2015 by fishers64

[Toa Smoke Monster]

Thanks guys. That makes a lot more sense, now. By the way, I can't decide whether to get Pohatu or Lewa next. Any suggestions?

I would go with Lewa. He is the overall better set out of these two IMO. That's not to say Pohatu is bad. I just think that Lewa is better.

[Quisoves Potoo]

IBionicle Gen 1 having a certain flaw doesn't excuse Bionicle Gen 2 from having the same flaw, though. 

I don't think anyone is saying that. What folks such as Dina or myself are arguing against are the "Gen2 should know better"-type claims. Most of the complaints against the current story compare Gen2 to Gen1. To wit:

 

So no, 2001 didn't have the illusion of being "better cause we were kids"; it DID have more content.

 

LEGO doesn't have an excuse. They don't have to go all-out on the storytelling, but nine 90-second cartoons spread through six months are not going to contain enough story to keep a viewers interest and compel them to return to the site. How difficult is it to have periodic story updates in forms of chronicles like they did in 2002 to go along with the Bohrok animations? That's a lot more exciting and at least helps with storybuilding and keeping the followers engaged in an ever-evolving story.   

 

Which is not to say that I find the handling of the current story terribly flawed. Different, it most certainly is. Also minimalist in comparison to some of LEGO's other story driven themes (though compared to something like Galaxy Squad or UFO, not really). Yet I don't think that makes it bad.

 

Welp, okay, Chima wasn't the best thing since sliced cheese, but at least it actually had a story and a world and stuff.

 

Which, to my mind, were so uninspired and insipid (at least Ninjago is an eclectic creative dessert) as to make most other LEGO stories look masterly. Whether or not one agrees, I think that it is safe to say that detail does not necessarily strengthen a story. Sometimes, the best things are short and sweet.

 

Although my complaints with the new animations have less to do with what is there than what isn't there, admittedly. What we have gotten is cool, I just want more of it.

As do I. Yet I think that if the worst one can say of a story is that there isn't enough of it, then it is doing a lot right.

[Tahu5181]

Alright, cool. Thanks for the suggestions, guys. And as for my opinion on the G1 vs G2 debate-well, I have more money now than I did during G1, that's for sure. I have three of the new sets, and I am pretty happy with them, plus I wasn't a BIONICLE fan back in 2001. I'll say over all, it seems like LEGO has learned from it's past mistakes and taken a lot of the good things about the old sets and added some more good things. Story-wise, G2 isn't great, but it's better than what Hero Factory had (in my opinion). As for the whole argument about the kids of today being different from kids in 2001, that's absolutely true. But I still believe that kids of today can appreciate a rich story...which LEGO has certainly not given us. I have read a Star Wars book by Ryder Windham (I think he's going to be the author of the next BIONICLE book) and it was decent. Also I have the Mask of Creation game, and it was fun at first but now it's getting boring and stale.

[sydorack]

I think we have to wait and see what really is going to happen with the new generation.  I think we're all looking back at gen1 with nostalgia and a bit of romanticism.  If i remember correctly (i was only 10 at the time) we didn't get there whole story as soon as they dropped the product line.  At least i don't remember it that way.  Yes i do agree that the videos on the lego site are pretty weak, but there is plenty of room for this story to become way awesome.  I mean look at how long they kept gen1 going.  So far I really like the gen2 sets, and that's the most important factor to me.  Yes the story is important, but theres still room for that to grow and become something sweet.  Or maybe they'll just sideline the story and try to just push the sets.  Either way I'm pumped as ###### for the summer sets.  Skeleton warriors and scorpions and bashers? yeahhhhhh.  Also the mask of creation MIGHT just be the coolest mask yet.  

Edited March 11, 2015 by -Windrider-

[Ballom Nom Nom]

In contrast to a number of people posted here, I don't think I'll mind the minimal nature of the new story for a very long time. It's just such an amazing and refreshing change of pace from the (gigantic bloated mess of) Bionicle Gen 1's story!

Okay, granted, a smidgen more length to the animations would be nice. But still, my point stands.

