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Bionicle Concludes Again

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Well all this might be true, but G2 was still cancelled after two years. That's the facts, so clearly they didn't try or care hard enough.

I suppose by this argument anybody in the world who's homeless or impoverished doesn't care or try hard? It's impossible for mistakes or outside circumstances to affect somebody or something's chances of success?

 

No, of course not. Pretending that how hard somebody cares or tries are the only things in the world that can affect their financial performance is downright irrational. A person can pour their heart and soul into a project and try their hardest to make it the best that it can be, and it can still fail if people don't like it or respond to the ways they try to promote it.

 

You're comparing poverty, an actual issue ongoing literally all over the world due to the poor economy, to a lackluster toyline? That's a really far fetched analogy.

 

How are you going to continue jumping through hoops to defend another heartless reboot even after it was cancelled after two years? It's clear Lego must've felt the same way otherwise they wouldn't have given it the axe.

 

Looking back, I must agree with you that my analogy was poor. But Aanchir's is very true. Just because something doesn't last long doesn't mean no effort was put into it. That's basic logic.

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Well all this might be true, but G2 was still cancelled after two years. That's the facts, so clearly they didn't try or care hard enough.

I suppose by this argument anybody in the world who's homeless or impoverished doesn't care or try hard? It's impossible for mistakes or outside circumstances to affect somebody or something's chances of success?

 

No, of course not. Pretending that how hard somebody cares or tries are the only things in the world that can affect their financial performance is downright irrational. A person can pour their heart and soul into a project and try their hardest to make it the best that it can be, and it can still fail if people don't like it or respond to the ways they try to promote it.

 

You're comparing poverty, an actual issue ongoing literally all over the world due to the poor economy, to a lackluster toyline? That's a really far fetched analogy.

 

How are you going to continue jumping through hoops to defend another heartless reboot even after it was cancelled after two years? It's clear Lego must've felt the same way otherwise they wouldn't have given it the axe.

 

 

And what makes you so sure Lego felt that way? For all you know, they may not have wanted to pull the plug on it, but had no choice because of how it was going.


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Well all this might be true, but G2 was still cancelled after two years. That's the facts, so clearly they didn't try or care hard enough.

I suppose by this argument anybody in the world who's homeless or impoverished doesn't care or try hard? It's impossible for mistakes or outside circumstances to affect somebody or something's chances of success?

 

No, of course not. Pretending that how hard somebody cares or tries are the only things in the world that can affect their financial performance is downright irrational. A person can pour their heart and soul into a project and try their hardest to make it the best that it can be, and it can still fail if people don't like it or respond to the ways they try to promote it.

 

You're comparing poverty, an actual issue ongoing literally all over the world due to the poor economy, to a lackluster toyline? That's a really far fetched analogy.

 

How are you going to continue jumping through hoops to defend another heartless reboot even after it was cancelled after two years? It's clear Lego must've felt the same way otherwise they wouldn't have given it the axe.

 

People worked on it and put effort into it. Designing a major toyline is harder than it sounds.

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I went into G2 highly critical. And, while I don't think it's story quite stood up to g1, I don't think that's it's fault. We forget that G1 had 10 or 11 years to build up an audience and lore, and to learn from it's own set design mistakes. We judged a theme in it's infancy against the matured monolith that was G1.

 

with that in mind...I shouldn't have been as critical as I was at G2's begining. They did a good job. It's likely that g1 will still be the line with the strongest legacy, but I hope g2 stays strong in people's minds.

 

There's absolutely no need to bash G2, guys.

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---[{How To Consolidate Gen2's Storytelling Flaws}]---

The Toa Mata were legends in the Matoran Universe long before they ever did anything. They must have been the subject of legends and stories.

Gen2 is the story.

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Well all this might be true, but G2 was still cancelled after two years. That's the facts, so clearly they didn't try or care hard enough.

Firefly was a good show that the people behind it cared for a lot.  It didn't even get a full season before it was cancelled.

 

Market don't care how much you love what you made.  It'll live and die on what people are into at the moment, along with a host other things.

 

When people tell you that they've seen the great efforts the designers sunk into the products they put out and you just respond with "can't be, got cancelled" then it shows that you don't understand how many factors go into determining what's successful.

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Well all this might be true, but G2 was still cancelled after two years. That's the facts, so clearly they didn't try or care hard enough.

I suppose by this argument anybody in the world who's homeless or impoverished doesn't care or try hard? It's impossible for mistakes or outside circumstances to affect somebody or something's chances of success?

 

No, of course not. Pretending that how hard somebody cares or tries are the only things in the world that can affect their financial performance is downright irrational. A person can pour their heart and soul into a project and try their hardest to make it the best that it can be, and it can still fail if people don't like it or respond to the ways they try to promote it.

 

You're comparing poverty, an actual issue ongoing literally all over the world due to the poor economy, to a lackluster toyline? That's a really far fetched analogy.

 

How are you going to continue jumping through hoops to defend another heartless reboot even after it was cancelled after two years? It's clear Lego must've felt the same way otherwise they wouldn't have given it the axe.

