Bzpower Pet Peeves

[Let's Henshin!]

To go with the signature pixel thing, I have an analogy: Letting them be one pixel bigger is like someone going into a bank and stealing a dollar, it may not seem like a lot but it adds up. Another example is being overcharged a dollar, after a while if you go along with it that extra one dollar becomes the norm and then one more dollar may be overcharged. Eventually if you don't stop it, you end up getting overcharged by a lot more than you started.

[GSR]

On a lighter note... the topic titles automatically being set to Capitalize Every Word And Allow No Extra Capitals nags at me a bit. Some sentences just don't work that way.

Edited December 14, 2011 by GSR

[Bfahome]

Punishment as a whole seems to be well handled here. I can say for personal experience that I've been told off many times because my banner was too big.

Are you not sensing a bit of a contradiction there? Punishment might be 'handled well', but the fact you can be punished because your banner is a couple of pixels too big is ridiculous.- Tilius

Not really. Considering the "punishment" is to have the banner removed, it's not that ridiculous at all.

But the fact that being 2 pixels over is an issue is ridiculous.- Tilius

Other people have been saying what I've been thinking, but in a more "slippery slope" way than I'd like.Basically, we've got 800x300 sigs. If, say, 5 pixels of leeway is given both directions then that's essentially just a roundabout way of upping the limit to 805x305. If someone has a 806x305 signature, then that would be removed for being over the limit and outside the leeway. Or if it isn't, then that's pretty much changing the rule to add another pixel.Strictly defined wiggle room isn't really that great a solution.On the other hand, if the rule is changed to "800x300, but you can go a little bit over", then there's ambiguity as to what "a little bit over" means. This might mean that someone's signature is removed for being 10 pixels over, but a 9-pixel-over sig stays. Or, if different people are handling them, it could mean that a 9-pixel-over sig gets removed and a 10-pixel over sig stays. And you can bet that there would be plenty of complaints about that.tl;dr: You have 240,000 pixels at your disposal. Use them wisely.

[Scanty Demon]

Another one of my pet peeves is when the staff don't get some slack or respect they deserve for making BZP one of the safer places on the Internet.

Edited December 14, 2011 by muharax makuta of insanity

[UltraHau]

I hate MLP and I like to express my opnions. I don't care if everyone disagrees with me and I don't care if everyone on here hates me(which they most likely do). I've already said why I don't like it in a previous thread. I don't hold back my opnions.

Differing opinions are always welcome here, but not in the hateful way you seem to do it. Always respect other people's opinions, views and values over here, even if you don't agree with them. To be honest, you're being a bit immature about it.It's that simple, really.

If you're going to go on this "Always respect other people's opinion" thing, why not respect the opinions of those who hate MLP, and leave us alone - in my opinion, Knight Rider was not being immature - in fact, I think you're the one being immature about someone hating on a show you like.

Another one of my pet peeves is when the staff don't get some slack or respect they deserve for making BZP one of the safer places on the Internet.

Frankly, I think the staff make BZP rules way, way tighter than they should be. Rules like "no linking to outside sites", "no mentioning that video site, or that social network" don't really make sense anymore, considering pretty much everyone on BZP now is at least 14 and uses such sites daily anyway. Edited December 14, 2011 by UltraHau

[Rarity]

I don't think any of them were immature.

[InnerRayg]

I hate MLP and I like to express my opnions. I don't care if everyone disagrees with me and I don't care if everyone on here hates me(which they most likely do). I've already said why I don't like it in a previous thread. I don't hold back my opnions.

Differing opinions are always welcome here, but not in the hateful way you seem to do it. Always respect other people's opinions, views and values over here, even if you don't agree with them. To be honest, you're being a bit immature about it.It's that simple, really.

If you're going to go on this "Always respect other people's opinion" thing, why not respect the opinions of those who hate MLP, and leave us alone - in my opinion, Knight Rider was not being immature - in fact, I think you're the one being immature about someone hating on a show you like.

Another one of my pet peeves is when the staff don't get some slack or respect they deserve for making BZP one of the safer places on the Internet.

Frankly, I think the staff make BZP rules way, way tighter than they should be. Rules like "no linking to outside sites", "no mentioning that video site, or that social network" don't really make sense anymore, considering pretty much everyone on BZP now is at least 14 and uses such sites daily anyway.