~B~

[Prowl Nightwolf]

 

I'm going to ask a question to the people who believe Bionicle 2 has failed to meet their standards. How much of what you say is missing is necessary? Not 'it would be nice to have', or 'these gave gen1 character so gen2 should do it too', but what is strictly necessary to tell the story?

More screentime for people who aren't Tahu.

 

 This I agree with. I mean this is Bionicle not the Tahu show. To further on this train of thought it is not just about how Tahu seems to be the star for being the leader or past love of what the character was/is. I stat as such because we want to see the Island flushed out more. What is the Region of Ice like? I don't think it is simply a village and an ice bridge to some form of temple where the Mask was stashed. What of the land of Earth? Other than the village is it just a richer outcrop of stones and rocks? Does it exist under the island in caves and tunnels or is it on the surface? I mean if it supposedly took each Toa months to travel from where they landed(Seemingly each outside of the respective village?) To wherever their masks were located let's see some of it.

 

Keeping in mind I have not played the Okoto App game, so not sure if it fills in these region gaps the lack of screen time of the other Toa creates. I want to know if they are alone on this Island or what they villagers eat. Are they simply harvesters or do they hunt local fauna? I do not mind having generic characters to go along with the more flushed out ones. I mean it is lego after all. There is suppose to be room for imagination for one to create their own concepts. 

 

Gen1 did this beautifully. They had a balance between the generic Matoran villagers of a then unknown amount while also providing some depth to others so it isn't just a cookie cutter images of "yeah these are earth villagers, then are the fire ones, these over here are ice, and they are air. So what more do you want?" Now to be fair we are only in Month 3 of the Gen2 story and I don't know how long it took for gen1 to fill in their story. That however is no excuse. This Island cannot be just some random land mass with these different colored villagers who do what? Nothing... What are they? what do they stand for? Why does it seem the only other creatures on this island are these Skull Spiders?

 

I can be all for the bare minimum but this isn't walking outside in the nude... it is walking out without even wearing your flesh. I want to know why it took so long to reach the masks. I want to see the other regions in more depth. I want to know why these Protectors do that makes them different than the average villager or each other.

 

 

 

Also, to the people using the "it's targeted towards children" excuse: If children aren't enticed to by a good story (like the past generation could be), then doesn't that mean that human beings are becoming less intelligent? If the answer is yes, then I'm disappointed in how the world has been raising its children. If the answer is no, then whey the heck do industries push the whole "children are too stupid to understand this" ploy on so many marketing decisions? It's extremely discriminatory.

 

I'm still not seeing how this story is inherently worse than the previous one. Could it be told better? Of course! But 2001 wasn't told perfectly either; we didn't even get a cohesive plot line for it until 2003! Ignoring how they're being told, the stories, outside of meaningless fluff like a million mask powers and characters, are really on the same level. Sure, Okoto isn't quite as filled out as Mata Nui, but I find that an odd reason to declare this story will forever be inferior to the sluggish behemoth of useless information and tryhard edginess that was Bionicle G1.

 

People seem to be forgetting that one of the reasons that Okoto may not be fully fleshed out yet is possibly due to the fact that the story may need to stay centered on that island. Perhaps there are hidden structures on the island that could lead to future story points? Has anyone else thought of this?

 

 

I have... Though they could still fill in the blanks while also keeping those areas secret until later reveals. I mean how long had the Matoran been on Mata Nui before finding out there was a cave or tunnel to Metru Nui? You'd think they'd of found it by then however this was not the case. Why? because rahi guarded it and kept would be discoverers at bay. Now I am not saying that there needs to be an underground city on Okoto. Just that they can fill in some blanks without revealing the whole island.

 

 

It's interesting how consistently G1 BIONICLE's later years are disparaged around here, when I personally consider them to have some of the theme's best storytelling, period. Hm.

