Who Is (And Isn't) The Great Being?

[Guest]

Dume was imprisoned in the Matoran Sphere 18 months before the Great Cataclysm and the Great Rescue. So a little over 18 months.

Well that's a pro for Dume. 18 months is more than a year, which means he should've lost his memory. Although we don't know whether the spheres have the mind-wiping effect on Turaga as well.

[Ice the Great]

Dume was imprisoned in the Matoran Sphere 18 months before the Great Cataclysm and the Great Rescue. So a little over 18 months.

Well that's a pro for Dume. 18 months is more than a year, which means he should've lost his memory. Although we don't know whether the spheres have the mind-wiping effect on Turaga as well.

Dume didn't seem to have any mind wipe that I can recall. So it would appear that they do not. Dume is still an option, especially considering that he rescued Matoran Lhikan.

[atvan]

For those who say the GB must be the murderer, Tren Krom could be destroyed with his own energy thing, right? Perhaps even a mirror could destroy him, if used to deflect the energy beam.Hydraxon could be the GB, because Tren Krom demostrated that in a mind switch, the powers go with the mind. Perhaps the GB simply hid his mind in the MoLife until the opportunity arose to create a new body.Also, the GB placing the MoLife that is afraid for its safety is reminded that the mask will create gaurdians, but he feels that those will not be enough. Axonn and Brutaka then go to gaurd the Mask. Brutaka was regarded as a scholar, seems fitting, but both he and Axxon are in the temple. So there goes that. But perhaps the GB was one of the Southern Continent Matoran. This supports the Kazi/Velika Theory. Of course, this all rests on the GB being the one that placed the MoLife.

[Ice the Great]

For those who say the GB must be the murderer, Tren Krom could be destroyed with his own energy thing, right? Perhaps even a mirror could destroy him, if used to deflect the energy beam.

The murderer can't be the GB Read the first post. HE ISN'T NAMED. That rules him out.

[Guest]

Dume didn't seem to have any mind wipe that I can recall. So it would appear that they do not. Dume is still an option, especially considering that he rescued Matoran Lhikan.

Yeah, that was my point. We know Dume didn't get mind-wiped in the sphere, even though he was in there longer than the Matoran. So that leaves us with two options: 1, he didn't get mind-wiped because he is the GB (and he resisted it or something), 2, he didn't get mind-wiped because spheres don't have that effect on Turaga.

The murderer can't be the GB Read the first post. HE ISN'T NAMED. That rules him out.

You're just playing with words here. The murderer isn't named because we don't know who he is yet, for all we know Dume could be the murderer. And then Dume, who is also the murderer, is a viable candidate to be the GB since we know his name, Dume.

[Nick Silverpen]

I think Ice the Great believes the murder is an entirely new character. No, its not, already someone we've met,For Hydraxon, I'd like to think so, but the only problem is, why would he want to go into isolation as a jailkeeper of a bubble? Why leave the bigger part of the world?

[Voxumo]

I think Ice the Great believes the murder is an entirely new character. No, its not, already someone we've met,For Hydraxon, I'd like to think so, but the only problem is, why would he want to go into isolation as a jailkeeper of a bubble? Why leave the bigger part of the world?

Good point. the great being wanted to observe and he could not very well observe it from underwater or in a closed area.

[Raph]

So GB need to observe all universe. Why he can't do that telepatically?i mean he is a GREAT being? who can know MU better that he?

[Infrared]

So GB need to observe all universe. Why he can't do that telepatically?i mean he is a GREAT being? who can know MU better that he?

I'm assuming that you mean that the Great Being would stay on the fragments of Spherus Magna. If so, the Mata Nui Robot would travel so far away from the Spherus Magna fragments that there could not be a reliable connection (or any at all, for that matter [after all, they would be many lightyears apart]). Plus, one might argue that it just wouldn't have the same depth: for example, you can glean much more from a sports game if you are actually there as opposed to just watching it from home.I don't think that I've seen it asked yet, but I could have missed something. Did the Great Being go by his actual name while posing as an MU inhabitant, or did he go by another name? Edited December 14, 2011 by Infrared

[Raph]

So GB need to observe all universe. Why he can't do that telepatically?i mean he is a GREAT being? who can know MU better that he?