Just FYI you are incredibly wrong about this.Anyway personally I agree that maybe those rules have outlived their usefulness and an alternative system could be considered, such as a wikipedia style gateway asking if you really want to exit, but then that takes on a whole 'nother level of technical hardship. I absolutely don't think you should be able to just link to outside content willy nilly, because at the end of the day we have kids here. We want to protect them. Yes, it's an eventually futile battle, and eventually they will find undesirable content on the internet, but we would still like to do our part and keep part of the net safe for a little while longer.

[Bambi]

The whole no wet mane deal.

[Angel Beat]

If you're going to go on this "Always respect other people's opinion" thing, why not respect the opinions of those who hate MLP, and leave us alone - in my opinion, Knight Rider was not being immature

I do respect your opinion that you hate MLP. I just don't want to see anyone rage over it.If someone says "I hate/don't like MLP, because it's too silly and/or girly to me (etc)", hey, I can respect that.But if someone says "I hate MLP (and/or bronies) because it's sick and wrong for grown up guys to like shows aimed to younger girls", that just doesn't sound right to me.

in fact, I think you're the one being immature about someone hating on a show you like.

Wait, what?Fascinating. Edited December 14, 2011 by Valenti

[Gatanui]

I don't like not being able to see when a member joined. That's the only downside of the forum upgrades.

Just hover the cursor over a member´s name to see that.

The people who feel the need to capitalize EVERY SINGLE LETTER of 'Bionicle'.

Yay! I'm not the only one who hates that!I also don't really like how the "senior staff" almost never comments, just to comment. It'd make them seem a little more "human" and less intimating to new members.

Hey, a couple of staff members posting here including me are Senior Staff. Anyway, the kind of senior staff you mean is largely inactive or too busy to be hanging around the forums.

On a lighter note... the topic titles automatically being set to Capitalize Every Word And Allow No Extra Capitals nags at me a bit. Some sentences just don't work that way.

That´s the way the board software handles it. Forum Leaders can manually edit topic titles, though, so you could try reporting your topic and asking for a fix. ;)About the signature size limit: Five pixels isn´t too much, but as soon as you allow people to have a signature that´s five pixels over the limit, they will make signatures that exceed it by ten. And anyway, you are saying yourself that five pixels are ridiculous. Then why not simply cut off five lines of pixels from your banner so it fits? Your banner won´t become less awesome by that.~Gata. Edited December 14, 2011 by Gatanui

[Makaru]

Current peeve: when over-reaction leads to misinformation, which leads into over-reaction.

[Field Marshal Rakmon]

I get annoyed by the members. Go ahead, kill me. Well, mainly the massive amount of trolls in CoT. Oh, and I don't see why so many people think MLP is a fad. Would you call the fans of BIONICLE 'members of an annoying fad you can't wait to see die down?' please explain why you hate MLP. If it's purely because of Ponies and firendship, you have clearly never watched any of the show other than the Pilot and will promptly be ignored.

[Toa Zaz]

Punishment as a whole seems to be well handled here. I can say for personal experience that I've been told off many times because my banner was too big.

Are you not sensing a bit of a contradiction there? Punishment might be 'handled well', but the fact you can be punished because your banner is a couple of pixels too big is ridiculous.- Tilius

Tilius, you have, in a less-reserved way, been echoing my thoughts.The apparent reason BZPower has their signature guidelines is to make things more convenient for slow-loading computers. I thought the six-month downtime was meant to fix things so BZPower would load faster. If so, then it should designate at least more generous signature rules.

Okay, seriously. This is freaking ridiculous. We just updated the signature guidelines. So that members could have signatures that were far larger than before, and they're still not big enough for you? We now allow signatures larger than any of the other forums I'm a member on. And that's a lot of forums.And no, it's not ridiculous to remove signatures for two or three pixels, because those are still against the rules. Like seriously, the rules are there, everyone can see them, they're clear, concise, and generous. We enforce our rules, and it gets pretty tiresome to see people who complain because, well, they just like to complain. Blah blah blah the staff won't let me be rude and hate on everything and post inappropriate pictures or links, or use foul language or insult others, blah blah blah. I'm so oppressed!

The complaints are here because it's BZPOWER PET PEEVES! That's what the topic is for!