 

My main beef with G2 so far is how non-existent the world feels. Okoto barely qualifies as a setting. Ok, we have the Temple of Time and the Ancient City, and then...what, exactly? There is no feel to the island, no atmosphere. There is not a single named inhabitant of the place, outside of Ekimu and Makuta. None of the villagers have names, and the Protectors who are supposed to apparently play the role of Turaga have no personalities. Nothing. We literally do not have a single character trait for a single one of them. Couple that with the webisodes that almost exclusively focus on Tahu, who has no actual personality there either, and you end up with a story that isn't there.

 

There are promising hints of things to come, such as the constant references to 'Time' and the Ancient City...but the problem is that nothing is being established. The Ancient City is clearly meant to house secrets and revelations...but I feel no real interest in discovering them. G2 is trying to build up a sense of mystery without establishing anything first. Why should I care about the truth behind this world or the adventures to come when I don't feel anything for...well, anything? Why should I care about these Toa? This island? The story team has put no effort into building investment in what we're seeing here.

 

There is simplification...and there is just poor story-telling. And try as some here might make it appear, 2015 is not equal to 2001, in any department (story-wise, of course. The sets rock.)

 

THIS. I haven't touched my Bionicle sets since getting them because everything's just so bare bones. What's Gali doing right now? Still trying to find her golden mask?

 

Yep. Oh, wait. She just found it. Now it'll take her another month to meet the others.

 

The Tahu Show isn't any fun, either. And why don't the Protectors have any personalities? They are literally just the definition of generic.

 

This is a bit of my beef. I mean we know or can assume that the Protectors who are helping the Toa are not the same ones that found Ekimu(& Makuta?) So many generations ago. Still who are they? Do they get past from within the family like a Monarchy or more of a voting deal. Each generation has it's own protector but how if at all are they chosen? What of having more than one offspring? Do they all become Protectors or is it the first born? Are we talking Phoenix style rebirth or is there actual reproduction? Why don't we have any data on gender scarcity? Nothing... I mean come on now... So far the only one who know is female is Gali and only due to her past selves being female. I remember quite an uproar on the idea that Gali is a man due to the first animation and her speech being male over female.

 

So far due to what seems to be a Tahu/PoF story we don't know if anything about the other Protectors. Are they as brave as the PoF? Are they exactly the same other than weapon and living conditions? It just seems empty. Like getting but a bite if that of your favorite dish and then watching the rest be thrown away or kept and taunted with it. Maybe I'll give you more, maybe I wont and force you to eat this not as desirable dish. You'll eat it and like it or get nothing..

[Torchbearer]

 

Edit: What Iblis said.

That should have been your entire post, not an addition to it.

I don't mean to be rude here, but notice how I said "Edit:"? That means I saw Iblis' post after I had finished mine, and found he/she (sorry, avatar makes it hard to tell) to have a better explanation than my own.

[Iblis]

You did make me realise how much I want to see Ussal crabs again, Takua & Pewku was an awesome set, & giant friendly 'pet' crabs is nice to see IMO ^{(not very common nor overly rare?)}, & I think a (part) CCBS version could work, although I'm not in a rush to see it --  I can see how two dozen Humanoids, a giant spider, many small spiders/scorpions, a big scorpion, and a crab might seem a bit... bland for some... eh. ^{(Who wants to see a G2 Bionicle [other animal]?)}

Important thing: I thought Pewku was awesome

 

Oh & yeah I got nothing to add ATM, Prowl Nightwolf summed a lot up. ^{(Fairly certain most of us here have conversation looped multiple times on this forum, with no more new information... can't really be helped?)}

 

I don't mean to be rude here, but notice how I said "Edit:"? That means I saw Iblis' post after I had finished mine, and found he/she (sorry, avatar makes it hard to tell) to have a better explanation than my own.

 

Just for the record I'm male ^{(sex & gender)}, the avatar ^{(Link, Wii U version, some liberties)} is very ambiguous, anyhow; considering the upvotes I thinks it's safe to say that you communicated something that was better & different ^{(points for examples)} than what I had typed

[Regitnui]

Pohatu: Boomerangs (a.k.a. "Stormerangs") -> "Jeterangs" and Dagger

 

Speaking of, since Dina (can't remember the rest of your name, sorry) pointed out that most media shows him with the 'jetarangs' facing forward from his feet like sand-shoes, I've headcanoned that the spread 'boomerang-riding' pose on his box is only when he's flying. While walking, he wears them like he did in his character video. Makes Pohatu's adrenaline mode much easier to pose.