I'm assuming that you mean that the Great Being would stay on the fragments of Spherus Magna. If so, the Mata Nui Robot would travel so far away from the Spherus Magna fragments that there could not be a reliable connection (or any at all, for that matter [after all, they would be many lightyears apart]). Plus, one might argue that it just wouldn't have the same depth: for example, you can glean much more from a sports game if you are actually there as opposed to just watching it from home.I don't think that I've seen it asked yet, but I could have missed something. Did the Great Being go by his actual name while posing as an MU inhabitant, or did he go by another name?

That's an interrest question. I assume he or she goes under MU name. I don't think that GB's name means anything to MU inhabitants..i mean he's real name.

So GB need to observe all universe. Why he can't do that telepatically?i mean he is a GREAT being? who can know MU better that he?

I'm assuming that you mean that the Great Being would stay on the fragments of Spherus Magna. If so, the Mata Nui Robot would travel so far away from the Spherus Magna fragments that there could not be a reliable connection (or any at all, for that matter [after all, they would be many lightyears apart]). Plus, one might argue that it just wouldn't have the same depth: for example, you can glean much more from a sports game if you are actually there as opposed to just watching it from home.I don't think that I've seen it asked yet, but I could have missed something. Did the Great Being go by his actual name while posing as an MU inhabitant, or did he go by another name?

I don't mean it. i mean he has some telepatic abilities or he somehow connected mentally with MU. His mind was transported into MU inhabitant/// so he still connected to MU....He and his kind created MU. They definatly have some creator/creation link/ Edited December 15, 2011 by Raph

[Guest]

So GB need to observe all universe. Why he can't do that telepatically?i mean he is a GREAT being? who can know MU better that he?

He's a Great Being, so? As far as I know we haven't heard of Great Beings having telepathic abilities so far. You seem to assume the Great Beings are somehow omnipotent, but they're not. Greg confirmed that the Great Spirit Robot was way more powerful than the Great Beings.

I don't think that I've seen it asked yet, but I could have missed something. Did the Great Being go by his actual name while posing as an MU inhabitant, or did he go by another name?

Well he has no reason to go under an alias of course, since no one would know of his name in the first place. I'm inclined to think that if Greg realizes this, he won't give the Great Being a new name, since he has only a limited number of names to spare.

[Infrared]

So GB need to observe all universe. Why he can't do that telepatically?i mean he is a GREAT being? who can know MU better that he?

He's a Great Being, so? As far as I know we haven't heard of Great Beings having telepathic abilities so far. You seem to assume the Great Beings are somehow omnipotent, but they're not. Greg confirmed that the Great Spirit Robot was way more powerful than the Great Beings.

Just something that I remembered that could be in favor of Raph's idea...It is believed that Angonce gave Psionic powers to the Sisters of the Skrall, so the Great Beings might have created something that they could use to give themselves Psionic powers. We don't know for certain if he gave them the powers, but assuming that they did know of a way to give them the powers, the Great Beings could have theoretically placed their mind in the Great Spirit robot, I suppose, but I think that it's pretty unlikely. However, differences in the two anatomies and the fact that we don't know when the Sisters of the Skrall got their powers might invalidate the theory... Edited December 20, 2011 by Infrared

[Raph]

So GB need to observe all universe. Why he can't do that telepatically?i mean he is a GREAT being? who can know MU better that he?

He's a Great Being, so? As far as I know we haven't heard of Great Beings having telepathic abilities so far. You seem to assume the Great Beings are somehow omnipotent, but they're not. Greg confirmed that the Great Spirit Robot was way more powerful than the Great Beings.

I don't think that I've seen it asked yet, but I could have missed something. Did the Great Being go by his actual name while posing as an MU inhabitant, or did he go by another name?