 

 

And what makes you so sure Lego felt that way? For all you know, they may not have wanted to pull the plug on it, but had no choice because of how it was going.

 

I'd say the fact that they're the biggest toy company in the world and have no chance of toppling their empire by putting money into an IP that isn't making as much money as they'd hope is a pretty good indicator how Lego feels. If they love the line and didn't care about the money they'd keep making the sets for the fans because the love of the line was stronger than the income. But it clearly wasn't.

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I never wanted it to end, but now that it has I want to know exactly why this happened. I's good to see though that just because the sets are ending (again) it isn't entirely over. I think we'll still have another two years for BIONICLE stuff from LEGO, if not longer hopefully.


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Well all this might be true, but G2 was still cancelled after two years. That's the facts, so clearly they didn't try or care hard enough.

Firefly was a good show that the people behind it cared for a lot.  It didn't even get a full season before it was cancelled.

 

Market don't care how much you love what you made.  It'll live and die on what people are into at the moment, along with a host other things.

 

When people tell you that they've seen the great efforts the designers sunk into the products they put out and you just respond with "can't be, got cancelled" then it shows that you don't understand how many factors go into determining what's successful.

 

Another poor comparison. Firefly was a relatively expensive CGI-heavy show at a time where those were few and far between. Fox put money into the show and when there wasn't an immediate return inflow they canned it. Visual media is incredibly expensive and with something of that degree you can't just throw that kind of money away because the people making it and a few fans liked it. Lego, on the other hand, has dozens of themes that, while surely expensive, make their money back enough that Lego is certainly in the position where they can take risks without bankrupting themselves. But they're a business and don't really care about BIONICLE as a real IP, so they treated it as such. 

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I'd say the fact that they're the biggest toy company in the world and have no chance of toppling their empire by putting money into an IP that isn't making as much money as they'd hope is a pretty good indicator how Lego feels. If they love the line and didn't care about the money they'd keep making the sets for the fans because the love of the line was stronger than the income. But it clearly wasn't.

As romantic as the idea of LEGO selflessly continuing BIONICLE without a good financial return may sound, that's not how any of it works.

 

… and it would also mean that LEGO didn't "love" G1 either, because that got cancelled due to declining sales.

 

 

Lego, on the other hand, has dozens of themes that, while surely expensive, make their money back enough that Lego is certainly in the position where they can take risks without bankrupting themselves.

 

And I'd say bringing back a previously-cancelled theme so soon after it ended would count as one of those "risks", especially with the amount of promotion they focused on it.  But how long would you expect them to keep up the risk before deciding against continuing?

Edited by Bfahome
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I think it's just that most kids don't care much for original constraction themes these days. It's probably a hard sell for them.


 

 

Please; try to understand. 
 
With G1, they tried because they were about to go bankrupt
 
with G2, there was no need to try - Lego is now very successful


A few things. First of all, when LEGO was developing G1 Bionicle in 1999 and 2000, they did not have any clue that in three or four years they would be on the brink of bankruptcy. Obviously, they knew that the company's record of double-digit sales growth year to year had stopped in 1993, and that in 1998 the company had reported its first ever financial loss, which they wrongly blamed on kids having short attention spans and wanting instant gratification. But as early as 1999 they were back to being profitable. They had just launched the highly successful LEGO Star Wars theme and hired new management that successfully increased sales and promised to double them by 2005. The LEGO Group fully believed they were in the midst of a turnaround. Even as late as 2002, LEGO thought they were on the up-and-up. It's therefore difficult to argue that Bionicle G1's success from the outset was driven by financial desperation. It wasn't until 2003 that LEGO had any idea what a predicament their new innovation-driven corporate mindset had gotten them into.

Second, with the kind of assumption you're making, you'd think no successful company could ever hope to create a successful toyline or IP. But even just looking at LEGO, there's plenty of evidence that isn't true. In 2008, when LEGO began developing Ninjago, they had already greatly recovered from their crisis years of 2003 and 2004 and managed to make a yearly profit of over two billion DKK (over 300 million USD in today's money). Not only did they have the continued success of LEGO Star Wars propping them up, but LEGO City was also carrying them higher and higher each year. And yet, when Ninjago launched in 2011 it sold better than any previous launch of a new LEGO product line — including Bionicle. By your argument, this should not have been possible, because a LEGO theme's success or failure hinges on how much they care about it, and how much they care on it hinges on how desperate they are financially. But clearly, it happened.

For what it's worth, I've met several of the people involved with the Bionicle reboot. There's no denying that they cared profoundly about making it the best it could be. You might prefer to imagine that because you didn't like it, the people making it didn't care or try hard enough. You'd be wrong.

 

Well all this might be true, but G2 was still cancelled after two years. That's the facts, so clearly they didn't try or care hard enough.

 

 

Maybe kids just weren't very responsive to the new line 'cause they're too different from us.


 

 

Well all this might be true, but G2 was still cancelled after two years. That's the facts, so clearly they didn't try or care hard enough.

Firefly was a good show that the people behind it cared for a lot.  It didn't even get a full season before it was cancelled.
 
Market don't care how much you love what you made.  It'll live and die on what people are into at the moment, along with a host other things.
 