[Torchbearer]

 

I don't mean to be rude here, but notice how I said "Edit:"? That means I saw Iblis' post after I had finished mine, and found he/she (sorry, avatar makes it hard to tell) to have a better explanation than my own.

 

Just for the record I'm male ^{(sex & gender)}, the avatar ^{(Link, Wii U version, some liberties)} is very ambiguous, anyhow; considering the upvotes I thinks it's safe to say that you communicated something that was better & different ^{(points for examples)} than what I had typed

 

Oh... sorry, I don't usually take notice of upvotes on here.

[bioniclepluslotr]

I feel like the character development is so poor in G2. You just don't know anything about the Toa, because they don't know anything about themselves. And it doesn't help that all the web videos have the exact same voice for each character so there's not much distinction there. In the 2001 comics, you see stuff like Kopaka meeting Matoro and being cold and hostile, but in G2, the most memorable thing about him is probably "I didn't slip."

Edited March 11, 2015 by bioniclepluslotr

[Tarvaxx]

I feel like the character development is so poor in G2. You just don't know anything about the Toa, because they don't know anything about themselves. And it doesn't help that all the web videos have the exact same voice for each character so there's not much distinction there. In the 2001 comics, you see stuff like Kopaka meeting Matoro and being cold and hostile, but in G2, the most memorable thing about him is probably "I didn't slip."

You see the problem here isn't just the character development, it's how the story handles itself. It doesn't take itself seriously. You can have a good story that is both lighthearted AND serious. Wind Waker is a prime example of having dark elements and seriousness blended in with a lighthearted atmosphere. I think instead of trying to make the target audience "kids", they should do something more like what Batman: The Animated Series did and what Nintendo does, which is making a story that ALL ages can enjoy, as that's what Lego is about, isn't it? 

Edited March 11, 2015 by BlatantlyHeroic

[Aanchir]

I feel like the character development is so poor in G2. You just don't know anything about the Toa, because they don't know anything about themselves. And it doesn't help that all the web videos have the exact same voice for each character so there's not much distinction there. In the 2001 comics, you see stuff like Kopaka meeting Matoro and being cold and hostile, but in G2, the most memorable thing about him is probably "I didn't slip."

Personality-wise I'd almost be willing to say that's an improvement. An insecure character is much more interesting to me than one who's just abrasive and antisocial.

 

Frankly, though, most of our most interesting characterization for the Toa came after they met each other, and we simply haven't gotten to that point in this story. What made the first comic most interesting for me was not Kopaka's unpleasant attitude, but the way Pohatu was willing to try and befriend him in spite of that, and the way that ultimately led to a very close friendship between them.

 

In any case, criticizing the animations so far because we haven't gotten to know Kopaka really well in them is like criticizing that first comic because we didn't get to know Tahu or Lewa really well in it. Obviously, you're not going to see a lot of character development in any kind of media among characters who barely even appear. I do hope to see more of Kopaka in the future (because his rebooted personality is FANTASTIC), but the animations so far have focused on Tahu and the Protector of Fire, and I'm okay with that.

[Tarvaxx]

 

I feel like the character development is so poor in G2. You just don't know anything about the Toa, because they don't know anything about themselves. And it doesn't help that all the web videos have the exact same voice for each character so there's not much distinction there. In the 2001 comics, you see stuff like Kopaka meeting Matoro and being cold and hostile, but in G2, the most memorable thing about him is probably "I didn't slip."

Personality-wise I'd almost be willing to say that's an improvement. An insecure character is much more interesting to me than one who's just abrasive and antisocial.