I hate MLP and I like to express my opnions. I don't care if everyone disagrees with me and I don't care if everyone on here hates me(which they most likely do). I've already said why I don't like it in a previous thread. I don't hold back my opnions.

Differing opinions are always welcome here, but not in the hateful way you seem to do it. Always respect other people's opinions, views and values over here, even if you don't agree with them. To be honest, you're being a bit immature about it.It's that simple, really.

If you're going to go on this "Always respect other people's opinion" thing, why not respect the opinions of those who hate MLP, and leave us alone - in my opinion, Knight Rider was not being immature - in fact, I think you're the one being immature about someone hating on a show you like.

Another one of my pet peeves is when the staff don't get some slack or respect they deserve for making BZP one of the safer places on the Internet.

Frankly, I think the staff make BZP rules way, way tighter than they should be. Rules like "no linking to outside sites", "no mentioning that video site, or that social network" don't really make sense anymore, considering pretty much everyone on BZP now is at least 14 and uses such sites daily anyway.

Just FYI you are incredibly wrong about this.Anyway personally I agree that maybe those rules have outlived their usefulness and an alternative system could be considered, such as a wikipedia style gateway asking if you really want to exit, but then that takes on a whole 'nother level of technical hardship. I absolutely don't think you should be able to just link to outside content willy nilly, because at the end of the day we have kids here. We want to protect them. Yes, it's an eventually futile battle, and eventually they will find undesirable content on the internet, but we would still like to do our part and keep part of the net safe for a little while longer.

Last time I checked, something like 80% of BZPower members are over 14, anyway. Edited December 14, 2011 by Toa Zaz

[King Joe]

Oh, and I don't see why so many people think MLP is a fad. Would you call the fans of BIONICLE 'members of an annoying fad you can't wait to see die down?' please explain why you hate MLP. If it's purely because of Ponies and firendship, you have clearly never watched any of the show other than the Pilot and will promptly be ignored.

I don't really hate it, it just has no appeal for me. And the reason it annoys me is because its EVERYWHERE! Now, I expect BIONICLE to be all over here because its BIONICLE Zone Power. I just see ponies everywhere. No prob if you like it. I just want less pony avatars.

[Toa Gabriella0111]

The "cool dude" word filter is so pointless. The word it filters is even in the BIONICLE books, repeatedly! If it's found in the main books that this is a site about, then it should be okay for the target audience, right? *sighs*"Bionicles" never bothered me all that much. I know it's incorrect but it's understandable why some people might mistake it for being correct. One thing that did bother me before the forum crash was that run we had of "Have You Ever (insert ridiculous action here) To Your Bionicle Sets?" topics. It was just getting ridiculous.~Toa Gabriella

[Protodite Karzahni]

The whole no wet mane deal.

Dude, wait, what?

[Rarity]

The whole no wet mane deal.

For me, it was how it was handled.

[Peach 00]

A few more peeves:

• [*]Bring Back Bionicle members. Sure, lost causes are the only ones worth fighting for, but this lost cause has been dead for a year. =/

• [*]BBB members thinking that MLP is replacing Bionicle and going to stop Bionicle from returning.

• [*]Less respect for staff members, as well as less for members. When I mean respect for members, I mean respect coming from the staff for the members. Everybody should respect everybody, unless there are people who have been disrespectful to you.

• [*]MLP haters. Everybody can have their opinion, don't try to get people to conform to your opinion or beliefs. Same thing applies to some subjects that can't be discussed on BZP, specifically religion and politics. I've seen a lot of people who hate MLP that try to get people who don't really have an opinion on it to hate it, to basically push out the fad. It's the latest fad, and like other long fads, it'll probably end, but it'll take awhile.

My additional peeves with the ones I said at the beginning of the topic, as well as what Makaru said earlier in the topic.

[Field Marshal Rakmon]

I'm still not entirely convinced MLP is a Fad. Would you call the fans of BIONICLE (that's technically how it's spelled, delawithit) members of a fad that will undoubtably die?Because We've been more or less keeping it going in a way two years after it ended. :shrug:

[InnerRayg]

Last time I checked, something like 80% of BZPower members are over 14, anyway.

Here's the thing: you didn't check. You just made that up. I will guarantee you the figure for active members is not that high. Bionicle and Hero Factory's entire main demographic is well below 14. Somehow I think one of the largest fan sites for it will have members that follow that trend.Now I'll grant you, a lot of our members are precocious. Something about Lego tends to attract kids who speak pretty eloquently and can function very well in some more mature situations. It might lead to the impression that all our members are older. Doesn't mean that they are.