When people tell you that they've seen the great efforts the designers sunk into the products they put out and you just respond with "can't be, got cancelled" then it shows that you don't understand how many factors go into determining what's successful.

 

Another poor comparison. Firefly was a relatively expensive CGI-heavy show at a time where those were few and far between. Fox put money into the show and when there wasn't an immediate return inflow they canned it. Visual media is incredibly expensive and with something of that degree you can't just throw that kind of money away because the people making it and a few fans liked it. Lego, on the other hand, has dozens of themes that, while surely expensive, make their money back enough that Lego is certainly in the position where they can take risks without bankrupting themselves. But they're a business and don't really care about BIONICLE as a real IP, so they treated it as such. 

 

 

I guess with the explosion of Ninjago and The Lego Movie shaping the tastes of today's kids, lego's all about their system sets, nowadays. The only reason their Star Wars figures are selling okay is probably because of the Star Wars part.

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The Toa- A Bionicle Retelling by NickonAquaMagna http://www.bzpower.com/board/topic/25275-the-toa-a-retelling-of-bionicle/

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I checked out my local toy store the other day to see if they had any interesting new LEGO sets. I was surprised to find that over half the Bionicle sets on display were from last year, both winter and summer waves, and that they were at the bottom of the shelf with little prominence. Assuming this is at all indicative of things elsewhere, I can't say this news comes as too much of a surprise.

 

I've not enjoyed Gen 2 nearly as much as Gen 1 mostly due to what was, in my opinion, a thin and disappointing story. I was also less than impressed with this years sets. Saying that, I really enjoyed the Journey to One episodes, and wish there had been more story to go with them (four episodes in a year with nothing in between or after leaves a lot of dry spells). I also really liked last year's sets, and had very much hoped for at least a third year for the line.

 

While I may not have liked this gen so much, I shall still be sad that Bionicle is one again gone from store shelves. Perhaps they'll try again in another five years.


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I'd say the fact that they're the biggest toy company in the world and have no chance of toppling their empire by putting money into an IP that isn't making as much money as they'd hope is a pretty good indicator how Lego feels. If they love the line and didn't care about the money they'd keep making the sets for the fans because the love of the line was stronger than the income. But it clearly wasn't.

As romantic as the idea of LEGO selflessly continuing BIONICLE without a good financial return may sound, that's not how any of it works.

 

… and it would also mean that LEGO didn't "love" G1 either, because that got cancelled due to declining sales.

 

 

Lego, on the other hand, has dozens of themes that, while surely expensive, make their money back enough that Lego is certainly in the position where they can take risks without bankrupting themselves.

 

And I'd say bringing back a previously-cancelled theme so soon after it ended would count as one of those "risks", especially with the amount of promotion they focused on it.  But how long would you expect them to keep up the risk before deciding against continuing?

 

You completely missed the point. I don't expect them to keep it running with poor sales and I don't expect Lego to care. Lego's a successful business specifically because it works like that.

 

What I was trying to suggest, and what I will do so blatantly now, is that Lego didn't have faith in BIONICLE G2(and by extension lost faith in G1). G1 ended cause they got lazy with the sets and started recycling all the same pieces until the fans got bored. 

 

G2 ended because Lego didn't give BIONICLE a real chance from the offset. They again reused a ton of old pieces with only a few new ones, they didn't promote it very well, and they didn't try to expand the media and get it relevant to children again. They went for some cheap online cartoons in the beginning instead of the CGI stuff we got in 2016. They had more faith this year with some of the new pieces and JtO, but it was too late and it wasn't enough.They only gave JtO four episodes to expand the story and the sets didn't look any better despite some of the new pieces. 

 

You can go back to the Firefly argument that Whedon tried really hard on that and the money didn't come in, but that was a case of a creative team that was held back by the lack of faith of the studio. This is a case of the company having a lack of faith so much that they didn't even bother with a creative team and threw it on people who didn't even really care about BIONICLE. 

Edited by CallanLoF
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At this point, unless they get a true visionary like the way Disney did with Star Wars or IDW did with Transformers, it's best for Bionicle to remain dead.

Edited by BaltaSucks
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I honestly think this year's sets are better than MOST of the Toa we got in G1. They have such an intense elemental, almost spiritual feel that I wish more of them could've conveyed back in the day. I don't think Bionicle G2's failure has anything to do with the sets' quality, but rather its inability to reach the kids of this day and age. They're just too different from us, with their ipads an' such.

 

....and yes, I attribute that largely to the rather lukewarm promotion last year.

Edited by NickonAquaMagna
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I wasn't exactly thrilled when they announced a reboot, but I think part of me was at least thankful they were doing something with the name.


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I stopped caring about the reboot a while ago, because the primary media was just unexciting and unengaging to me, so I honestly can't say to be affected in any way by this announcement. So it's ending. I guess it it.

 

It is something of a shame though. I was looking forward to another year of the sets at least. To get the MoUP, to see where they were going with the Vahi...oh well. It was nice while it lasted.