 

Frankly, though, most of our most interesting characterization for the Toa came after they met each other, and we simply haven't gotten to that point in this story. What made the first comic most interesting for me was not Kopaka's unpleasant attitude, but the way Pohatu was willing to try and befriend him in spite of that, and the way that ultimately led to a very close friendship between them.

 

In any case, criticizing the animations so far because we haven't gotten to know Kopaka really well in them is like criticizing that first comic because we didn't get to know Tahu or Lewa really well in it. Obviously, you're not going to see a lot of character development in any kind of media among characters who barely even appear. I do hope to see more of Kopaka in the future (because his rebooted personality is FANTASTIC), but the animations so far have focused on Tahu and the Protector of Fire, and I'm okay with that.

 

That's your opinion though. Just because you don't like an anti-social character doesn't mean we don't. Besides, that's who Kopaka was, not liking that means you don't like him (at least the G1 version) which really means you have no right to talk about which personality "fits" him better. When you change the personality of a character to the extent G2 has, that basically means that it's no longer that character, it's a different person.

 

Also, their personalities were meant to be their element incarnate. Ice is cold and abrasive, Fire is hot and full of rage, etc. 

Edited March 11, 2015 by BlatantlyHeroic

[Iblis]

Personality-wise I'd almost be willing to say that's an improvement. An insecure character is much more interesting to me than one who's just abrasive and antisocial.

 

Arguably that's just ones preference for angst vs edginess; a matter of taste, I'd suggest both/either/one can be executed [opinion here];

But G2 Kopaka has 1 line to him... G1 Kopaka had almost the entire focus of the first comic (so more comparable to G2 Tahu in the sense of content), however that came out in June 2001, so arguably Kopaka G2 Wave 1 has more content to him than any of the G1 Wave 1 characters did...

 

[...] but the animations so far have focused on Tahu and the Protector of Fire, and I'm okay with that.

 

I agree with the vast majority of the cut content here, & well, yeah the focus has been on those two, but based soley ont eh animations their target audience appears to be significantly less cognitively developed, but looking at the age-brackets & complexity of the G2 sets... that seems patently fallacious.

 

I'm intrigued to see how the present presentation of story could mature within a single year to something less narmy without being entirely jarring...

 

Really though, unless Wave 2 brings some very dramatic changes, I think it's fairly accurate to say that the story hasn't just been streamlined but has been dumbed down, although that's based on the opinion that a complete lack of subtlety (exception; easter-eggs), the PoF [seems like he] is [intended to be] a wise character, but I know five year-olds who can communicate much more eloquently.

 

Looking at the first Bionicle comic, sure there isn't anything really deep in there, but look at Nujus 'communication' there vs the PoFs in all 9 (or as many as you can understand I suppose) videos... its simpler in almost every sense of the word.

 

Might not be a bad thing for some, but look at (the books in both cases) Harry Potter vs Twilight; many characters at least start off fairly well flat, one series certainly developed characters more than another... obviously there are size differences; as there are between G1 & G2, although G2 is still growing, G1, Harry Potter, & Twilight aren't really...

[believe victims]

When you change the personality of a character to the extent G2 has, that basically means that it's no longer that character, it's a different person.

 

 

See, I don't get this. When I look at the G2 characters, I don't see massive changes. They're more fleshed out, with more than one personality trait per character, but they still have the essence of their characters for the most part. Lewa's still sarcastic and impulsive, Kopaka is still reserved and aloof, Gali is still friendly and peaceful, Onua is still wise and strong, and Tahu is still hot-headed and self-important. The only character I'd say has changed significantly is Pohatu, which is a shame, but he's hardly enough to throw the entire G2 cast under the bus.

 

They're not the exact same characters of course, but then again, why should they be? We don't even know if they're supposed to be the exact same characters; it is a reboot, after all. Just as every iteration of Optimus Prime has their differences, so too are the G2 Toa different from the G1 Toa. They're similar characters that take familiar personalities and flesh them out more, to make them more lifelike and relatable than the cardboard cutout Toa Mata.

[Jobber]

Am I the only one who cares more about the sets themselves rather than the story? Both G1 and G2.