[Sumiki]

Now I'll grant you, a lot of our members are precocious. Something about Lego tends to attract kids who speak pretty eloquently and can function very well in some more mature situations. It might lead to the impression that all our members are older. Doesn't mean that they are.

Doesn't that lend itself, at least slightly, to the argument that other site linkage should be allowed? Obviously, the 80% remark was not a factual statement, but I can understand that side of the argument.

[FrozenFlash]

One of my pet peeves are the ponies. There are pics of them just about everywhere in the forum and it sort of gets annoying.

[InnerRayg]

Now I'll grant you, a lot of our members are precocious. Something about Lego tends to attract kids who speak pretty eloquently and can function very well in some more mature situations. It might lead to the impression that all our members are older. Doesn't mean that they are.

Doesn't that lend itself, at least slightly, to the argument that other site linkage should be allowed? Obviously, the 80% remark was not a factual statement, but I can understand that side of the argument.

In this case though, it really sort of doesn't matter what the child may or may not be mature enough to handle. It's up to the parents what sort of content they deem appropriate. I know there are at least a few parents who appreciate the sort of protections BZPower has on hand for our younger members.Look, I totally appreciate that it's sort of suffocating to not be able to link to a video you like or something because of the rule. I'm not arguing that it isn't a little bit of a hassle. I've already stated above that I personally, in a totally not speaking for the staff kind of way, believe our site could still run pretty swimmingly with a more lenient gateway kind of system. Or maybe a system where any post with that kind of link had to be approved. I don't know.At the end of the day however I know it's not really that much of a hindrance. There are hundreds of thousands of other places to share this kind of content with people. I know a lot of you are members of other forums, and so am I! Not to mention all the chat clients and the PM system here you can utilize to communicate something "below the radar." Technically it's against the rules, but people still do it. That is why It's super hard to take people seriously when they go on about how strict BZP rules are and that sort of thing. If you really want to share content, then you'll find a way and it probably won't take you that long. Want to swear? Holy cow, you've got a whole wide Internet you can go do it on!We are not violating any rights you have. We are just a couple of guys and gals asked by a really nice fellow named Andrew to help keep his website child friendly. We are not the secret police.Not till the new uniforms come in.

[Gatanui]

The "cool dude" word filter is so pointless. The word it filters is even in the BIONICLE books, repeatedly! If it's found in the main books that this is a site about, then it should be okay for the target audience, right? *sighs*

That word isn´t filtered because it´s inappropiate but rather because it has been misused in the past as an insult too many times.~Gata.

[Taipu1]

The "cool dude" word filter is so pointless. The word it filters is even in the BIONICLE books, repeatedly! If it's found in the main books that this is a site about, then it should be okay for the target audience, right? *sighs*

That word isn´t filtered because it´s inappropiate but rather because it has been misused in the past as an insult too many times.~Gata.

On that basis, perhaps it would be possible to allow the word in the library forums? That could still result in it being used as an insult in reviews, but speaking as a writer, I would rather be able to use the word and be called it, than to have my work sound a bit stupid when I forget that filter is there.

[Gatanui]

The "cool dude" word filter is so pointless. The word it filters is even in the BIONICLE books, repeatedly! If it's found in the main books that this is a site about, then it should be okay for the target audience, right? *sighs*

That word isn´t filtered because it´s inappropiate but rather because it has been misused in the past as an insult too many times.~Gata.

On that basis, perhaps it would be possible to allow the word in the library forums? That could still result in it being used as an insult in reviews, but speaking as a writer, I would rather be able to use the word and be called it, than to have my work sound a bit stupid when I forget that filter is there.

We may or may not think about that when we update the word filter.~Gata.

[Makaru]

Not till the new uniforms come in.

Oh, and they are sharp.

[Laughing Man]

Bionicle. Everywhere I go, I see the avatars and banners and usernames, and it's getting very annoying! I hope this fad ends soon.

[King Joe]

Bionicle. Everywhere I go, I see the avatars and banners and usernames, and it's getting very annoying! I hope this fad ends soon.

