RPG Forum Contest 23 Reviews

[Toa Levacius Zehvor]

@ TPTI; Well I for one am not discouraged, and shall be leading any other suicidal brave players in the battles!@ KNI

Between those I believe you could've deduced the correct mindset.

Yes, I deduced your mindest. But put it in the RPG. Nobodies going to check the Review topic to see if any questions got answered. If there was a question, make sure it's answered.@ Zarayna

If you always lied, then your statement that you always lie is wrong. therefore, you only lie sometimes, like now.

Ah, but you stated that everything I reversed. Thus, when I say I always lie, I really mean I always tell the truth. But if I always tell the truth, I wouldn't have said the opposite of what I mean, and thus, I don't always tell the truth, which makes that a lie. And so on...

Okay, so they've just arrived on Metru Nui after months aboard ships, trying to survive. Next, they have next to no resources, and the land doesn't offer much. A senior warlord, a quite powerful, with support from several other warlords proposes a plan of government that will allow them to survive. He gains massive support from the half starved Steltians, and they make him king. Remember, if you're on the verge of starvation, with sickness, fighting, etc. breaking out, the future looks like non existent. If a powerful person, well respected (It is my opinion that the other Steltians, being a race of warriors, would bear him a form of grudging respect), comes along, and proposes a plan that will save your skin, has several other warlords supporting him, and starts enacting it, other warlords would join up, and as fewer were left out, those few would join as well.

Thanks. Shorten that and mix it with what you already have. Suggestion -

After Stelt fell to the Brotherhood, its populace roamed the seas until finally settling in the Le-Metru district of Metru-Nui. Eyorak, the most powerful and well supplied warlord at the time, managed to gain the support of the less powerful warlords and united them under one banner, creating the first Steltian monarchy. The most obviously powerful faction as far as military, Stelt is organized into a feudal caste system. The lower class and gladiator species are serfs and common soldiers, whilst the upper class species hold titles ranging from knight to warlord. The strongest of these factions are placed in similar but changing positions, with their internal struggles keeping them from an all out civil war. His most loyal servants are his three counts, who serve as his inner council, and several dozen warlords (including a few 'senior' warlords). The Steltians are the least likely to bend under the Brotherhood, and the most likely to defeat them. Ever since their home was conquered by the Brotherhood, they have held a deepset hatred of the Brotherhood. Thankfully for the Brotherhood, the Steltians are struggling simply to find food and supplies, and their old conflicts are becoming increasingly prevalent; only the wise actions of King Eyorak have kept this house of explosive cards from collapsing...

Suggestion - duke is a higher position than count, and it just sounds cooler.@ Lloyd

I recall watching RPGs that had to be terminated earlier than expected hurry along battles-in-progress and finish off the Big Bad in one post to give the PCs a happy ending. I couldn't point you to the specific game but I do recall it was one set in BZPower.

I'm still bitter about that one Dovy. I really wanted to fight a Makuta...@ Shyyrn

If somebody does perceive a possible hole in a part of the background--as Levacius does when he insists that a Steltian monarchy would be inherently unstable--I feel the onus should be on that person to exploit that hole within the game. If you feel that the other Steltian warlords can be turned against the monarch, then convince them to do so within the game.

All I want is for the GM to make a convincing argument. Frankly, I don't think I'll get a better on than I got, but I'll go with it because its exploitable, and if it wins, I'll be planning terrorist activities within the first week. Maybe this time a couple hundred nutters won't pop up out of nowhere.

P.S.: This is not, by the way, a different way of saying 'No one should be allowed to criticize GMs.' Of course you should... if you feel the idea would potenitally limit the gameplay experience or chances of winning the contest, not because you have a personal quarrel with the storyline, which is what Levacius seems to have with 'City of the Dead.'

Plot holes come in two varieties -1. The kind that you hide from the players, and leave there purposefully for the cunning ones to figure out.2. The GM left the skeleton in the closet and had to drive home. The pits still there.I see a few other things that are exploitable, and I'll speak to the Zarayna about them if the RPG looks like it might win. Talk to LegoLover about little things I noted - Toa energy in S-Toran, the amount of energy provided by the Kanohi Ignika, just minor things completely irrelevant at first, but they could prove useful later on.But the ones I've addressed on this one refer to general character knowledge, things that I'd like to see answers to. I haven't struck down the GMs idea, I asked him to fill it in.-Toa Levacius Zehvor

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Yes, I deduced your mindest. But put it in the RPG. Nobodies going to check the Review topic to see if any questions got answered. If there was a question, make sure it's answered.

You're telling me you want me to edit the RPG?This is another one of your jokes, right?Honestly though, the statement was that Steltians aren't savages. Literally no one else challenged that. If you'd read Eyorak's profile (oh my!) you could've answered your question. Edited March 14, 2012 by Shadow Guardian

[Toa Levacius Zehvor]

Yes, I deduced your mindest. But put it in the RPG. Nobodies going to check the Review topic to see if any questions got answered. If there was a question, make sure it's answered.

You're telling me you want me to edit the RPG?This is another one of your jokes, right?Honestly though, the statement was that Steltians aren't savages. Literally no one else challenged that. If you'd read Eyorak's profile (oh my!) you could've answered your question.

Oh my. Once more, back to the 'check the NPCs profiles, because we stuck it there instead of the RPGs'. I can excuse it in Knives in the Dark, since the emphasis is on the six warlords. But here? No. The profiles shouldn't be where story related information is placed; they're extras.Obviously not. However, since it's safe to assume that head GM is reading the reviews for his own RPG (which he is). Would you like me to lengthen it? Okay. "Ask Zarayna to make note of it in his RPG topic." There.My original reason for calling them savages is because of the practice of using slaves in gladiatorial combat (though that's who get usually used). That issue was ignored, and an unimportant one as there aren't really arenas of that type in Metru-Nui (just the racing ones in Le-Metru), and the other reasons have been patched up, giving a bunch of terrible entities the semblance of a normal society that is teetering at the edge of collapse.-Toa Levacius Zehvor

[Kal the Guardian]

Trapped in a Map-Ok, so the banner is simple yet effective. I like it. The title of the RPG appears rather small underneath it, though. The introduction, while I've read it before, still caught my interest. It's funny how exclamation points make things more exciting!Story. Wow, simple and to the point. It makes the story section in Dreamland look enormous.Factions. So, are all Toa of Plant Life sworn over to the worshippers so that all food goes through them? Or is it possible that there is some secret dude out there providing food on a major scale? Or would the Enforcers catch on too quickly and redistribute the food?Map. Beautifully simple and yet fun to look at. I must say the cracks don't seem that menacing. Is there an edge to the map, where if you walk far enough it just ends. What happens if you go off the side? Gravity kicks in and pulls you to the other side of the map? Is there something on the other side of the map?Other. Ok, so if everything is slower in map, do the three flashes happen slower? Almost like solar flares, causing people to stay inside and perhaps sand to melt, maybe even crumble away the edge of the map?You say you only control the Carver, but what about Carmera? And is there a set time that all this is happening? I ask this because Dreamland takes place when Makuta are good for the most part and the players should know this.Otherwise, I like this RPG and wouldn't mind seeing it win.