Well he has no reason to go under an alias of course, since no one would know of his name in the first place. I'm inclined to think that if Greg realizes this, he won't give the Great Being a new name, since he has only a limited number of names to spare.

How can Great Spirit Robot be powerful than GB? GB created him!And as for psionic powers GB can observe somehow universe. I just then can't imagine who he can be? Hydraxon- no cuz he's dead. I tought he can be Akmou, but Greg sad that he cannot be any of Metru matoran, Takadox? maybe. He's my favorite candidate. He's one of the warlords who ruled the universe. Zaktan? possible.but then if he was GB how can Makuta control him?

[Infrared]

How can Great Spirit Robot be powerful than GB? GB created him!And as for psionic powers GB can observe somehow universe. I just then can't imagine who he can be? Hydraxon- no cuz he's dead. I tought he can be Akmou, but Greg sad that he cannot be any of Metru matoran, Takadox? maybe. He's my favorite candidate. He's one of the warlords who ruled the universe. Zaktan? possible.but then if he was GB how can Makuta control him?

Well, remember that the Great Being didn't want to disturb anything in the Matoran Universe, he wanted to observe it. He wouldn't draw too much attention to himself (for example constantly avoiding Makuta capture) because his true identity might be revealed.Another thought: if the Great Being goes by his real name, wouldn't his name stick out a bit against other Matoran Universe ones? The most Spherus Magnan name for a Matoran Universe resident that I can think of immediately is Gaardus. He's probably been mentioned in the archived topic, but I did a search and didn't find him here. I could see him wanting revenge because of what the Nynrah Ghosts did to him...he probably isn't the Great Being, though, and his name can be explained away because of when it was approved.

[Raph]

How can Great Spirit Robot be powerful than GB? GB created him!And as for psionic powers GB can observe somehow universe. I just then can't imagine who he can be? Hydraxon- no cuz he's dead. I tought he can be Akmou, but Greg sad that he cannot be any of Metru matoran, Takadox? maybe. He's my favorite candidate. He's one of the warlords who ruled the universe. Zaktan? possible.but then if he was GB how can Makuta control him?

Well, remember that the Great Being didn't want to disturb anything in the Matoran Universe, he wanted to observe it. He wouldn't draw too much attention to himself (for example constantly avoiding Makuta capture) because his true identity might be revealed.Another thought: if the Great Being goes by his real name, wouldn't his name stick out a bit against other Matoran Universe ones? The most Spherus Magnan name for a Matoran Universe resident that I can think of immediately is Gaardus. He's probably been mentioned in the archived topic, but I did a search and didn't find him here. I could see him wanting revenge because of what the Nynrah Ghosts did to him...he probably isn't the Great Being, though, and his name can be explained away because of when it was approved.

That just got me an idea! Red Star! can GB be one of Kestora? He was on Red Star while MN robot was crashed in aqua magna and observed it from Red Star!Then when MU is returned to Bara Magna he leave Red Star, and began his actions. OR he can be one of familiar characters, but then he was reside in Red Star.I think he or Kestora or MU inhabitant that was lived on Red Star. And assuming that Greg said that GB is named character and appeared in story before, we need just guess who he is.

[Taipu1]

It's confirmed the GB is a known character, and the only known character on the Red star is Mavrah, and he's ruled out by the time slip I think...?

[Infrared]

It's confirmed the GB is a known character, and the only known character on the Red star is Mavrah, and he's ruled out by the time slip I think...?

He abandoned Metru Nui when Whenua was still a Matoran, so he wasn't encapsulated and he is a possibility.

[Makuta Matata]

I'm going with Dume for now.

[ALVIS]

So GB need to observe all universe. Why he can't do that telepatically?i mean he is a GREAT being? who can know MU better that he?

He's a Great Being, so? As far as I know we haven't heard of Great Beings having telepathic abilities so far. You seem to assume the Great Beings are somehow omnipotent, but they're not. Greg confirmed that the Great Spirit Robot was way more powerful than the Great Beings.