[Prowl Nightwolf]

That's your opinion though. Just because you don't like an anti-social character doesn't mean we don't. Besides, that's who Kopaka was, not liking that means you don't like him (at least the G1 version) which really means you have no right to talk about which personality "fits" him better. When you change the personality of a character to the extent G2 has, that basically means that it's no longer that character, it's a different person.

 

Also, their personalities were meant to be their element incarnate. Ice is cold and abrasive, Fire is hot and full of rage, etc.

I don't know how accurate this post is in regards to Gen1, though if that is the play they are doing here in gen2 I can stand behind it. I mean it makes sense after all. If the Toa are the embodiment of their respective element then why not take on some of its characteristics.

 

On a side note: Prowl done went and made another Online Purchase from the Lego store. This time he finished off his Protector's collection with the Water, Stone, Ice, and Jungle Protectors. Also I grabbed Lewa so I now will have one of each of the Original Toa Mata I owned some 15 years prior. They Are Onua, Gali, and Lewa. This time however I added Tahu to my Collection. Leaving only Pohatu and Kopaka remaining unpurchased. Their Toa Mata Versions were owned by my Brother along with Tahu. I may have them in a box somewhere, as I don't think we lost or sold them. No Idea what condition they would be in though... .

[Tarvaxx]

Am I the only one who cares more about the sets themselves rather than the story? Both G1 and G2.

It depends on why a person wants to buy sets.

 

A lot of us want them because we're still childish at heart, and because of the story which COMES with the toyline. Others who just collect toys and could care less about a story of course wouldn't need one. A child wants a story though. something to help them build a setting that would take place with his/her toys.

[Nescent]

On a side note: Prowl done went and made another Online Purchase from the Lego store. This time he finished off his Protector's collection with the Water, Stone, Ice, and Jungle Protectors. Also I grabbed Lewa so I now will have one of each of the Original Toa Mata I owned some 15 years prior. They Are Onua, Gali, and Lewa. This time however I added Tahu to my Collection. Leaving only Pohatu and Kopaka remaining unpurchased. Their Toa Mata Versions were owned by my Brother along with Tahu. I may have them in a box somewhere, as I don't think we lost or sold them. No Idea what condition they would be in though... .

 

I hope you can pick up Kopaka. I think he is my favorite set.

[Aanchir]

 

 

I feel like the character development is so poor in G2. You just don't know anything about the Toa, because they don't know anything about themselves. And it doesn't help that all the web videos have the exact same voice for each character so there's not much distinction there. In the 2001 comics, you see stuff like Kopaka meeting Matoro and being cold and hostile, but in G2, the most memorable thing about him is probably "I didn't slip."

Personality-wise I'd almost be willing to say that's an improvement. An insecure character is much more interesting to me than one who's just abrasive and antisocial.

 

Frankly, though, most of our most interesting characterization for the Toa came after they met each other, and we simply haven't gotten to that point in this story. What made the first comic most interesting for me was not Kopaka's unpleasant attitude, but the way Pohatu was willing to try and befriend him in spite of that, and the way that ultimately led to a very close friendship between them.

 

In any case, criticizing the animations so far because we haven't gotten to know Kopaka really well in them is like criticizing that first comic because we didn't get to know Tahu or Lewa really well in it. Obviously, you're not going to see a lot of character development in any kind of media among characters who barely even appear. I do hope to see more of Kopaka in the future (because his rebooted personality is FANTASTIC), but the animations so far have focused on Tahu and the Protector of Fire, and I'm okay with that.

 

That's your opinion though. Just because you don't like an anti-social character doesn't mean we don't. Besides, that's who Kopaka was, not liking that means you don't like him (at least the G1 version) which really means you have no right to talk about which personality "fits" him better. When you change the personality of a character to the extent G2 has, that basically means that it's no longer that character, it's a different person.

 

Also, their personalities were meant to be their element incarnate. Ice is cold and abrasive, Fire is hot and full of rage, etc. 