[Padishah Mehmet II]

My original reason for calling them savages is because of the practice of using slaves in gladiatorial combat (though that's who get usually used).-Toa Levacius Zehvor

... So the Roman Empire were savages? As much as I hate the Romans, that's not a word you can really apply to them.-Dovydas Edited March 14, 2012 by Dovydas of Gulet

[Wyrd Bid Ful Araed]

Aaaand you see where I'm going with this?

I assume you mean that metagamers aren't going to stop if you tell them. Generally players do. If not just punish them once and it tends to stick except in rare cases. Religious flamers not so much. The one I'm thinking of nearly got banned but only stopped because the topic was locked

...What isolation? They're in a large fortress full of the last of their kind. Sure there's pressure, but that is not the primary factor in their insanity--take these same Toa and pitch them against a zombie horde of equal size to the Outer Hordes, with only the Bastion and Colossi at their disposal and the odds are good they'd win. The simple fact, that you keep ignoring, is that the primary motivation in the insanity is the sheer alien-ness of the Horde. You seem, from where I'm sitting, to be grasping at anything you can attribute the madness to aside from the obvious. You know, the thing that I have said, by GM-fiat, is the cause.

Emphasis on 'last of their kind'See, Lovecraft horror tends to be agoraphobic in nature. The world is huge and full of things you cannot understand because you are tiny and small. Sure you can run, but whats the point because no mater where you go they will find you.This RPG is claustrophobic in nature. You are trapped in this fortress, can't go outside.And I'm not ignoring it, I addressed it several times, you're just making yourself dizzy going in circles. I pointed out that the madness effect of the creatures cannot be a factor. If you look at them and instantly go mad then you cannot fight them, to which you responded that the effects weren't instantaneous, its a slow boil. Which means the effects aren't directly noticeable which means they aren't going to be a factor. Your argument just proves my point.

I'll address these two jointly. I'm not contradicting myself. it's perfectly possible to offer the players hope, by which they can play for three months or so against all odds, and maybe, maybe win. Even Lovecraft didn't have all of his stories end badly. However, since most of his stories did end badly, the players are going to have to work very, very hard to get that good ending. So it's not that the Bastion "cannot' win, it's that it's unlikely in the extreme.The players can strike meaningful blows, it's just that the need a lot of strategically-placed very good ones.

How can we strike strategic blows when we can't get out the fortress? The only way to fight is to stay inside and just hold off the attacks which is a futile task as they are endless. Nor can we just wait it out because the siege mentality will drive us all mad or the Abd will get us. The only reason they haven't won already is the rather flimsy excuse of the Elder Leviathans being lazy despite the conquered universe being evidence to the contrary

The idea of fighting until the PC dies is central to this game, as it's one of the main things that I want to observe--how the players react to having their PCs killed. You, I can tell, seem to be reacting badly.

If people put work and investment into their characters they're unlikely to want them to die. Unless you're Darkon who kills and replaces his characters every few pages :PI cannot see players just ending their characters. Nor you just killing them because that doesn't fit what you're saying about control. So how exactly are the characters going to wind up dead?

But if the players win a battle, I will never, ever roflstomp them afterward with no way for them to save themselves, and I take offense to the implication that I would.

Which brings me back to the point about insanity. if they drive you mad just by looking at them this is exactly what you're doing. And if they don't make you stark staring just by looking at them, then how exactly is it them driving you insane rther than the oppression of their siege?

You mis-represent what i'm saying here. I'm not saying that they hurt you by attacking you, I'm saying that simply looking at them leaves long, lasting damage. Tell me what zombie can injure you just by being looked at?

Again, if they're that dangerous to look at you're just stomping the player for trying to fight which you say you don't want to do. And if they aren't, if they're just horrific to look at, then whats the difference between them and zombies except a few tentacles?See what I meant by contradictions?

It's the idea of an informed minority vs an uninformed majority, to put it in the technical terms

Which I'm also fairly sure I've seen before, though I don't remember every RPG off by heart, so I'll concede here at least for now

I did see that you said that there's nothing special about this RPG. I think that's patently ridiculous. It's like saying that there was nothing unique about Night of Infinity because it just used the backdrop of a science fiction world to let people fight each other, and wasn't original because Cap'n had used the idea of rank systems first

Ah, so you saw my point you just didn't think about it very much. NoI was special because it was the first Bionicle in space type RPG. This RPG is just another "We're all trapped in one place with enemies all around us" RPG. Seen it dozens of times before. Nothing wrong with it, but its hardly groundbreaking. The only standout point was the Horde itself, and the fact that I keep having to explain my problems and queries with that to you suggests an air of sticking your fingers in your ears

(though I did say that I liked the idea of a Sanity Meter but you wouldn't, because that's a number system)

1.) I could hardly criticise something I suggested now could I :biggrin:2.) I'm against overly complicated numbers systems, which an Insanity Factor (if it involved numbers at all) wouldn't need to be3.) I only offered one solution because I only posed one problem; that the RPG was a bit bland. The Insanity meter would have given it something different and meant the horde wasn't just meat thrown at the players the way they are now

All I gathered from you and Spink was that "it'll never catch on" because apparently numbers systems are too restrictive

Which means you missed our point entirely. Well, mine at least, can't speak for Spink. My point wasn't that it was too restrictive, it was that it took the fun out of things. Rather than be cleverer than your opponents, rather than try and outmanoeuvre and outwit them, you could only hope to be luckier. The dice was king, not story.I did wonder, when you started going on about how we didn't trust you as a GM and how it was all working on another forum, whether you were a bit to occupied playing the martyr to actually notice what we were saying

I also feel that the likelihood of you being mistaken about the blandness of my RPG is much higher than the odds of my having criticism-blinders on, mostly because all of the other people who've reviewed my RPG like it and do not feel that it's bland.