Actually, in Reign of Shadows, the mad Great Being contacted Vezon telepathically - across dimensions. Yeah, I'd say that's pretty powerful telepathy there. That's not an ability afforded to him by the curse; Greg's explanation was, to paraphrase, that if the GBs created masks of dimensional gates, they might well be able to see other dimensions.

[Voxumo]

So GB need to observe all universe. Why he can't do that telepatically?i mean he is a GREAT being? who can know MU better that he?

He's a Great Being, so? As far as I know we haven't heard of Great Beings having telepathic abilities so far. You seem to assume the Great Beings are somehow omnipotent, but they're not. Greg confirmed that the Great Spirit Robot was way more powerful than the Great Beings.

Just something that I remembered that could be in favor of Raph's idea...It is believed that Angonce gave Psionic powers to the Sisters of the Skrall, so the Great Beings might have created something that they could use to give themselves Psionic powers. We don't know for certain if he gave them the powers, but assuming that they did know of a way to give them the powers, the Great Beings could have theoretically placed their mind in the Great Spirit robot, I suppose, but I think that it's pretty unlikely. However, differences in the two anatomies and the fact that we don't know when the Sisters of the Skrall got their powers might invalidate the theory...

Uh can i just say that we know for a fact that Angonce did not give the sisters of the skrall their powers but Annona did. We know this because in Sahmads tale when Annona has Sahmad underground she reveals to him that she gave them the powers as a type of experiment in hopes they would destroy the males of their specieshere is the actual quote i had to find it on another site since biosector01 does not have that page up yet.

"There was that laughter again. I was starting to hate that sound. "The sisters are silly little fools," came the answer. "They actually believe a Great Being vested power upon them. It was I that gifted them with the psionic powers they wield. I thought it would be amusing to see them destroy the males of their species. But, like you, they were too weak, and allowed themselves to be driven out. They didn't have the will to conquer, and now they have no will at all."

I still think it is one of the less active dark hunters like Darkness or Minion. But hopefully we will all know soon enough. And does anyone know if the actual contest i think called guess the GB is still going on? At least i think there was a contest and if it is still going i don't know how they are going to choose who actually guessed it right because this has been going on for a while and there is the old archived topic and this one so i think it is going to be really difficult to find the winner,

[Taipu1]

I think I can rule out Mavrah as a possibility

3. a character who would have migrated to Spherus Magna by now.

Not sure how black and white the rules on the front page are, but Mavrah has not migrated to Spherus Magna, he's on the Red Star.Also Mavrah theorised about the Bohrok originally evolving out of something else. If he was a GB, he would know that they were originally Matoran. Furthermore, I don't think Mavrahs actions over the years suggest his main purpose is to observe.

[Voxumo]

I think I can rule out Mavrah as a possibility

3. a character who would have migrated to Spherus Magna by now.

Not sure how black and white the rules on the front page are, but Mavrah has not migrated to Spherus Magna, he's on the Red Star.Also Mavrah theorised about the Bohrok originally evolving out of something else. If he was a GB, he would know that they were originally Matoran. Furthermore, I don't think Mavrahs actions over the years suggest his main purpose is to observe.

That is a good point. mavrah never was on spherus magna and he met kopaka and the other toa nuva ,Whose name eludes me right now, on the red star. which if we assume the two stories are on the same time line there is no way mavrah could have been on spherus magna at the when orde and them are being hunted by vorox if he was already with kopaka. So i think with this information it is safe to assume it can not be mavrah.

[Chip Wiseman]

I just thought of something, what if it was Mavrah? He was a researcher, like the Great Beings, and a Great Being could easily control their creations, and possibly the creations their inventions made. He was obsessive about his work, and we know the Great Beings dumped control of a planet on some terrible leaders because they preferred to learn than lead. He didn't see the ramifications of his actions when the Toa Metru encountered him, and we know the Great Beings have a tendency to invent things that go horribly wrong( Elemental Lords, Baterra, that Toa killing robot...) And of all the Matoran in Metru-Nui, only he didn't loose his memories...But the reason I consider him is because he is because of the speculation that the Great Being is killing the Powers that Be(poor Tren Krom). When Tren Krom went to a farm where he will be much happier now, he sent a vision of the Red Star in Kopaka and Pohatu's minds. And when they reached said object, they discovered Mavrah. How could an ordinary Onu-Matoran go from drowning to hiding in a gigantic jetpack?Now I don't personally buy into this, as I feel there are too many gaps. But still, consider this if you like.