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I honestly think this year's sets are better than MOST of the Toa we got in G1. They have such an intense elemental, almost spiritual feel that I wish more of them could've conveyed back in the day. I don't think Bionicle G2's failure has anything to do with the sets' quality, but rather its inability to reach the kids of this day and age. They're just too different from us, with their ipads an' such.

 

....and yes, I attribute that largely to the rather lukewarm promotion last year.

Ey, that offends me. I'm an iPad user.

 

In all serious though it's not ao much that kids we'ren ncessaliry interested, it was that the marketing was god-awful. To be honest with you I never really saw much in the way of marketing with G2.


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Not surprising after the lackluster first year. It seemed that Lego barely tried to push it at all in 2015, despite the sets being good. Comparing the starts of other recent story based lines to this, such as Ninjago, Chima, Nexo Knights, or even Hero Factory, it is no surprise that G2 never got the usual full 3 years. 

 

Even with the catch up they played this year with the books, comics, and Journey to One (all of which I am thankful to have), it just couldn't conquer its slow start.

 

Toys are not going to sell if the marketing is not there. Launching a story based theme with next to no story was a mistake.

 

I was never one to belittle G2 by comparing it to G1 when G2 was still in its infancy. But now that it is complete, any and all comparisons are fine. Looking back now at a complete G2, I think it is safe to say that it just did not measure up to the original outside of the excellent sets. While I enjoyed the story we got, none of it really was as good as what we usually got during G1.

 

When G1 was canceled, I was upset. When this news sprang, I barely felt anything. The only regret I have is that there will be no G2 Makuta set released with a MoUP.

 

I do hope Bionicle returns again, but I hope it returns in a more proper form, with Lego actually having confidence behind its product. Right now, I'm looking forward to the next break and whatever new buildable figure line Lego plans on replacing G2 with.


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G2 ended because Lego didn't give BIONICLE a real chance from the offset. They again reused a ton of old pieces with only a few new ones, they didn't promote it very well, and they didn't try to expand the media and get it relevant to children again. They went for some cheap online cartoons instead of the CGI stuff we got in 2016 from the beginning. They had more faith this year with some of the new pieces and JtO, but it was too late and it wasn't enough.The only gave JtO for episodes to expand the story and the sets didn't look any better despite some of the new pieces.

"From the offset"?  "The offset" was LEGO dedicating their entire presence at NYCC to promote the BIONICLE reboot.  Everything you call lazy or careless was an attempt at bringing BIONICLE into the modern market.  The "cheap online cartoons" were designed with clarity and brevity for the generation with smartphones and other small screens, never mind that "cheap online cartoons" are some of the things the old BIONICLE fans look back on most fondly.  The part reuse is because CCBS is LEGO's constraction system now, and because they aren't about to go back to the massive bloat that caused them financial hardship in the first place, never mind that BIONICLE started as a TECHNIC sub-theme and the sets took several parts from previous themes like the Slizers.

 

You may think that LEGO should've seen BIONICLE's initial success and taken that as a sign that they need to sink a bunch of resources into a media franchise with lots of new parts that set it apart from everything else.  The reason they don't do that, though, is because last time they tried it the theme was named "Galidor" and it went badly for everyone involved.

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I honestly think this year's sets are better than MOST of the Toa we got in G1. They have such an intense elemental, almost spiritual feel that I wish more of them could've conveyed back in the day. I don't think Bionicle G2's failure has anything to do with the sets' quality, but rather its inability to reach the kids of this day and age. They're just too different from us, with their ipads an' such.

Insulting the intelligence of kids and reducing their interests to them being "too different" is ridiculous and flatly untrue. Many kids still enjoy buying toys, hence why Lego, Hasbro, Mattel, and the like are able to stay in business. Especially with building toys, Lego's more successful now than ever. The problem isn't with the kids, it's that Lego, albeit barely, marketed generally uninteresting sets. If anything, kids are MORE likely to want these kind of toys now seeing how mainstream they've become thanks to things like The Lego Movie. When you don't put in the creativity people know and love from a franchise, it causes disinterest. That's why G1's final years led to sales decline, the sets grew uninteresting and were the same sets every year, which led to less and less people being interested and willing to buy.

 

Also, to say that the new sets are better than most of the Toa in G1 is not only too opinionated, but when you consider sales numbers and how long they lasted with those Toa, is also untrue. G1 gave us fresh, new Toa designs every new arc (or even year, when you count 2004, 2005, and 2006) until after 2006. People want new designs, not recolored, rehashed ones. G2 gave us, essentially, glorified Hero Factory with added gear functions, which weren't fast paced and a lot of the time limited posability or prevented it's own use by interfering with armor plating (such as 2015 Tahu's shoulder armor).

 

G2's failure was a lack of interest and faith from Lego, they didn't put a team of people who truly had a vision for the franchise and they didn't even believe in it enough to market it anywhere aside from the internet. Journey to One not only was a mini-series, but essentially it was a CG web show followup to the 2D web show from the year prior, that was barely advertised. Compare that to Nexo Knights, which came out after and immediately was promoted and given it's own full fledged television series on Cartoon Network. They had faith in Nexo Knights and it showed. If they truly cared about Bionicle G2, it would've been given to people who knew what to do with it and would've been promoted like Nexo Knights and Ninjago had. But it didn't, and this cancellation only solidifies it.