I get what you're trying to say, but my point is that this is a Bionicle site. I would expect to see them there. But when I see 12 Billion pony avatars on a Bionicle fansite, it kinda annoys me. But you are well within your rights to put up a pony avatar if you wish, so I don't make a big deal about it.

[Protodite Karzahni]

Bionicle. Everywhere I go, I see the avatars and banners and usernames, and it's getting very annoying! I hope this fad ends soon.

I hate all these video game avatars. Just no matter what, video games. Can't people realise it's a Bionicle site?

[Toa Zaz]

The "cool dude" word filter is so pointless. The word it filters is even in the BIONICLE books, repeatedly! If it's found in the main books that this is a site about, then it should be okay for the target audience, right? *sighs*

That word isn´t filtered because it´s inappropiate but rather because it has been misused in the past as an insult too many times.~Gata.

Yeah, it has been used as an insult before. It's also been used as an insult in the Bionicle books that this site is supposed to be a fansite for. Not only that, but Greg's said himself that the books are made for eight-year-olds. So it's okay to have a book expose kids to a mild insult with the possibility that they could use it, but we can't say it on a fansite for these books where the average member is over 14. Edited December 16, 2011 by Watashi Wa
Do not allude to swear words.

[BioGio]

The "cool dude" word filter is so pointless. The word it filters is even in the BIONICLE books, repeatedly! If it's found in the main books that this is a site about, then it should be okay for the target audience, right? *sighs*

That word isn´t filtered because it´s inappropiate but rather because it has been misused in the past as an insult too many times.~Gata.

Yeah, it has been used as an insult before. It's also been used as an insult in the Bionicle books that this site is supposed to be a fansite for. Not only that, but Greg's said himself that the books are made for eight-year-olds. So it's okay to have a book expose kids to a mild insult with the possibility that they could use it, but we can't say it on a fansite for these books where the average member is over 14.

Could someone please show their work for the statement that the average member is 14+?Either way, the question isn't whether children will be exposed to a rude word; Gatanui's post clearly states that this word is too often used to insult other members--and that it is NOT filtered because it's inappropriate (which it obviously isn't, being in the very books, as you commented). Filtering the various put-downs is helpful in keeping people from insulting each other too much. It's also not proper for the overall positive tone of this website. The purpose isn't to keep kid's minds clean.Now, to avoid not going nearly off topic too much in this post, I'd say that my true "pet peeve" on BZPower is bad grammar. I don't mean borderline "not good but certainly not unintelligible" grammar--but rather the really bad grammar that makes me have to stop skimming. I also find it annoying when people try to say how BZPower members should feel about, say BIONICLE's end.~ BioGio Edited December 16, 2011 by Watashi Wa
Edited the quote

[Master Inika]

The sites we're not allowed to mention, the topic revival rule, and the extensive downtime. I hope the Downtime Days are well behind us.

[fishers64]

Last time I checked, something like 80% of BZPower members are over 14, anyway.

Here's the thing: you didn't check. You just made that up. I will guarantee you the figure for active members is not that high. Bionicle and Hero Factory's entire main demographic is well below 14. Somehow I think one of the largest fan sites for it will have members that follow that trend.Now I'll grant you, a lot of our members are precocious. Something about Lego tends to attract kids who speak pretty eloquently and can function very well in some more mature situations. It might lead to the impression that all our members are older. Doesn't mean that they are.

I would also like to see the homework on the 80% comment.Lego is a creative company; its primary costumers are creative nerds (and I am not saying all BZP is like this, don't get me wrong) who tend to have a high level of maturity. I think that was the part of the reason the rules were created in the first place - we are more intelligent than linking to inappropriate stuff, and we don't want Joe the Cool Dude coming in off the Internet, creating an account, and linking to inappropriate stuff, wasting my time and yours. We are better than that. People who are here to discuss Lego/Bionicle and make other positive contributions will come, but I think these kind of rules keep people who just want to abuse the forum to talk trash out. It improves the intelligence quotient of the forums. This is all my opinion, but it could explain why we have a bunch of "genius children" who are eloquent on here.