Mavrah? I never considered him! He is by far one of my fave characters, and he has a strong case:-He is obsessive about his work-He controls Rahi with ease-He got to the Red Star when he was last seen drowning-He is very stubborn-He was never put into stasisI was going to go with Velika, but this... this conveys a deep 'yeah' feeling in me.EDIT:

I think I can rule out Mavrah as a possibility

3. a character who would have migrated to Spherus Magna by now.

Not sure how black and white the rules on the front page are, but Mavrah has not migrated to Spherus Magna, he's on the Red Star.Also Mavrah theorised about the Bohrok originally evolving out of something else. If he was a GB, he would know that they were originally Matoran. Furthermore, I don't think Mavrahs actions over the years suggest his main purpose is to observe.

'WOULD have'. This suggests they didn't, but could have if something didn't stop them. Edited December 22, 2011 by Gresh's Thornax...Ouchy!!!

[Kilax]

I have a question,does the Great Being hide inside somebody who frequently roams around the MU (example a Toa or Dark Hunter) or observes the MU from a particular island only(like Matoran) ?

[Erebus]

We don't know the answers to your question. :PWe don't exactly know the extent of the Great Being's powers. Hey may not need to travel anyone to know what's going on.

[Raph]

That Great Being is sure one riddle. My guess he may reside in Red Star still even tough it's NOT Mavrah. There's a lot of creatures in Red Star. So maybe....

[Tahu Nuva Master of Fire]

Dume was imprisoned in the Matoran Sphere 18 months before the Great Cataclysm and the Great Rescue. So a little over 18 months.

Well that's a pro for Dume. 18 months is more than a year, which means he should've lost his memory. Although we don't know whether the spheres have the mind-wiping effect on Turaga as well.

Dume was prepared for the return from Mata Nui. When we met him in 2006 he remembered Vakama and the rest of the Turaga just fine.

[Raph]

Dume was imprisoned in the Matoran Sphere 18 months before the Great Cataclysm and the Great Rescue. So a little over 18 months.

Well that's a pro for Dume. 18 months is more than a year, which means he should've lost his memory. Although we don't know whether the spheres have the mind-wiping effect on Turaga as well.

Dume was prepared for the return from Mata Nui. When we met him in 2006 he remembered Vakama and the rest of the Turaga just fine.

Matorans of Metru Nui too remembered thier home. Dume maybe was in amnesia just as the matoran. And with time he remembered as wellplus dume was avakened earlier than matoran.

[Voxumo]

Dume was imprisoned in the Matoran Sphere 18 months before the Great Cataclysm and the Great Rescue. So a little over 18 months.

Well that's a pro for Dume. 18 months is more than a year, which means he should've lost his memory. Although we don't know whether the spheres have the mind-wiping effect on Turaga as well.

Dume was prepared for the return from Mata Nui. When we met him in 2006 he remembered Vakama and the rest of the Turaga just fine.

Matorans of Metru Nui too remembered thier home. Dume maybe was in amnesia just as the matoran. And with time he remembered as wellplus dume was avakened earlier than matoran.