Edited by BaltaSucks
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This is a shame. G2 never had the same spark as G1, for me, but I never felt like it was supposed to. I was 10 when Bionicle first came out. I'm 25, now. Your interests and your tastes change. 

 

That said, it was great seeing the sets on store shelves again and it was always fun picking up a random set every now and then. I would have never guessed that I'd build a Tahu while I was in grade school..... and then again, while I was getting my Master's Degree. I'm thankful and grateful that Bionicle was around for as long as it was, both times around. My appreciation to all the designers who made it happen. 

 

Maybe there will be a G3 one day. I'll remain hopeful. 

Edited by EPCOT Explorer
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I do hope Bionicle returns again, but I hope it returns in a more proper form, with Lego actually having confidence behind its product. Right now, I'm looking forward to the next break and whatever new buildable figure line Lego plans on replacing G2 with.

 

There probably won't be.

 

I honestly think this year's sets are better than MOST of the Toa we got in G1. They have such an intense elemental, almost spiritual feel that I wish more of them could've conveyed back in the day. I don't think Bionicle G2's failure has anything to do with the sets' quality, but rather its inability to reach the kids of this day and age. They're just too different from us, with their ipads an' such.

Insulting the intelligence of kids and reducing their interests to them being "too different" is ridiculous and flatly untrue. Many kids still enjoy buying toys, hence why Lego, Hasbro, Mattel, and the like are able to stay in business. Especially with building toys, Lego's more successful now than ever. The problem isn't with the kids, it's that Lego, albeit barely, marketed generally uninteresting sets. If anything, kids are MORE likely to want these kind of toys now seeing how mainstream they've become thanks to things like The Lego Movie. When you don't put in the creativity people know and love from a franchise, it causes disinterest. That's why G1's final years led to sales decline, the sets grew uninteresting and were the same sets every year, which led to less and less people being interested and willing to buy.

 

Also, to say that the new sets are better than most of the Toa in G1 is not only too opinionated, but when you consider sales numbers and how long they lasted with those Toa, is also untrue. G1 gave us fresh, new Toa designs every new arc (or even year, when you count 2004, 2005, and 2006) until after 2006. People want new designs, not recolored, rehashed ones. G2 gave us, essentially, glorified Hero Factory with added gear functions, which weren't fast paced and a lot of the time limited posability or prevented it's own use by interfering with armor plating (such as 2015 Tahu's shoulder armor).

 

G2's failure was a lack of interest and faith from Lego, they didn't put a team of people who truly had a vision for the franchise and they didn't even believe in it enough to market it anywhere aside from the internet. Journey to One not only was a mini-series, but essentially it was a CG web show followup to the 2D web show from the year prior, that was barely advertised. Compare that to Nexo Knights, which came out after and immediately was promoted and given it's own full fledged television series on Cartoon Network. They had faith in Nexo Knights and it showed. If they truly cared about Bionicle G2, it would've been given to people who knew what to do with it and would've been promoted like Nexo Knights and Ninjago had. But it didn't, and this cancellation only solidifies it.

 

 

 

I'm not saying kids don't like building toys. I'm saying they're drawn to CERTAIN building toys. There has been a huge, huge push for system sets in recent years, which I at least partially attribute to the success of The Lego Movie, and Ninjago before that.

 

I'm also not saying kids are stupid. I'm saying their interests are different. From the sound of it, the Star Wars constraction figures are selling pretty well. Yet aside from the standouts like Darth Vader and General Grievous, I can't say the construction of most of the other figures is quite as inspired as this years' Toa. I think it should be pretty clear that kids are buying THOSE sets because they have an attachment to those characters.

 

Imagine you're a little kid in December, or January, who just watched The Force Awakens in the theater. Now imagine you're in toys r us or wal mart the next day. Who are you gonna wanna get? Your favorite character(s) from the movie you just saw, or some weird robot things you've probably never seen before, these characters that you don't know, but your big brother talks about them sometimes because he bought similar things as a kid?

 

I think Bionicle is just a hard sell for the kids of today, for various reasons. I'm not saying it's the kids' fault, it's like how they USED to play with rocking horses, or a can and a stick. The world is always changing, and so those markets change.

 

I strongly disagree that G2's designs are lazy. I think they are miles better than most Hero Factory sets. Like, I don't think the comparison is even fair. Sure, they use a lot of the same pieces, but they use them in interesting WAYS... which is what lego is ultimately all about. Taking a few seemingly basic elements, and making something special out of them. And yeah, getting completely new builds (Metru, Piraka, what have you) each year was nice early on, but they increasingly became essentially clones of each other. Given that lego seems to be unwilling to create an entire new building system each year, I think they've utilized CCBS, and technic mixed in, pretty well.

  • Upvote 5

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G1 gave us fresh, new Toa designs every new arc (or even year, when you count 2004, 2005, and 2006) until after 2006. People want new designs, not recolored, rehashed ones. G2 gave us, essentially, glorified Hero Factory with added gear functions, which weren't fast paced and a lot of the time limited posability or prevented it's own use by interfering with armor plating (such as 2015 Tahu's shoulder armor).