 

 

Don't put words in my mouth. G1 Kopaka was one of my favorite characters. The reason for that, though, was that he wasn't just a shallow, antisocial stereotype, but rather a character with a good heart buried underneath that icy facade. Even though it took a lot for him to accept others as friends, he was just as committed to shielding others from harm as he was to shielding himself from others. And over time, he formed really strong bonds of friendship with the rest of his team, especially Pohatu.

 

The new Kopaka, I think, is interesting in his own right. He's still icy and aloof — not because he hates other people like the G1 version did at this point in the story, but rather because he holds himself to impossibly high standards. I think with his newer and more clearly defined strengths and weaknesses (which complement his character design), he has the potential to become an even more interesting character than his G1 incarnation. Whether he can live up to that potential and surpass his predecessor depends on what kinds of relationships he is able to form with others and what it takes for him to form those relationships. But currently, he hasn't had much time to develop as a character, much like the previous incarnation at this point in the G1 storyline.

 

 

Am I the only one who cares more about the sets themselves rather than the story? Both G1 and G2.

It depends on why a person wants to buy sets.

 

A lot of us want them because we're still childish at heart, and because of the story which COMES with the toyline. Others who just collect toys and could care less about a story of course wouldn't need one. A child wants a story though. something to help them build a setting that would take place with his/her toys.

 

 

I've known a lot of kids who loved the BIONICLE sets and barely cared about the story, even in G1's strongest years. They just wanted cool-looking action figures they could take apart and combine to create new creations. It's a mistake to assume that kids and kids-at-heart are all attracted to BIONICLE by its story, or that people who are not interested in the story only care about the sets for their collectible value.

 

Personally, I've always been drawn to both the sets and the story. The story enhances my enjoyment of the sets, and the sets enhance my enjoyment of the story, but I also enjoy the sets and the story for their own reasons.

[sydorack]

Personally, I've always been drawn to both the sets and the story. The story enhances my enjoyment of the sets, and the sets enhance my enjoyment of the story, but I also enjoy the sets and the story for their own reasons.

 

This exactly.

 

 

 

Edit: Please try to add a little more substance to your posts!

-Wind-

Edited March 12, 2015 by -Windrider-

[masterchirox580]

I must say I've noticed increasing disappointment in the reboot over the past few months, and just last year we were all super excited and happy for the reboot, now everyone is criticizing it (not that there's anything wrong with that). 

[bioniclepluslotr]

I must say I've noticed increasing disappointment in the reboot over the past few months, and just last year we were all super excited and happy for the reboot, now everyone is criticizing it (not that there's anything wrong with that).

It happens when things don't live up to expectations.

 

I think they made the story childish beyond necessary. They're marketing to kids 6-14 and they're making it like a child's show. Like in the webiside where Tahu derped out and accidentally defeated skull spiders, that's like funny if you're 7. Most people 12 and up aren't going to go show their friends this stuff and say they're huge fans of it. It's so awkward. The old Bionicle was reminiscent of superhero comics with action, heroism, sacrifice, and evil, stuff that people of any age could appreciate. I wouldn't be surprised if Lego started throwing fart jokes into their stories (actually I think they might have already somewhere).

Edited March 11, 2015 by bioniclepluslotr

[masterchirox580]

 

I must say I've noticed increasing disappointment in the reboot over the past few months, and just last year we were all super excited and happy for the reboot, now everyone is criticizing it (not that there's anything wrong with that).

 I wouldn't be surprised if Lego started throwing fart jokes into their stories (actually I think they might have already somewhere).

 

You're right, they did it in the Chima show(A.K.A one of the worst things lego have their name attached to). 

[Nescent]

I must say I've noticed increasing disappointment in the reboot over the past few months, and just last year we were all super excited and happy for the reboot, now everyone is criticizing it (not that there's anything wrong with that).

 I wouldn't be surprised if Lego started throwing fart jokes into their stories (actually I think they might have already somewhere).

You're right, they did it in the Chima show(A.K.A one of the worst things lego have their name attached to). 

 

They also did in MNOG.