Well sorry I'm not stroking your ego but thats never my goal when reviewing. I will say one thing though; out of all the reviews many said they liked it but none said why exactly. Well one did. He liked the banner Edited March 14, 2012 by The Dreadful Flying Glove

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Oh my. Once more, back to the 'check the NPCs profiles, because we stuck it there instead of the RPGs'. I can excuse it in Knives in the Dark, since the emphasis is on the six warlords. But here? No. The profiles shouldn't be where story related information is placed; they're extras.

No. This is getting ridiculous. I'm telling you there's a benefit to reading them when you couldn't catch the tip-offs the first time. 1. Uniting would show they have the common sense to do so. Savages don't have common sense.2. Fleeing instead of staying and fighting an unwinable fight.3. Building a colony with a monarchy.Did you actually think they were savages after that? Really? And yes, these were all in the RPG.Let me make this clear: NPCs are not extras. The game wouldn't be able to be fun without them. Techna without the Toa Techna. GoMN without Swordshifter. IoP without the Sheaperds.

[Toa Levacius Zehvor]

Oh my. Once more, back to the 'check the NPCs profiles, because we stuck it there instead of the RPGs'. I can excuse it in Knives in the Dark, since the emphasis is on the six warlords. But here? No. The profiles shouldn't be where story related information is placed; they're extras.

No. This is getting ridiculous. I'm telling you there's a benefit to reading them when you couldn't catch the tip-offs the first time.1. Uniting would show they have the common sense to do so. Savages don't have common sense.2. Fleeing instead of staying and fighting an unwinable fight.3. Building a colony with a monarchy.Did you actually think they were savages after that? Really? And yes, these were all in the RPG.Let me make this clear: NPCs are not extras. The game wouldn't be able to be fun without them. Techna without the Toa Techna. GoMN without Swordshifter. IoP without the Sheaperds.

You don't need a tidy little list to point out what I already know. I made the point that it's a race of barbaric savages in the canon, and listed my defensive points, which were mostly ignored. You made your counter, saying they're not, with the reason 'because this isn't the canon'. Which is perfectly fine.Your points aren't very good ones though, and I need to point out why. First off, savages can have common sense. The Mongol hordes, the Vikings. Second, that can also be associated with determination, and fighting the unwinnable fight is not a 'savage' thing. And it's quite possible for savages to have a monarchy - power granted to the strongest being, and to his children, as long as they can hold it.But no, I don't believe that they're savages in this alternate universe (though I hardly see what would stop a member of Gladiators species from just ripping through a squad of Matoran to kill off a few Rahkshi). I do, however, believe that some things need to be clarified, and if you don't believe that, then go right ahead. I'm pointing out the errors, correct them or don't. I couldn't care less.You've already stated that there's a benefit to reading the profiles. Which is why I now read them. What I'm telling you is that the player should not have to read profiles for basic plot information that could have easily been explained elsewhere. NPCs are extras that help make the RPG feel like an open world (even when combined) that they're just a part of, and to let players know that they're not the only beings that exist. They give the GM the ability to make direct interaction and allow him to direct the action if he needs to (and to railroad it, though nobody likes a railroad).

My original reason for calling them savages is because of the practice of using slaves in gladiatorial combat (though that's who get usually used).-Toa Levacius Zehvor

... So the Roman Empire were savages? As much as I hate the Romans, that's not a word you can really apply to them.-Dovydas

We could debate this to no end, but this is neither place to do it, nor would either of us change the others opinion.-Toa Levacius Zehvor

[Toa of Dancing]

You've already stated that there's a benefit to reading the profiles. Which is why I now read them. What I'm telling you is that the player should not have to read profiles for basic plot information that could have easily been explained elsewhere. NPCs are extras that help make the RPG feel like an open world (even when combined) that they're just a part of, and to let players know that they're not the only beings that exist. They give the GM the ability to make direct interaction and allow him to direct the action if he needs to (and to railroad it, though nobody likes a railroad).

I'm not going to try and involve myself in this anymore than saying that Lev has a very strong point here. Yes, people should read the NPCs' rofiles. But few people do more than skim them, at least before an RPG wins. They're there to support the RPG, not be the main driving factors. The story is supposed to do that. If the story is focused on the NPCs, then focus it on the NPCs. Make that clear, make people want to read the profiles.Also, it never hurts to restate something somewhere else. Edited March 14, 2012 by Toa of Dancing

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Indeed, but a peaceful monarchy. That's what they made. Not a class of who's more powerful and ripping at people's throats.

You've already stated that there's a benefit to reading the profiles. Which is why I now read them. What I'm telling you is that the player should not have to read profiles for basic plot information that could have easily been explained elsewhere. NPCs are extras that help make the RPG feel like an open world (even when combined) that they're just a part of, and to let players know that they're not the only beings that exist. They give the GM the ability to make direct interaction and allow him to direct the action if he needs to (and to railroad it, though nobody likes a railroad).

Benefit =/= having to read it.I stated that already, so before you accuse me of ignoring your points (which I didn't, but whatever) remember that this whole argument is due to the fact that you didn't take the time to reason through everything. I am done arguing, because we're basically repeating ourselves.See you in the game if it wins.

I'm not going to try and involve myself in this anymore than saying that Lev has a very strong point here. Yes, people should read the NPCs' rofiles. But few people do more than skim them, at least before an RPG wins. They're there to support the RPG, not be the main driving factors. The story is supposed to do that. If the story is focused on the NPCs, then focus it on the NPCs. Make that clear make people want to read the profiles.

Thank you for expressing your opinion. Please read my above statements. Edited March 14, 2012 by Shadow Guardian

[Grantaire]

Okay guys, cool it. I think this is getting a little out of hand. You both have good points. How abougt this: you both can this until I edit the RPG, okay?

[Lara White]

Aaaand you see where I'm going with this?