The "fresh, new Toa designs" didn't come about until BIONICLE's fourth year.  Every Toa set in the first three years used the same build on the same torso and the only new thing they ever got was two new pieces of armor and a new leg mold.

 

Vahki were pretty much Rahkshi 2.0.

 

Bohrok Va were pretty much Turaga 2.0.

 

Bohrok Kal were literally Bohrok 2.0.

 

Even within the old trend of pumping out new molds at an unnecessary rate BIONICLE had hardly been a stranger to design reuse.

 

Also, I don't get what you're saying about posability taking a hit?  Tahu can move his arms fine, and the inclusion of friction in the gear function actually makes it possible to pose your sets, unlike the sets with the old floppy functions.  Seriously, try putting 2001 Tahu in a cool action pose without modifying it.  Even disregarding the fact that the hips look ridiculous, you aren't going to get his sword to stay out in front of him.  The Toa Nuva sort of alleviated this with their swappable gear-lock thing, but that was immediately abandoned.

  • Upvote 4

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I think a big problem was that the media surrounding the reboot was lackluster after the initial hype with the golden masks. After that, there was only a single mobile game that didn't offer much in terms of interest in the story or the world. There were no comics in Lego Magazine to get kids interested, and then there was a miniseries exclusive to Netflix. There were designer videos but I don't think those are particularly appealing to kids who don't know about the line. A single licensed game, no matter how bad, would've drawn some attention. A single 4-episode miniseries aired on a channel like Cartoon Network would've drawn some attention. Of course, I have no knowledge of the business but this is just my two cents.

Edited by Toa of Gallifrey
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Geez, all this talk about "Lego didn't try" this generation as much as the last generation.

Im pretty sure that the team had these ideas they put into the theme, and they had figured it would sell well, as well as hone back to the 1st gen story for returning fans.

Imagine if they had an idea that just wasn't well recieved? They'd thought it would do well, but it didn't. Does that mean they didn't try hard enough? No. If they didn't want to try, they would'nt have started.

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Can't say I'm surprised. And can't say I will miss this line.

 

- weak lore

- weak story

- low marketing

- weak sets

- low budget

 

 

To be honest, this was doomed from the start. It was just a shadow of how great Bionicle once was. And no, I'm not being nostalgic here. When you play it safe, and consider kids are too dumb to understand a complete story with its own characterists and culture, you're wasting fantastic potential to make a great fantasy world. I hate to say this, but LEGO really screwed up here.

 

 

Edit: It already started wrong when they changed Lewa element to Jungle. Unforgivable.

Edited by Zidonaro
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It seems the prophecies have changed. Shame about that.

 

My feelings are well and truly mixed. I am by turns darkly amused, morbidly curious, sad, and rather relieved.

 

Let's start with that ending. Hmmm.... Not my piece of cake. I had already given up on Journey to One being even passable fare, so I only watched the finale to see what all the fuss was about, but still, it's hilariously rushed. "Makuta is coming through the Black Gate Shadow Portal. It's a good thing that we're actually stars! All we need is to believe in ourselves! Bye-bye!"

 

I am genuinely curious as to how much of this they planned from the start. It looks to me like they made it up on the spot, but I know from experience that this is a tremendously unfair assumption. If nothing else, it does parallel the climax of LoMN.

 

Then there's the loose ends... The Mask of Time's the biggie, but I don't doubt there were many other stillborn concepts. Let's hope they all see the light of day.

 

I'm quite curious as to how Gen2 bombed so badly. Hero Factory sold well enough to run for five years (though it was playing the porter for BIONICLE on both ends, to be fair,) and yet BIONICLE didn't last three. What changed? I almost wonder, absurd as this may sound, if the target audience at large mistook it for a licensed IP, and were turned off by knowing nothing about it. 

 

It's a shame it had to end on this note. A death at three years would have been natural. Sure, we'd have been disappointed at not seeing the Once and Future Theme return to take its rightful place in the Immortal Pantheon of Break Out Themes (for now occupied only by magical assassins with a penchant for outrageous vehicles,) but hey, there's no shame in doing well enough. It's also rather sad, IMO, to see the decline in set quality. Winter 2015? Awesome. Summer 2015? Not quite as cool, but still pretty good, not to mention novel and with some fantastic pieces. Winter 2016? Disappointing, overly-greebled Toa (Onua being a major exception,) but at least Umarak and the creatures were lovely. Summer 2016? Blargh, meh, humbug. Winter 2017? Well, hopefully they'll have learned from the reaction to the 2015 sets and they'll make a- Oh.

 

But in a strange way, it's a relief to know that Gen2 is dead. Gone is the oppressive uncertainty and fear born of hearing whispered reports of the theme's ill-health. It failed, yes, but we are at the wake, and the funeral is not long in coming. It will not bring joy, but it will bring closure, and that can not be undervalued.