[Toa of Nerds]

About the word filter, I feel like too much made about the word itself as opposed to the context. What is really wrong with a "mildly offensive" term which is currently censored on BZPower? Is it the word itself, or how the word is being used? From what Gata said, it's obviously the latter. Personally, instead of blanket-banning that word, I think the staff should just continue to enforce their anti-flaming rule. If the word is used to flame, the staff can edit it. Otherwise, I don't see any problem with using it in say, the library forum. Also, another pet peeve of mine regarding the word filter is that I'm not exactly sure of all the words that are banned. Now, I know the obvious cuss words, however, there are some marginal words (and some very mild expressions) that are censored, however, I don't know all of them. So, to invoke George Carlin, "could somebody give me a list?" -don't touch my pocket protector

Edited December 16, 2011 by Toa of Nerds

[fishers64]

Occasionally, I find it annoying when I start a topic in S & T and nobody reads the first post and the topic dissolves into new member's misconceptions being corrected. It shouldn't annoy me, but it does.

[Dralcax]

The Cool Dude filter is understandable but a bit more leniency is needed for everyday insults. Especially in the Library.

[BioGio]

Occasionally, I find it annoying when I start a topic in S & T and nobody reads the first post and the topic dissolves into new member's misconceptions being corrected.It shouldn't annoy me, but it does.

I concur, and would say that similar issues exist in other sub-forums, too. For instance, this topic has seen people getting corrected over such trivialities as whether MLP is a "meme." Of course, this problem is worst in S&T, and having an influx of posts on whether some character could have lived or done some random thing differently gets quite irritating when it distracts from better discussion of a theory. I wonder if there could be some sort of "Official Simple Questions and Misconceptions" thread.~ BioGio

[fishers64]

Occasionally, I find it annoying when I start a topic in S & T and nobody reads the first post and the topic dissolves into new member's misconceptions being corrected.It shouldn't annoy me, but it does.

I concur, and would say that similar issues exist in other sub-forums, too. For instance, this topic has seen people getting corrected over such trivialities as whether MLP is a "meme." Of course, this problem is worst in S&T, and having an influx of posts on whether some character could have lived or done some random thing differently gets quite irritating when it distracts from better discussion of a theory. I wonder if there could be some sort of "Official Simple Questions and Misconceptions" thread.~ BioGio

Or a "Things that Greg Farshtey has confirmed about current story" thread. Even a pinned link to the old "Official Greg Dialogue" would be helpful. This would stop new members spontaneously bringing Makuta Teridax back from the dead and claiming the Golden Being's mind could have come from Makuta antidermis.

Also, another pet peeve of mine regarding the word filter is that I'm not exactly sure of all the words that are banned. Now, I know the obvious cuss words, however, there are some marginal words (and some very mild expressions) that are censored, however, I don't know all of them. So, to invoke George Carlin, "could somebody give me a list?"-don't touch my pocket protector

Um...a posted list of all censored words would be unreadable, because it is, um, censored. And linking to a list of banned words by any member would likely land said member in the net equivalent of BZP jail.

[Toa Zaz]

The "cool dude" word filter is so pointless. The word it filters is even in the BIONICLE books, repeatedly! If it's found in the main books that this is a site about, then it should be okay for the target audience, right? *sighs*

That word isn´t filtered because it´s inappropiate but rather because it has been misused in the past as an insult too many times.~Gata.

Yeah, it has been used as an insult before. It's also been used as an insult in the Bionicle books that this site is supposed to be a fansite for. Not only that, but Greg's said himself that the books are made for eight-year-olds. So it's okay to have a book expose kids to a mild insult with the possibility that they could use it, but we can't say it on a fansite for these books where the average member is over 14.

Could someone please show their work for the statement that the average member is 14+?Either way, the question isn't whether children will be exposed to a rude word; Gatanui's post clearly states that this word is too often used to insult other members--and that it is NOT filtered because it's inappropriate (which it obviously isn't, being in the very books, as you commented). Filtering the various put-downs is helpful in keeping people from insulting each other too much. It's also not proper for the overall positive tone of this website. The purpose isn't to keep kid's minds clean.Now, to avoid not going nearly off topic too much in this post, I'd say that my true "pet peeve" on BZPower is bad grammar. I don't mean borderline "not good but certainly not unintelligible" grammar--but rather the really bad grammar that makes me have to stop skimming. I also find it annoying when people try to say how BZPower members should feel about, say BIONICLE's end.~ BioGio

Yes, And if the same kids read the "cool dude" in a Bionicle book, they could go around insulting people, too.And I got the "80%-ish" thing from a poll a while back.