I assume you mean that metagamers aren't going to stop if you tell them. Generally players do. If not just punish them once and it tends to stick except in rare cases. Religious flamers not so much. The one I'm thinking of nearly got banned but only stopped because the topic was locked

I'll cede this point.

...What isolation? They're in a large fortress full of the last of their kind. Sure there's pressure, but that is not the primary factor in their insanity--take these same Toa and pitch them against a zombie horde of equal size to the Outer Hordes, with only the Bastion and Colossi at their disposal and the odds are good they'd win. The simple fact, that you keep ignoring, is that the primary motivation in the insanity is the sheer alien-ness of the Horde. You seem, from where I'm sitting, to be grasping at anything you can attribute the madness to aside from the obvious. You know, the thing that I have said, by GM-fiat, is the cause.

Emphasis on 'last of their kind'See, Lovecraft horror tends to be agoraphobic in nature. The world is huge and full of things you cannot understand because you are tiny and small. Sure you can run, but whats the point because no mater where you go they will find you.This RPG is claustrophobic in nature. You are trapped in this fortress, can't go outside.And I'm not ignoring it, I addressed it several times, you're just making yourself dizzy going in circles. I pointed out that the madness effect of the creatures cannot be a factor. If you look at them and instantly go mad then you cannot fight them, to which you responded that the effects weren't instantaneous, its a slow boil. Which means the effects aren't directly noticeable which means they aren't going to be a factor. Your argument just proves my point.

Not directly noticeable =/= not a factor. I suspect that this is the heart of this particular misunderstanding.

I'll address these two jointly. I'm not contradicting myself. it's perfectly possible to offer the players hope, by which they can play for three months or so against all odds, and maybe, maybe win. Even Lovecraft didn't have all of his stories end badly. However, since most of his stories did end badly, the players are going to have to work very, very hard to get that good ending. So it's not that the Bastion "cannot' win, it's that it's unlikely in the extreme.The players can strike meaningful blows, it's just that the need a lot of strategically-placed very good ones.

How can we strike strategic blows when we can't get out the fortress? The only way to fight is to stay inside and just hold off the attacks which is a futile task as they are endless. Nor can we just wait it out because the siege mentality will drive us all mad or the Abd will get us. The only reason they haven't won already is the rather flimsy excuse of the Elder Leviathans being lazy despite the conquered universe being evidence to the contrary

I haven't actually written out the conquering of the reat of the MU but from my vague idea, the Elder Leviathans may have had to intervene, maybe once, probably against the OoMN or something.Like I said, lazy bums. :PHow, exactly, the players want to try and win will be up to them.

The idea of fighting until the PC dies is central to this game, as it's one of the main things that I want to observe--how the players react to having their PCs killed. You, I can tell, seem to be reacting badly.

If people put work and investment into their characters they're unlikely to want them to die. Unless you're Darkon who kills and replaces his characters every few pages :PI cannot see players just ending their characters. Nor you just killing them because that doesn't fit what you're saying about control. So how exactly are the characters going to wind up dead?

Hey, we all need to kill PCs sooner or later. I don't know how it'll come about but, you know, that's part of the experiment.

But if the players win a battle, I will never, ever roflstomp them afterward with no way for them to save themselves, and I take offense to the implication that I would.

Which brings me back to the point about insanity. if they drive you mad just by looking at them this is exactly what you're doing. And if they don't make you stark staring just by looking at them, then how exactly is it them driving you insane rther than the oppression of their siege?

You mis-represent what i'm saying here. I'm not saying that they hurt you by attacking you, I'm saying that simply looking at them leaves long, lasting damage. Tell me what zombie can injure you just by being looked at?

Again, if they're that dangerous to look at you're just stomping the player for trying to fight which you say you don't want to do. And if they aren't, if they're just horrific to look at, then whats the difference between them and zombies except a few tentacles?See what I meant by contradictions?

See previous comments about slow and steady =/= not a factor.

I did see that you said that there's nothing special about this RPG. I think that's patently ridiculous. It's like saying that there was nothing unique about Night of Infinity because it just used the backdrop of a science fiction world to let people fight each other, and wasn't original because Cap'n had used the idea of rank systems first

Ah, so you saw my point you just didn't think about it very much. NoI was special because it was the first Bionicle in space type RPG. This RPG is just another "We're all trapped in one place with enemies all around us" RPG. Seen it dozens of times before. Nothing wrong with it, but its hardly groundbreaking. The only standout point was the Horde itself, and the fact that I keep having to explain my problems and queries with that to you suggests an air of sticking your fingers in your ears

I did exactly the same type of thing with NoI that I am doing with THooL. I said "Hey, what would be a cool genre to play in?" and I found one, then wrote it with a Bionicle background. I could easily have done a lot of different things with THooL, but I picked the last redoubt of Matoran-kind setting because it would be the most conducive to letting the players fight, and from my experience it's rare for a game to succeed when there's not much chance to fight.

(though I did say that I liked the idea of a Sanity Meter but you wouldn't, because that's a number system)

1.) I could hardly criticise something I suggested now could I :biggrin:2.) I'm against overly complicated numbers systems, which an Insanity Factor (if it involved numbers at all) wouldn't need to be3.) I only offered one solution because I only posed one problem; that the RPG was a bit bland. The Insanity meter would have given it something different and meant the horde wasn't just meat thrown at the players the way they are now

Hmmm, okay, I'm listening. How exactly would you implement a Sanity Meter? ATM all I'm seeing is a numbers system, but you seem to have something else in mind.

All I gathered from you and Spink was that "it'll never catch on" because apparently numbers systems are too restrictive

Which means you missed our point entirely. Well, mine at least, can't speak for Spink. My point wasn't that it was too restrictive, it was that it took the fun out of things. Rather than be cleverer than your opponents, rather than try and outmanoeuvre and outwit them, you could only hope to be luckier. The dice was king, not story.I did wonder, when you started going on about how we didn't trust you as a GM and how it was all working on another forum, whether you were a bit to occupied playing the martyr to actually notice what we were saying

Again, I speak from experience when I say that A: the die is not king (that was the whole point of attributes) and B: I outmanuvered the other team several times when I was playing with that system. Their reactions were priceless.

I also feel that the likelihood of you being mistaken about the blandness of my RPG is much higher than the odds of my having criticism-blinders on, mostly because all of the other people who've reviewed my RPG like it and do not feel that it's bland.