 

On the bright side, provided LEGO doesn't decide to jump the in-house contstaction ship all together, Gen2's successor must be more than just a cut-price BIONICLE. Perhaps we'll get something new and wonderful. Perhaps out of this tragedy, much good will come.

 

Regardless, I would like to thank the Gen2 team for their efforts. It's clear they put their hearts and souls into this, and for that I commend them. Thank you all. Thank you for helping to recapture some of the magic of my childhood. Y'all rock!

  • Upvote 7

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I'm hesitant to post here, primarily because I'm someone who comes to this topic as a "G1" fan who never did get into this second generation.  That is due to me being quite a bit older now than I was when Bionicle began back in the day and I recognise that I'm at an age now where I naturally wouldn't be drawn quite as much to a toy line like Bionicle!  I also have been very infrequently active on BZPower these last ten or so years, so not sure if my voice deserves to be heard!

 

Nevertheless, just wanted to make one statement regarding the popularity of the original Bionicle line...I've seen a couple comments along the lines of G1 Bionicle being more popular because it had so many more years(10 I think?) to build up its lore and story, giving it a weight and gravitas and granting it a longer period of time to build a fan base.  That longer time period is granted, but please remember that Bionicle was much loved even from the very first days of its launch, even before the sets were released - those of us who were around back then remember the hardcore fascination and debate over all things Bionicle...from the very beginning.  The story behind Bionicle was beautifully spun, being masterfully presented in the MNOLG and the comics(I can still remember the chills running down my arms as I read the very first comic out of the Lego magazine!!)  Bionicle in its earliest incarnation had a weight and a wonderful epic quality about it that quickly conjured up a rather obsessed fan base!  So G1 Bionicle had a great beginning that drew in people who remain fans to this day.  Did G2 have this same quality to it?  I'm unsure, as I honestly haven't followed it closely.  But I just wanted to throw in my two cents here, to remind some of you exactly why G1 aficionados are as passionate as we are.  It's not just because it's a toy line that lasted for ten years.  It's because it was a story that was beautifully told.  (Well.  Most of the time. :))

 

Pardon this long post - I really do feel a bit of an intruder, having posted so little in these past years!!  Thanks for reading.  :)

 

:tohu:

-IT

  • Upvote 8

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It's sad to see BIONICLE go once more. I really enjoyed collecting all the sets this year, as I personally found the sets some of the best construction sets ever released. It was clear to me that everyone on the project worked hard to make the line enjoyable, so it's sad to see it end even before their 3-year plan was finished.

  • Upvote 1

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Can't say I'm surprised. And can't say I will miss this line.

 

- weak lore

- weak story

- low marketing

- weak sets

- low budget

 

 

To be honest, this was doomed from the start. It was just a shadow of how great Bionicle once was. And no, I'm not being nostalgic here. When you play it safe, and consider kids are too dumb to understand a complete story with its own characterists and culture, you're wasting fantastic potential to make a great fantasy world. I hate to say this, but LEGO really screwed up here.

 

 

Edit: It already started wrong when they changed Lewa element to Jungle. Unforgivable.

Got a source on that low budget thing? And as for the Lewa thing, how dare they try something different. They should have just reissued all the old sets and never done anything different.

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Well, it was fun while it lasted, and that's really all that matters, right? ;) It may have only been 2 years, but it was 2 years of some really great sets and some really great times. Too bad we'll never get the Mask of Ultimate Power in brick form though. I wish Lego would have allowed it to last just one more year so we could have completed the 3-year story arc. It's going to be very interesting to see where CCBS goes from here onward... Going to watch the last 2 episodes of Journey to One now...

 

And who knows? 2025 sounds like a reasonable date for another shot at rebooting the theme...

Edited by SuperGeniusCreator
  • Upvote 2

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This is so disappointing...the three year arc would have worked really well ;__;

That reminds me, I suppose we won't be getting a MoUP either, despite it having been designed.

  • Upvote 1

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I'm hesitant to post here, primarily because I'm someone who comes to this topic as a "G1" fan who never did get into this second generation.  That is due to me being quite a bit older now than I was when Bionicle began back in the day and I recognise that I'm at an age now where I naturally wouldn't be drawn quite as much to a toy line like Bionicle!  I also have been very infrequently active on BZPower these last ten or so years, so not sure if my voice deserves to be heard!

 

Nevertheless, just wanted to make one statement regarding the popularity of the original Bionicle line...I've seen a couple comments along the lines of G1 Bionicle being more popular because it had so many more years(10 I think?) to build up its lore and story, giving it a weight and gravitas and granting it a longer period of time to build a fan base.  That longer time period is granted, but please remember that Bionicle was much loved even from the very first days of its launch, even before the sets were released - those of us who were around back then remember the hardcore fascination and debate over all things Bionicle...from the very beginning.  The story behind Bionicle was beautifully spun, being masterfully presented in the MNOLG and the comics(I can still remember the chills running down my arms as I read the very first comic out of the Lego magazine!!)  Bionicle in its earliest incarnation had a weight and a wonderful epic quality about it that quickly conjured up a rather obsessed fan base!  So G1 Bionicle had a great beginning that drew in people who remain fans to this day.  Did G2 have this same quality to it?  I'm unsure, as I honestly haven't followed it closely.  But I just wanted to throw in my two cents here, to remind some of you exactly why G1 aficionados are as passionate as we are.  It's not just because it's a toy line that lasted for ten years.  It's because it was a story that was beautifully told.  (Well.  Most of the time. :))

 

Pardon this long post - I really do feel a bit of an intruder, having posted so little in these past years!!  Thanks for reading.   :)

 

:tohu:

-IT

I'm more or less in your boat. I did watch some of the story episodes and paid attention to the sets, though never cared enough to plunk cash down for them. It was honestly underwhelming for a couple reasons. 