Actually they do not remember there home. There is a quote which i remeber which might be what your mistaking as them actually remembering there home.I had to pull out my copy of bionicle legends #2 dark destiny to find it mind you the book is being held together by tape after the many times i have read it.Imagine a librarian rummaging threw a long forgotten bookcase looking for a specific book then holding the book in his hand shouting "Found it!" that was me

"maybe i can." the words came from hahli,who was holding a small stone tablet in her hand. " i found this on the ground, not far from here. it's ancient . almost unbelievably so. turaga nuju showed me some of the marker stones kept in the ko-metru knowledge towers. and based on the carvings and symbols on this.... it was made before metru nui even existed.""Can you read it?/" asked kongu"a few months ago, i would have said no," replied hahli," but nokama has been teaching me. she says i used to know how to do this, but i just forgot. anyway, let me try."pages 45-46 of bionicle legends #2 dark destiny

That in a way references it. So they do not actually remember. Although i believe after a while certain things might have jogged small parts of thier memories but not like it matters anymore metru-nui is history. Also slightly off topic but i want to state this I bet after The Toa Mahri returned to Metru-nui after saved mata-nuis life that Turaga Nokama ran to dume and burst into his chambers and went" Ha You crusty old ice bat! See what me telling Jaller did? I bet you won't be pointing your fingers at me for awhile now that i in a way saved the matoran universe by telling Jaller! Take that." she walks out the room smiling with a hint of revenge while dume just stands there is jaw on the floor with shock in his eyes.and also I find it amazing that after a thousand years Nuju remembered where those marker stone were. I would have thought he would be searching Ko-Metru going " I could have sworn i left those marker stones over here or maybe it was over there." I mean come on anyone would forget small trivial things like that especially when the turaga never thought they would see metru-nui again i mean come on. I just had to get that out now i feel better

[Dralcax]

Dume, being a Turaga, may be more resistant to artificial memory loss. After all, it took 1000 years to erase the Toa Mata, and they still remembered their skills and duty, if not how they learned them.

[Raph]

Dume may be still possibility...but......realy realy.....unbeliveble. He's Turaga. And i remember that Greg stated that GB don't cares 'bout matoran/

[Elephant in the Room]

He confirmed all Makuta were dead, but if Krika was a GB then he wouldn't be lying.

This statement doesn't make sense. :PGregF would be lying if Krika was a GB because he's confirmed that all Makuta are dead, except for Miserix and alternate Teridax. Krika faded from existence, so he can't come back.

But if Krika was a great being, he wouldn't be a makuta. Therefore he would be excepted from the all makuta are dead statement.

[Erebus]

I understand what you're saying, but it's not going to happen. One of the guidelines was that it was a still living character. GregF isn't going to make an exception and troll us by bringing back a dead character and making him a GB.

[Raph]

I state my official candidate: Takadox. He's GB.

[Kopaka25]

Dume was trusted and respected by the Metru Nui Matoran. If he was the GB, then he would not care about them, and the impression I got from Legacy of Evil was that Dume did strongly care about his city and its Matoran. I'm doubtful about him being the GB.

[Elephant in the Room]

I understand what you're saying, but it's not going to happen. One of the guidelines was that it was a still living character. GregF isn't going to make an exception and troll us by bringing back a dead character and making him a GB.

Oh I agree with you, I was just pointing out that loophole :PI'm gonna stick with Krakua. I made a case for him in the old topic that held some water but I can't for the life of me remember most of it. Oh well. It had something to do with him being an order member - what better way to observe his creations? The rest I unfortunately can't recall. Edited January 2, 2012 by Elephant in the Room

[ALVIS]

Most of the evidence for Krakua points more towards the murderer in TPTB, honestly. So unless the GB and the murderer are one and the same - which is possible - I'm not supporting Krakua as the GB.

[Nuparu1995]

I definitely think an OoMN member is a possibility. Or one of the much older Toa.

[Voxumo]

I still feel strongly that it is Darkness the dark hunter. I think it's him because he is always watching the shadowed one. He is also not directly involved in the events. But still i think he is perfect. The possibility of krakua is also a high possibility, but i still think it is Darkness.

[Dralcax]

Lets bring back the Velika theory and cross it with the GB=murderer theory. The murderer killed Karzahni. And, being one of Karzahni's victims, Velika would certainly have reason to do so if he was able. Sure, the other Voyatoran have stronger feelings towards Karzahni, but who knows? Velika hasn't ever shown much emotion. All he ever does is talk in riddles. Maybe he was simply hiding it, along with everything else.