Well sorry I'm not stroking your ego but thats never my goal when reviewing. I will say one thing though; out of all the reviews many said they liked it but none said why exactly. Well one did. He liked the banner

I don't care about ego-stroking. I am saying that if everyone except one person likes it, that one person tends to either be biased, too critical, or just mistaken. I'm trying not to imply anything there, I am just once again speaking from experience. (Don't make comments about how Twilight sucks when you have a Twilight fan in the audience).

[Toa Kovolta]

@Loyd and TPtII would just like to jump in and say that the Abd Al Azrad mechanic is one of the things that attracts me to the game.If everyone knows who the spies are, then where's the fun? The point is to try and figure out who they are without any knowledge, meta game, of who they might be.

[Wyrd Bid Ful Araed]

I picked the last redoubt of Matoran-kind setting

Yeah, its this that keeps making me think zombies. I'll admit that I haven't read even half of what Lovecraft wrote, but what I have read is never a last redoubt setting. Its never about holding your own against never ending tides of meat, and its certainly never about giant mechs. From my view point you seem to have nullified anything that makes the Lovecraftian beasties genuinely Lovecraftian.

Hmmm, okay, I'm listening. How exactly would you implement a Sanity Meter? ATM all I'm seeing is a numbers system, but you seem to have something else in mind

Weeeell, if it were down to me then off the top of my head I would say give every monster some kind of Insanity Level that deems how much effect it has on you (so lets say a hordeling would be 3%) and that every time you make a post around one of these creatures that factor multiplies by itself. So first post with that hordeling your character would be 3% insane, then 9%, then 27%, so if they didn't finish it off quickly they go bonkers. Bigger more illogical creatures have a higher rating. So if a Leviathan with a factor of 5% showed up you could only be around it a couple of times before it got to you. This would also help with limiting sneaking round the city as it doesn't matter how well you're hidden because you can still see them and therefore still be driven mad

[Parugi]

[/late to the party]

Return review for Realm of Darkness by Zombie Shark Ragnorak.First impression/Layout: Well, you certainly have everything that an RPG needs, so kudos for that, and the name definitely interests me.I feel like the presentation could use a bit more zing, though. Currently, everything's pushed to the left and is, except for the title, all the same size. I would stylize it a bit more -- mark the sections with bigger sizes, center the title and opening quote. Personalize it a bit more.I also am not a fan of the bright orange-yellow color that you use for a couple of sections--it makes it very difficult to read. I would suggest using a darker or softer color.Story: One thing that struck me almost instantly as odd was...

Peace came to Stelt and Zakaz, the Dark Hunters scattered, and Xia became a lush jungle.

I suppose I can see Stelt and Zakaz eventually becoming peaceful, and the scattering of the Dark Hunters is something that could definitely occur given enough effort. But Xia -> jungle? The island is jampacked with factories and other pollutants, on top of the acid grass and the mountain, so... eh...

All in the meanwhile, the ADF is stepping up operations in the mines to clear out the Moles, while at the same time preparing for a large incursion intoIt seems that things in the Avohkii, as well as the field itself, are in for a war.

A large incursion into where?Anyway, that aside, the story sound pretty interesting. My only real question is what the groups are actually doing--are they still looking for the Av-Matoran, as per their original reason for entering the RoD; are they looking for a means to make money; or is the point to only explore and fight shadowguys?Factions: Seem pretty standard.

Factions: In this world of shadows, oftentimes the sides of good and evil are blurred. To make your way in this world, you must choose a faction, or go on alone, in order to turn the tides on any side.

These two sentences are a bit confusing. On the one hand, the bolded section states that we have to be affiliated with one of the three (or four?) factions. But then the italized section implies that we don't have to, which is subverted by the fact that there is no section detailing what an unaffiliated person would actually do. I would clear this up.Were the Forever Shadow beings who came from the MU and were subsequently 'infected', or are they inhabitants of the RoD?

Some ambitious gangs, believing that they could establish another black market within the domes. So, they secretly....

Odd section. First sentence never actually finishes the thought that it began.Unknown group seems pretty cool. I have a thing for fighting bikers. :PI'm not sure how I feel about the objectives lists; part of me feels like it makes things too absolute. Can we deviate from them, or are they the abolsute goals that we have to achieve?Other: I would highly suggest giving the RPG a look over for grammar errors; I noticed a couple in the first few sentences (for example, "than" where "then" should have been) that were particularly glaring to me. Then again that may just be a result of the Creative Writing class I'm taking, making me a bit more critical than usual. :POn the whole ship thing--I have to wonder how the Matoran were able to fit another set of domes within their own domeverse (Domeception!), at least as they're described. It seems like they possess islands inside of them, but then, would the Matoran Universe be able to fit another universe inside of it? I'm being confusing, I guess, but it's a point to consider.... unless I'm just completely misinterpreting where these other islands--New Stelt, for instance--came from. Which is completely possible. As a matter of fact, just ignore this. XPI'm curious as to why the Masks of Elemental Energy and Clairvoyance are banned. The former is (in canon, anyway) a one use only mask, and even if that isn't the case in Realm of Darkness, you could set limits on how often it can be used.As for the Mask of Clairvoyance--its use is out of the control of the wearer, anyway; anything that they would see would be information shown ICly by the Game Master, so it wouldn't necessarily provide anyone with exploitable information.That's just my opinion, of course.

-Keep romance and humor limited. In addition, do make posts overly gory.

Do or don't make posts overly gory? I feel like overly gory posts wouldn't be allowed if overused romance and humor aren't.Final: It's not a bad RPG. I think it's pretty interesting and could be played very well. As things stand, though, there are a few things that could be cleared up and smoothed out. Essentially, the ideas are good, but the presentation could be polished up a bit. At any rate, good luck!

Review for Island of Pain by The Dreadful Flying Glove.First impression: [/insert completely biased comment here.]Story: Repeating myself from past contests, I love the tone of the introduction/story explanation. Well done.Other: I really have nothing to say here or any comments for basically anything. Except for this: Considering everything that has happened as of IoP's last season--especially everything that was building up to the final battle before the RPG closed, as well as, for instance, the large battle between Hexxon, Okena, Jontan, and Rastaque--I really think the RPG could benefit from a summary of some sort, somewhere, that recounts at least the basics of what's currently happening so that new people don't get confused when they join and find out that there's a group of 20~ people waiting to ambush a Makuta.Aside from that...Final: I'm wondering why I even bothered to review this when I already know I'm voting for it. XP Regardless, I obviously still love it, and I hope to play Island of Pain again in the near future.