 

The main thing is that it felt like it lacked the epic tone of the original line. Partly this is going to be a result of having a short run. Partly this is a matter of presentation. The characters' presentation seemed to be dumbed down, with clearly defined traits. It was as if they said "ok, now here's his strong point and here's his weak point." The episodes' script did little to avert this; the parts that I watched (granted, I haven't seen everything) appeared to not take the story seriously. It felt (and yes, this is all my subjective personal impression) as if they were doing it just so they could check the "we have a plot" box.

 

Given this, I don't really care all that much that BIONICLE has ended a second time. I rather think it was never revived.

 

 

Well, I guess I care enough to read an article and comment afterwards...

 

 

Kinda a bummer that I never got into MOCing, but I can always do so later, BIONICLE or no BIONICLE, assuming I have enough cash once I get the time and inclination.

 

EDIT: Ooh, cool. I have an Olmak. That's neat.

Edited by Nujanii: Kanohi Master

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Well, I'd like to say thanks to everyone at LEGO who put a lot of effort into this line for the past two years. It was amazing in-itself and how I was able to relive it for a short while. Everything's gotta end, so see you later, alligator.

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It just sucks that they didn't even give the theme the benefit of the doubt that it would atleast last three years. I mean for the love of god, Chima lasted three years, and we know how nuch that was well liked. No onen talked about it is what. At least not here that is.

 

In any case, are we going to do anything as a community now? Or are we just gonna let ourselves fade out of existence? I certainly hope it's not the latter.

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The simple fact of the matter is, yes, it is true TLG was doing much worse financially in the early 2000s. Bionicle was a major investment for TLG, and they had a lot riding on its success. As a result, extreme effort was put into Bionicle, in terms of marketing, designing, media, and the story. The second time around, there was less incentive for TLG to invest the same percentage of capital because they did not need the same percentage of return.



We also need to consider the economic atmosphere of G1. When Bionicle first started, the main heroes cost $7 a piece. Granted, inflation and cost drivers change, but now the flagship characters cost, at a minimum, double what the same character cost when G1 launched. Yes, things are by and large more expensive now, but it cannot be denied that 2001 and 2002 were so successful because the story’s main focuses cost less than $10. Yes, the Toa Mata were smaller in stature than their 2015 descendants, but their function in the story was identical. HF likely saw a second year because of the sales of the heroes (marketed to be the leading characters AND the least expensive products). Even four years ago, the entire roster of heroes could be purchased for less than $75. Now, the same quantity will cost you over $100. The story was focused on the most attainable characters because they sold the best. This leads directly into my next point.



The market has also changed. The G2 target age group today is more connected to media outlets than the G1 target group. Yes, G1 saw massive success because of media-based games and products, but it was a secondary factor to playing. Today, tablets and phones are replacing physical toys as the primary form of entertainment. Reading-based story presentation, another critical part of G1’s success, is also diminished now. The Protectors, excluding Narmoto, saw barely any face-time in the animated story last year. Do you think that helped sales? Why would you feel compelled to remember to ask for a character that never spoke or played a major part in the story? Bionicle comics arrived monthly, showcasing several characters, and regular monthly animations did the same. Can four 22-segement animations, available for a fee, released over a much wider timeframe be expected to garner the same interest and action? Of course not. It can also be noted that G1 was released at a time with less inter-brand competition. There was no other Lego theme remotely like Bionicle when it arrived. When G2 came out, Ninjago, Chima, and several other themes made Bionicle less unique, relatively speaking. Yes, Chima was discontinued last year, but having three elemental-based toys at the most crucial time of introduction undoubtedly impacted sales.



I have no doubt that passion went into the genesis of G2, but it was not introduced with the same mindset, under the same circumstances, or to the exact same behaving target audience as G1. If TLG was expecting another bombastic Bionicle (which I doubt) they were being unrealistic. G2 was a worthy successor to G1. It had good builds, an acceptable story, and just enough of the familiar to beckon old fans’ attentions. It wasn’t perfect, and frankly, cannot ever be equal to G1, but I don’t think anyone who experienced G1 would ever allow it to be. Now is not the time to argue over what caused G2’s cancellation. There were likely several factors. But the fact is, green is always, always, going to be the main driver. If you are upset the G2 was cancelled, but never purchased a single set, it is likely that inaction that led to this end result. If you did buy even one set, then thank you. Bionicle does not have to end in squabbling, but rather continue through fond memories and creative new adventures through fans’ imagination.

Edited by VahiHolder02
  • Upvote 7

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