Reviews in progress:-Trapped in a Map-Beat and Rhythm-Dreamland: Awakening-The Horde Out of Limbo

[Lara White]

I picked the last redoubt of Matoran-kind setting

Yeah, its this that keeps making me think zombies. I'll admit that I haven't read even half of what Lovecraft wrote, but what I have read is never a last redoubt setting. Its never about holding your own against never ending tides of meat, and its certainly never about giant mechs. From my view point you seem to have nullified anything that makes the Lovecraftian beasties genuinely Lovecraftian.

You do have a point there, but if I made the RPG entirely about investigations no one would play it.

Hmmm, okay, I'm listening. How exactly would you implement a Sanity Meter? ATM all I'm seeing is a numbers system, but you seem to have something else in mind

Weeeell, if it were down to me then off the top of my head I would say give every monster some kind of Insanity Level that deems how much effect it has on you (so lets say a hordeling would be 3%) and that every time you make a post around one of these creatures that factor multiplies by itself. So first post with that hordeling your character would be 3% insane, then 9%, then 27%, so if they didn't finish it off quickly they go bonkers. Bigger more illogical creatures have a higher rating. So if a Leviathan with a factor of 5% showed up you could only be around it a couple of times before it got to you. This would also help with limiting sneaking round the city as it doesn't matter how well you're hidden because you can still see them and therefore still be driven mad

That actually sounds like it would work very well. Might have to tweak the numbers a bit but I think I could implement that.

[Shyyrn]

@Dread Flying Glove:You're criticizing Lloyd over what you perceive to be a lack of Lovecraftian-ness (sorry for the shoddy word construction XP) in his monsters, and with his story in general.However, there is one angle you're failing to consider: the role of the players themselves.In Lloyd's submission post, he described the Outer Hordes has being 'every shape and size imaginable,' from large to small, from purely organic to purely inorganic That conjured up a lot of images in my mind, many of which probably wouldn't be considered 'Lovecraftian' at all.As such, it might be an exercise in futility to make him modify his story to be more Lovecraftian when the very players of the game wouldn't comply themselves.Additionally, I personally oppose the Insanity Meter for a simple reason: whenever somebody made an IC post fighting one of the monsters, a portion of each post would inevitably have to be devoted to describing how the player's character was going insane. This would be a waste of space and would consume a lot of time, slowing down many people's posts and thus limiting their role in the game.-Shyyrn

[Parugi]

On the contrary. I don't think having to add a quick few sentences demonstrating how your character is being affected would be bad at all--and, in fact, it could go a long way in showing how the insanity is affecting your character's ability to fight right then and there. I think it'd be great. *shrug*

Edited March 15, 2012 by Parugi

[Grantaire]

So basically, Lloyd, in your RPG, after ten or so encounters with members of the opposing faction, your character is driven insane.And you're stuck in a fortress, with no escape, so the only point is to fight until you go insane, or die....Is it my imagination, or is this RPG incredibly narrow in focuses?

[Lara White]

I prefer to call it "streamlining." I'm focusing on the things that the RPG is really about and not adding extra bells and whistles that could distract from what the game is about.And I'm most likely going to tweak the numbers so that you have a little more longevity in sanity than ten posts. If the players themselves express enough interest in the Sanity Meter mechanic. What do you think, guys?

[Toa of Dancing]

Methinks that you also need something to restore sanity. Say, once someone racks up insanity, instead of being useless, they can retreat, feel the healing aura from something or other, and be restored.

[Shyyrn]

Methinks that you also need something to restore sanity. Say, once someone racks up insanity, instead of being useless, they can retreat, feel the healing aura from something or other, and be restored.

I second this.-Shyyrn

[Toa Levacius Zehvor]

Ce-Toa neurosurgeons with masks of healing. That's my answer to everything.-Toa Levacius Zehvor

Edited March 15, 2012 by Toa Levacius Zehvor

[Fighty]

Oh my. Once more, back to the 'check the NPCs profiles, because we stuck it there instead of the RPGs'. I can excuse it in Knives in the Dark, since the emphasis is on the six warlords. But here? No. The profiles shouldn't be where story related information is placed; they're extras.

No. This is getting ridiculous. I'm telling you there's a benefit to reading them when you couldn't catch the tip-offs the first time.1. Uniting would show they have the common sense to do so. Savages don't have common sense.2. Fleeing instead of staying and fighting an unwinable fight.3. Building a colony with a monarchy.Did you actually think they were savages after that? Really? And yes, these were all in the RPG.Let me make this clear: NPCs are not extras. The game wouldn't be able to be fun without them. Techna without the Toa Techna. GoMN without Swordshifter. IoP without the Sheaperds.

You don't need a tidy little list to point out what I already know. I made the point that it's a race of barbaric savages in the canon, and listed my defensive points, which were mostly ignored. You made your counter, saying they're not, with the reason 'because this isn't the canon'. Which is perfectly fine.Your points aren't very good ones though, and I need to point out why. First off, savages can have common sense. The Mongol hordes, the Vikings. Second, that can also be associated with determination, and fighting the unwinnable fight is not a 'savage' thing. And it's quite possible for savages to have a monarchy - power granted to the strongest being, and to his children, as long as they can hold it.But no, I don't believe that they're savages in this alternate universe (though I hardly see what would stop a member of Gladiators species from just ripping through a squad of Matoran to kill off a few Rahkshi). I do, however, believe that some things need to be clarified, and if you don't believe that, then go right ahead. I'm pointing out the errors, correct them or don't. I couldn't care less.You've already stated that there's a benefit to reading the profiles. Which is why I now read them. What I'm telling you is that the player should not have to read profiles for basic plot information that could have easily been explained elsewhere. NPCs are extras that help make the RPG feel like an open world (even when combined) that they're just a part of, and to let players know that they're not the only beings that exist. They give the GM the ability to make direct interaction and allow him to direct the action if he needs to (and to railroad it, though nobody likes a railroad).

My original reason for calling them savages is because of the practice of using slaves in gladiatorial combat (though that's who get usually used).-Toa Levacius Zehvor

... So the Roman Empire were savages? As much as I hate the Romans, that's not a word you can really apply to them.-Dovydas

We could debate this to no end, but this is neither place to do it, nor would either of us change the others opinion.-Toa Levacius Zehvor

Guys, it's just Bionicle. I mean, really.Also hai everyone. =DAnyways, here are my (brief) two cents on The Horde Out of Limbo:First off, I have to say that I admire the Abd-AhamadinejadIdontgiveadamselhowthiswordisactuallyspelled mechanic. Having that added aspect of paranoia atop the already immense anxiety within the Bastion is a cool little idea. Hopefully it will keep the game from getting too stale.But unfortunately, this game seems very one-dimensional to me. I get that you love Lovecraft and wanted to do an RPG styled after him. I get that you want this to play out like a last-ditch effort to save Bionicle-kind, where death is a high probability. I get that. Sadly, though, it just doesn't make for a game that I, as a role-player, want to play.For one, it's just too limited. I know this isn't a zombie-style game, but let's compare this to The Walking Dead. In that universe, the threat of death is always upon you, and you need to scavenge to survive, yet you have a multiplicity of options. You could go to this warehouse or that prison. You could hold up in this cabin or make a break for that hospital. And the reason you have those options is because while the threat of death is upon you, the certainty of it isn't. I mean, in this RPG, our characters are going to die. That's pretty much a given. Plus, unless we pull out some uber-awesome, super-concerted plan that we execute to perfection, all of Bionicle-kind is going to die. So, all our time spent on this RPG could ultimately amount to "everyone dies." If I invest hours and hours of my life into an RPG, by its end I want to feel like I've accomplished something.So, in a nutshell, here are my main complaints: Locations too restricted, factions way too restricted, no PvP (unless you count the Abd-whatevers), no exploration, and very little chance of actually accomplishing anything. This kind of game could work in other sectors of entertainment (heck, look at the popularity of Nazi Zombies), but for a TBRPG I don't think it's an ideal fit. Edited March 15, 2012 by TheMightyFighty

[Kal the Guardian]

I'm all for the Sanity Meter. But like ToD has stated, there needs to be some way to reverse the effects. Now, during each battle, the insanity increases each post. Once it reaches a certain point, are you irreversably damaged? Or will there be a Sanity Meter and an Insanity Meter? An Insanity Meter being the overarching meter that builds up each time you break your Sanity Meter into the forever scaring range.For example, you can fight ten monsters and reach the insanity point on your Sanity Meter each fight, each time you reach insanity, your Insanity Meter goes up one. At the end of those ten monsters you would be insane beyond hope. Completely stark raving mad.Of course, my suggestion seems to overcomplicate things and really turn it into a numbers system. Still, food for thought.

[Lara White]

I am liking these suggestions for the In/Sanity Meter. While I do not think I'll implement two meters, one meter divided into smaller irrecoverable segments should work fine. Maybe once one hits 25% they can never go back below that, 50% likewise, and 75%. Thoughts?@ Fighty: hey, been a while. The reason it's so "restricted" is because I only included the elements I wanted to experiment with. If you don't like it, well, it's only going to run for one season, so don't worry. I'll have something with a LOT more freedom next time around, I like how the brainstorming is shaping up. Might look into some viral advertising for it, could bring in new players to the forum.

[Toa Kovolta]

Alright, I've made some changes/added info to TiaM, most prominently in the "Other" section, in response to questions and suggestions.

Trapped in a Map-Ok, so the banner is simple yet effective. I like it. The title of the RPG appears rather small underneath it, though. The introduction, while I've read it before, still caught my interest. It's funny how exclamation points make things more exciting! <- I see what you did there.How did my title get that small? I don't remember making it like that.Anyways, I'm glad that my intro is so effective! <- See what I did there?Story. Wow, simple and to the point. It makes the story section in Dreamland look enormous. Just imagine it sitting next to Elementum Nui 2.Factions. So, are all Toa of Plant Life sworn over to the worshippers so that all food goes through them? Or is it possible that there is some secret dude out there providing food on a major scale? Or would the Enforcers catch on too quickly and redistribute the food?It's possible, but probably only on a very small scale. Like you said, the Enforcers would catch on if it were too large, and also they wouldn't have very much space to cultivate large amounts of food.Map. Beautifully simple and yet fun to look at. I must say the cracks don't seem that menacing. Is there an edge to the map, where if you walk far enough it just ends. What happens if you go off the side? Gravity kicks in and pulls you to the other side of the map? Is there something on the other side of the map?I guess I'll have to take a look at those cracks to see if I can't make them look more dangerous. As for your other questions, see my modifications.Other. Ok, so if everything is slower in map, do the three flashes happen slower? Almost like solar flares, causing people to stay inside and perhaps sand to melt, maybe even crumble away the edge of the map?Hmmm, didn't think about this. I like your suggestion though. Again, see modifications.You say you only control the Carver, but what about Carmera? Carmera is be a character that I will rp as. But as with any character, staff will have power to "godmod" her. This is not the case with the Carver.And is there a set time that all this is happening? I ask this because Dreamland takes place when Makuta are good for the most part and the players should know this.Since so many people were asking when it's set, I have added this.Otherwise, I like this RPG and wouldn't mind seeing it win.Great! Thanks so much!

I'll try to get to some more reviews tomorrow. And maybe I'll even get to read some more of the entries! XPRealm of Darkness and Dreamland: Awakening are the only ones to which I owe return reviews correct? Edited March 15, 2012 by Toa Kovolta

[25K Now!]

Say Lloyd, what would one classify as insane? Would a character be a gibbering wreck or just a madman?

[Evex_Wolfwing]

I oppose the idea of a sanity meter. The fact is, everybody is going to react differently, and have a different tolerance. One of the characters I had planned is very simple minded, and doesn't really stop to process these creatures, he just fights them.The fact that you pretty much can't leave the building and live is starting to seem like a problem. The problem is, what about food? What about materials? I know that I will attempt to scavenge, and attempt to find a way to escape (a plan that may work with luck...).

[Wyrd Bid Ful Araed]

Yay, someone who agrees with me! Cheers Fighty!

That actually sounds like it would work very well. Might have to tweak the numbers a bit but I think I could implement that.

Perhaps make it just regular multiplication rather than an exponential increase. Rather than a 5% monster going from 5 to 25 to 125 make it 5, 10, 15 etc. Gives you a broader scale since number don't jump up into 100% insanity within three posts anymoreAnd surely the way to cure insanity is to stop fighting the monsters? When they're not attacking the walls you get to relax, to talk with friends, to mourn your lost, grounding you again. This would also allow more characterisation other than "WOOOOOO, I PUNCH MONSTERS IN THE FACE!"

[Lara White]

I oppose the idea of a sanity meter. The fact is, everybody is going to react differently, and have a different tolerance. One of the characters I had planned is very simple minded, and doesn't really stop to process these creatures, he just fights them.The fact that you pretty much can't leave the building and live is starting to seem like a problem. The problem is, what about food? What about materials? I know that I will attempt to scavenge, and attempt to find a way to escape (a plan that may work with luck...).

Matoran only need to eat a few times per thousand years. it hasn't been more than a couple of years since the invasion started. Also, where would you go?@ Power: Yes, because the way to cure PTSD is to take soldiers out of the combat zone. *eyebrow* Edited March 15, 2012 by Lloyd: the White Wolf

[Wyrd Bid Ful Araed]

We're not dealing with PTSD though, we're dealing with madness brought on by seeing things indescribably alien. If it is just PTSD then my comments earlier about the madness being down to environment were actually correct rather than 'clutching at straws'

[Grantaire]

I prefer to call it "streamlining." I'm focusing on the things that the RPG is really about and not adding extra bells and whistles that could distract from what the game is about.

There is a difference between a streamlined RPg and a stick RPG. Right now, your RPG provides players with two things: 1: fight random monsters until you go insane. 2: play as a random monster. This is not streamlining, it's a massively bareboned gameplay, which gives player far too few options on what they're able to do.

And I'm most likely going to tweak the numbers so that you have a little more longevity in sanity than ten posts. If the players themselves express enough interest in the Sanity Meter mechanic. What do you think, guys?

If the point of the game for the non monster faction is to fight the monsters, than a sanity meter is an annoying cripple. Therefore, I am definitely opposed to it.Lloyd, I don't know where you're getting the idea that Matoran only eat once every thousand years: on Metru Nui there was an energy feeding station, which matoran visited far more often than once about thousand years. On Voya Nui, it is described that food and water are scarce, forcing the matoran to salvage what they can. If they did not need to eat, food would be no problem for them.

[Lara White]

We're not dealing with PTSD though, we're dealing with madness brought on by seeing things indescribably alien. If it is just PTSD then my comments earlier about the madness being down to environment were actually correct rather than 'clutching at straws'

I'm not saying it is PTSD, I'm saying that mental issues in general aren't that easy to treat. It's called a metaphor.

I prefer to call it "streamlining." I'm focusing on the things that the RPG is really about and not adding extra bells and whistles that could distract from what the game is about.

There is a difference between a streamlined RPg and a stick RPG. Right now, your RPG provides players with two things: 1: fight random monsters until you go insane. 2: play as a random monster. This is not streamlining, it's a massively bareboned gameplay, which gives player far too few options on what they're able to do.

I don't think you're seeing what a lot of other people are seeing. Where you are not seeing a lot of options, they're seeing plenty of options for customization of their players (I've seen ideas so far for blind characters or lobotomized characters) not to mention a lot more power being thrown around than is normally permitted, they can customize their Colossi if they have one, heck they can customize the monsters they're fighting against. And when they're not fighting, the Abd players are scheming on how to sabotage the war effort (a lot harder and more engaging than it sounds) while everyone else is hunting them down (quite fun, actually).

And I'm most likely going to tweak the numbers so that you have a little more longevity in sanity than ten posts. If the players themselves express enough interest in the Sanity Meter mechanic. What do you think, guys?

If the point of the game for the non monster faction is to fight the monsters, than a sanity meter is an annoying cripple. Therefore, I am definitely opposed to it.

Good point.

Lloyd, I don't know where you're getting the idea that Matoran only eat once every thousand years: on Metru Nui there was an energy feeding station, which matoran visited far more often than once about thousand years. On Voya Nui, it is described that food and water are scarce, forcing the matoran to salvage what they can. If they did not need to eat, food would be no problem for them.

I recall reading it on BS01 somewhere...the vague idea was "Matoran only need to eat a few times every thousand years to survive, but prefer to eat more often than that." Somewhat like we do--we don't need to have three square meals a day, but we certainly prefer to.

[Kal the Guardian]

If the point of the game for the non monster faction is to fight the monsters, than a sanity meter is an annoying cripple. Therefore, I am definitely opposed to it.

A giant point being that the monsters will bring about insanity by looking at them too long is the reason there should be a sanity meter. I find it a convienant way to keep track of insanity and it also causes those who would not actually have their characters go crazy (or oppose it some other way) to make sure they follow the "story" (going insane while looking at the monsters for too long). Sure, it might seem tedious, but what's the point of roleplaying unless you put a little work into it.I see it as a plus. After all, no two characters will go crazy the same way. I think making our characters go crazy will actually help and/or force us to develop them more than we normally would. And a sanity meter helps us know how far to take things and when we should retreat instead of continuously slaying monsters.

[Toa Kovolta]

Here's an interesting question. What if we have a blind character that relies on other senses and certain elemental powers to be aware of his surroundings?

[Portalfig]

Or a mask of sonar? I would think you could use that to fight them... :

[Grantaire]

Sonar? Nope. You'd still get driven nuts. You could tell exactly what the monster is, via hearing.Lloyd: Still, seems far too 2D. Especially when it comes to locations.

Edited March 15, 2012 by Zarayna: The Quiet Light

[Portalfig]

But, you aren't looking at them, right? Maybe I just didn't read through it very well.I am saying you would keep your eyes closed you know.

[Lara White]

Here's an interesting question. What if we have a blind character that relies on other senses and certain elemental powers to be aware of his surroundings?

Or a mask of sonar? I would think you could use that to fight them... :

You realize that the form of sonar used by that mask is echolocation? You can hear the baddies and the noises they make just aren't right.

Sonar? Nope. You'd still get driven nuts.Lloyd: Still, seems far too 2D. Especially when it comes to locations.

Unfortunately it's hard to come up with locations when everything except the Bastion is uniformly destroyed.